One of my players got hit with power word stun and wasn’t rolling the save. In the aftermath, I mentioned they might have been able to use dispel magic to remove the magical effect but now I am not so sure.
can you dispel magic the effects of power word stun?
Why not? Dispel Magic doesn't seem to specify that limitation.
PW stun has the instant effect, but the effect lasts until you make the save. I don't see why this effect couldn't be Dispelled if you either roll 18 or use a level 8 slot.
A spell's duration is the length of time the spell persists. A duration can be expressed in rounds, minutes, hours, or even years. Some spells specify that their effects last until the spells are dispelled or destroyed.
Instantaneous
Many spells are instantaneous. The spell harms, heals, creates, or alters a creature or an object in a way that can't be dispelled, because its magic exists only for an instant.
Why not? Dispel Magic doesn't seem to specify that limitation.
PW stun has the instant effect, but the effect lasts until you make the save. I don't see why this effect couldn't be Dispelled if you either roll 18 or use a level 8 slot.
From Sage Advice:
Whenever you wonder whether a spell’s effects can be dispelled or suspended, you need to answer one question: is the spell’s duration instantaneous? If the answer is yes, there is nothing to dispel or suspend. Here’s why: the effects of an instantaneous spell are brought into being by magic, but the effects aren’t sustained by magic. The magic flares for a split second and then vanishes. For example, the instantaneous spell animate deadharnesses magical energy to turn a corpse or a pile of bones into an undead creature. That necromantic magic is present for an instant and is then gone. The resulting undead now exists without the magic’s help. Casting dispel magic on the creature can’t end its mockery of life, and the undead can wander into an antimagic field with no adverse effect.
Why not? Dispel Magic doesn't seem to specify that limitation.
PW stun has the instant effect, but the effect lasts until you make the save. I don't see why this effect couldn't be Dispelled if you either roll 18 or use a level 8 slot.
From Sage Advice:
Whenever you wonder whether a spell’s effects can be dispelled or suspended, you need to answer one question: is the spell’s duration instantaneous? If the answer is yes, there is nothing to dispel or suspend. Here’s why: the effects of an instantaneous spell are brought into being by magic, but the effects aren’t sustained by magic. The magic flares for a split second and then vanishes. For example, the instantaneous spell animate deadharnesses magical energy to turn a corpse or a pile of bones into an undead creature. That necromantic magic is present for an instant and is then gone. The resulting undead now exists without the magic’s help. Casting dispel magic on the creature can’t end its mockery of life, and the undead can wander into an antimagic field with no adverse effect.
I think PW Stun wording is a bit wonky in this light. Because it speaks of ending the "effect". It should say end the "condition" to emphasize that the following stun saves are natural and no longer magical
I'll just add that I do find it a little odd that "enchantment" spells like this can even have an instantaneous duration. When I think of what an enchantment is, I personally think of it as ongoing magic that persists. But this just isn't the case in 5e. From D&DBeyond's spell search tool, when filtered for enchantments there are 52 spells. 13 of these are instantaneous, which is more than I would have expected. Although 8 of those are from outside source books beyond just Basic Rules and PHB content.
And yes, sometimes the wording seems pretty sloppy. For example, the instantaneous spell Feeblemind:
I don't consider wording like that to be enough to supersede the general rule posted above regarding instantaneous durations, but it's sloppy enough that it leaves the door open to interpretation.
I'll just add that I do find it a little odd that "enchantment" spells like this can even have an instantaneous duration. When I think of what an enchantment is, I personally think of it as ongoing magic that persists. But this just isn't the case in 5e. From D&DBeyond's spell search tool, when filtered for enchantments there are 52 spells. 13 of these are instantaneous, which is more than I would have expected. Although 8 of those are from outside source books beyond just Basic Rules and PHB content.
And yes, sometimes the wording seems pretty sloppy. For example, the instantaneous spell Feeblemind:
I don't consider wording like that to be enough to supersede the general rule posted above regarding instantaneous durations, but it's sloppy enough that it leaves the door open to interpretation.
The point being that Restoration spells and Heal can end specific conditions and other spell effects, while Dispel Magic can only end an ongoing spell. Think of it as the difference between removing the initial source of the effect vs healing the damage it caused. Really, it mostly just comes down to Dispel Magic being a bit of a misnomer in terms of its actual effect, and people who base their assumption of the capabilities on the name then get caught flat footed when they learn their assumption was incorrect.
I don't consider wording like that to be enough to supersede the general rule posted above regarding instantaneous durations, but it's sloppy enough that it leaves the door open to interpretation.
I'd say that one reason for this is to not have Dispel Magic be the one overarching default spell to stop everything. Why have spells like lesser/greater restoration or remove curse or similar when Dispel can do it all? Seems like a better concept to have different spells do different thing.
A stunned creature would not be able to cast most spells on themselves regardless. There may be some spells that I am not aware of that do not require them, but, as indicated by the condition, you cannot move and speak only faltering, thus a spell with verbal and/or somatic components the stunned creature cannot utilize, especially on themselves.
A stunned creature would not be able to cast most spells on themselves regardless. There may be some spells that I am not aware of that do not require them, but, as indicated by the condition, you cannot move and speak only faltering, thus a spell with verbal and/or somatic components the stunned creature cannot utilize, especially on themselves.
More to the point, they’re incapacitated
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One of my players got hit with power word stun and wasn’t rolling the save. In the aftermath, I mentioned they might have been able to use dispel magic to remove the magical effect but now I am not so sure.
can you dispel magic the effects of power word stun?
No you can't dispel instantaneous effect
Why not? Dispel Magic doesn't seem to specify that limitation.
PW stun has the instant effect, but the effect lasts until you make the save. I don't see why this effect couldn't be Dispelled if you either roll 18 or use a level 8 slot.
Finland GMT/UTC +2
From Sage Advice:
Whenever you wonder whether a spell’s effects can be dispelled or suspended, you need to answer one question: is the spell’s duration instantaneous? If the answer is yes, there is nothing to dispel or suspend. Here’s why: the effects of an instantaneous spell are brought into being by magic, but the effects aren’t sustained by magic. The magic flares for a split second and then vanishes. For example, the instantaneous spell animate deadharnesses magical energy to turn a corpse or a pile of bones into an undead creature. That necromantic magic is present for an instant and is then gone. The resulting undead now exists without the magic’s help. Casting dispel magic on the creature can’t end its mockery of life, and the undead can wander into an antimagic field with no adverse effect.
Cheers! Thanks. 🙂
Finland GMT/UTC +2
I think PW Stun wording is a bit wonky in this light. Because it speaks of ending the "effect". It should say end the "condition" to emphasize that the following stun saves are natural and no longer magical
Finland GMT/UTC +2
Many spells have instantaneous effect, which last only an instant but produce lasting effect not sustained by magic but as a result from it.
I'll just add that I do find it a little odd that "enchantment" spells like this can even have an instantaneous duration. When I think of what an enchantment is, I personally think of it as ongoing magic that persists. But this just isn't the case in 5e. From D&DBeyond's spell search tool, when filtered for enchantments there are 52 spells. 13 of these are instantaneous, which is more than I would have expected. Although 8 of those are from outside source books beyond just Basic Rules and PHB content.
And yes, sometimes the wording seems pretty sloppy. For example, the instantaneous spell Feeblemind:
What "spell" exactly? It was instantaneous.
I don't consider wording like that to be enough to supersede the general rule posted above regarding instantaneous durations, but it's sloppy enough that it leaves the door open to interpretation.
The point being that Restoration spells and Heal can end specific conditions and other spell effects, while Dispel Magic can only end an ongoing spell. Think of it as the difference between removing the initial source of the effect vs healing the damage it caused. Really, it mostly just comes down to Dispel Magic being a bit of a misnomer in terms of its actual effect, and people who base their assumption of the capabilities on the name then get caught flat footed when they learn their assumption was incorrect.
I'd say that one reason for this is to not have Dispel Magic be the one overarching default spell to stop everything. Why have spells like lesser/greater restoration or remove curse or similar when Dispel can do it all? Seems like a better concept to have different spells do different thing.
A stunned creature would not be able to cast most spells on themselves regardless. There may be some spells that I am not aware of that do not require them, but, as indicated by the condition, you cannot move and speak only faltering, thus a spell with verbal and/or somatic components the stunned creature cannot utilize, especially on themselves.
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More to the point, they’re incapacitated