While its understood that the wish spell can do many things... for example copy any spell of level 8 and lower, a question has poped into my head.
Should say, a warlock or a sorcerer cast wish to truly become something else for example: a warlock wish's that his true form would be that of a balor.
Or a sorcerer wishing for his true form to be that of a dragon (as to avoide the true polymorph debuckle) can a wish pull it off? Or is it too strong? (Or can it do it, on the cost and risk of casting wish on higher level)
Really need your help, a dreamful pc, and a confused DM.
p.s (while i know that as i gm i can rule it however i wish, pun intended, i'm talking from a point of RULES AS WRITTEN prespective)
While its understood that the wish spell can do many things... for example copy any spell of level 8 and lower, a question has poped into my head.
Should say, a warlock or a sorcerer cast wish to truly become something else for example: a warlock wish's that his true form would be that of a balor.
Or a sorcerer wishing for his true form to be that of a dragon (as to avoide the true polymorph debuckle) can a wish pull it off? Or is it too strong? (Or can it do it, on the cost and risk of casting wish on higher level)
Really need your help, a dreamful pc, and a confused DM.
p.s (while i know that as i gm i can rule it however i wish, pun intended, i'm talking from a point of RULES AS WRITTEN prespective)
Thank you!
Here's the spell description:
Wish is the mightiest spell a mortal creature can cast. By simply speaking aloud, you can alter the very foundations of reality in accord with your desires.
The basic use of this spell is to duplicate any other spell of 8th level or lower. You don't need to meet any requirements in that spell, including costly components. The spell simply takes effect.
Alternatively, you can create one of the following effects of your choice:
You create one object of up to 25,000 gp in value that isn't a magic item. The object can be no more than 300 feet in any dimension, and it appears in an unoccupied space you can see on the ground.
You allow up to twenty creatures that you can see to regain all hit points, and you end all effects on them described in the greater restoration spell.
You grant up to ten creatures that you can see resistance to a damage type you choose.
You grant up to ten creatures you can see immunity to a single spell or other magical effect for 8 hours. For instance, you could make yourself and all your companions immune to a lich's life drain attack.
You undo a single recent event by forcing a reroll of any roll made within the last round (including your last turn). Reality reshapes itself to accommodate the new result. For example, a wish spell could undo an opponent's successful save, a foe's critical hit, or a friend's failed save. You can force the reroll to be made with advantage or disadvantage, and you can choose whether to use the reroll or the original roll.
You might be able to achieve something beyond the scope of the above examples. State your wish to the GM as precisely as possible.The GM has great latitude in ruling what occurs in such an instance; the greater the wish, the greater the likelihood that something goes wrong. This spell might simply fail, the effect you desire might only be partly achieved, or you might suffer some unforeseen consequence as a result of how you worded the wish. For example, wishing that a villain were dead might propel you forward in time to a period when that villain is no longer alive, effectively removing you from the game. Similarly, wishing for a legendary magic item or artifact might instantly transport you to the presence of the item's current owner.
The stress of casting this spell to produce any effect other than duplicating another spell weakens you. After enduring that stress, each time you cast a spell until you finish a long rest, you take 1d10 necrotic damage per level of that spell. This damage can't be reduced or prevented in any way. In addition, your Strength drops to 3, if it isn't 3 or lower already, for 2d4 days. For each of those days that you spend resting and doing nothing more than light activity, your remaining recovery time decreases by 2 days. Finally, there is a 33 percent chance that you are unable to cast wish ever again if you suffer this stress.
You can attempt literally anything with Wish. If your wish is not one of the listed examples, then it is entirely up to the DM to decide what happens.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
The RAW for Wish is very literally "The DM decides what your Wish does if it's not one of the Wishes listed here." Any request for "what would happen if..." on Wish is going to get a bevy of very different responses, depending on how merciless the responder is as a DM and how much they hate the Wish spell.
One example I think you'll see a lot for "I wish to be [Choice of Very Powerful Creature]" Wishes is the DM saying that the character gets his Wish and becomes that creature...complete with the alignment and general behavior listed in its stat block/fluff and with a wrenching shift in personality. A warlock who Wishes to be a Balor would become a Balor...and immediately attack the party as a Chaotic Evil super demon NPC under the DM's control. A Balor like any other, whose memories of their time as a mortal adventurer pale in comparison to the drives and persona of their new form.
I would definitely talk about this sort of thing with a DM beforehand, as dropping that sort of immensely powergame-y Wish on a DM cold is a great way to have your Wish twisted in a way that ****s you over. Remember - the vast majority of DMs absolutely detestWish and will do everything in their power to ensure that a player always - always always ALWAYS - regrets casting the spell. It's crap, but it's also unfortunately true.
Oh absolutely, no one wants to be the edge that goes "LOL MAKE ME BIG POWER DEMON PLZ" and power play it, i assumed it be end game kinda deal, as the heroes finish the campaign, the warlock uses the wish to become a balor,at which the campaign ends so... you know... it doesnt affect anyone really,its more of a story thing.
Also,as a DM. I understand that very well, just hoped to see a dream of a player of mine, and in a way of myself to be real.
To be fair, with my DM hat on rather than my player hat, I look at Wish as the fulfillment and pinnacle of a couple of different classes' abilities, and if the players use that power responsibly there is little reason for a DM to burn her players over and over again for trying to use the spell. A sorcerer who wishes to become a dragon sounds like the worst power play...unless that sorcerer is a Draconic Bloodline sorcerer who's spent the entire campaign pursuing the power and secrets of dragonkind and for whom finally shedding kith form to take their place amongst dragonkind is a splendid resolution of their character arc. If such a character made such a Wish, especially if it was something they'd spoken to me about behind the scenes, I'd probably be happy to give them a species change to a Young dragon of their given color, probably even with their spellcasting intact.
Would it be overpowered as shit? Probably! But by that point you're dealing with an Epic-level party that can cast Wish. Challenge Rating has flown the coop and any adventures by that point need to be hand tailored specifically for a massively overpowered party anyways.
Warlocks cannot cast wish unless they're a Genie warlock, which nips most of that "Grant me ALL the power of my patron!" junk in the bud...but a warlock going mad with power and wishing to become a devastatingly powerful extraplanar monster is kinda on brand for many such critters. At that point maybe the warlock wants to go out in a blaze of Abyssal infamy and die at the hands of the party; if that's the way his character arc is going, then maybe as a DM it's my job to let him have his PVP moment, especially if I know the other players at my table would run with it. And if he gets away? Well, hell! Then you have a fantastic BBEG/Antagonistic Force for your next campaign handed to you on a platter!
My stance on Wish has always been "If the player is using Wish to enhance the game and make it more fun, more engaging, or more impactful, then they can have their Wish. At least as much as it's possible within the game. If a player is using Wish to be a dickwagon, detract from the game, or otherwise diminish everyone's experience, then their Wish backfires catastrophically. Work with me and Wish is fine. Screw with me and I'll cook you."
With wish you can do anything as long as the DM says so. If you wish yourself into a balor though, or a dragon for that matter, is it worth the risk of becoming somehting else that doesn't have your memories? Like Yurei said, try to be too OP and the DM will (likely) make you regret it.
I mean,all of it is super clear to me, i would not allow my players or myself to abuse wish to power play or harm other players or even the setting!, i see wish as an END goal, you use it to finalize a character arch, a demented warlock who got his grabby little hands on a wish scroll, and wishes to acend to demonhood ultimately ends the arch for him as he sacrifces his humanity for power, power warps absolutely
A dragon sorcerer finishing his quest of becoming a full dragon!,the idea of smart use is a must with wish, i was just curious about the raw logistics, as i understand, with true polymorph, what it essentialy does is give you a permanat costume, it doesnt actually change what you are truly, when the form loses all its hit points or fails dispel magic check, you ultimately return to what you were... bummer.
Finally, do keep in mind that even when the DM is totally into your off-book request like Yurei described above and gives you everything you ask for, that doesn't change the fact that these special Wisheswill totally hose your strength and kill your spellcasting for a few days, and have a rolled 33% chance to prevent you from ever casting it again. So, use carefully.
Wish is the mightiest spell a mortal creature can cast. By simply speaking aloud, you can alter the very foundations of reality in accord with your desires.
The basic use of this spell is to duplicate any other spell of 8th level or lower. You don't need to meet any requirements in that spell, including costly components. The spell simply takes effect.
Alternatively, you can create one of the following effects of your choice:
You create one object of up to 25,000 gp in value that isn't a magic item. The object can be no more than 300 feet in any dimension, and it appears in an unoccupied space you can see on the ground.
You allow up to twenty creatures that you can see to regain all hit points, and you end all effects on them described in the greater restoration spell.
You grant up to ten creatures that you can see resistance to a damage type you choose.
You grant up to ten creatures you can see immunity to a single spell or other magical effect for 8 hours. For instance, you could make yourself and all your companions immune to a lich's life drain attack.
You undo a single recent event by forcing a reroll of any roll made within the last round (including your last turn). Reality reshapes itself to accommodate the new result. For example, a wish spell could undo an opponent's successful save, a foe's critical hit, or a friend's failed save. You can force the reroll to be made with advantage or disadvantage, and you can choose whether to use the reroll or the original roll.
You might be able to achieve something beyond the scope of the above examples. State your wish to the GM as precisely as possible.The GM has great latitude in ruling what occurs in such an instance; the greater the wish, the greater the likelihood that something goes wrong. This spell might simply fail, the effect you desire might only be partly achieved, or you might suffer some unforeseen consequence as a result of how you worded the wish. For example, wishing that a villain were dead might propel you forward in time to a period when that villain is no longer alive, effectively removing you from the game. Similarly, wishing for a legendary magic item or artifact might instantly transport you to the presence of the item's current owner.
The stress of casting this spell to produce any effect other than duplicating another spell weakens you. After enduring that stress, each time you cast a spell until you finish a long rest, you take 1d10 necrotic damage per level of that spell. This damage can't be reduced or prevented in any way. In addition, your Strength drops to 3, if it isn't 3 or lower already, for 2d4 days. For each of those days that you spend resting and doing nothing more than light activity, your remaining recovery time decreases by 2 days. Finally, there is a 33 percent chance that you are unable to cast wish ever again if you suffer this stress.
Greetings !
My question is in relation to the wish spell description, it says that any other effect then duplicating a spell weakens you. Before that it lists a set of alternative effects. So my question is thus :
Do these alternative effects also cause the weakening effect ? Or is that reserved for those options of going beyond those mentioned, those that you haveto negotiate with your DM.
Yes, the alternative effects still cause the weakening effect. The benefit of those effects is that the DM doesn't get to twist the Wish. It's also meant to be a guideline for DMs on how powerful another wished effect should be. I would not recommend using the spell for anything other than replicating a spell unless it's a last resort, as you don't want to lose the ability to cast it; even with the replication effect, you can do a lot of broken stuff, such as an action cast Mirage Arcane to completely change the battlefield, or a spell like Druid Grove for instant battlefield control that your party is immune to.
BTW, in the future, you should make a new threat if you have a new question instead of using an old one.
If you are playing a one shot game, go crazy with wishes.
If not, only use it duplicate another level spell. Nothing else is worth the 33% chance of never casting another wish to dupe all non-9th level spells.
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While its understood that the wish spell can do many things... for example copy any spell of level 8 and lower, a question has poped into my head.
Should say, a warlock or a sorcerer cast wish to truly become something else for example: a warlock wish's that his true form would be that of a balor.
Or a sorcerer wishing for his true form to be that of a dragon (as to avoide the true polymorph debuckle) can a wish pull it off? Or is it too strong? (Or can it do it, on the cost and risk of casting wish on higher level)
Really need your help, a dreamful pc, and a confused DM.
p.s (while i know that as i gm i can rule it however i wish, pun intended, i'm talking from a point of RULES AS WRITTEN prespective)
Thank you!
Here's the spell description:
You can attempt literally anything with Wish. If your wish is not one of the listed examples, then it is entirely up to the DM to decide what happens.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
The RAW for Wish is very literally "The DM decides what your Wish does if it's not one of the Wishes listed here." Any request for "what would happen if..." on Wish is going to get a bevy of very different responses, depending on how merciless the responder is as a DM and how much they hate the Wish spell.
One example I think you'll see a lot for "I wish to be [Choice of Very Powerful Creature]" Wishes is the DM saying that the character gets his Wish and becomes that creature...complete with the alignment and general behavior listed in its stat block/fluff and with a wrenching shift in personality. A warlock who Wishes to be a Balor would become a Balor...and immediately attack the party as a Chaotic Evil super demon NPC under the DM's control. A Balor like any other, whose memories of their time as a mortal adventurer pale in comparison to the drives and persona of their new form.
I would definitely talk about this sort of thing with a DM beforehand, as dropping that sort of immensely powergame-y Wish on a DM cold is a great way to have your Wish twisted in a way that ****s you over. Remember - the vast majority of DMs absolutely detest Wish and will do everything in their power to ensure that a player always - always always ALWAYS - regrets casting the spell. It's crap, but it's also unfortunately true.
Please do not contact or message me.
Oh absolutely, no one wants to be the edge that goes "LOL MAKE ME BIG POWER DEMON PLZ" and power play it, i assumed it be end game kinda deal, as the heroes finish the campaign, the warlock uses the wish to become a balor,at which the campaign ends so... you know... it doesnt affect anyone really,its more of a story thing.
Also,as a DM. I understand that very well, just hoped to see a dream of a player of mine, and in a way of myself to be real.
Regardless, THANK YOU!
To be fair, with my DM hat on rather than my player hat, I look at Wish as the fulfillment and pinnacle of a couple of different classes' abilities, and if the players use that power responsibly there is little reason for a DM to burn her players over and over again for trying to use the spell. A sorcerer who wishes to become a dragon sounds like the worst power play...unless that sorcerer is a Draconic Bloodline sorcerer who's spent the entire campaign pursuing the power and secrets of dragonkind and for whom finally shedding kith form to take their place amongst dragonkind is a splendid resolution of their character arc. If such a character made such a Wish, especially if it was something they'd spoken to me about behind the scenes, I'd probably be happy to give them a species change to a Young dragon of their given color, probably even with their spellcasting intact.
Would it be overpowered as shit? Probably! But by that point you're dealing with an Epic-level party that can cast Wish. Challenge Rating has flown the coop and any adventures by that point need to be hand tailored specifically for a massively overpowered party anyways.
Warlocks cannot cast wish unless they're a Genie warlock, which nips most of that "Grant me ALL the power of my patron!" junk in the bud...but a warlock going mad with power and wishing to become a devastatingly powerful extraplanar monster is kinda on brand for many such critters. At that point maybe the warlock wants to go out in a blaze of Abyssal infamy and die at the hands of the party; if that's the way his character arc is going, then maybe as a DM it's my job to let him have his PVP moment, especially if I know the other players at my table would run with it. And if he gets away? Well, hell! Then you have a fantastic BBEG/Antagonistic Force for your next campaign handed to you on a platter!
My stance on Wish has always been "If the player is using Wish to enhance the game and make it more fun, more engaging, or more impactful, then they can have their Wish. At least as much as it's possible within the game. If a player is using Wish to be a dickwagon, detract from the game, or otherwise diminish everyone's experience, then their Wish backfires catastrophically. Work with me and Wish is fine. Screw with me and I'll cook you."
Please do not contact or message me.
With wish you can do anything as long as the DM says so. If you wish yourself into a balor though, or a dragon for that matter, is it worth the risk of becoming somehting else that doesn't have your memories? Like Yurei said, try to be too OP and the DM will (likely) make you regret it.
Keep your friends close, and enemies closer.
I mean,all of it is super clear to me, i would not allow my players or myself to abuse wish to power play or harm other players or even the setting!, i see wish as an END goal, you use it to finalize a character arch, a demented warlock who got his grabby little hands on a wish scroll, and wishes to acend to demonhood ultimately ends the arch for him as he sacrifces his humanity for power, power warps absolutely
A dragon sorcerer finishing his quest of becoming a full dragon!,the idea of smart use is a must with wish, i was just curious about the raw logistics, as i understand, with true polymorph, what it essentialy does is give you a permanat costume, it doesnt actually change what you are truly, when the form loses all its hit points or fails dispel magic check, you ultimately return to what you were... bummer.
Finally, do keep in mind that even when the DM is totally into your off-book request like Yurei described above and gives you everything you ask for, that doesn't change the fact that these special Wishes will totally hose your strength and kill your spellcasting for a few days, and have a rolled 33% chance to prevent you from ever casting it again. So, use carefully.
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
Greetings !
My question is in relation to the wish spell description, it says that any other effect then duplicating a spell weakens you.
Before that it lists a set of alternative effects. So my question is thus :
Do these alternative effects also cause the weakening effect ?
Or is that reserved for those options of going beyond those mentioned, those that you haveto negotiate with your DM.
Thank you inadvance
Yes, the alternative effects still cause the weakening effect. The benefit of those effects is that the DM doesn't get to twist the Wish. It's also meant to be a guideline for DMs on how powerful another wished effect should be. I would not recommend using the spell for anything other than replicating a spell unless it's a last resort, as you don't want to lose the ability to cast it; even with the replication effect, you can do a lot of broken stuff, such as an action cast Mirage Arcane to completely change the battlefield, or a spell like Druid Grove for instant battlefield control that your party is immune to.
BTW, in the future, you should make a new threat if you have a new question instead of using an old one.
anyway, I hope that helped.
I write homebrew and don't publish it. (evil, I know)
If you are playing a one shot game, go crazy with wishes.
If not, only use it duplicate another level spell. Nothing else is worth the 33% chance of never casting another wish to dupe all non-9th level spells.