Quote from ornithoptercat >>

This is awful. It removed the shared spells, which already covered the healing this allows - and you didn't even let it heal from Laying on Hands on yourself! It's slower and slightly lower HP than a Pegasus even at Casting Level 5. 

And it STILL doesn't let you equip it with barding, nor even the required saddle, without having to carry that stuff if it dies, or address survivability in high level combat!

To make this halfway decent: Have it show up with Plate Barding (flat AC 18), military/exotic military saddle, and bridle (which vanish if removed or when it does, so you can't exploit them). Give it back shared spells. Build at least some of the effects of Mounted Combatant (you can force an attack targeted at your mount to target you instead, evasion) into it. Give it double the HP. NOW you have a worthy steed.

 I was under the impression that Find Steed didn't require a saddle, given that it's a summoned creature that works in perfect tandem with its rider. As for showing up with flat 18 AC, that would be pretty busted at 5th level, which is the earliest level you can cast this at. It might be better to just double the AC bonus it gets per spell level, which would end up with 20 AC when cast with 5th level slots at high levels: 14 at 2nd level, 16 at 3rd, 18 at 4th, and 20 at 5th. That might open it up to abuse with multiclassed characters with access to 9th level slots, but you could add a special condition that the bonus caps at 20, or doesn't get any bonus when cast with a slot higher than 5th level.

What I do agree with you on, however, is that there should be some features of Mounted Combatant wrapped up in this, and return the shared spells feature. I don't know why they got rid of shared spells, since that was just a good thing to have.

Great upgrade for 17th level casters (and 20th level clerics) to get a free permanent, scaled to 8th level, flying mount.

Now, why fullcasters needed a better Find Steed for Wish is a bit of a mystery, given this is supposed to be the Paladin's steed... so it is very peculiar that the best "Find Steed" will always be a Wizard's Find Steed (or any fullcaster taking a 5-level dip into Paladin). It seems a bit short sighted and a fairly disappointing choice by the 2024 PHB design team.

Now, if the goal was to give the 2024 PHB Paladins their iconic magical steed from the heavens (or whatever), a good first step would have been to make Find Steed / Find Greater Steed a non-Wish target by making it feature (say, by tying it to the Paladin's Channel Divinity) non-spell.

Hell, it certainly should not scale past 5th level, because, Paladins don't get a spell slot above 5th level. Instead, the team made Find Steed (2024) scale entirely off spell level, so anyone committing to Paladin will never have the best version of their own iconic feature. Now, Divine Smite has a similar issue after the removal of its previous spell level cap and being turned into a 1st level spell, it just scales faster and much better multiclassing, prompting the 2024 PHB Paladin (who doesn't even have exclusive access to smite spells like Wrathful or Searing) to never be the best at what is supposed to be their spells. At least it isn't a Wish target.

The Paladin class feels like a prestige 6 level dip for a charisma based full-caster, with its main stick from 2014 being disseminated to the Warlock, Moon Druid, and Zealot Barbarian, before being turned into a BA spell variant of Brutal Critical for the 2024 PHB Paladin, oh well.

Quote from Cezmi >>

Great upgrade for 17th level casters (and 20th level clerics) to get a free permanent, scaled to 8th level, flying mount.

Now, why fullcasters needed a better Find Steed for Wish is a bit of a mystery, given this is supposed to be the Paladin's steed... so it is very peculiar that the best "Find Steed" will always be a Wizard's Find Steed (or any fullcaster taking a 5-level dip into Paladin). It seems a bit short sighted and a fairly disappointing choice by the 2024 PHB design team.

Now, if the goal was to give the 2024 PHB Paladins their iconic magical steed from the heavens (or whatever), a good first step would have been to make Find Steed / Find Greater Steed a non-Wish target by making it feature (say, by tying it to the Paladin's Channel Divinity) non-spell.

Hell, it certainly should not scale past 5th level, because, Paladins don't get a spell slot above 5th level. Instead, the team made Find Steed (2024) scale entirely off spell level, so anyone committing to Paladin will never have the best version of their own iconic feature. Now, Divine Smite has a similar issue after the removal of its previous spell level cap and being turned into a 1st level spell, it just scales faster and much better multiclassing, prompting the 2024 PHB Paladin (who doesn't even have exclusive access to smite spells like Wrathful or Searing) to never be the best at what is supposed to be their spells. At least it isn't a Wish target.

The Paladin class feels like a prestige 6 level dip for a charisma based full-caster, with its main stick from 2014 being disseminated to the Warlock, Moon Druid, and Zealot Barbarian, before being turned into a BA spell variant of Brutal Critical for the 2024 PHB Paladin, oh well.

Would duplicating this 2nd level spell with Wish mean the Find Steed is cast at 9th level? Or is it just duplicating a 2nd level spell, so you get the 2nd level results?
With Wish, I don't think you're actually casting Find Steed at 9th level, you're just using Wish to duplicate the 2nd level spell Find Steed. The same with using Wish to cast Heal, for example, I think you'd just get the 70 HP effect, not the 100 HP a cleric or druid would get from actually casting Heal with a 9th level slot.
Actually removing Find Greater Steed as a spell might actually have made it so only characters going at least 5 levels of Paladin could eventually get access to a flying mount via this spell.

Yeah, I think this is just fine. It's a magical steed you can call up wherever and whenever you want. If it dies, cast it back to life. That's the benefit. Now it can scale a little with level if you want so it's not just a base warhorse or whatever no matter your level. Plus, find greater steed is still on the paladin spell list, so you can always go for it instead (only PHB spells are now legacy).

No, it doesn't wear barding or carry saddlebags, or if you add those after the fact it all falls to the ground if the steed is killed. Difference if you had a real steed? None, except of course you can magic up a new steed 6 seconds later. This is a 2nd level spell. How much are you expecting from it? If you want a more durable mount, get a real horse and level it up with the sidekick rules.

Your paladin doesn't need to carry around a saddle. It's magic. Any DM who requires that is being needlessly pedantic. Purely my opinion, of course.

And are we really complaining about how a 17th level wizard could cast this spell really, really well with wish? Honestly? A 17th level wizard can true polymorph a boulder into a young silver dragon and ride it around for an hour, after which it could be a permanent ally. A little perspective here, people. Any wizard wasting wish on find steed has a screw loose.

Quote from Rwombat >>

Quote from Cezmi >>

Great upgrade for 17th level casters (and 20th level clerics) to get a free permanent, scaled to 8th level, flying mount.

Now, why fullcasters needed a better Find Steed for Wish is a bit of a mystery, given this is supposed to be the Paladin's steed... so it is very peculiar that the best "Find Steed" will always be a Wizard's Find Steed (or any fullcaster taking a 5-level dip into Paladin). It seems a bit short sighted and a fairly disappointing choice by the 2024 PHB design team.

Now, if the goal was to give the 2024 PHB Paladins their iconic magical steed from the heavens (or whatever), a good first step would have been to make Find Steed / Find Greater Steed a non-Wish target by making it feature (say, by tying it to the Paladin's Channel Divinity) non-spell.

Hell, it certainly should not scale past 5th level, because, Paladins don't get a spell slot above 5th level. Instead, the team made Find Steed (2024) scale entirely off spell level, so anyone committing to Paladin will never have the best version of their own iconic feature. Now, Divine Smite has a similar issue after the removal of its previous spell level cap and being turned into a 1st level spell, it just scales faster and much better multiclassing, prompting the 2024 PHB Paladin (who doesn't even have exclusive access to smite spells like Wrathful or Searing) to never be the best at what is supposed to be their spells. At least it isn't a Wish target.

The Paladin class feels like a prestige 6 level dip for a charisma based full-caster, with its main stick from 2014 being disseminated to the Warlock, Moon Druid, and Zealot Barbarian, before being turned into a BA spell variant of Brutal Critical for the 2024 PHB Paladin, oh well.

Would duplicating this 2nd level spell with Wish mean the Find Steed is cast at 9th level? Or is it just duplicating a 2nd level spell, so you get the 2nd level results?
With Wish, I don't think you're actually casting Find Steed at 9th level, you're just using Wish to duplicate the 2nd level spell Find Steed. The same with using Wish to cast Heal, for example, I think you'd just get the 70 HP effect, not the 100 HP a cleric or druid would get from actually casting Heal with a 9th level slot.
Actually removing Find Greater Steed as a spell might actually have made it so only characters going at least 5 levels of Paladin could eventually get access to a flying mount via this spell.

The funny thing is I thought Wish had different wording in regards to the duplication effect.

As for what actually happens, yeah, the Otherworldly Steed would be cast by 9th level spell, and since the Otherworldly Steed's stat-block is entirely based on the level of the spell used to summon it, which in this case is a 9th level Wish rather than an 8th level upcast of Find Steed.

Quote from DallonChevalier >>

And are we really complaining about how a 17th level wizard could cast this spell really, really well with wish? Honestly? 

Yes, because a 17th level caster gets to have a reliable, permanent, flying magical steed with a stat-block that benefits from spell level... at the cost of waiting a few more levels.

And the reason one would complain about something like this relates to two things:

1. Anyone with Wish has access to infinite flight on demand that actually scales with their 9th level cast. Sure, they could also Polymorph a rock into a dragon, but they can have both this steed, and a rock who thinks its a dragon, and I want to live in a world where the design team thinks being able to turn a rock into a dragon is good enough for fullcasters, lol.

2. The redesign of Find Steed (2024) was done under the pretense of being a boon for Paladin players, and instead, became a clear boon for high level spellcasters or Paladin Bard / Sorceror multiclasses. They're directly benefiting more from this change than the actual Paladin did

Despite all these claims about wanting to "protect" the identity of these classes, the 2024 design team opted to ignore Wish exists. The entire genesis of changing Bard's magical secrets seems mute when all they're doing is just moving the goal-post to T4 play rather than the start of T3.

Quote from DallonChevalier >>

A little perspective here, people. Any wizard wasting wish on find steed has a screw loose.

How does one "waste" Wish on a permanent duration flying steed that doesn't recquire concentration and can just exist indefinitely alongside the caster that summoned it? I'm looking for that "perspective." :)

This is worse than 2014 FS (and especially FGS) at every level (not counting the aforementioned multiclass shenanigans that is). Still disappointed by them removing the spell sharing.

But hey, technically, the way the backwards compatibility content is laid out, you can at least just still take Find Greater Steed anyways, since that's a XGtE spell. Though that does lose out on the this being a "free" spell. But on the other other hand, free-cast spells are always cast at their lowest level unless explicitly stated otherwise, so the free cast is worthless past lv 9 anyways.

I think a lot of the early posters in this thread missed a key rule: specific beats general. If the spell says the steed in question has another Action, it has that Action.

Now, whether it can use this Action while being ridden is still up for debate (I'd say yes, absolutely).

Quote from UtaGrudaveld >>

 This is based on what is written in the 2014 that "if the mount provokes an opportunity attack while you’re on it, the attacker can target you or the mount"... since it's not provoking Opportunity Attacks (through disengage), none can be made (against either rider or mount) 

Any feedback on this would be greatly appreciated. 

 Correct. Since you're not the one moving, you don't provoke opportunity attacks. Your mount does (unless it disengages).

is there a way tog et it as a medium sized mount?

If you do that, another medium-sized creature can't mount it. Only a small or maybe even tiny could mount it at that point. I would allow it in those situations.

it appears this is an update to the Find Steed spell, Otherworldly Steed

Why is that steed not available in the mount section of the Extras in the character sheet? I agree that the rework seems lacking, but at least make it readily available to the players.

So, if I'm reading this spell correctly--and I might not be--a paladin at level 17 can look forward to getting a replaceable mount with:

• 55 HP
• an AC of 15
• a flying speed of 60 feet
• a 1d8 + 5 melee attack that deals magic damage
• a single casting per day of what is basically Misty Step, Cause Fear, or Cure Wounds.

Which is neat and all. But not at level 17. Especially when you consider that at least some of these benefits are rendered redundant by:

• having a Carpet of Flying, Broom of Flying, or Winged Boots
• having a Longsword, +1,
• taking the Magic Initiate feat a few times, and/or being an elf.

True, having an independent mount increases your action economy. But then, so does having a Sidekick. In fact, depending on how generous the DM is with letting players purchase or make magic items, a High Elf warlock can replicate several of these features just by taking the Pact of the Blade and Pact of the Chain invocations with a flying familiar. At level 8.

The same is true for a High Elf Eldritch Knight fighter, who can also replicate most of the benefits of this spell. At level 6.

Or they could be a Bladesinger wizard.

A late answer but...In the current rules  (2024) "You can make an Opportunity Attack when a creature that you can see leaves your reach using its action, its Bonus Action, its Reaction, or one of its speeds."  Your mount is using the action not you, so you can not be the target of the opportunity attack, only the mount.  Also, the mount is using the disengage action so the mount can not be a target of the attack.  Neither of you take the Opportunity Attack.  Your friend is almost correct, you do not benefit from your mounts disengage, but it does not matter because you are not using your action.

As far as 2014 is concerned - The mount does not provoke an attack (disengage), so, as you pointed out this: ["if the mount provokes an opportunity attack while you’re on it, the attacker can target you or the mount".] does not apply.  Your character is being forcibly moved by the mount.  Forced movement does not provoke attacks of opportunity.  Being willing does not change what is forced (allowing yourself to be shoved/dragged for example does not provoke AAO on you).  Even if the DM does not consider it forced movement, the 2014 Attacks of Opportunity require - "A creature within your reach uses a manipulate action or a move action, makes a ranged attack, or leaves a square during a move action it's using"  Once again the mount is using it's move action so no attack on you and it is disengaging for itself so no attack or special rule trigger on the mount.

Thanks @blacshades!!! 

Your first paragraph is SO HELPFUL - it articulates a problem i've had in my own group - where a player was adamant that a mount disengaging still should have the PC exposed to an opportunity attack. Their logic being that if the horse you riding ducks from a tree branch, you're still at risk of getting hit by the branch and need to take an action (dodge/disengage) to avoid it. 

Now I can articulate - via the rules - why a disengaging mount doesn't expose the PC. Thank you. 

this is insane, even the left 4 spell summon greater demon doesn't have 18 ac, and the spell summon dragon spirit just barely as a ac of 19 at base level five so by same, but going back down to level 3 if you cast summon undead at level 5 you would have a creature with an ac of 16 on the battle field, and yet your trying to tell me that you want this level 2 base spell to have an ac of 18 on the battle field for no reason really? just stupid, also what's with all of that exotic military saddle junk, why would it have that why would that happen? just so stupid, why does it need to be exotic, can't you just go get that your self, and I don't know work to have a steed fit for a hero?

Would be nice if it was available under extras in character sheet

I would note, those are in two separate sections, one in the spell description proper, the other in the steed’s stat block. They are not necessarily tied together, though one does imply the other.

i would rule (at my table) the rider gets their normal action economy: action, bonus action, free action, reaction, as normal. And, so too, does the steed. It just so happens that the steed is more limited in what it can use those bonus actions to do (depending on type: fear effect, teleport, or healing). 

note: the healing is not a spell effect, and therefore does not instigate the life bond ability.

Quote from DallonChevalier >>

Yeah, I think this is just fine. It's a magical steed you can call up wherever and whenever you want. If it dies, cast it back to life. That's the benefit. Now it can scale a little with level if you want so it's not just a base warhorse or whatever no matter your level. Plus, find greater steed is still on the paladin spell list, so you can always go for it instead (only PHB spells are now legacy).

You have a good point there.

I was annoyed before realizing that we still had the old spell with the old wording.

Since Find Greater Steed was an expansion spell I expect that it will come out again in an expansion. My expectation, (though I could easily be wrong) is that Wizard's will drop an expansion book that covers all of the spells from say Tasha's along with adding new ones. That provides the benefit of letting the players and DMs know that all of the old spells from that book have become legacy material at the same time. Book-by-book would be less complicated than doing it on a spell-by-spell basis, though they might try it that way instead just to cause confusion and try to make people use the One D&D app just to all stay on the same page.

In any case, we'll need to see the new content before we see if they completely nerfed the greater spell too. I'm not sure that I'm holding out hope, but maybe they'll get enough feedback that they decide to keep the spells affecting the mount as a logical feature when they make the new spell. I suspect that many DMs will continue to house rule it both for game balance and common sense:

If a multi-classed paladin casts mirror image on himself while riding into combat are you just going to have three images of him sitting on their butts and floating 4 feet off the ground?

"Gee, I wonder which one is real... Nope, not that one. Hey, Gorg, do you think it might be the one on the horse?"