Awhile ago I was running icewindale rime of the frost maiden and one of my players cast speak with animals .I had rolled for animals in the area on a home brew table it landed on penguins so I did a impression of the skipper from the penguins of Madagascar. In response one of my Players left told me he wanted to play a serious campaign. The Penguin did not really say much accept that he's saw a man running off in a direction. I need advice on how much humor should do at the table . I want to avoid this in the future cause I actually thought my players would find it funny it's not like I had the penguins follow the party and do the stuff those penguins do all through the session. Has anyone else had a similar problem? How can I avoid this in the future?
There's no correct answer. It really depends on the party, the DM and even the kind of campaign you are running. Apparently, that player had a different idea of what level of humour/seriousness to expect than you did. In all fairness, RoftFM does lend itself to a generally more serious tone than some other adventures, but there's no right or wrong way to do it. You just have to read the table (maybe ask for other player's opinions?) and try to gauge the right level for everyone. I mean, if everyone else wants a comedy and lighthearted gags, then, well, sucks to be the serious Sam, I guess. On the other hand, if everyone but you would appreciate a deadly serious tone throughout, then tone it down.
I'm sorry, but the answer is that you have to look at your table and find out what they want, then figure out the best way to keep everyone happy, if possible.
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If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
Each and every group is different and there is no universal standard for how much humour is too much. Any number of factors - the players themselves, the tone of the rest of the campaign, what is happening at any given moment in the campaign, what characters people are playing, intoxication levels, etc. - all influence the outcome of this decision, and the “right” answer might be different even within the same campaign. This is one of those situations where the internet cannot really help you - you have to read the room and make a judgment based upon the facts as they exist at that point in time.
Personally, I air on the side of a fair bit of humour in campaigns. There’s still plenty of serious things that happen, and sometimes it veers heavily into dark comedy, but there are plenty of puns, humorous situations, and eccentric NPCs. That works for my players - they tend to play in a more “let’s get together and just have fun roleplaying” fashion, so it creates a give and take between players and myself as the DM.
If you are not familiar with the other players or their preferences, and/or are not comfortable with your ability to read the room, a session zero (even in the middle of a campaign) can help with setting expectations. You can have the same conversation you are asking here with your players, and work with them to figure out what the balance for your campaign might be.
I would not beat yourself up too much over the player quitting. Anyone who finds a single joke enough to ragequit a campaign (rather than talk to the DM) is probably not a particularly fun person to play with, and likely would have found something else to be a stick-in-the-mud over. Talk with the other players - if they do not have a problem, then count yourself lucky that the player left, rather than tried to force their view of fun on others.
I would cover this in session zero, where you go over expectation and tone for the campaign. I wouldn't change your Dm'ing style. You wanna have a silly goose time with your friends and not do some serious, dramatic, gritty game. I would just find other sillier people. If you're like me, you're not gonna enjoy Dm'ing a super serious game, so don't try to cater to people who do. "The Adventure Zone" and "Dungeons and Daddies" are good examples of what you might be looking for
Play the game you want to play. If you want humor, add humor. While a DM has some responsibility to ensure their players enjoy the game, the DM also has the right to enjoy their own campaign, too. You can try to explain what you're going for in session zero, but ultimately, players will be self-selecting. Sometimes, people discover they have different playstyles only after they start playing together. And if a player quits because they were looking for a different gaming experience, it's not a reflection of your DMing. It's just a reflection of personal preferences not matching up.
As for me, I run a campaign with some really dark themes. However, I also add silly and absurd things in to provide some variety and keep it fun. For some, my DM style is too dark. For others, it's not gritty enough. To each their own.
For me and me alone, I give myself over to the DM's story and style as a player instead of placing expectations. I'm the kind of person who puts an entire library of mismatched music on shuffle (and I do). I don't go out with the intent for something specific.
There are many who pick something to fit what they're in the mood to playing, like choosing a movie to see. This is not unreasonable. I knew someone who knew zip-all about the From Dusk 'Till Dawn movie and was expecting a gangster movie which it decidedly is not about halfway through it. Imagine a player having the impression of a gangster theme and ending up with [Vampires] instead.
(Drag a selection to include the word to see it. Chose this method to create an in-line spoiler instead of the separate spoiler box.)
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Human. Male. Possibly. Don't be a divider. My characters' backgrounds are written like instruction manuals rather than stories. My opinion and preferences don't mean you're wrong. I am 99.7603% convinced that the digital dice are messing with me. I roll high when nobody's looking and low when anyone else can see.🎲 “It's a bit early to be thinking about an epitaph. No?” will be my epitaph.
It is worth noting that, though BigLizard phrased their post as if it were speaking about objective truths, they were not. There is no right way to play D&D--and the only wrong way to play D&D to be a curmudgeon who tries to force their views on how D&D should be played on others (be it saying their game style is not "real D&D"; not being a team player; etc.). You can, of course, play D&D where the DM makes lots of fun NPCs, makes bad jokes, leads as a storyteller, and otherwise does all of the things BigLizard says do not work.
As the majority on this thread has said, figure out what works for you and your players--whatever ends up working for you will, in fact, be "real D&D."
Well said, as a DM myself i often leave the humor to my players and incorporate their jokes into the story as we go because they have chaotic nature. however i only do this while its fun for me and my players, we covered a lot of topics before session one but ultimately we still have conversations after each session about our experiences as we learn in our first campaign together what we all enjoy. but as you said a DM has just as much right to enjoy the game as players, this is my third group as the first didn't match my style and the second lost interest after too long a break.
honestly, that sounds like a fun session to me personally. As a DM i have learned that communication of expectation and desire is not only key but a constant theme. i hope you are not discouraged from experimenting and improvising at the table, as for humor i personally let my players lead. my players are very chaotic and loud so i generally play into the jokes and bring to life that humor such as renaming npcs on the fly. If only one player is demanding serious and immersive game while you and the rest would like at least some humor that is a conversation worth having either as a group or privately as you believe would help. maybe use Easter egg like jokes sprinkled in or references to common hobbies between players. i hope you and your players the best!
The fundamental issue here is the broken promise that D&D is a game of playing and creating a story at the table with friends, it's not, it never has been and never will be. D&D is a game in which you run adventures and/or campaigns. The story that is created, this part of the game happens after the session and what the story is and how it is actually told depends on the players and their perceptions about what actually happened in the sessions they remember and the moments they remember. You cannot (en)force "story" into the game, story is what incidentally happens in D&D as you play the game. It's not theatre, it's a game.
The point here is don't do stupid stuff to be funny because you want to create a "fun story" for them to remember, this does not work. Contrary to what Critical Role has taught you, they (Critical Role) are not playing D&D, they are putting on a show for an audience with the awareness that there will be an audience and that is not the same thing as playing D&D at home with your friends. What you are experiencing is the effects of what happens when you try to put on a theatre show with no audience for your players... that is not why they (your players) showed up at your house... they showed up... to play D&D and D&D is a game that is governed by rules based on a fantasy version of a real world. It's not a cartoon, it's not a puppet show, it's not theatre, it's not an opportunity to try out your stand-up material or any other silly crap you see on youtube.
Real D&D games, the way they play out, the way they are executed is absolutely nothing like how its represented on Youtube which sadly has been the primary way people have been initiated into the hobby and the reason why topics like this are repeated a million times, over and over again on this forum.
My advice is this. Recognize and make peace with the fact that you are not a storyteller and you are not there to entertain your players as a DM. Funny things will happen in your game naturally as they do in the real world, stories will be remembered just like they are in the real world and memories will be created as a result just like in the real world. But you can't create or make a D&D session a memorable story any more than you can make a fishing trip a memorable story. Some D&D sessions will become the stuff of legend, stories your players will tell in the aftermath of the game years after they happen but most will disappear into irrelevant obscurity and this is normal just like a good fishing story is based on the events of one exciting day out of many days of relatively boring standing around looking at the lake doing nothing but drinking beer.
The most surefire way to ruin a D&D experience for a group is to, as a DM, try to force something to happen based on a vision of a story you want to create for players, in fact this is the bane of most new DM's who get into the hobby thinking that this is what the DM does. It's not really how it works in practice and this is going to be very painfully obvious to your players when you try. This isn't complaining by your player that he doesn't want funny things to happen, he is complaining that you are trying to force funny things to happen by doing voices and like-minded silly nonsense to try to make the experience memorable so that you can trick your players into telling the story of your game later... my advice is don't do that.. This cannot be artificially created and anyone who tells you differently is full of it. let the game be a game, execute it with a neutral tone and let the story evolve naturally, sporadically and unexpectedly which will include funny moments.
I have been running games for over 30 years, trust me when I tell you that when a player talks about a memorable character, story or a series of events in a game they were in, I guarantee you it was not because the DM is a brilliant storyteller. It's the result of unplanned, incidental results of what happens when a group of people get together and play D&D week after week for some time. Anyone who takes credit for such things is utterly and objectively full of ... ...
yeah...im sorry but your entirely wrong here my guy, people can and will : do the funny voices, do bad jokes and multiple other things, and yes, while trying to railroad your party down a certain path isnt great, that isnt what anyone was talking about: also dnd, is very much about creating a story with friends and if that means they want an actually scripted out game? thats still dnd, and creating a story with friends if they dont? thats still dnd, and creating a story with friends you dont have to do things neutrally, or in a flat tone, you can have fun, its all about how it meshes with the group your playing with, and sometimes it just doesnt work, just like i can tell you the majority of the 200+ players ive played with, would find the neutral tone boring as **** and wonder why you didnt inject jokes into your game
you very much run your game how you want and how your party is cool with. this guys player didnt like what happened and he left, that happens sometimes, I should know, ive been playing nearly three decades myself, and can tell you that it happens
TLDR : sometimes people leave, you cant really control that, just have fun and play it the way you want to
If a player leaves over something as simple as that then at least you both know what kind of game you want to run: yours is somewhat lighthearted, and that player wants a constantly serious game. When people feel they can tell jokes, especially bad ones, it usually means they're comfortable at the table with present company. If that person isn't ready for that, or doesn't like that sort of humour, they're fine to go elsewhere.
You can police the humour at your table, you can ban certain subjects or gags, but it's impossible to eliminate all jokes and goofing around. If you say "no jokes" in your Session Zero because you'd be laughed off the table, ironically enough.
My conclusion is this person was having a bad day and wanted any excuse to take it out on someone else and unfortunately that person was you. I can't give you any advice because the problem lies with that player, not you.
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Zero is the most important number in D&D: Session Zero sets the boundaries and the tone; Rule Zero dictates the Dungeon Master (DM) is the final arbiter; and Zero D&D is better than Bad D&D.
"Let us speak plainly now, and in earnest, for words mean little without the weight of conviction."
It is worth noting that, though BigLizard phrased their post as if it were speaking about objective truths, they were not. There is no right way to play D&D--and the only wrong way to play D&D to be a curmudgeon who tries to force their views on how D&D should be played on others (be it saying their game style is not "real D&D"; not being a team player; etc.). You can, of course, play D&D where the DM makes lots of fun NPCs, makes bad jokes, leads as a storyteller, and otherwise does all of the things BigLizard says do not work.
As the majority on this thread has said, figure out what works for you and your players--whatever ends up working for you will, in fact, be "real D&D."
Back in the day, it was pretty much expected that once in a while the game would have to be paused for half an hour as the players were too busy making Monty Python or Time Bandits or Princess Bride references to actually pay attention.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
It is worth noting that, though BigLizard phrased their post as if it were speaking about objective truths, they were not. There is no right way to play D&D--and the only wrong way to play D&D to be a curmudgeon who tries to force their views on how D&D should be played on others (be it saying their game style is not "real D&D"; not being a team player; etc.). You can, of course, play D&D where the DM makes lots of fun NPCs, makes bad jokes, leads as a storyteller, and otherwise does all of the things BigLizard says do not work.
As the majority on this thread has said, figure out what works for you and your players--whatever ends up working for you will, in fact, be "real D&D."
Back in the day, it was pretty much expected that once in a while the game would have to be paused for half an hour as the players were too busy making Monty Python or Time Bandits or Princess Bride references to actually pay attention.
mine still do that, except we added anime references to ours, just cuz we all into it
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Awhile ago I was running icewindale rime of the frost maiden and one of my players cast speak with animals .I had rolled for animals in the area on a home brew table it landed on penguins so I did a impression of the skipper from the penguins of Madagascar. In response one of my Players left told me he wanted to play a serious campaign. The Penguin did not really say much accept that he's saw a man running off in a direction. I need advice on how much humor should do at the table . I want to avoid this in the future cause I actually thought my players would find it funny it's not like I had the penguins follow the party and do the stuff those penguins do all through the session. Has anyone else had a similar problem? How can I avoid this in the future?
There's no correct answer. It really depends on the party, the DM and even the kind of campaign you are running. Apparently, that player had a different idea of what level of humour/seriousness to expect than you did. In all fairness, RoftFM does lend itself to a generally more serious tone than some other adventures, but there's no right or wrong way to do it. You just have to read the table (maybe ask for other player's opinions?) and try to gauge the right level for everyone. I mean, if everyone else wants a comedy and lighthearted gags, then, well, sucks to be the serious Sam, I guess. On the other hand, if everyone but you would appreciate a deadly serious tone throughout, then tone it down.
I'm sorry, but the answer is that you have to look at your table and find out what they want, then figure out the best way to keep everyone happy, if possible.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
Each and every group is different and there is no universal standard for how much humour is too much. Any number of factors - the players themselves, the tone of the rest of the campaign, what is happening at any given moment in the campaign, what characters people are playing, intoxication levels, etc. - all influence the outcome of this decision, and the “right” answer might be different even within the same campaign. This is one of those situations where the internet cannot really help you - you have to read the room and make a judgment based upon the facts as they exist at that point in time.
Personally, I air on the side of a fair bit of humour in campaigns. There’s still plenty of serious things that happen, and sometimes it veers heavily into dark comedy, but there are plenty of puns, humorous situations, and eccentric NPCs. That works for my players - they tend to play in a more “let’s get together and just have fun roleplaying” fashion, so it creates a give and take between players and myself as the DM.
If you are not familiar with the other players or their preferences, and/or are not comfortable with your ability to read the room, a session zero (even in the middle of a campaign) can help with setting expectations. You can have the same conversation you are asking here with your players, and work with them to figure out what the balance for your campaign might be.
I would not beat yourself up too much over the player quitting. Anyone who finds a single joke enough to ragequit a campaign (rather than talk to the DM) is probably not a particularly fun person to play with, and likely would have found something else to be a stick-in-the-mud over. Talk with the other players - if they do not have a problem, then count yourself lucky that the player left, rather than tried to force their view of fun on others.
I would cover this in session zero, where you go over expectation and tone for the campaign. I wouldn't change your Dm'ing style. You wanna have a silly goose time with your friends and not do some serious, dramatic, gritty game. I would just find other sillier people. If you're like me, you're not gonna enjoy Dm'ing a super serious game, so don't try to cater to people who do. "The Adventure Zone" and "Dungeons and Daddies" are good examples of what you might be looking for
Play the game you want to play. If you want humor, add humor. While a DM has some responsibility to ensure their players enjoy the game, the DM also has the right to enjoy their own campaign, too. You can try to explain what you're going for in session zero, but ultimately, players will be self-selecting. Sometimes, people discover they have different playstyles only after they start playing together. And if a player quits because they were looking for a different gaming experience, it's not a reflection of your DMing. It's just a reflection of personal preferences not matching up.
As for me, I run a campaign with some really dark themes. However, I also add silly and absurd things in to provide some variety and keep it fun. For some, my DM style is too dark. For others, it's not gritty enough. To each their own.
I'm ambivalent because I'm not everyone else.
For me and me alone, I give myself over to the DM's story and style as a player instead of placing expectations. I'm the kind of person who puts an entire library of mismatched music on shuffle (and I do). I don't go out with the intent for something specific.
There are many who pick something to fit what they're in the mood to playing, like choosing a movie to see. This is not unreasonable. I knew someone who knew zip-all about the From Dusk 'Till Dawn movie and was expecting a gangster movie which it decidedly is not about halfway through it. Imagine a player having the impression of a gangster theme and ending up with [Vampires] instead.
(Drag a selection to include the word to see it. Chose this method to create an in-line spoiler instead of the separate spoiler box.)
Human. Male. Possibly. Don't be a divider.
My characters' backgrounds are written like instruction manuals rather than stories. My opinion and preferences don't mean you're wrong.
I am 99.7603% convinced that the digital dice are messing with me. I roll high when nobody's looking and low when anyone else can see.🎲
“It's a bit early to be thinking about an epitaph. No?” will be my epitaph.
It is worth noting that, though BigLizard phrased their post as if it were speaking about objective truths, they were not. There is no right way to play D&D--and the only wrong way to play D&D to be a curmudgeon who tries to force their views on how D&D should be played on others (be it saying their game style is not "real D&D"; not being a team player; etc.). You can, of course, play D&D where the DM makes lots of fun NPCs, makes bad jokes, leads as a storyteller, and otherwise does all of the things BigLizard says do not work.
As the majority on this thread has said, figure out what works for you and your players--whatever ends up working for you will, in fact, be "real D&D."
Well said, as a DM myself i often leave the humor to my players and incorporate their jokes into the story as we go because they have chaotic nature. however i only do this while its fun for me and my players, we covered a lot of topics before session one but ultimately we still have conversations after each session about our experiences as we learn in our first campaign together what we all enjoy. but as you said a DM has just as much right to enjoy the game as players, this is my third group as the first didn't match my style and the second lost interest after too long a break.
honestly, that sounds like a fun session to me personally. As a DM i have learned that communication of expectation and desire is not only key but a constant theme. i hope you are not discouraged from experimenting and improvising at the table, as for humor i personally let my players lead. my players are very chaotic and loud so i generally play into the jokes and bring to life that humor such as renaming npcs on the fly. If only one player is demanding serious and immersive game while you and the rest would like at least some humor that is a conversation worth having either as a group or privately as you believe would help. maybe use Easter egg like jokes sprinkled in or references to common hobbies between players. i hope you and your players the best!
yeah...im sorry but your entirely wrong here my guy, people can and will : do the funny voices, do bad jokes and multiple other things, and yes, while trying to railroad your party down a certain path isnt great, that isnt what anyone was talking about: also dnd, is very much about creating a story with friends
and if that means they want an actually scripted out game? thats still dnd, and creating a story with friends
if they dont? thats still dnd, and creating a story with friends
you dont have to do things neutrally, or in a flat tone, you can have fun, its all about how it meshes with the group your playing with, and sometimes it just doesnt work, just like i can tell you the majority of the 200+ players ive played with, would find the neutral tone boring as **** and wonder why you didnt inject jokes into your game
you very much run your game how you want and how your party is cool with. this guys player didnt like what happened and he left, that happens sometimes, I should know, ive been playing nearly three decades myself, and can tell you that it happens
TLDR : sometimes people leave, you cant really control that, just have fun and play it the way you want to
If a player leaves over something as simple as that then at least you both know what kind of game you want to run: yours is somewhat lighthearted, and that player wants a constantly serious game. When people feel they can tell jokes, especially bad ones, it usually means they're comfortable at the table with present company. If that person isn't ready for that, or doesn't like that sort of humour, they're fine to go elsewhere.
You can police the humour at your table, you can ban certain subjects or gags, but it's impossible to eliminate all jokes and goofing around. If you say "no jokes" in your Session Zero because you'd be laughed off the table, ironically enough.
My conclusion is this person was having a bad day and wanted any excuse to take it out on someone else and unfortunately that person was you. I can't give you any advice because the problem lies with that player, not you.
Zero is the most important number in D&D: Session Zero sets the boundaries and the tone; Rule Zero dictates the Dungeon Master (DM) is the final arbiter; and Zero D&D is better than Bad D&D.
"Let us speak plainly now, and in earnest, for words mean little without the weight of conviction."
- The Assemblage of Houses, World of Warcraft
Back in the day, it was pretty much expected that once in a while the game would have to be paused for half an hour as the players were too busy making Monty Python or Time Bandits or Princess Bride references to actually pay attention.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
mine still do that, except we added anime references to ours, just cuz we all into it