If it was good without numbers id be fine (see: illusionist wizards are one of my favorite subclasses) but this is a barebones idea with barely any flavor, that will almost never be used due to it not even influencing the game that much.
I don't know what kind of playstyle archivist was trying to fit into (skill proficiencies? utility? psychic stuff?
The last one, it was the Arcanist Mentalist spec of prior editions stapled on and stealing the name of a entirely different class (Archivist being focused on scroll creation, mid combat checks vs specific creature types for certain buffs and the ability to wizard it up with any divine spell/have a prayerbook that breaks how multiclassing worked which got defaulted to 5e; Mentalist in turn being a arcane pseudo-psion that can easily cc lock a enemy or two, usually with familiar and slight illusion focus, with the main gimmick being reduicng enemy saves vs their effects/thus in 5e targeting the weakest save).
Ok so, I know what the statblock of the homunculus is now. Its AC is 13, and it has hp equal to 1 + your INT + your artificer level. Low hp, yeah that sucks. It still has might of the master, and a different attack that deals 1d4+prof force damage with a reach of 30 feet (you command it to do so as a bonus action), and as a reaction it can cast artificer touch spells from you (so spare the dying could be good, it has a fly speed of 30 feet). It also has the evasion feature. I mean, its not as good? Its not horrible, scales decent ok, and can add to your damage as an alchemist, but not nearly as much. Evasion is nice, but they nerfed the hp to hell and back.
I like that if you choose to use a spell slot to make an Elixir, you can pick its effect. That makes it significantly better. I will miss Wand Prototype giving extra cantrips, but this works just as well. Thorn Whip works in either melee or at range, and is almost never resisted.
Also, I would like to point out in regards to Right Cantrip for the Job that since Artificers prepare their spells rather than know them, Spell Versatility would likely allow Artificers to switch spells out upon level up rather than after a long rest (as it does for Sorcerers or Bards) or short rest (as Artificers can do under current UA).
I like that if you choose to use a spell slot to make an Elixir, you can pick its effect. That makes it significantly better. I will miss Wand Prototype giving extra cantrips, but this works just as well. Thorn Whip works in either melee or at range, and is almost never resisted.
Also, I would like to point out in regards to Right Cantrip for the Job that since Artificers prepare their spells rather than know them, Spell Versatility would likely allow Artificers to switch spells out upon level up rather than after a long rest (as it does for Sorcerers or Bards) or short rest (as Artificers can do under current UA).
So basically it makes it worse because you have to wait for a level up every time you might want to change your cantrips. RCftJ would have been extremely useful as you could more easily change around cantrips for the situation. Thankfully our DM is cool with me just keeping it at long rests and keeping the RCftJ once I hit 10 because that's a bit hit to the class's versatility.
Well, we don't know that 100% for certain. There is a possibility it got wrapped into a level 1 feature (No guarantee, but we haven't seen the full table yet so it's still guesswork at this point.)
I saw a pagethrough youtube video. I have seen the full table. You cannot switch out cantrip (although they would probably have the benefit of cantrip versatility a la UA variants.
Here's the thing. The other two subclasses are buffed 2nd level spells in terms of power, but experimental is a slightly better 1st level spell in terms of power (and some of them are even less). They seriously would need to buff the effects to make it work. Yes, the effects are choosable with a spell slot, but remember: artificer is a half caster, something that costs a spell slot needs to be REALLY GOOD
They also buffed many of the infusions. The +1 weapons (besides radiant weapon, repeating shot, and returning weapon) now are +2 at level 10, and radiant weapon/repulsion shield are now charge based, and recover 1d4 charges at dawn. Replicate magic item is now 2nd, 6th, 10th, and 14th, and seems to be scaled better (utility at 2nd, niche usefulness allowing for versatility at 6th, good generally useful items at 10th, fantastic items at 14th. An example is, at 2nd, you get bag of holding, at 6th, you get cloak of the manta ray, at 10th, you get winged boots, at 14th, you get the amulet of heatlh). You learn a max of 12 infusions, and can have a max of 6 active (they amount active seems to increase beyond 3 to fit the amount of attuned items you can have).
So the homunculus is as disappointing as everyone knew it would be. Huzzah. At least you won't have to waste an infusion on it. Buzzed through the artificer spell list earlier, next to nothing on it is both Touch-range and useful. No, Spare the Dying does not count on a class with effectively zero room for noncritical cantrips. Homunculus is more or less "kill an infusion for Mage Hand with a face". Awesome.
Especially given the loss of RCftJ. That hurts a lot on a class with so few cantrips, and makes Magic Initiate or some dips into another caster nearly mandatory. Which is itself really painful because the artificer actually has a level 20 capstone worth a damn. Still, without an expanded cantrip list somewhere, the artificer just does not have the tools it needs. That'd have to be part of any "make the class playable" Captain Fixit homebrew.
Enhanced infusions is cool and leans into the whole magic item master thing harder, especially if you ever get to the point where you're getting extra attunement slots. They're probably intending for that to make up for the artificer's nearly crippling weaknesses elsewhere, which it does not, but it at least offers some of the exploration and adventuring versatility they used to have back to them.
Blorghe. They just really don't like this class much over at Wizards, do they?
I think it's one of those instances where they tried to over-balance something and basically ended up making it lose its charm. It seems to be in a lot of products, the easiest way to balance a class/character/etc is just to remove stuff and make it worse overall. I figured artificer was considered a pretty 'low tier' class before but still had some fun and flavor to play with. Now it's hard to warrant picking one because it's not really as useful in or out of combat besides maybe buffing your team mates up a little bit.
Warforged took a hit too since I believe they lost their integrated tools and maybe a bit more. Kind of disappointed overall.
Y'all do realize that they buffed artificer right? Like, the infusions are way better than before, and scale as such. Yeah, the loss of rcftj sucked (should have been at a lower level). Homunculus isn't great but is not nearly as bad as you are making it out to be yurei. Yes, it has low damage, but alchemist is not a subclass designed to damage. It's greatest weakness is its own low hp, which stings a bit yeah, at least it has evasion but, you are probably gonna have to give it some temp hp at the start of each adventuring day. And you can't just revive it on a short rest anymore.
Nerfs: arcane weapon is gone, no full crossbow prof, rcftj is gone, alchemist is bad now
Buffs: More infusions known and active, infusions are more powerful than before, artillerist got buffed sky high to be equal to battle smith (which got nerfed, but in a reasonable way), level 7 feature is fantastic, spell storing item is level 11 now, attunement scales with level instead of being all relegated to the capstone, replicate magic item is more useful at lower levels now.
Also "nothing is touch range and useful" there are around 20 spells with a range of touch on the artificer. An alchemist SHOULD NOT have the same DPR as a battle smith or artillerist, they are a subclass focused on support. This does not mean all of their abilities should be support based (and not all of them are, see level 5). Homunculus lets their DPR be around equivalent to the other subclasses (21 DPR while homunculus is alive at level 6, increasing with levels, this is with level 5+ firebolt and prof being +3). If experimental elixir was worth a damn, I would say that the alchemist is decently balanced, but each and every one of the ones you can create is terrible and not worth the spell slot, until level 9, where it gives additional temp hp. But they couldn't make a feature worth a damn. Don't blame the fans here, there is no one saying that experimental elixir is a good feature, and what they actually wanted, blame WoTC for making a bad feature.
And virtually all of those touch-range spells are pre-fight or out-of-combat buffs where it matters not a whit if the homunculus can deliver them or not. Perhaps the one exception is Cure Wounds, so okay. People who think the entire artificer class should be nothing more than a crapass passive healbot with no combat presence or adventuring utility (so...everyone except me, apparently) can take a homunculus to throw Cure Wounds at shit from thirty feet away. Bizzwham. Class saved. #sarcasm. And frankly that whole thing works better as a Celestial patron warlock with Pact of the Chain, instead.
Remember, Bunsen. This is exactly what everyone demanded the company do. Wizards doesn't do its own game design anymore, they outsource their game design to the nebulous Internet masses. Y'all hated the homunculus when it was an awesome steampunk mechanical familiar - you lot wanted MOAR POSHUNZ. Whelp. Ye got Moar Poshunz. They're awful, and significantly weaker than the homunculus, but that's okay because they're poshunz, so they're what the players wanted. Mission: Accomplished.
Those of us who're interested in game design will be fixing the subclass shortly after Rising drops. I will let people know if the homebrew editor lets me rebuild an Alchemist worth playing.
I'm a little disappointed that they mostly got rid of the magic item crafting features, since most campaigns that I've played in don't run much past level 10. Ah well, the class still looks playable, and the infusions will make the party love you.
Wow. Ignore literally everything i said to justify a blind anger to not getting what you want from a class. Blame me for them making a bad ability. Reduce the heavily popular opinion that alchemy which in most dungeons and dragons worlds is associated most with potions should have its defining subclass ability be potion related, to just "haha boom boom" because anything other than your personal opinion is stupid and juvenile and you wont hear anything about a "support based subclass" unless it also has an acid vomiting pet that you are forced into taking. Alchemist is not a damage based subclass, it is one that focuses on support fully, instead of being half support half marital like the battle smith, or half support half caster like the artillerist. Experimental Elixir is a terrible feature, please stop whining about having a subclass fit a perfectly valid support/power cantrip playstyle that you do not like. Cause guess what, I can use random adjectives to make things look like a more intense opinion too. We didn't want "MOAR POTIONS" we wanted "potions literally at all without using a crafting rule with 3 variants that you may never get to use if the dm does not provide you downtime"
Tbh the alchemist in it's original state wasn't very good either. It was a half-assed homunculus, mixed with a half-assed skeleton for the potion alchemist everyone actually wanted. Depending on how you view it, it's a unique homunculus focused subclass dragging around the dead weight of the potion stuff everyone associates with an alchemist, or a cool potion focused artificer weighed down by a pointless familiar that doesn't have a single interesting thing done with it, and that only has number scaling as it's claim to growing stronger alongside the player.
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Giant flaming rocks filled with tarrasques fall, everyone dies.
Homunculus being an infusion I am perfectly fine with in concept. If it had a higher max hp, I would be great with it. Again, experimental elixir is not a bad feature in concept, because the idea is contributing to support (before you go "aahhh not every supporter should just do nothing all the time and be a stupid heal*****", remember, you can drink them too, and you get to make your own powerful magic weapons as an artificer, as well as having power cantrips), but the options were so underpowered that it might as well just not exist. And I have seen no one, no one, defend experimental elixir beyond "oh i read something that made it not as bad as i thought it was, although it still sucks". If WoTC outsourced their game design to the internet, as you claim, experimental elixir would be MUCH MUCH MUCH more powerful (although arcane weapon would still be gone, rip, that one stung). This is what happens when they make something without actually letting anyone playtest it.
I hate the implementation of experimental elixir so ******* much. I thought the homunculus should have been a higher level feature or infusion, yes, but when I say something like that I mean "and replaced with something as mechanically viable", or I guess that has to be outright stated, because, since I advocated for a potion related feature, that must mean I love experimental elixir right? It is horrible, and needs a significant buff. The homunculus needs to have a 3* modifier added to its hp section, and experimental elixir needs to be either: given on a long rest an amount of times equal to half your artificer level + your INT modifier, or have the effects of it buffed to be about 3 times as powerful as they are now (except bouyancy, that one is fine out of combat, can lead to some fun problem solving). If these were done, I would be fine with alchemist.
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If it was good without numbers id be fine (see: illusionist wizards are one of my favorite subclasses) but this is a barebones idea with barely any flavor, that will almost never be used due to it not even influencing the game that much.
The last one, it was the Arcanist Mentalist spec of prior editions stapled on and stealing the name of a entirely different class (Archivist being focused on scroll creation, mid combat checks vs specific creature types for certain buffs and the ability to wizard it up with any divine spell/have a prayerbook that breaks how multiclassing worked which got defaulted to 5e; Mentalist in turn being a arcane pseudo-psion that can easily cc lock a enemy or two, usually with familiar and slight illusion focus, with the main gimmick being reduicng enemy saves vs their effects/thus in 5e targeting the weakest save).
Ok so, I know what the statblock of the homunculus is now. Its AC is 13, and it has hp equal to 1 + your INT + your artificer level. Low hp, yeah that sucks. It still has might of the master, and a different attack that deals 1d4+prof force damage with a reach of 30 feet (you command it to do so as a bonus action), and as a reaction it can cast artificer touch spells from you (so spare the dying could be good, it has a fly speed of 30 feet). It also has the evasion feature. I mean, its not as good? Its not horrible, scales decent ok, and can add to your damage as an alchemist, but not nearly as much. Evasion is nice, but they nerfed the hp to hell and back.
I like that if you choose to use a spell slot to make an Elixir, you can pick its effect. That makes it significantly better. I will miss Wand Prototype giving extra cantrips, but this works just as well. Thorn Whip works in either melee or at range, and is almost never resisted.
Also, I would like to point out in regards to Right Cantrip for the Job that since Artificers prepare their spells rather than know them, Spell Versatility would likely allow Artificers to switch spells out upon level up rather than after a long rest (as it does for Sorcerers or Bards) or short rest (as Artificers can do under current UA).
@Bunsenburner03 Where did you find this, if you don't mind my asking?
So basically it makes it worse because you have to wait for a level up every time you might want to change your cantrips. RCftJ would have been extremely useful as you could more easily change around cantrips for the situation. Thankfully our DM is cool with me just keeping it at long rests and keeping the RCftJ once I hit 10 because that's a bit hit to the class's versatility.
Well, we don't know that 100% for certain. There is a possibility it got wrapped into a level 1 feature (No guarantee, but we haven't seen the full table yet so it's still guesswork at this point.)
I saw a pagethrough youtube video. I have seen the full table. You cannot switch out cantrip (although they would probably have the benefit of cantrip versatility a la UA variants.
Here's the thing. The other two subclasses are buffed 2nd level spells in terms of power, but experimental is a slightly better 1st level spell in terms of power (and some of them are even less). They seriously would need to buff the effects to make it work. Yes, the effects are choosable with a spell slot, but remember: artificer is a half caster, something that costs a spell slot needs to be REALLY GOOD
They also buffed many of the infusions. The +1 weapons (besides radiant weapon, repeating shot, and returning weapon) now are +2 at level 10, and radiant weapon/repulsion shield are now charge based, and recover 1d4 charges at dawn. Replicate magic item is now 2nd, 6th, 10th, and 14th, and seems to be scaled better (utility at 2nd, niche usefulness allowing for versatility at 6th, good generally useful items at 10th, fantastic items at 14th. An example is, at 2nd, you get bag of holding, at 6th, you get cloak of the manta ray, at 10th, you get winged boots, at 14th, you get the amulet of heatlh). You learn a max of 12 infusions, and can have a max of 6 active (they amount active seems to increase beyond 3 to fit the amount of attuned items you can have).
So the homunculus is as disappointing as everyone knew it would be. Huzzah. At least you won't have to waste an infusion on it. Buzzed through the artificer spell list earlier, next to nothing on it is both Touch-range and useful. No, Spare the Dying does not count on a class with effectively zero room for noncritical cantrips. Homunculus is more or less "kill an infusion for Mage Hand with a face". Awesome.
Especially given the loss of RCftJ. That hurts a lot on a class with so few cantrips, and makes Magic Initiate or some dips into another caster nearly mandatory. Which is itself really painful because the artificer actually has a level 20 capstone worth a damn. Still, without an expanded cantrip list somewhere, the artificer just does not have the tools it needs. That'd have to be part of any "make the class playable" Captain Fixit homebrew.
Enhanced infusions is cool and leans into the whole magic item master thing harder, especially if you ever get to the point where you're getting extra attunement slots. They're probably intending for that to make up for the artificer's nearly crippling weaknesses elsewhere, which it does not, but it at least offers some of the exploration and adventuring versatility they used to have back to them.
Blorghe. They just really don't like this class much over at Wizards, do they?
Please do not contact or message me.
I think it's one of those instances where they tried to over-balance something and basically ended up making it lose its charm. It seems to be in a lot of products, the easiest way to balance a class/character/etc is just to remove stuff and make it worse overall. I figured artificer was considered a pretty 'low tier' class before but still had some fun and flavor to play with. Now it's hard to warrant picking one because it's not really as useful in or out of combat besides maybe buffing your team mates up a little bit.
Warforged took a hit too since I believe they lost their integrated tools and maybe a bit more. Kind of disappointed overall.
Y'all do realize that they buffed artificer right? Like, the infusions are way better than before, and scale as such. Yeah, the loss of rcftj sucked (should have been at a lower level). Homunculus isn't great but is not nearly as bad as you are making it out to be yurei. Yes, it has low damage, but alchemist is not a subclass designed to damage. It's greatest weakness is its own low hp, which stings a bit yeah, at least it has evasion but, you are probably gonna have to give it some temp hp at the start of each adventuring day. And you can't just revive it on a short rest anymore.
Nerfs: arcane weapon is gone, no full crossbow prof, rcftj is gone, alchemist is bad now
Buffs: More infusions known and active, infusions are more powerful than before, artillerist got buffed sky high to be equal to battle smith (which got nerfed, but in a reasonable way), level 7 feature is fantastic, spell storing item is level 11 now, attunement scales with level instead of being all relegated to the capstone, replicate magic item is more useful at lower levels now.
Also "nothing is touch range and useful" there are around 20 spells with a range of touch on the artificer. An alchemist SHOULD NOT have the same DPR as a battle smith or artillerist, they are a subclass focused on support. This does not mean all of their abilities should be support based (and not all of them are, see level 5). Homunculus lets their DPR be around equivalent to the other subclasses (21 DPR while homunculus is alive at level 6, increasing with levels, this is with level 5+ firebolt and prof being +3). If experimental elixir was worth a damn, I would say that the alchemist is decently balanced, but each and every one of the ones you can create is terrible and not worth the spell slot, until level 9, where it gives additional temp hp. But they couldn't make a feature worth a damn. Don't blame the fans here, there is no one saying that experimental elixir is a good feature, and what they actually wanted, blame WoTC for making a bad feature.
And virtually all of those touch-range spells are pre-fight or out-of-combat buffs where it matters not a whit if the homunculus can deliver them or not. Perhaps the one exception is Cure Wounds, so okay. People who think the entire artificer class should be nothing more than a crapass passive healbot with no combat presence or adventuring utility (so...everyone except me, apparently) can take a homunculus to throw Cure Wounds at shit from thirty feet away. Bizzwham. Class saved. #sarcasm. And frankly that whole thing works better as a Celestial patron warlock with Pact of the Chain, instead.
Remember, Bunsen. This is exactly what everyone demanded the company do. Wizards doesn't do its own game design anymore, they outsource their game design to the nebulous Internet masses. Y'all hated the homunculus when it was an awesome steampunk mechanical familiar - you lot wanted MOAR POSHUNZ. Whelp. Ye got Moar Poshunz. They're awful, and significantly weaker than the homunculus, but that's okay because they're poshunz, so they're what the players wanted. Mission: Accomplished.
Those of us who're interested in game design will be fixing the subclass shortly after Rising drops. I will let people know if the homebrew editor lets me rebuild an Alchemist worth playing.
Please do not contact or message me.
I'm a little disappointed that they mostly got rid of the magic item crafting features, since most campaigns that I've played in don't run much past level 10. Ah well, the class still looks playable, and the infusions will make the party love you.
Wow. Ignore literally everything i said to justify a blind anger to not getting what you want from a class. Blame me for them making a bad ability. Reduce the heavily popular opinion that alchemy which in most dungeons and dragons worlds is associated most with potions should have its defining subclass ability be potion related, to just "haha boom boom" because anything other than your personal opinion is stupid and juvenile and you wont hear anything about a "support based subclass" unless it also has an acid vomiting pet that you are forced into taking. Alchemist is not a damage based subclass, it is one that focuses on support fully, instead of being half support half marital like the battle smith, or half support half caster like the artillerist. Experimental Elixir is a terrible feature, please stop whining about having a subclass fit a perfectly valid support/power cantrip playstyle that you do not like. Cause guess what, I can use random adjectives to make things look like a more intense opinion too. We didn't want "MOAR POTIONS" we wanted "potions literally at all without using a crafting rule with 3 variants that you may never get to use if the dm does not provide you downtime"
Tbh the alchemist in it's original state wasn't very good either. It was a half-assed homunculus, mixed with a half-assed skeleton for the potion alchemist everyone actually wanted. Depending on how you view it, it's a unique homunculus focused subclass dragging around the dead weight of the potion stuff everyone associates with an alchemist, or a cool potion focused artificer weighed down by a pointless familiar that doesn't have a single interesting thing done with it, and that only has number scaling as it's claim to growing stronger alongside the player.
Giant flaming rocks filled with tarrasques fall, everyone dies.
Homunculus being an infusion I am perfectly fine with in concept. If it had a higher max hp, I would be great with it. Again, experimental elixir is not a bad feature in concept, because the idea is contributing to support (before you go "aahhh not every supporter should just do nothing all the time and be a stupid heal*****", remember, you can drink them too, and you get to make your own powerful magic weapons as an artificer, as well as having power cantrips), but the options were so underpowered that it might as well just not exist. And I have seen no one, no one, defend experimental elixir beyond "oh i read something that made it not as bad as i thought it was, although it still sucks". If WoTC outsourced their game design to the internet, as you claim, experimental elixir would be MUCH MUCH MUCH more powerful (although arcane weapon would still be gone, rip, that one stung). This is what happens when they make something without actually letting anyone playtest it.
I hate the implementation of experimental elixir so ******* much. I thought the homunculus should have been a higher level feature or infusion, yes, but when I say something like that I mean "and replaced with something as mechanically viable", or I guess that has to be outright stated, because, since I advocated for a potion related feature, that must mean I love experimental elixir right? It is horrible, and needs a significant buff. The homunculus needs to have a 3* modifier added to its hp section, and experimental elixir needs to be either: given on a long rest an amount of times equal to half your artificer level + your INT modifier, or have the effects of it buffed to be about 3 times as powerful as they are now (except bouyancy, that one is fine out of combat, can lead to some fun problem solving). If these were done, I would be fine with alchemist.