If you add more utility to their attacks does that help them feel like they are a fast moving Jet Li character or just another utility attack that while useful feels underwhelming?
More attacks is not the same thing as greater speed; someone windmilling their arms around really fast could be said to be making more attacks, but doing so artlessly, which shouldn't be what Monks are about. Martial Arts shouldn't be about smashing a punching bag as fast as possible, it's about using an enemy's strengths against them, it's about fluid motion from one form to the next.
Stunning Strike arguably already makes you faster in the way that you want; because it lets you land more hits on a target who is powerless to stop you, it very much captures the idea of laying into a single target with overwhelming/unparalleled speed. At earlier levels though Stunning Strike drains Ki quickly if you want it to be somewhat reliable; but at later levels you have the Ki to do it frequently.
The problem is that it's our only answer at these higher levels, and it's not reliable enough for use against multiple opponents unless you get lucky (though an ally with Bane can help), which is why we need more higher level Ki abilities for different situations. Stunning Strike also arguably comes in too strong; it's a Ki ability that drains Ki fast to guarantee it, so you can't use it reliably until later, we could really do with "free" abilities sooner which is why I've already mentioned adding Open Hand Technique as a core class feature (and giving something else to Open Hand) as that gives us a core of minor control options that are cheaper than pouring all of our Ki into Stunning Strikes.
What we need are abilities that let us emphasise different things like I say; the Distracting Strikes I proposed would let us lean more into tanking/protection, representing enemies who are being struck precisely or too quickly to have the luxury to target anyone else. Combine it with Patient Defence and even though you'll make fewer attacks, you'd still be faster as you're simultaneously attacking, distracting and dodging.
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The monk has a lot of skills, but has anyone noticed that the features are only for his own use. The monk lacks features that support the group. For example, Deflect missiles could protect everyone adjacent to the monk. Slow Fall could slow the fall of everyone who is close 30-40 feet to the monk. Stilness of mind could work on everyone the monk can touch. Purity of body could also have the power to heal others from disease and poison. Making a character useful to the group is important.
I, too, agree that the monk lacks combat techniques that require saving throws other than Constitution. The open hand techniques are a good example. Maybe the monk doesn't need more attacks, just do more damage. Like adding his Proficiency Bonus to the damage on all those the monk has advantage. Maybe add 1 or 2 reaction attack techniques wouldn't be bad, it would give the image of a martial arts master.
Concept: No massive table of ki-fueled saving throw effects. Instead, at the end of turn, apply an effect to each target struck based on the number of successful hits against it this turn.
Example: 1 hit - 1 level of exhaustion that wears off at start of Monk's turn. 2 hits - 2 levels. Etc.
So you could attack 3 guys and if you hit them all, they all get a small debuff. Or you could pile it on one guy and really mess him up. Or anything in between. Your Flurry of Blows effectively doubles as your scaling for this effect, as does your Extra Attack.
Curiously, it could also scale in the opposite direction. 1 hit, strong effect; many hits, weak effect. You could scale up by level like this -- debuff them based on the attacks you didn't make against them.
Concept: No massive table of ki-fueled saving throw effects. Instead, at the end of turn, apply an effect to each target struck based on the number of successful hits against it this turn.
Example: 1 hit - 1 level of exhaustion that wears off at start of Monk's turn. 2 hits - 2 levels. Etc.
So you could attack 3 guys and if you hit them all, they all get a small debuff. Or you could pile it on one guy and really mess him up. Or anything in between. Your Flurry of Blows effectively doubles as your scaling for this effect, as does your Extra Attack.
Curiously, it could also scale in the opposite direction. 1 hit, strong effect; many hits, weak effect. You could scale up by level like this -- debuff them based on the attacks you didn't make against them.
I like that one. The first hit would be rarely useful considering one rarely has to make ability checks during combat (mostly concentration checks for mages) since grapple and such are skill checks, the second hit would still be niche but better and the third hit would be universally strong.
We'd have to seriously think about the 4th hit though as halving the hit point maximum would be fine if they are already below it since it'd only reduce the max amount they could get healed but if they're above their max health it'd suddenly turn into HUGE damage against enemies with a big health pool.
Grapple is an ability check, there are no “skill checks” just ability checks that add proficiency bonus if you have proficiency in a skill related to the ability check. That’s why grapple is an opposed Strength (athletics) vs Strength (athletics) or Dexterity (acrobatics) check. Unless I am misunderstanding your comment, that 1st level of exhaustion would apply.
Concept: No massive table of ki-fueled saving throw effects. Instead, at the end of turn, apply an effect to each target struck based on the number of successful hits against it this turn.
Example: 1 hit - 1 level of exhaustion that wears off at start of Monk's turn. 2 hits - 2 levels. Etc.
So you could attack 3 guys and if you hit them all, they all get a small debuff. Or you could pile it on one guy and really mess him up. Or anything in between. Your Flurry of Blows effectively doubles as your scaling for this effect, as does your Extra Attack.
Curiously, it could also scale in the opposite direction. 1 hit, strong effect; many hits, weak effect. You could scale up by level like this -- debuff them based on the attacks you didn't make against them.
I like that one. The first hit would be rarely useful considering one rarely has to make ability checks during combat (mostly concentration checks for mages) since grapple and such are skill checks, the second hit would still be niche but better and the third hit would be universally strong.
We'd have to seriously think about the 4th hit though as halving the hit point maximum would be fine if they are already below it since it'd only reduce the max amount they could get healed but if they're above their max health it'd suddenly turn into HUGE damage against enemies with a big health pool.
Grapple is an ability check, there are no “skill checks” just ability checks that add proficiency bonus if you have proficiency in a skill related to the ability check. That’s why grapple is an opposed Strength (athletics) vs Strength (athletics) or Dexterity (acrobatics) check. Unless I am misunderstanding your comment, that 1st level of exhaustion would apply.
Correct. I'm not sure exhaustion is really the way to go, though, it's just an easily mapped example. My actual design would probably look something like this:
1 hit - disadvantage on their next opportunity attack. 2 hits - disadvantage on their next attack. 3 hits - disadvantage on their next roll. 4 hits - disadvantage on all their rolls. 5 hits (is this even possible?) - stunned.
I really like this idea ChoirOfFire so wether you use exhaustion, disadvantage, a combination of the two or something different it’s a nice add on.
Would this be Ki to use, free? PB times per short or long rest?
I was honestly envisioning it as their default "thing." Like it just happens at the end of each of the Monk's turns. Taking up the power space of Stunning Strike.
I mean, without spending ki on FoB, you'd only ever land a maximum of 3 hits with a 5+ level Monk, and that's assuming you do hit. Allowing the Monk to set up a singular saving throw debuff or attack debuff every turn without spending resources seems totally within bounds and pretty fun. If you only land one, you can still dip out and probably not die for it. I think it plays nicely with the play pattern of waiting to see whether your attacks land before deciding what to do with your bonus action.
With this exact set of debuffs, you could get rid of the Disengage text on Step of the Wind to simplify a bit at the cost of a bit of power. But I doubt these are the exact debuffs that would be correct. I just thought they looked nice.
I really like this idea ChoirOfFire so wether you use exhaustion, disadvantage, a combination of the two or something different it’s a nice add on.
Would this be Ki to use, free? PB times per short or long rest?
I was honestly envisioning it as their default "thing." Like it just happens at the end of each of the Monk's turns. Taking up the power space of Stunning Strike.
I mean, without spending ki on FoB, you'd only ever land a maximum of 3 hits with a 5+ level Monk, and that's assuming you do hit. Allowing the Monk to set up a singular saving throw debuff or attack debuff every turn without spending resources seems totally within bounds and pretty fun. If you only land one, you can still dip out and probably not die for it. I think it plays nicely with the play pattern of waiting to see whether your attacks land before deciding what to do with your bonus action.
With this exact set of debuffs, you could get rid of the Disengage text on Step of the Wind to simplify a bit at the cost of a bit of power. But I doubt these are the exact debuffs that would be correct. I just thought they looked nice.
Having it always on I don’t think would be too OP. Astral Self does get 3 attacks as part of their Extra Attack feature as part of the Awakened Astral Self 17th level feature so they would get 5 attack possibly. And Drunken Master can get up to 7 at 17th level. But things like disadvantage, can’t take reactions, stunned, incapacitated, etc. would be all be nice options.
I really like this idea ChoirOfFire so wether you use exhaustion, disadvantage, a combination of the two or something different it’s a nice add on.
Would this be Ki to use, free? PB times per short or long rest?
I was honestly envisioning it as their default "thing." Like it just happens at the end of each of the Monk's turns. Taking up the power space of Stunning Strike.
I mean, without spending ki on FoB, you'd only ever land a maximum of 3 hits with a 5+ level Monk, and that's assuming you do hit. Allowing the Monk to set up a singular saving throw debuff or attack debuff every turn without spending resources seems totally within bounds and pretty fun. If you only land one, you can still dip out and probably not die for it. I think it plays nicely with the play pattern of waiting to see whether your attacks land before deciding what to do with your bonus action.
With this exact set of debuffs, you could get rid of the Disengage text on Step of the Wind to simplify a bit at the cost of a bit of power. But I doubt these are the exact debuffs that would be correct. I just thought they looked nice.
Having it always on I don’t think would be too OP. Astral Self does get 3 attacks as part of their Extra Attack feature as part of the Awakened Astral Self 17th level feature so they would get 5 attack possibly. And Drunken Master can get up to 7 at 17th level. But things like disadvantage, can’t take reactions, stunned, incapacitated, etc. would be all be nice options.
Well, the Drunken Master isn't allowed to hit the same creature twice with his Intoxicated Frenzy feature, so in that case each target would only suffer the 1-hit debuff (or more if he hit them with his normal Attack action). But yeah, I'm cool with all that. It makes it fun to acquire more attacks even if your damage kinda sucks.
As for the debuff hits being always on, I don't think that would fly. Stunning strikes did cost ki points and everything the fighter battlemaster does costs resources as well. It's already strong enough that it doesn't require the target you hit to fail some kind of saving throw for the debuffs to apply.
Limit it only to unarmed attacks, and maybe decrease or even remove the Martial Arts scaling. The Monk can still use weapons, but can only use this feature (let's call it Overwhelming Assault for now) with his weakest damage option. This makes him a better debuffer than a Fighter, but he can't hit as hard. That's the point, right? To create a slippery martial support character? If you go in the opposite direction, removing all his debuff options in favor of damage, you get real close to a Rogue.
Well, armorer artificer has an always on soft taunt (creature hit with thunder gauntlet has disadvantage attacking anyone other than the armorer) so it’s about equivalent as the 1st level of hits. And the ability does require multiple hits. But maybe it can be a feature that works until the start of the monks next turn PB times per short/long rest? I think it could be balanced in various ways without relying on Ki like much else the monk does.
Can some one explain to me why u force flying Speed? U can use jumps ??
I dont see logic here.
Fighters dont have fly same barbs do why monks shuld have? Even rogue dont have fly.
Give nim better jumping and shuld be ok.
Like -After u move more than 5ft u can jump for distance of feat using all ur remaning MS.
U can use ur ki point to ki jump for ur max MS even if u moved urself on ur turn.
Ur ki jump distance incrace for 2x at lvl 10 and 3x at lvl 15 of ur MS that left.
I’m not sure who you are responding to, but I don’t think anyone is forcing a fly speed. Monks already get double jump distance with step of the wind. Would you prefer a different mechanic for how monks use jumping?
Long Jump. When you make a long jump, you cover a number of feet up to your Strength score if you move at least 10 feet on foot immediately before the jump. When you make a standing long jump, you can leap only half that distance. Either way, each foot you clear on the jump costs a foot of movement.
This rule assumes that the height of your jump doesn't matter, such as a jump across a stream or chasm. At your DM's option, you must succeed on a DC 10 Strength (Athletics) check to clear a low obstacle (no taller than a quarter of the jump's distance), such as a hedge or low wall. Otherwise, you hit it.
When you land in difficult terrain, you must succeed on a DC 10 Dexterity (Acrobatics) check to land on your feet. Otherwise, you land prone.
High Jump. When you make a high jump, you leap into the air a number of feet equal to 3 + your Strength modifier (minimum of 0 feet) if you move at least 10 feet on foot immediately before the jump. When you make a standing high jump, you can jump only half that distance. Either way, each foot you clear on the jump costs a foot of movement. In some circumstances, your DM might allow you to make a Strength (Athletics) check to jump higher than you normally can.
You can extend your arms half your height above yourself during the jump. Thus, you can reach above you a distance equal to the height of the jump plus 1 1/2 times your height.
That is part of tph.
Problem here is that monk with his superior body and ki still jumps with same ruls like other classes.
Using step of The wind dubles that but still it is a very low. It will be better on str bulids ofc.
In my opinion monk that is not overcumbered or with any armor/h. Weapon shuld jump more freely.
In my opinion monk shuld:
- Ignoring jump ruls when he need to check on what distans he can jump.
- Ignoring rule of jump half distans on long jump. Instead after 10ft of movement he can jump for all remain feat he didnt use.
That is dubled if he use (step of the wind) ki and in my opinion shuld be tripled on lvl15.
Monk Then can easly jump for 120ft per round in every direction. He can ignor some of The fall dmg and i think we shuld Focus on that.
I see what you are saying, especially since STR seems to be a common dump stat for monks their jump distance is already hampered. Another option would be scaling the jump distance with SotW so that it starts at double, then triple distance at 5, quadruple at 11, and quintuple at the 17 or something like that. Or base on DEX instead of STR
Long Jump. When you make a long jump, you cover a number of feet up to your Strength score if you move at least 10 feet on foot immediately before the jump. When you make a standing long jump, you can leap only half that distance. Either way, each foot you clear on the jump costs a foot of movement.
This rule assumes that the height of your jump doesn't matter, such as a jump across a stream or chasm. At your DM's option, you must succeed on a DC 10 Strength (Athletics) check to clear a low obstacle (no taller than a quarter of the jump's distance), such as a hedge or low wall. Otherwise, you hit it.
When you land in difficult terrain, you must succeed on a DC 10 Dexterity (Acrobatics) check to land on your feet. Otherwise, you land prone.
High Jump. When you make a high jump, you leap into the air a number of feet equal to 3 + your Strength modifier (minimum of 0 feet) if you move at least 10 feet on foot immediately before the jump. When you make a standing high jump, you can jump only half that distance. Either way, each foot you clear on the jump costs a foot of movement. In some circumstances, your DM might allow you to make a Strength (Athletics) check to jump higher than you normally can.
You can extend your arms half your height above yourself during the jump. Thus, you can reach above you a distance equal to the height of the jump plus 1 1/2 times your height.
That is part of tph.
Problem here is that monk with his superior body and ki still jumps with same ruls like other classes.
Using step of The wind dubles that but still it is a very low. It will be better on str bulids ofc.
In my opinion monk that is not overcumbered or with any armor/h. Weapon shuld jump more freely.
In my opinion monk shuld:
- Ignoring jump ruls when he need to check on what distans he can jump.
- Ignoring rule of jump half distans on long jump. Instead after 10ft of movement he can jump for all remain feat he didnt use.
That is dubled if he use (step of the wind) ki and in my opinion shuld be tripled on lvl15.
Monk Then can easly jump for 120ft per round in every direction. He can ignor some of The fall dmg and i think we shuld Focus on that.
Y'know this actually a good point why isn't their jump tied to Dex? This definitely feels like a necessary tweak that can easily be slotted into the Slow Fall feature if not earlier.
Honestly I belive that simple tweaks are more likely to occur than full changes.
Inspired by what Thrikeen was going for plus what I liked from Haraviks tweaks.
Class Features
As a monk, you gain the following class features.
Hit Points
Hit Dice: 1d8 per monk level Hit Points at 1st Level: 8 + your Constitution modifier Hit Points at Higher Levels: 1d8+ your Constitution modifier per monk level after 1st
Proficiencies
Armor: None Weapons: Simple weapons, shortswords and pikes. Tools: Choose one type of artisan's tools or one musical instrument Saving Throws:Wisdom, Dexterity Skills: Choose two from Acrobatics, Athletics, History, Insight, Medicine, Religion, and Stealth
Equipment
You start with the following equipment, in addition to the equipment granted by your background:
(a) a shortsword or (b) any simple weapon
(a) a dungeoneer's pack or (b) an explorer's pack
10 darts
Unarmored Defense
Beginning at 1st level, while you are wearing no armor and not wielding a shield, your AC equals 10 + your Dexterity modifier + your Wisdom modifier.
Martial Arts
At 1st level, your practice of martial arts gives you mastery of combat styles that use unarmed strikes and monk weapons, which are shortswords, pikes and any simple melee weapons that don't have the two-handed or heavy property.
You gain the following benefits while you are unarmed or wielding only monk weapons and you aren't wearing heavy armor or wielding a shield:
You can use Dexterity instead of Strength for the attack and damage rolls of your unarmed strikes and monk weapons.
You can roll a d4 in place of the normal damage of your unarmed strike or monk weapon. This die size increase as you gain monk levels, d6 at 5th, d8 at 9th, d10 at 13th and finally d12 at 17th.
When you use the Attack action with an unarmed strike or a monk weapon on your turn, you can make one unarmed strike as a bonus action. For example, if you take the Attack action and attack with a quarterstaff, you can also make an unarmed strike as a bonus action, assuming you haven't already taken a bonus action this turn.
Certain monasteries use specialized forms of the monk weapons. For example, you might use a club that is two lengths of wood connected by a short chain (called a nunchaku) or a sickle with a shorter, straighter blade (called a kama). Whatever name you use for a monk weapon, you can use the game statistics provided for the weapon on the Weapons page.
Ki
Starting at 2nd level, your training allows you to harness the mystic energy of ki. Your access to this energy is represented by a number of ki points. Your monk level + wisdom modifier + proficinacy bonus determine the number of points you have.
You can spend these points to fuel various ki features. You start knowing three such features: Flurry of Blows, Patient Defense, and Step of the Wind. You learn more ki features as you gain levels in this class.
When you spend a ki point, it is unavailable until you finish a short or long rest, at the end of which you draw all of your expended ki back into yourself. You must spend at least 30 minutes of the rest meditating to regain your ki points.
Some of your ki features require your target to make a saving throw to resist the feature's effects. The saving throw DC is calculated as follows:
Ki save DC = 8 + your proficiency bonus + your Wisdom modifier
Flurry of Blows. Immediately after you take the Attack action on your turn, you can spend 1 ki point to make two additional unarmed strikes as part of the same action.
Patient Defense. You can spend 1 ki point to use your reaction to add your proficiency bonus to your AC for that attack, potentially causing the attack to miss you.
Step of the Wind. You can spend 1 ki point to take the Dodge, Disengage or Dash action as a bonus action on your turn, and your jump distance is doubled for the turn.
Unarmored Movement
Starting at 2nd level, your speed increases by 10 feet while you are not wearing heavy armor or wielding a shield. This bonus increases when you reach certain monk levels, as shown in the Monk table.
At 9th level, you gain the ability to move along vertical surfaces and across liquids on your turn without falling during the move.
Dedicated Weapon (Optional)
Also at 2nd level, you train yourself to use a variety of weapons as monk weapons, not just simple melee weapons and shortswords. Whenever you finish a short or long rest, you can touch one weapon, focus your ki on it, and then count that weapon as a monk weapon until you use this feature again.
The chosen weapon must meet these criteria:
The weapon must be a simple or martial weapon.
You must be proficient with it.
It must lack the heavy and special properties.
Monastic Tradition
When you reach 3rd level, you commit yourself to a monastic tradition. Your tradition grants you features at 3rd level and again at 6th, 11th, and 17th level.
Deflect MissilesAttack
Starting at 3rd level, you can spend 1 ki point to use your reaction to deflect an attack or catch the missile when you are hit by an attack. When you do so, the damage you take from the attack is reduced by 1d10 + your Dexterity modifier + your monk level.
When you reduce the damage to 0 and if you catch the missile provided it is small enough for you to hold in one hand and you have at least one hand free. If you catch a missile in this way, you can make a ranged attack with a range of 20/60 using the weapon or piece of ammunition you just caught, as part of the same reaction. You make this attack with proficiency, regardless of your weapon proficiencies, and the missile counts as a monk weapon for the attack.
Ki-Fueled Attack (Optional)
Also at 3rd level, if you spend 1 ki point or more as part of your action on your turn, you can make one attack with an unarmed strike or a monk weapon as a bonus action before the end of the turn.
Ability Score Improvement
When you reach 4th level, and again at 8th, 10th, 12th, 16th, and 19th level, you can increase one ability score of your choice by 2, or you can increase two ability scores of your choice by 1. As normal, you can't increase an ability score above 20 using this feature.
Slow Fall
Beginning at 4th level, you can use your reaction when you fall to reduce any falling damage you take by an amount equal to five times your monk level.Moreover you can use your Dexterity modifier to determine your Jump distance.
Quickened Healing (Optional)
Also at 4th level, as an action, you can spend 2 ki points and roll a Martial Arts die. You regain a number of hit points equal to the number rolled plus your proficiency bonus.
Pressure Points (Optional)
At 4th level, when you channel ki into your attacks you augment its effectivness.
Whenever you hit a creature with one of the attacks granted by your Flurry of Blows, you can impose one of the following effects on the target:
Weakened Body. The target has disadvantage on the next saving throw it makes before the end of your next turn.
Terror Touch. The target must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw or become frightened of you until the end of your next turn.
Blind Rage. The target suffers disadvantage on all attack rolls against targets other than you until the end of your next turn.
Tender Flesh. The target gains vulnerability to bludgeoning damage until the end of your next turn.
Extra Attack
Beginning at 5th level, you can attack twice, instead of once, whenever you take the Attack action on your turn.
Stunning Strike
Starting at 5th level, you can interfere with the flow of ki in an opponent's body. When you hit another creature with a melee weapon attack, you can spend 1 ki point to attempt a stunning strike. The target must succeed on a Constitution saving throw or become dazed. On a failed save the target has a -2 penalty to attack rolls, ability checks and Dexterity saving throws and it can’t take reactions until the end of your next turn.
Beginning at 9 level, on a failed Constitution saving throw the target is stunned until the end of your next turn, and at 17th level every time you make a critical hit the enemy is automatically stunned until the end of your next turn.
Focused Aim (Optional)
Also at 5th level, when you miss with an attack roll, you can spend 1 to 3 ki points to increase your attack roll by 2 for each of these ki points you spend, potentially turning the miss into a hit.
Ki-Empowered Strikes
Starting at 6th level, your unarmed strikes count as magical for the purpose of overcoming resistance and immunity to nonmagical attacks and damage.
Evasion
At 7th level, your instinctive agility lets you dodge out of the way of certain area effects, such as a blue dragon's lightning breath or a fireball spell. When you are subjected to an effect that allows you to make a Dexterity saving throw to take only half damage, you instead take no damage if you succeed on the saving throw, and only half damage if you fail.
Stillness of Mind
Starting at 7th level, you have advantage on saving throws against being charmed or frightened. This applies to initial saves as well as ongoing saving throws. If you become aware that you are charmed or frightened you can use your action to end one of these effects on yourself.
Purity of Body
At 10th level, your mastery of the ki flowing through you makes you immune to disease and poison.
Tongue of the Sun and Moon
Starting at 13th level, you learn to touch the ki of other minds so that you understand all spoken languages. Moreover, any creature that can understand a language can understand what you say.
Diamond Soul
Beginning at 14th level, your mastery of ki grants you proficiency in all saving throws.
Additionally, whenever you make a saving throw and fail, you can spend 1 ki point to reroll it and take the second result.
Timeless Body
At 15th level, your ki sustains you so that you suffer none of the frailty of old age, and you can't be aged magically. You can still die of old age, however. In addition, you no longer need food or water. Addtionally, When you use your Flurry of Blows feature it costs no ki and the amount increses to three unarmed strikes.
Empty Body
Beginning at 18th level, you can use your action to spend 4 ki points to become invisible for 1 minute. During that time, you also have resistance to all damage but force damage.
Additionally, you can spend 8 ki points to cast the Astral Projection spell, without needing material components. When you do so, you can't take any other creatures with you.
Perfect Self
At 20th level, when you roll for initiative and have no ki points remaining, you regain 10 ki points.
Long Jump. When you make a long jump, you cover a number of feet up to your Strength score if you move at least 10 feet on foot immediately before the jump. When you make a standing long jump, you can leap only half that distance. Either way, each foot you clear on the jump costs a foot of movement.
This rule assumes that the height of your jump doesn't matter, such as a jump across a stream or chasm. At your DM's option, you must succeed on a DC 10 Strength (Athletics) check to clear a low obstacle (no taller than a quarter of the jump's distance), such as a hedge or low wall. Otherwise, you hit it.
When you land in difficult terrain, you must succeed on a DC 10 Dexterity (Acrobatics) check to land on your feet. Otherwise, you land prone.
High Jump. When you make a high jump, you leap into the air a number of feet equal to 3 + your Strength modifier (minimum of 0 feet) if you move at least 10 feet on foot immediately before the jump. When you make a standing high jump, you can jump only half that distance. Either way, each foot you clear on the jump costs a foot of movement. In some circumstances, your DM might allow you to make a Strength (Athletics) check to jump higher than you normally can.
You can extend your arms half your height above yourself during the jump. Thus, you can reach above you a distance equal to the height of the jump plus 1 1/2 times your height.
That is part of tph.
Problem here is that monk with his superior body and ki still jumps with same ruls like other classes.
Using step of The wind dubles that but still it is a very low. It will be better on str bulids ofc.
In my opinion monk that is not overcumbered or with any armor/h. Weapon shuld jump more freely.
In my opinion monk shuld:
- Ignoring jump ruls when he need to check on what distans he can jump.
- Ignoring rule of jump half distans on long jump. Instead after 10ft of movement he can jump for all remain feat he didnt use.
That is dubled if he use (step of the wind) ki and in my opinion shuld be tripled on lvl15.
Monk Then can easly jump for 120ft per round in every direction. He can ignor some of The fall dmg and i think we shuld Focus on that.
Y'know this actually a good point why isn't their jump tied to Dex? This definitely feels like a necessary tweak that can easily be slotted into the Slow Fall feature if not earlier.
Because making a long jump is a Strength thing that doesn't make sense as a Dexterity thing? You can't just swap everything to Dex.
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More attacks is not the same thing as greater speed; someone windmilling their arms around really fast could be said to be making more attacks, but doing so artlessly, which shouldn't be what Monks are about. Martial Arts shouldn't be about smashing a punching bag as fast as possible, it's about using an enemy's strengths against them, it's about fluid motion from one form to the next.
Stunning Strike arguably already makes you faster in the way that you want; because it lets you land more hits on a target who is powerless to stop you, it very much captures the idea of laying into a single target with overwhelming/unparalleled speed. At earlier levels though Stunning Strike drains Ki quickly if you want it to be somewhat reliable; but at later levels you have the Ki to do it frequently.
The problem is that it's our only answer at these higher levels, and it's not reliable enough for use against multiple opponents unless you get lucky (though an ally with Bane can help), which is why we need more higher level Ki abilities for different situations. Stunning Strike also arguably comes in too strong; it's a Ki ability that drains Ki fast to guarantee it, so you can't use it reliably until later, we could really do with "free" abilities sooner which is why I've already mentioned adding Open Hand Technique as a core class feature (and giving something else to Open Hand) as that gives us a core of minor control options that are cheaper than pouring all of our Ki into Stunning Strikes.
What we need are abilities that let us emphasise different things like I say; the Distracting Strikes I proposed would let us lean more into tanking/protection, representing enemies who are being struck precisely or too quickly to have the luxury to target anyone else. Combine it with Patient Defence and even though you'll make fewer attacks, you'd still be faster as you're simultaneously attacking, distracting and dodging.
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The monk has a lot of skills, but has anyone noticed that the features are only for his own use. The monk lacks features that support the group. For example, Deflect missiles could protect everyone adjacent to the monk. Slow Fall could slow the fall of everyone who is close 30-40 feet to the monk. Stilness of mind could work on everyone the monk can touch. Purity of body could also have the power to heal others from disease and poison. Making a character useful to the group is important.
I, too, agree that the monk lacks combat techniques that require saving throws other than Constitution. The open hand techniques are a good example. Maybe the monk doesn't need more attacks, just do more damage. Like adding his Proficiency Bonus to the damage on all those the monk has advantage. Maybe add 1 or 2 reaction attack techniques wouldn't be bad, it would give the image of a martial arts master.
Concept: No massive table of ki-fueled saving throw effects. Instead, at the end of turn, apply an effect to each target struck based on the number of successful hits against it this turn.
Example: 1 hit - 1 level of exhaustion that wears off at start of Monk's turn. 2 hits - 2 levels. Etc.
So you could attack 3 guys and if you hit them all, they all get a small debuff. Or you could pile it on one guy and really mess him up. Or anything in between. Your Flurry of Blows effectively doubles as your scaling for this effect, as does your Extra Attack.
Curiously, it could also scale in the opposite direction. 1 hit, strong effect; many hits, weak effect. You could scale up by level like this -- debuff them based on the attacks you didn't make against them.
Grapple is an ability check, there are no “skill checks” just ability checks that add proficiency bonus if you have proficiency in a skill related to the ability check. That’s why grapple is an opposed Strength (athletics) vs Strength (athletics) or Dexterity (acrobatics) check. Unless I am misunderstanding your comment, that 1st level of exhaustion would apply.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
Correct. I'm not sure exhaustion is really the way to go, though, it's just an easily mapped example. My actual design would probably look something like this:
1 hit - disadvantage on their next opportunity attack. 2 hits - disadvantage on their next attack. 3 hits - disadvantage on their next roll. 4 hits - disadvantage on all their rolls. 5 hits (is this even possible?) - stunned.
I really like this idea ChoirOfFire so wether you use exhaustion, disadvantage, a combination of the two or something different it’s a nice add on.
Would this be Ki to use, free? PB times per short or long rest?
EZD6 by DM Scotty
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I was honestly envisioning it as their default "thing." Like it just happens at the end of each of the Monk's turns. Taking up the power space of Stunning Strike.
I mean, without spending ki on FoB, you'd only ever land a maximum of 3 hits with a 5+ level Monk, and that's assuming you do hit. Allowing the Monk to set up a singular saving throw debuff or attack debuff every turn without spending resources seems totally within bounds and pretty fun. If you only land one, you can still dip out and probably not die for it. I think it plays nicely with the play pattern of waiting to see whether your attacks land before deciding what to do with your bonus action.
With this exact set of debuffs, you could get rid of the Disengage text on Step of the Wind to simplify a bit at the cost of a bit of power. But I doubt these are the exact debuffs that would be correct. I just thought they looked nice.
Having it always on I don’t think would be too OP. Astral Self does get 3 attacks as part of their Extra Attack feature as part of the Awakened Astral Self 17th level feature so they would get 5 attack possibly. And Drunken Master can get up to 7 at 17th level. But things like disadvantage, can’t take reactions, stunned, incapacitated, etc. would be all be nice options.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
Well, the Drunken Master isn't allowed to hit the same creature twice with his Intoxicated Frenzy feature, so in that case each target would only suffer the 1-hit debuff (or more if he hit them with his normal Attack action). But yeah, I'm cool with all that. It makes it fun to acquire more attacks even if your damage kinda sucks.
Limit it only to unarmed attacks, and maybe decrease or even remove the Martial Arts scaling. The Monk can still use weapons, but can only use this feature (let's call it Overwhelming Assault for now) with his weakest damage option. This makes him a better debuffer than a Fighter, but he can't hit as hard. That's the point, right? To create a slippery martial support character? If you go in the opposite direction, removing all his debuff options in favor of damage, you get real close to a Rogue.
Well, armorer artificer has an always on soft taunt (creature hit with thunder gauntlet has disadvantage attacking anyone other than the armorer) so it’s about equivalent as the 1st level of hits. And the ability does require multiple hits. But maybe it can be a feature that works until the start of the monks next turn PB times per short/long rest? I think it could be balanced in various ways without relying on Ki like much else the monk does.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
I’m not sure who you are responding to, but I don’t think anyone is forcing a fly speed. Monks already get double jump distance with step of the wind. Would you prefer a different mechanic for how monks use jumping?
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
I see what you are saying, especially since STR seems to be a common dump stat for monks their jump distance is already hampered. Another option would be scaling the jump distance with SotW so that it starts at double, then triple distance at 5, quadruple at 11, and quintuple at the 17 or something like that. Or base on DEX instead of STR
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
Y'know this actually a good point why isn't their jump tied to Dex? This definitely feels like a necessary tweak that can easily be slotted into the Slow Fall feature if not earlier.
Made a few changes based on the whole jump issue.
Because making a long jump is a Strength thing that doesn't make sense as a Dexterity thing? You can't just swap everything to Dex.