I have reviewed other posts but never been able to get a clear answer on the 2024 rules. Any insights are much appreciated!
Two questions:
1. With a Halberd does the bonus action attack with the back of the Halberd also have the Cleave weapon property? I understand Cleave can only happen once per turn, but assume the main attacks missed, but the character did hit with the bonus action attack. Would Cleave trigger off the back of the Halberd? If so, is the extra attack against another enemy within 5 feet be from the main halberd blade end (1d10) or from the back of the Halberd (1d4) ?
2. If you have a +1 Halberd, is the back of the Halberd used for the bonus action attack also at +1 ?
I'd say "opposite end of the weapon" is still the weapon, so all its properties should apply. For example, for a Halberd: Heavy, Reach, and the Weapon Mastery Cleave. Or with a Quarterstaff, you could apply Topple when you make the Bonus Action attack.
Following this ruling, the extra attack against a second creature would use the main part of the weapon, so 1d10.
(that said, I'd agree if a DM ruled differently, if they consider the opposite end of the weapon doesn't have any Mastery Property)
As for the second question, yes, a magic weapon applies to the Bonus Action attack from Polearm Master.
Regarding #2: be aware that D&D Beyond will put a bonus action on your character sheet for the Polearm Master extra attack, but it has no way of choosing which weapon it applies to.
This means that the attack bonus and damage roll listed will not include the benefits of any magic weapon you're carrying. As TarodNet said, the +1 bonus from the magic weapon does apply according to the rules, but you will need to do the math on it yourself as D&D Beyond won't do it for you.
The back end of the weapon is a 1d4 Bludgeoning attack and could not possible have Cleave as cleaving implies slashing across two opponents and the butt of the Halberd is just a wooden tick. It would still get a +1 though.
Realistically the Polearm is useful at 10ft and gets an Opportunity attack when an opponent comes within reach, but closer it is useless and a secondary weapon would need to be used. Have a look at historical uses to the Halberd and clearly the weapon is a standoff weapon and users would drop it to fight with a sword or other weapon once an opponent gets too close.
The back end of the weapon is a 1d4 Bludgeoning attack and could not possible have Cleave as cleaving implies slashing across two opponents and the butt of the Halberd is just a wooden tick [...]
As I mentioned, I could agree with this ruling. But RAW, this seems to me more narrative than actual rules.
The back end of the weapon is a 1d4 Bludgeoning attack and could not possible have Cleave as cleaving implies slashing across two opponents and the butt of the Halberd is just a wooden tick. It would still get a +1 though.
I could understand that PoV but IMO the RAW doesn't make that distinction (and I don't think it would be over powered to allow it). However...
Following this ruling, the extra attack against a second creature would use the main part of the weapon, so 1d10.
As for the second question, yes, a magic weapon applies to the Bonus Action attack from Polearm Master.
Cleave says that it takes "the weapons damage" and in the case of the opposite end that is a d4 damage die so I would enforce that. But yes, additional bonuses due to being magical would still apply.
The back end of the weapon is a 1d4 Bludgeoning attack and could not possible have Cleave as cleaving implies slashing across two opponents and the butt of the Halberd is just a wooden tick. It would still get a +1 though.
I could understand that PoV but IMO the RAW doesn't make that distinction (and I don't think it would be over powered to allow it). However...
Following this ruling, the extra attack against a second creature would use the main part of the weapon, so 1d10.
As for the second question, yes, a magic weapon applies to the Bonus Action attack from Polearm Master.
Cleave says that it takes "the weapons damage" and in the case of the opposite end that is a d4 damage die so I would enforce that. But yes, additional bonuses due to being magical would still apply.
Yeah, I had considered that possibility too.
I interpreted it differently, since Cleave says:
If you hit a creature with a melee attack roll using this weapon, you can make a melee attack roll with the weapon against a second creature within 5 feet of the first that is also within your reach.
To me, the blue part happens thanks to the Attack action (1d10) or, in this scenario, your Bonus Action from Polearm Master (1d4).
And the green part happens when you make a new melee attack roll using the main part of the weapon—the regular way each Master Property is used—in this case, the Halberd's blade (1d10).
This approach also keeps the narrative that BlackDog13 pointed out.
I have reviewed other posts but never been able to get a clear answer on the 2024 rules. Any insights are much appreciated!
The answer is that 2024 does not give a clear answer. PAM allows you to "make a melee attack with the opposite end of the weapon". As that is an attack with the weapon, you would expect that any properties that apply when you attack with that weapon (such as masteries and enchantment) would continue to apply, but as far as I know "opposite end of the weapon" is used nowhere else, so it's not absurd to think it has different properties.
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I have reviewed other posts but never been able to get a clear answer on the 2024 rules. Any insights are much appreciated!
Two questions:
1. With a Halberd does the bonus action attack with the back of the Halberd also have the Cleave weapon property? I understand Cleave can only happen once per turn, but assume the main attacks missed, but the character did hit with the bonus action attack. Would Cleave trigger off the back of the Halberd? If so, is the extra attack against another enemy within 5 feet be from the main halberd blade end (1d10) or from the back of the Halberd (1d4) ?
2. If you have a +1 Halberd, is the back of the Halberd used for the bonus action attack also at +1 ?
Thank you!
I'd say "opposite end of the weapon" is still the weapon, so all its properties should apply. For example, for a Halberd: Heavy, Reach, and the Weapon Mastery Cleave. Or with a Quarterstaff, you could apply Topple when you make the Bonus Action attack.
Following this ruling, the extra attack against a second creature would use the main part of the weapon, so 1d10.
(that said, I'd agree if a DM ruled differently, if they consider the opposite end of the weapon doesn't have any Mastery Property)
As for the second question, yes, a magic weapon applies to the Bonus Action attack from Polearm Master.
Regarding #2: be aware that D&D Beyond will put a bonus action on your character sheet for the Polearm Master extra attack, but it has no way of choosing which weapon it applies to.
This means that the attack bonus and damage roll listed will not include the benefits of any magic weapon you're carrying. As TarodNet said, the +1 bonus from the magic weapon does apply according to the rules, but you will need to do the math on it yourself as D&D Beyond won't do it for you.
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The back end of the weapon is a 1d4 Bludgeoning attack and could not possible have Cleave as cleaving implies slashing across two opponents and the butt of the Halberd is just a wooden tick. It would still get a +1 though.
Realistically the Polearm is useful at 10ft and gets an Opportunity attack when an opponent comes within reach, but closer it is useless and a secondary weapon would need to be used. Have a look at historical uses to the Halberd and clearly the weapon is a standoff weapon and users would drop it to fight with a sword or other weapon once an opponent gets too close.
As I mentioned, I could agree with this ruling. But RAW, this seems to me more narrative than actual rules.
EDIT: for clarity.
I could understand that PoV but IMO the RAW doesn't make that distinction (and I don't think it would be over powered to allow it). However...
Cleave says that it takes "the weapons damage" and in the case of the opposite end that is a d4 damage die so I would enforce that. But yes, additional bonuses due to being magical would still apply.
Yeah, I had considered that possibility too.
I interpreted it differently, since Cleave says:
To me, the blue part happens thanks to the Attack action (1d10) or, in this scenario, your Bonus Action from Polearm Master (1d4).
And the green part happens when you make a new melee attack roll using the main part of the weapon—the regular way each Master Property is used—in this case, the Halberd's blade (1d10).
This approach also keeps the narrative that BlackDog13 pointed out.
EDIT: for clarity.
The answer is that 2024 does not give a clear answer. PAM allows you to "make a melee attack with the opposite end of the weapon". As that is an attack with the weapon, you would expect that any properties that apply when you attack with that weapon (such as masteries and enchantment) would continue to apply, but as far as I know "opposite end of the weapon" is used nowhere else, so it's not absurd to think it has different properties.