I think that turning a bunch of Acid Vials or Alchemist's Fire or something into Tiny Servants would probably have some juice to it as well, but would be pretty DM dependent on how that gets arbitrated. Would the servants get a special action to splash themselves on the enemy? Explode when killed? Nothing?
But spending an hour and all your spell slots to temporarily animate dozens of bombs probably isn't a realistic response to anything other than a single very well planned boss fight, I doubt your DM wants to deal with you having 32 minions more than once or twice (which coincidentally, is the sad reason that Necromancer builds really aren't as fun as they seem they would be).
I think that turning a bunch of Acid Vials or Alchemist's Fire or something into Tiny Servants would probably have some juice to it as well, but would be pretty DM dependent on how that gets arbitrated. Would the servants get a special action to splash themselves on the enemy? Explode when killed? Nothing?
But spending an hour and all your spell slots to temporarily animate dozens of bombs probably isn't a realistic response to anything other than a single very well planned boss fight, I doubt your DM wants to deal with you having 32 minions more than once or twice (which coincidentally, is the sad reason that Necromancer builds really aren't as fun as they seem they would be).
The Herald of The Gods: Paladin 11 (Vengeance)/Fighter 2/Cleric 2 (Grave)/Warlock 5 (Hexblade)- Assuming this is against a fiend or undead, with 20 in str and cha, and with a divine amulet this deals 1d12+4d8+6d8+1d8+10 times 2, then 1d12+4d8+5d8+1d8+10, the ACTION SUUURGE for 1d12+5d8+1d8+10 and 1d12+5d8+1d8+10, with hexblade’s curse. This is a nuke on feinds and undead that expends: 1 5th level slot, 3 4th level slots, and 2 3rd level slots, along with hexblade’s curs and channel divinity (both from class and amulet). Averages: 130, 60, 53, 53, for a total of 296 damage on average, and with vow of enmity this will likely crit at least once, so likely 378 on average, as a crit is 20% on each attack.
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Helper of Create a World thread/Sedge is Chaotic Neutral/ Mega Yahtzee High: 34, Low: 14/I speak English, je me parle le Francais, agus Labhraim beagan Gaeilge
The Herald of The Gods: Paladin 11 (Vengeance)/Fighter 2/Cleric 2 (Grave)/Warlock 5 (Hexblade)- Assuming this is against a fiend or undead, with 20 in str and cha, and with a divine amulet this deals 1d12+4d8+6d8+1d8+10 times 2, then 1d12+4d8+5d8+1d8+10, the ACTION SUUURGE for 1d12+5d8+1d8+10 and 1d12+5d8+1d8+10, with hexblade’s curse. This is a nuke on feinds and undead that expends: 1 5th level slot, 3 4th level slots, and 2 3rd level slots, along with hexblade’s curs and channel divinity (both from class and amulet). Averages: 130, 60, 53, 53, for a total of 296 damage on average, and with vow of enmity this will likely crit at least once, so likely 378 on average, as a crit is 20% on each attack.
This build does not have 5th level slots, also, you can only eldritch smite once per turn. You also only need a 20 in CHA, STR can be as low as 13 (because hex warrior uses CHA with weapons), which frees up an ASI for great weapon master.
So lets see, turn 1 use both CDs. Turn 2 BA hexblade curse then:
Attack 1d12(weapon)+6d8(d smite)+3d8(e smite)+1d8(I d smite)+5(cha)+6(HB curse)+1(I pact weapon)+10(gwm)=94.595×2(CD:PttG)= 189.19
Extra attack 1d12+5d8+1d8+22=75.8525
Action surge 1d12+5d8+1d8+22=75.8525
AS extra attack 1d12+5d8+1d8+22=75.8525
Totalling an average 416.7475 after using 1 level 4 slot, 4 level 3, 2 channel divinities, 1 action surge, and 2 turns.
All average damages adjusted for great weapon fighting style, savage attacks (half orc), and 19% crit chance from curse and advantage.
Minor improvement: go paladin 12/warlock 4, eldritch smite does 1d8 less damage, but more than make up for it by taking the additional orcish fury feat and with the second level 4 divine smite, total average increases by 6.7525.
The Herald of The Gods: Paladin 11 (Vengeance)/Fighter 2/Cleric 2 (Grave)/Warlock 5 (Hexblade)- Assuming this is against a fiend or undead, with 20 in str and cha, and with a divine amulet this deals 1d12+4d8+6d8+1d8+10 times 2, then 1d12+4d8+5d8+1d8+10, the ACTION SUUURGE for 1d12+5d8+1d8+10 and 1d12+5d8+1d8+10, with hexblade’s curse. This is a nuke on feinds and undead that expends: 1 5th level slot, 3 4th level slots, and 2 3rd level slots, along with hexblade’s curs and channel divinity (both from class and amulet). Averages: 130, 60, 53, 53, for a total of 296 damage on average, and with vow of enmity this will likely crit at least once, so likely 378 on average, as a crit is 20% on each attack.
You are a little bit short of the damage of Stannis's Shadow Build from HeironymusZot that I posted here. It is post #175, that build is a true nova beast that requires no special items but is more of a infiltrate and assassinate against a single target then slipping out again.
I have recently figured out a way to improve that build's damage even more by swapping out Bard for 4 Levels od Shadow Sorcerer and 2 levels of Spores Druid for Symbiotic Entity to deal additional necrotic damage to every hit.
Here's my little entry in this game! Doesn't require a surprise round or magic items (although a bag of holding would help).
Class: Bard 10+, subclass irrelevant, all levels in a full caster class. Magical secrets: Tiny Servant, Contagion.
Use most of the bard's spell slots to cast Tiny Servant, giving you 78 of them. Make sure to leave a level 5 slot. Here's your turn:
Action: Cast Contagion to give an enemy Flesh Rot, giving them vulnerability to all damage.
BA: Command all servants to attack at +5, for 1d4+3 damage.
Assuming they fail the save and all attacks hit (as every calculation here has done so far) we're looking at an average of 78*(2,5+3)*2=858 damage!
This obviously doesn't factor in legendary saves or AC, but there's otherwise a lot you can play with since we've left 10 levels open. You can do the same thing with a Wizard instead of a Bard by leaving out the Contagion gimmick, which will increase your total number of Servants to 98 due to Signature Spell and Arcane Recovery, and also open up your action (although you won't have any spells above level 2 left). Note we haven't touched our concentration yet. Also, you can technically get this number close to twice by using all your slots before the end of a long rest, or by being an elf/warforged, but I do not condone even theorizing that way.
Enjoy gouging your enemies to bits with an army of tea spoons!
You can't get this kind of DPR out of Tiny Servant without giving them ranged attacks - there's only enough room in melee for about 32 of them to surround a Medium target, and if you make them squeeze to fit, they'll have disadvantage on all of their attacks even if your DM homebrews a solution for how many you can fit in melee range while squeezing.
So far as I know, the best way to turn the servants into DPR is to give them a general command, like "attack whomever I point at", so you don't need to spend a BA to make them attack, and then fuel them with Magic Stone, essentially letting your bonus action to cast Magic Stone become 3 attacks at your normal spellcasting accuracy, dealing 1d6+SAM damage each, 3d6+3*SAM total, which is very decent for a bonus action.
I don't see a reason why they wouldn't be able to individually attack and then retreat back, leaving space for others to move in and attack. The damage of three magic stones really doesn't compare.
General conditional orders are obviously more efficient, but I feel like using them to bypass action economy restrictions might overstep the intended purpose of the spell somewhat. You're right that it's completely rules-legal though. If you're gonna use standing orders for the Tiny Servants, for the purposes of this thought experiment it would be more damage-efficient to use the bonus action to combine it with a high-level Animate Objects or Danse Macabre.
With a ninth-level Danse Macabre, a slot for Contagion, and the rest spent on Tiny Servants, you'll have 13 empowered dancing skeletons and 65 tiny servants lined up. If the Contagion sticks and all attacks hit, that's gonna be an average of 2*(13*(3,5 + 7) + 65*(2,5 + 3)) = 988 damage.
I think that turning a bunch of Acid Vials or Alchemist's Fire or something into Tiny Servants would probably have some juice to it as well, but would be pretty DM dependent on how that gets arbitrated. Would the servants get a special action to splash themselves on the enemy? Explode when killed? Nothing?
But spending an hour and all your spell slots to temporarily animate dozens of bombs probably isn't a realistic response to anything other than a single very well planned boss fight, I doubt your DM wants to deal with you having 32 minions more than once or twice (which coincidentally, is the sad reason that Necromancer builds really aren't as fun as they seem they would be).
Very true, but I think most of the damage calculations in this thread feature a single round of combat, often a surprise round, and use most of the daily resources of the class, so they wouldn't apply more than once anyway. At least this one can theoretically be used all day long, with the exception of the Contagion.
Here's my little entry in this game! Doesn't require a surprise round or magic items (although a bag of holding would help).
Class: Bard 10+, subclass irrelevant, all levels in a full caster class. Magical secrets: Tiny Servant, Contagion.
Use most of the bard's spell slots to cast Tiny Servant, giving you 78 of them. Make sure to leave a level 5 slot. Here's your turn:
Action: Cast Contagion to give an enemy Flesh Rot, giving them vulnerability to all damage.
BA: Command all servants to attack at +5, for 1d4+3 damage.
Assuming they fail the save and all attacks hit (as every calculation here has done so far) we're looking at an average of 78*(2,5+3)*2=858 damage!
This obviously doesn't factor in legendary saves or AC, but there's otherwise a lot you can play with since we've left 10 levels open. You can do the same thing with a Wizard instead of a Bard by leaving out the Contagion gimmick, which will increase your total number of Servants to 98 due to Signature Spell and Arcane Recovery, and also open up your action (although you won't have any spells above level 2 left). Note we haven't touched our concentration yet. Also, you can technically get this number close to twice by using all your slots before the end of a long rest, or by being an elf/warforged, but I do not condone even theorizing that way.
Enjoy gouging your enemies to bits with an army of tea spoons!
You can't get this kind of DPR out of Tiny Servant without giving them ranged attacks - there's only enough room in melee for about 32 of them to surround a Medium target, and if you make them squeeze to fit, they'll have disadvantage on all of their attacks even if your DM homebrews a solution for how many you can fit in melee range while squeezing.
So far as I know, the best way to turn the servants into DPR is to give them a general command, like "attack whomever I point at", so you don't need to spend a BA to make them attack, and then fuel them with Magic Stone, essentially letting your bonus action to cast Magic Stone become 3 attacks at your normal spellcasting accuracy, dealing 1d6+SAM damage each, 3d6+3*SAM total, which is very decent for a bonus action.
I don't see a reason why they wouldn't be able to individually attack and then retreat back, leaving space for others to move in and attack. The damage of three magic stones really doesn't compare.
General conditional orders are obviously more efficient, but I feel like using them to bypass action economy restrictions might overstep the intended purpose of the spell somewhat. You're right that it's completely rules-legal though. If you're gonna use standing orders for the Tiny Servants, for the purposes of this thought experiment it would be more damage-efficient to use the bonus action to combine it with a high-level Animate Objects or Danse Macabre.
With a ninth-level Danse Macabre, a slot for Contagion, and the rest spent on Tiny Servants, you'll have 13 empowered dancing skeletons and 65 tiny servants lined up. If the Contagion sticks and all attacks hit, that's gonna be an average of 2*(13*(3,5 + 7) + 65*(2,5 + 3)) = 988 damage.
In my opinion Contagion is not a very good way to increase damage. It takes 3 turns for it to activate in the best scenario and if you are attacking with a swarm of 70+ minions whatever you are attacking will likely be dead after the 2nd round if not the 1st round.
In my opinion Contagion is not a very good way to increase damage. It takes 3 turns for it to activate in the best scenario and if you are attacking with a swarm of 70+ minions whatever you are attacking will likely be dead after the 2nd round if not the 1st round.
That's true. I was lightly lampooning the idea that everyone assumes all saves fail and all attacks hit, but having to wait a minimum of 3 turns makes it nonfunctional. I believe it works with Hold Monster, to at least double damage dice and gain advantage. That does mean we can't use our bonus action for Danse Macabre or Animate Objects. Behold, the revised Teaspoon Tyrant:
Preparation: Use your level 3+ spell slots, Arcane Recovery, and Signature Spell to cast Tiny Servant, giving you 92 of them. Leave a level 5 slot. Give all servants a general order to attack whoever you Eldritch Blast and immediately retreat into your bag.
Action: Cast Hold Monster, using a portent to ensure failure.
BA: 4 Quickened Eldritch Blasts for 2d10+5 each.
General order: 92 Servants for 2d4+3 each.
4*(2*5,5+5) + 92*(2*2,5+3) = an average of 800 damage per round.
Still no need for a surprise round or any magic items, but I'd expect my DM to quickly start giving every enemy immunity to nonmagical attacks if I try to pull this off. Not unfeasible for a crazy oneshot!
The Herald of The Gods: Paladin 11 (Vengeance)/Fighter 2/Cleric 2 (Grave)/Warlock 5 (Hexblade)- Assuming this is against a fiend or undead, with 20 in str and cha, and with a divine amulet this deals 1d12+4d8+6d8+1d8+10 times 2, then 1d12+4d8+5d8+1d8+10, the ACTION SUUURGE for 1d12+5d8+1d8+10 and 1d12+5d8+1d8+10, with hexblade’s curse. This is a nuke on feinds and undead that expends: 1 5th level slot, 3 4th level slots, and 2 3rd level slots, along with hexblade’s curs and channel divinity (both from class and amulet). Averages: 130, 60, 53, 53, for a total of 296 damage on average, and with vow of enmity this will likely crit at least once, so likely 378 on average, as a crit is 20% on each attack.
You are a little bit short of the damage of Stannis's Shadow Build from HeironymusZot that I posted here. It is post #175, that build is a true nova beast that requires no special items but is more of a infiltrate and assassinate against a single target then slipping out again.
I have recently figured out a way to improve that build's damage even more by swapping out Bard for 4 Levels od Shadow Sorcerer and 2 levels of Spores Druid for Symbiotic Entity to deal additional necrotic damage to every hit.
Nice Magi, Spore Druid is fun touch and an ambush build would have an easier time getting at least one turn out of the damage. Part of my perimeters for Stannis' Shadow was optimizing Initiative. I couldn't even fit Lucky in, and I've struggled to find a way to squeeze in Twilight Cleric 1 as well for the purpose. Some extra damage from spores is certainly a nice, but I couldn't imagine presenting an Assassin build without copious initiative boosts. That ability is just so bad it really needs all the help it can get.
@Zuma: You can't take Agonizing Blast with Eldritch Adept unless you have a level in warlock. Any invocations that have a prerequisite require you to be a warlock that meets those prerequisites.
In my opinion Contagion is not a very good way to increase damage. It takes 3 turns for it to activate in the best scenario and if you are attacking with a swarm of 70+ minions whatever you are attacking will likely be dead after the 2nd round if not the 1st round.
That's true. I was lightly lampooning the idea that everyone assumes all saves fail and all attacks hit, but having to wait a minimum of 3 turns makes it nonfunctional. I believe it works with Hold Monster, to at least double damage dice and gain advantage. That does mean we can't use our bonus action for Danse Macabre or Animate Objects. Behold, the revised Teaspoon Tyrant:
Preparation: Use your level 3+ spell slots, Arcane Recovery, and Signature Spell to cast Tiny Servant, giving you 92 of them. Leave a level 5 slot. Give all servants a general order to attack whoever you Eldritch Blast and immediately retreat into your bag.
Action: Cast Hold Monster, using a portent to ensure failure.
BA: 4 Quickened Eldritch Blasts for 2d10+5 each.
General order: 92 Servants for 2d4+3 each.
4*(2*5,5+5) + 92*(2*2,5+3) = an average of 800 damage per round.
Still no need for a surprise round or any magic items, but I'd expect my DM to quickly start giving every enemy immunity to nonmagical attacks if I try to pull this off. Not unfeasible for a crazy oneshot!
Yup like HeironymusZot pointed out you cannot take Agonizing Blast. Also you cannot cast Hold Monster then Quicken EB, you need to do it the other way around. Still not sure about the general order thing for Tiny Servants. I mean they have an INT score of 2 and getting 92 of them to pull of a complex maneuver in which they all get in an attack within 6 seconds without getting in each others way is something that requires special forces level training lol. If I was DMing I would probably give them all disadvantage for that very reason.
Ah, well the Eldritch Blast only accounts for 8% of the total damage, so let's just remove the crazy prerequisites, change the general order to a bonus action order (or add a Cloak of Billowing), and decrease the total damage per round to 736, unless anyone's got a wilder idea.
The practicality of this is definitely up to DM discretion. Personally I'm imagining being swarmed by cutlery, which doesn't require a great deal of coordination or intelligence. Even so, disadvantage would just cancel out the advantage from Hold Monster, so it's not the end of the world. As a DM I wouldn't see a problem with it if you're a level 20 wizard and this is what you want to do with all of your spell slots and your turn, and as ThelonelyMagi pointed out earlier I'd take the hit and ready an action to fireball your swarm the next time it comes out, or do so directly if I still have line of effect.
(In case anyone is wondering what damage this build would do with hit chance included, against AC 20 it's ~375 DPR with advantage and ~221 without. Without the Hold Person it's ~280 and ~163 respectively. At AC 25 and above the Servants only hit on a crit and DPR is only ~72 and ~38 respectively. Apply damage resistance liberally.)
Bladesinger Wizard 8, Sorcerer 4, Pact of the Hexblade Warlock 3, Echo Knight 3, Paladin 2
Feat: Great Weapon Master, Crossbow Expert (if close combat shooter isn't available)
Item: Illusionists Bracers (optional), Big Glaive, maybe a couple of stat tomes to get required ability scores.
Invocation: Agonizing Blast, Improved Pact Weapon
Setup: Hexblade Curse, Spirit Shroud upcast to lvl 7, Echo and self next to target
Bonus Action: Use Quicken Spell or bracers to fire off Eldritch Blast
4* 1d10 + 5 + 6 + 3d8
Action: Attack using Bladesinger's Extra Attack and fire off Eldritch Blast. Proc additional attack from Echo's location using Unleash Incarnation. Use Divine Smite/GWM on the regular attack and the echo attack.
4* 1d10 + 5 + 6 + 3d8
2* 1d10 + 1 + 5 + 6 + 3d8 + 10 + 5d8
Trigger Action Surge and use Bladesinger extra attack. This time use Twinned Spell to fire off Booming Blade twice. If you got 14 Con proc another attack from Echo using Unleash Incarnation. Use Divine Smite/GWM on the BB attacks, regular attack and the echo attack.
2* 1d10 + 1 + 5 + 6 + 3d8 + 10 + 5d8 + 7d8
2* 1d10 + 1 + 5 + 6 + 3d8 + 10 + 5d8
Min Damage: 320
Average Damage: 684
Max Damage: 1048
MaD as they come (13 in Str, Int, Wis, 14 in Con and 20 in Cha) and there is a debate about Twinned spell on Booming Blade. Required target to move and trigger BB. Feat tight but could be boosted by a magical weapon
(all damage ignoring any crits, misses or rerolls from Great Weapon Fighting)
EDIT: Maybe you could do more by losing warlock. Casting more Booming Blade and Twinning them while using the extra slots to Divine Smite some more? Might boost max damage to ~1246 depending on available smite slots/sorcery points. Potentially getting something levels in Fey Wanderer and getting Dreadful Strikes or another smiting weapon attack through Hunter/Horde Breaker (Max of ~1382)
EDIT 2: if you use your bonus to cast spirit shroud and already have an echo in place it is 936 max
You could use a point buy to get 15, 13, 13, 13, 11, 8. Add a custom or v.human and boost primary stat to 16 and Con to 12 and take GWM for your racial feat. Use your following 3 ASI to boost Con to 14 and primary to 20.
The edited ranger idea would need 13 dex which makes it nigh impossible
Feist's idea is interesting but 2 turns of setup is asking a little too much I feel. I've tried to refine it a little bit and came up with the following: 8 Bladesinger Wizard, 4 Sorcerer/Bard, 2 Paladin, 2 Hexblade Warlock, 4 Echo Knight. Ability Scores will be as follows 13 STR, 8 DEX, 13 CON, 13 INT, 11 WIS, 15 CHA. You can pretty much use whatever race you desire and this build comes with 4-5 ASI/feats which is more than enough to do whatever build you please.
For my personal build I would wear heavy armor and use a shield for a solid AC and my ASIs will be used to max CHA, bump STR to 15 and take the Warcaster feat. My trusty weapon will be the Whip. Combat if no prep I will close to within 10 ft of the enemy and cast Spirit Shroud upcast with a 7th level spellslot to grant an additional 3d8 to all my attacks. Then I attack with Eldritch Blast (with no disadvantage because 10 ft distance) doing 4 x (1d10 + 3d8 + 5) which averages to 96, then we throw in 2 Whip attacks (Echo Knight) from 10 ft away because of reach with Divine Smites doing another 2 x (1d4 + 8d8 +5) which averages to 87. Then we Action Surge and do it all again resulting in total average damage of 366 with no setup.
If I had a round to setup I would try to cast Bestow Curse with a 5th level slot and throw on Hexblade's Curse. This results in an average increase of 10.5 damage per hit which thanks to the 12 hits we are dishing out during the nova round equates to another 126 average damage boosting the total average damage to a very respectable 492.
What I like most about this build is even after the Nova round it still has a TON of damage potential.
I have once thought about what it would be to play a Goblin, level 18 Fire Giant Soul Sorcerer and level 2 Fighter. The Fire Giant Souls abilities at level 1 give you Fire bolt and burning hands, at level 3 give you Flaming Sphere, at level 6 every time you cast one of these spells in one turn then your CON mod stacks onto the next one as damage, the level 14 is irrelevant to this build, and the level 18 raise your CON mod by 2. You need +5 CON and +5 CHA, which then at level 18 gives you +6 CON. You spend 2 sorcery points to quickened spell cast Flaming Sphere at 9th level right in front of the enemy dealing 9d6+6 fire damage, then use your action to twinned spell cast firebolt for 4d10+12 and then 4d10+18. Then Action Surge for twinned spell fire bolt again dealing 4d10+24 and 4d10+30. Then use the bonus action from action surge to move flaming sphere back 5ft then forward 5ft 3 times dealing the damage again 3 times for 9d6+30 3 times. And on the last fire bolt just add the Fury of the Small 20 damage. This gives you 20(fury of the small)+16d10(4 fire bolts)+36d6(4 flaming sphere damage)+180(multiplied CON mod). Total Average Damage: 388 fire damage in one turn. And they couldn't even be resistant to it because of elemental adept fire option at 4th level.
If you're allowing some set up before combat, or rather a lot of set up, just tack on as many Glyphs of Warding onto every page of a book, and then have them all go off either when the book is opened or when a command word is spoken. Assuming a 10k gp budget, which is, admittedly, high, you could deal 550d8 damage for an average of 2,200 that can be spread out among different damage types. Ends up having a range of between 550-4400 damage before saving throws.
If you're allowing some set up before combat, or rather a lot of set up, just tack on as many Glyphs of Warding onto every page of a book, and then have them all go off either when the book is opened or when a command word is spoken. Assuming a 10k gp budget, which is, admittedly, high, you could deal 550d8 damage for an average of 2,200 that can be spread out among different damage types. Ends up having a range of between 550-4400 damage before saving throws.
The one major problem I find with this method is you have the range of the spell. If your target is in say a castle or something, you have to sneak in. Get to within 10 ft of where you plan to spring the ambush and potentially spend weeks there filling your book with Glyph of Wardings. All this without being detected. Prep is one thing, having a vacation in an enemy stronghold is quite another lol.
If you're allowing some set up before combat, or rather a lot of set up, just tack on as many Glyphs of Warding onto every page of a book, and then have them all go off either when the book is opened or when a command word is spoken. Assuming a 10k gp budget, which is, admittedly, high, you could deal 550d8 damage for an average of 2,200 that can be spread out among different damage types. Ends up having a range of between 550-4400 damage before saving throws.
The one major problem I find with this method is you have the range of the spell. If your target is in say a castle or something, you have to sneak in. Get to within 10 ft of where you plan to spring the ambush and potentially spend weeks there filling your book with Glyph of Wardings. All this without being detected. Prep is one thing, having a vacation in an enemy stronghold is quite another lol.
Just bring them to the book/item.
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I think that turning a bunch of Acid Vials or Alchemist's Fire or something into Tiny Servants would probably have some juice to it as well, but would be pretty DM dependent on how that gets arbitrated. Would the servants get a special action to splash themselves on the enemy? Explode when killed? Nothing?
But spending an hour and all your spell slots to temporarily animate dozens of bombs probably isn't a realistic response to anything other than a single very well planned boss fight, I doubt your DM wants to deal with you having 32 minions more than once or twice (which coincidentally, is the sad reason that Necromancer builds really aren't as fun as they seem they would be).
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
Or anything with upcast Conjure Animals......
The Herald of The Gods: Paladin 11 (Vengeance)/Fighter 2/Cleric 2 (Grave)/Warlock 5 (Hexblade)- Assuming this is against a fiend or undead, with 20 in str and cha, and with a divine amulet this deals 1d12+4d8+6d8+1d8+10 times 2, then 1d12+4d8+5d8+1d8+10, the ACTION SUUURGE for 1d12+5d8+1d8+10 and 1d12+5d8+1d8+10, with hexblade’s curse. This is a nuke on feinds and undead that expends: 1 5th level slot, 3 4th level slots, and 2 3rd level slots, along with hexblade’s curs and channel divinity (both from class and amulet). Averages: 130, 60, 53, 53, for a total of 296 damage on average, and with vow of enmity this will likely crit at least once, so likely 378 on average, as a crit is 20% on each attack.
Helper of Create a World thread/Sedge is Chaotic Neutral/ Mega Yahtzee High: 34, Low: 14/I speak English, je me parle le Francais, agus Labhraim beagan Gaeilge
Dream of Days Lore Bard 9/Wizard 4 Baulder's Gate: Descent to Avernus (In Person/Over Zoom)
Saleadon Morgul Battle Smith Artificer 11 Tyranny of Dragons (In Person/Over Zoom)
Hurtharn Serpti Ghostslayer Blood Hunter 7 Spelljammer (Over Zoom)
Ex Sig
This build does not have 5th level slots, also, you can only eldritch smite once per turn. You also only need a 20 in CHA, STR can be as low as 13 (because hex warrior uses CHA with weapons), which frees up an ASI for great weapon master.
So lets see, turn 1 use both CDs. Turn 2 BA hexblade curse then:
Totalling an average 416.7475 after using 1 level 4 slot, 4 level 3, 2 channel divinities, 1 action surge, and 2 turns.
All average damages adjusted for great weapon fighting style, savage attacks (half orc), and 19% crit chance from curse and advantage.
Minor improvement: go paladin 12/warlock 4, eldritch smite does 1d8 less damage, but more than make up for it by taking the additional orcish fury feat and with the second level 4 divine smite, total average increases by 6.7525.
You are a little bit short of the damage of Stannis's Shadow Build from HeironymusZot that I posted here. It is post #175, that build is a true nova beast that requires no special items but is more of a infiltrate and assassinate against a single target then slipping out again.
I have recently figured out a way to improve that build's damage even more by swapping out Bard for 4 Levels od Shadow Sorcerer and 2 levels of Spores Druid for Symbiotic Entity to deal additional necrotic damage to every hit.
I don't see a reason why they wouldn't be able to individually attack and then retreat back, leaving space for others to move in and attack. The damage of three magic stones really doesn't compare.
General conditional orders are obviously more efficient, but I feel like using them to bypass action economy restrictions might overstep the intended purpose of the spell somewhat. You're right that it's completely rules-legal though. If you're gonna use standing orders for the Tiny Servants, for the purposes of this thought experiment it would be more damage-efficient to use the bonus action to combine it with a high-level Animate Objects or Danse Macabre.
With a ninth-level Danse Macabre, a slot for Contagion, and the rest spent on Tiny Servants, you'll have 13 empowered dancing skeletons and 65 tiny servants lined up. If the Contagion sticks and all attacks hit, that's gonna be an average of 2*(13*(3,5 + 7) + 65*(2,5 + 3)) = 988 damage.
Very true, but I think most of the damage calculations in this thread feature a single round of combat, often a surprise round, and use most of the daily resources of the class, so they wouldn't apply more than once anyway. At least this one can theoretically be used all day long, with the exception of the Contagion.
In my opinion Contagion is not a very good way to increase damage. It takes 3 turns for it to activate in the best scenario and if you are attacking with a swarm of 70+ minions whatever you are attacking will likely be dead after the 2nd round if not the 1st round.
That's true. I was lightly lampooning the idea that everyone assumes all saves fail and all attacks hit, but having to wait a minimum of 3 turns makes it nonfunctional. I believe it works with Hold Monster, to at least double damage dice and gain advantage. That does mean we can't use our bonus action for Danse Macabre or Animate Objects. Behold, the revised Teaspoon Tyrant:
Class: Wizard 20. Optimally a Diviner.
Stats: 20 cha.
Feats: Magic Initiate (Eldritch Blast), Eldritch Adept (Agonizing Blast), Metamagic Adept (Quickened Spell)
Preparation: Use your level 3+ spell slots, Arcane Recovery, and Signature Spell to cast Tiny Servant, giving you 92 of them. Leave a level 5 slot. Give all servants a general order to attack whoever you Eldritch Blast and immediately retreat into your bag.
4*(2*5,5+5) + 92*(2*2,5+3) = an average of 800 damage per round.
Still no need for a surprise round or any magic items, but I'd expect my DM to quickly start giving every enemy immunity to nonmagical attacks if I try to pull this off. Not unfeasible for a crazy oneshot!
Nice Magi, Spore Druid is fun touch and an ambush build would have an easier time getting at least one turn out of the damage. Part of my perimeters for Stannis' Shadow was optimizing Initiative. I couldn't even fit Lucky in, and I've struggled to find a way to squeeze in Twilight Cleric 1 as well for the purpose. Some extra damage from spores is certainly a nice, but I couldn't imagine presenting an Assassin build without copious initiative boosts. That ability is just so bad it really needs all the help it can get.
@Zuma: You can't take Agonizing Blast with Eldritch Adept unless you have a level in warlock. Any invocations that have a prerequisite require you to be a warlock that meets those prerequisites.
Yup like HeironymusZot pointed out you cannot take Agonizing Blast. Also you cannot cast Hold Monster then Quicken EB, you need to do it the other way around. Still not sure about the general order thing for Tiny Servants. I mean they have an INT score of 2 and getting 92 of them to pull of a complex maneuver in which they all get in an attack within 6 seconds without getting in each others way is something that requires special forces level training lol. If I was DMing I would probably give them all disadvantage for that very reason.
Ah, well the Eldritch Blast only accounts for 8% of the total damage, so let's just remove the crazy prerequisites, change the general order to a bonus action order (or add a Cloak of Billowing), and decrease the total damage per round to 736, unless anyone's got a wilder idea.
The practicality of this is definitely up to DM discretion. Personally I'm imagining being swarmed by cutlery, which doesn't require a great deal of coordination or intelligence. Even so, disadvantage would just cancel out the advantage from Hold Monster, so it's not the end of the world. As a DM I wouldn't see a problem with it if you're a level 20 wizard and this is what you want to do with all of your spell slots and your turn, and as ThelonelyMagi pointed out earlier I'd take the hit and ready an action to fireball your swarm the next time it comes out, or do so directly if I still have line of effect.
(In case anyone is wondering what damage this build would do with hit chance included, against AC 20 it's ~375 DPR with advantage and ~221 without. Without the Hold Person it's ~280 and ~163 respectively. At AC 25 and above the Servants only hit on a crit and DPR is only ~72 and ~38 respectively. Apply damage resistance liberally.)
Got one.
Bladesinger Wizard 8, Sorcerer 4, Pact of the Hexblade Warlock 3, Echo Knight 3, Paladin 2
Feat: Great Weapon Master, Crossbow Expert (if close combat shooter isn't available)
Item: Illusionists Bracers (optional), Big Glaive, maybe a couple of stat tomes to get required ability scores.
Invocation: Agonizing Blast, Improved Pact Weapon
Setup: Hexblade Curse, Spirit Shroud upcast to lvl 7, Echo and self next to target
Bonus Action: Use Quicken Spell or bracers to fire off Eldritch Blast
4* 1d10 + 5 + 6 + 3d8
Action: Attack using Bladesinger's Extra Attack and fire off Eldritch Blast. Proc additional attack from Echo's location using Unleash Incarnation. Use Divine Smite/GWM on the regular attack and the echo attack.
4* 1d10 + 5 + 6 + 3d8
2* 1d10 + 1 + 5 + 6 + 3d8 + 10 + 5d8
Trigger Action Surge and use Bladesinger extra attack. This time use Twinned Spell to fire off Booming Blade twice. If you got 14 Con proc another attack from Echo using Unleash Incarnation. Use Divine Smite/GWM on the BB attacks, regular attack and the echo attack.
2* 1d10 + 1 + 5 + 6 + 3d8 + 10 + 5d8 + 7d8
2* 1d10 + 1 + 5 + 6 + 3d8 + 10 + 5d8
Min Damage: 320
Average Damage: 684
Max Damage: 1048
MaD as they come (13 in Str, Int, Wis, 14 in Con and 20 in Cha) and there is a debate about Twinned spell on Booming Blade. Required target to move and trigger BB. Feat tight but could be boosted by a magical weapon
(all damage ignoring any crits, misses or rerolls from Great Weapon Fighting)
EDIT: Maybe you could do more by losing warlock. Casting more Booming Blade and Twinning them while using the extra slots to Divine Smite some more? Might boost max damage to ~1246 depending on available smite slots/sorcery points. Potentially getting something levels in Fey Wanderer and getting Dreadful Strikes or another smiting weapon attack through Hunter/Horde Breaker (Max of ~1382)
EDIT 2: if you use your bonus to cast spirit shroud and already have an echo in place it is 936 max
@Fiest: How are you actually building this with Race and Stats? Impressive numbers but it seems rather dubious as a build.
If you're going to allow stupid prep, this is where Glyph of Warding comes in. Just use Demiplane to store your buffs. Dropping a thousand Otiluke's Freezing Sphere on something will leave a dent.
You could use a point buy to get 15, 13, 13, 13, 11, 8. Add a custom or v.human and boost primary stat to 16 and Con to 12 and take GWM for your racial feat. Use your following 3 ASI to boost Con to 14 and primary to 20.
The edited ranger idea would need 13 dex which makes it nigh impossible
By consent of the DM giving you 160 long rests
Feist's idea is interesting but 2 turns of setup is asking a little too much I feel. I've tried to refine it a little bit and came up with the following: 8 Bladesinger Wizard, 4 Sorcerer/Bard, 2 Paladin, 2 Hexblade Warlock, 4 Echo Knight. Ability Scores will be as follows 13 STR, 8 DEX, 13 CON, 13 INT, 11 WIS, 15 CHA. You can pretty much use whatever race you desire and this build comes with 4-5 ASI/feats which is more than enough to do whatever build you please.
For my personal build I would wear heavy armor and use a shield for a solid AC and my ASIs will be used to max CHA, bump STR to 15 and take the Warcaster feat. My trusty weapon will be the Whip. Combat if no prep I will close to within 10 ft of the enemy and cast Spirit Shroud upcast with a 7th level spellslot to grant an additional 3d8 to all my attacks. Then I attack with Eldritch Blast (with no disadvantage because 10 ft distance) doing 4 x (1d10 + 3d8 + 5) which averages to 96, then we throw in 2 Whip attacks (Echo Knight) from 10 ft away because of reach with Divine Smites doing another 2 x (1d4 + 8d8 +5) which averages to 87. Then we Action Surge and do it all again resulting in total average damage of 366 with no setup.
If I had a round to setup I would try to cast Bestow Curse with a 5th level slot and throw on Hexblade's Curse. This results in an average increase of 10.5 damage per hit which thanks to the 12 hits we are dishing out during the nova round equates to another 126 average damage boosting the total average damage to a very respectable 492.
What I like most about this build is even after the Nova round it still has a TON of damage potential.
I have once thought about what it would be to play a Goblin, level 18 Fire Giant Soul Sorcerer and level 2 Fighter. The Fire Giant Souls abilities at level 1 give you Fire bolt and burning hands, at level 3 give you Flaming Sphere, at level 6 every time you cast one of these spells in one turn then your CON mod stacks onto the next one as damage, the level 14 is irrelevant to this build, and the level 18 raise your CON mod by 2. You need +5 CON and +5 CHA, which then at level 18 gives you +6 CON. You spend 2 sorcery points to quickened spell cast Flaming Sphere at 9th level right in front of the enemy dealing 9d6+6 fire damage, then use your action to twinned spell cast firebolt for 4d10+12 and then 4d10+18. Then Action Surge for twinned spell fire bolt again dealing 4d10+24 and 4d10+30. Then use the bonus action from action surge to move flaming sphere back 5ft then forward 5ft 3 times dealing the damage again 3 times for 9d6+30 3 times. And on the last fire bolt just add the Fury of the Small 20 damage. This gives you 20(fury of the small)+16d10(4 fire bolts)+36d6(4 flaming sphere damage)+180(multiplied CON mod). Total Average Damage: 388 fire damage in one turn. And they couldn't even be resistant to it because of elemental adept fire option at 4th level.
If you're allowing some set up before combat, or rather a lot of set up, just tack on as many Glyphs of Warding onto every page of a book, and then have them all go off either when the book is opened or when a command word is spoken. Assuming a 10k gp budget, which is, admittedly, high, you could deal 550d8 damage for an average of 2,200 that can be spread out among different damage types. Ends up having a range of between 550-4400 damage before saving throws.
The one major problem I find with this method is you have the range of the spell. If your target is in say a castle or something, you have to sneak in. Get to within 10 ft of where you plan to spring the ambush and potentially spend weeks there filling your book with Glyph of Wardings. All this without being detected. Prep is one thing, having a vacation in an enemy stronghold is quite another lol.
Just bring them to the book/item.