I know the RAW rules for jumping involve your strength or strength mod, depending on high vs. long jumps. I have a druid player who likes to wild shape into a dire wolf, which is a large creature, and she asked me how far she could jump in that form. My gut was that jumping distance scaled with creature size similarly to how lift/drag capacity did. But it turns out it doesn't, at least as far as I can find.
Has anyone experimented with scaling jumping distance using the size-based lift/drag formula? Does it seem game-breaking to do that?
It would be unrealistic. Mass scales with the cube of height. A large creature weighs eight times as much as a medium one and requires eight times as much force to accelerate by the same amount.
Creatures that have specifically evolved anatomy for jumping, like kangaroos or cats, should probably get some kind of bonus if we want to try to model reality more closely, but bigger size has nothing to do with it, and in fact makes jumping more difficult and taxing, not less. You don't see many elephants jumping around like basketball players.
Also, jumping distance is ALREADY dependent on Strength and most larger creatures tend to be strong.
Example:
Running Long Jump distance = Strength in feet.
Standing Jump Distance = Strength/2 in feet.
Running/Standing over an obstacle/hurdle upto 1/4 distance tall requires a DC 10 Athletics check.
Running High jump gets you up 3+Strength Modifier
Standing High Jump gets you up (3+Str Mod)/2
Strength (Athletics) check to jump a bit higher than normal
When trying to jump and grab, you can grab something that is 1.5 x your height + Jump height.
For a normal human, strength 10, 6ft tall, that would be:
Running = 10 ft , standing = 5 ft, Over a hurdle up to 2.5 ft running, 1.25 ft standing. Running High = 3 ft, standing high = 1.5 ft, running grab = 19, standing grab = 14 ft
For a 20 ft tall Frost Giant with strength 23 (+6):
Running = 23 ft, standing = 11.5 ft. over a hurdle 5.75 ft running, 2 7/8 ft standing, Running High = 9 ft, standing high = 4.5ft, running grab = 53, standing grab = 41.5 ft
Looks an awful lot like they already did what you desired using the Strength formula.
Realism per se isn't my concern. I'm more thinking of balance.
Maybe another approach, instead of adding a size mod to the base formula, is to tweak athletic checks for "pushing" leaping distances. I wish the game had some more structure there...
If you reallly want to give Large and larger creatures a bump to their jump ability, an easy hack would be to let them measure the jump distance off their front square, but land their back square in that space. That'll 'cheat' their jump up in an amount which exactly corresponds with their size.
Otherwise, as stated, jumping is already keyed off of Strength and move speed, and large creatures generally already have high strength and improved move speeds.
Also, jumping distance is ALREADY dependent on Strength and most larger creatures tend to be strong.
Example:
Running Long Jump distance = Strength in feet.
Standing Jump Distance = Strength/2 in feet.
Running/Standing over an obstacle/hurdle upto 1/4 distance tall requires a DC 10 Athletics check.
Running High jump gets you up 3+Strength Modifier
Standing High Jump gets you up (3+Str Mod)/2
Strength (Athletics) check to jump a bit higher than normal
When trying to jump and grab, you can grab something that is 1.5 x your height + Jump height.
For a normal human, strength 10, 6ft tall, that would be:
Running = 10 ft , standing = 5 ft, Over a hurdle up to 2.5 ft running, 1.25 ft standing. Running High = 3 ft, standing high = 1.5 ft, running grab = 19, standing grab = 14 ft
For a 20 ft tall Frost Giant with strength 23 (+6):
Running = 23 ft, standing = 11.5 ft. over a hurdle 5.75 ft running, 2 7/8 ft standing, Running High = 9 ft, standing high = 4.5ft, running grab = 53, standing grab = 41.5 ft
Looks an awful lot like they already did what you desired using the Strength formula.
For the normal human STR10, 6ft tall, wouldn't the running grab be 12ft? and the standing grab be 10.5ft? [The formula is: Jump and grab = 1.5 x height(reach base) + jump height. ] So reach base is 1.5 x height = 1.5 x 6ft = 9ft. This 9ft is the reach base, and we still have to add jump height, either a running jump or a standing jump. Running high jump = 3 ft. So overall running jump and grab is 9ft reach base + 3ft = 12ft? ...And the standing jump height is 1.5ft, so the standing jump and grab should be 9ft reach base +1.5ft = 10.5ft. Do i have this correct? Thanks
I know the RAW rules for jumping involve your strength or strength mod, depending on high vs. long jumps. I have a druid player who likes to wild shape into a dire wolf, which is a large creature, and she asked me how far she could jump in that form. My gut was that jumping distance scaled with creature size similarly to how lift/drag capacity did. But it turns out it doesn't, at least as far as I can find.
Has anyone experimented with scaling jumping distance using the size-based lift/drag formula? Does it seem game-breaking to do that?
It would be unrealistic. Mass scales with the cube of height. A large creature weighs eight times as much as a medium one and requires eight times as much force to accelerate by the same amount.
Creatures that have specifically evolved anatomy for jumping, like kangaroos or cats, should probably get some kind of bonus if we want to try to model reality more closely, but bigger size has nothing to do with it, and in fact makes jumping more difficult and taxing, not less. You don't see many elephants jumping around like basketball players.
I agree with Saga.
Also, jumping distance is ALREADY dependent on Strength and most larger creatures tend to be strong.
Example:
For a normal human, strength 10, 6ft tall, that would be:
Running = 10 ft , standing = 5 ft, Over a hurdle up to 2.5 ft running, 1.25 ft standing. Running High = 3 ft, standing high = 1.5 ft, running grab = 19, standing grab = 14 ft
For a 20 ft tall Frost Giant with strength 23 (+6):
Running = 23 ft, standing = 11.5 ft. over a hurdle 5.75 ft running, 2 7/8 ft standing, Running High = 9 ft, standing high = 4.5ft, running grab = 53, standing grab = 41.5 ft
Looks an awful lot like they already did what you desired using the Strength formula.
Realism per se isn't my concern. I'm more thinking of balance.
Maybe another approach, instead of adding a size mod to the base formula, is to tweak athletic checks for "pushing" leaping distances. I wish the game had some more structure there...
I would love to know what people do with this. What DC, how much is a "bit,", etc.?
If you reallly want to give Large and larger creatures a bump to their jump ability, an easy hack would be to let them measure the jump distance off their front square, but land their back square in that space. That'll 'cheat' their jump up in an amount which exactly corresponds with their size.
Otherwise, as stated, jumping is already keyed off of Strength and move speed, and large creatures generally already have high strength and improved move speeds.
dndbeyond.com forum tags
I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
Where is jumping distance keyed off movement? I mean aside from the general rule that your maximum jump distance can't exceed it?
That’s all I’m referring to.
dndbeyond.com forum tags
I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
For the normal human STR10, 6ft tall, wouldn't the running grab be 12ft? and the standing grab be 10.5ft? [The formula is: Jump and grab = 1.5 x height(reach base) + jump height. ] So reach base is 1.5 x height = 1.5 x 6ft = 9ft. This 9ft is the reach base, and we still have to add jump height, either a running jump or a standing jump. Running high jump = 3 ft. So overall running jump and grab is 9ft reach base + 3ft = 12ft? ...And the standing jump height is 1.5ft, so the standing jump and grab should be 9ft reach base +1.5ft = 10.5ft. Do i have this correct? Thanks
Yes, I believe Mog_Dracov had a couple errors there and you are correct.