There's a 4th-level rogue character in one of my campaigns and I just wanted to confirm something about their abilities.
They had a natural speed of 30 feet, but because they're a Variant Human, they took the Mobile feat, which brought their natural speed up to 40 feet.
My question is: Due to the Cunning Action ability granted at 2nd level, does this mean that the rogue can dash twice on their turn (once as an action, once as a bonus action) and move up to 160 feet?? That seems insane. The character appears too over-powered compared to other characters during combat.
Is this how the ability actually works, and do you have any suggestions to help make this character not quite as overpowered? Thanks.
I know a Rogue is supposed to dart out really quickly from the shadows and stab stuff, but... it seems to be too powerful.
I believe this is how it works, yes. Anyone can normally dash using their action; a rogue can dash as a bonus action due to their cunning action class feature.
I am confused though. All the character is doing is running really fast when they do this. They are not able to anything else that requires an action—no hide, no aim, no attack, no using an item etc.—because they have used their action to dash. This rogue is 120’ away from his party presenting himself as a deliciously fragile, low AC target to be dogpiled for at least 2 rounds before anyone can catch up to him to help out. What is OP about this?
Okay, the main thing here is that the player is constantly bragging about their character's abilities, including their speed and high Stealth score. So, essentially, I was asking two related questions (although I should have made this much clearer):
A) Is this how the ability works
and
B) How do I deal with a player who keeps bragging about their character's abilities and annoying the other players?
B) How do I deal with a player who keeps bragging about their character's abilities and annoying the other players?
A) Yes, though I think it's 120 feet, not 160. (move 40 + action 40 + cunning action 40)
B) The more attention you give their bragging, the more they'll do it. Besides, they're giving up attacking, hiding, disengaging, etc. for it, so eventually they'll see it's not so important. Monks can also get this fast, etc.
Generally, rogues are "supposed" to be good at getting away and hiding, so they're just bragging about class features.
B) How do I deal with a player who keeps bragging about their character's abilities and annoying the other players?
A) Yes, though I think it's 120 feet, not 160. (move 40 + action 40 + cunning action 40)
B) The more attention you give their bragging, the more they'll do it. Besides, they're giving up attacking, hiding, disengaging, etc. for it, so eventually they'll see it's not so important. Monks can also get this fast, etc.
Generally, rogues are "supposed" to be good at getting away and hiding, so they're just bragging about class features.
So, 120's better.
I usually ignore the bragging but they just keep doing it anyway. The problem is that, unless they use a spell, no one else in the party can ever get that fast.
I usually ignore the bragging but they just keep doing it anyway. The problem is that, unless they use a spell, no one else in the party can ever get that fast.
Somewhere on these forums, there's a thread of people looking for ways to go as fast as possible in a single round, combining race features, class features, spells, magic items, etc. A few of the builds can break the sound barrier.
Anyway, are you staging a foot race? If a PC wants to get far away from the party that much, it's not terrible. I'm sure there are things the other PCs can do that this rogue can't...
I'm currently dealing with a similar situation with one of my players being a rogue, who has the mobile feat. It's a little frustrating at times that the one character potentially has so much movement available in one round versus the rest of the party, but it's not really that overpowered when you factor everything else into the situations.
As Born_of_Fire and Kenclary clarified, they are moving up to 120 feet per turn (move 40 + dash action 40 + cunning action 40), but they are spending both their action and bonus action to get that much movement. Unless the party is running a race, a character moving that much during their turn really isn't going to help that much. So, if they're spending their time dashing, they aren't fight opponents. They're also not disengaging from anything, which is another benefit of the rogue's cunning action...so hope that they have enough room to avoid all the potential AoO aimed at them.
It's a great combination of feat and class ability, but it's fairly limited in scope if you're only focused on moving around a lot. It'd be like the speedster superhero bragging about running around really quickly while the other heroes take down the BBEG.
Well, that's a whole different ball of wax. If that is your concern, it has little to do with the Rogue class or any other other game mechanic. You should address it out of character. Doing so will likely be difficult but you and the other players are well within your rights to express your displeasure with another person's inappropriate behaviour. Annoying braggarts are generally not tolerated in other types of activity; there is no reason you should feel obligated to tolerate one here. Ask him to stop, GM to player.
If you feel unable to address the problem in what is IMHO the best way, consider what I mentioned when I asked you how exactly this was OP. So what he can do that? What good does it do him? If he runs off by himself using his action and bonus action, dogpile his foolish ass until the other characters catch up. You won't be picking on him, you'll be doing what any sensible predator would do to him. He might as well cover himself in BBQ sauce. When he dies because he's too far away from any sort of back up, he'll likely change his tune.
And, I mean, your other players could maybe toughen up a bit? I don't know the precise extent of this bragging and annoying but it doesn't seem like something worth getting worked up about unless it's affecting the actual gameplay. If it is, they should ask him to stop, player to player. This is not an in character problem.
Just have the wizard fireball him the next time he brags. Then the cleric can stand over his singed body and ask him which is better, running really fast or being able to heal?
Just have the wizard fireball him the next time he brags. Then the cleric can stand over his singed body and ask him which is better, running really fast or being able to heal?
Unless the rogue already has evasion as well... Then the high dexterity (and saving throw proficient) rogue takes no damage when he makes his saving throw against the fireball and starts bragging about that, too.
Unless the rogue already has evasion as well... Then the high dexterity (and saving throw proficient) rogue takes no damage when he makes his saving throw against the fireball and starts bragging about that, too.
The rogue in question is level 4; Evasion comes at level 7.
The party is split up into a couple different groups at the moment... The Rogue in question is with a Berserker Barbarian, a Hunter Ranger, and an Eldritch Knight pacifist.
Unless the rogue already has evasion as well... Then the high dexterity (and saving throw proficient) rogue takes no damage when he makes his saving throw against the fireball and starts bragging about that, too.
The rogue in question is level 4; Evasion comes at level 7.
Derp... Much obliged, Kenclary. Would probably have helped if I reread the original post for the detail on the rogue's current level.
Less impactful of an example, but the point of my previous post still remains that infighting among the players is only going to feed the rogue's ego (or lead to hurt feelings). Agree with the previous statements about needing to talk to the player directly if their behavior continues to be an issue.
The barbarian is the centaur who tries to climb cliffs all the time. She's trying to balance her rage, though, with calm, so she might do a monk multiclass. I'm really enjoying the current assortment of characters.
Can we get some context of the bragging? Like others were saying it doesn't seem to be anything overpowered or game breaking, but rather the player just being annoying. But even then it's hard to picture because unless he's just trolling what would he even be bragging about?
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There's a 4th-level rogue character in one of my campaigns and I just wanted to confirm something about their abilities.
They had a natural speed of 30 feet, but because they're a Variant Human, they took the Mobile feat, which brought their natural speed up to 40 feet.
My question is: Due to the Cunning Action ability granted at 2nd level, does this mean that the rogue can dash twice on their turn (once as an action, once as a bonus action) and move up to 160 feet?? That seems insane. The character appears too over-powered compared to other characters during combat.
Is this how the ability actually works, and do you have any suggestions to help make this character not quite as overpowered? Thanks.
I know a Rogue is supposed to dart out really quickly from the shadows and stab stuff, but... it seems to be too powerful.
I believe this is how it works, yes. Anyone can normally dash using their action; a rogue can dash as a bonus action due to their cunning action class feature.
I am confused though. All the character is doing is running really fast when they do this. They are not able to anything else that requires an action—no hide, no aim, no attack, no using an item etc.—because they have used their action to dash. This rogue is 120’ away from his party presenting himself as a deliciously fragile, low AC target to be dogpiled for at least 2 rounds before anyone can catch up to him to help out. What is OP about this?
Okay, the main thing here is that the player is constantly bragging about their character's abilities, including their speed and high Stealth score. So, essentially, I was asking two related questions (although I should have made this much clearer):
A) Is this how the ability works
and
B) How do I deal with a player who keeps bragging about their character's abilities and annoying the other players?
A) Yes, though I think it's 120 feet, not 160. (move 40 + action 40 + cunning action 40)
B) The more attention you give their bragging, the more they'll do it. Besides, they're giving up attacking, hiding, disengaging, etc. for it, so eventually they'll see it's not so important. Monks can also get this fast, etc.
Generally, rogues are "supposed" to be good at getting away and hiding, so they're just bragging about class features.
So, 120's better.
I usually ignore the bragging but they just keep doing it anyway. The problem is that, unless they use a spell, no one else in the party can ever get that fast.
Somewhere on these forums, there's a thread of people looking for ways to go as fast as possible in a single round, combining race features, class features, spells, magic items, etc. A few of the builds can break the sound barrier.
Anyway, are you staging a foot race? If a PC wants to get far away from the party that much, it's not terrible. I'm sure there are things the other PCs can do that this rogue can't...
I'm currently dealing with a similar situation with one of my players being a rogue, who has the mobile feat. It's a little frustrating at times that the one character potentially has so much movement available in one round versus the rest of the party, but it's not really that overpowered when you factor everything else into the situations.
As Born_of_Fire and Kenclary clarified, they are moving up to 120 feet per turn (move 40 + dash action 40 + cunning action 40), but they are spending both their action and bonus action to get that much movement. Unless the party is running a race, a character moving that much during their turn really isn't going to help that much. So, if they're spending their time dashing, they aren't fight opponents. They're also not disengaging from anything, which is another benefit of the rogue's cunning action...so hope that they have enough room to avoid all the potential AoO aimed at them.
It's a great combination of feat and class ability, but it's fairly limited in scope if you're only focused on moving around a lot. It'd be like the speedster superhero bragging about running around really quickly while the other heroes take down the BBEG.
Well, that's a whole different ball of wax. If that is your concern, it has little to do with the Rogue class or any other other game mechanic. You should address it out of character. Doing so will likely be difficult but you and the other players are well within your rights to express your displeasure with another person's inappropriate behaviour. Annoying braggarts are generally not tolerated in other types of activity; there is no reason you should feel obligated to tolerate one here. Ask him to stop, GM to player.
If you feel unable to address the problem in what is IMHO the best way, consider what I mentioned when I asked you how exactly this was OP. So what he can do that? What good does it do him? If he runs off by himself using his action and bonus action, dogpile his foolish ass until the other characters catch up. You won't be picking on him, you'll be doing what any sensible predator would do to him. He might as well cover himself in BBQ sauce. When he dies because he's too far away from any sort of back up, he'll likely change his tune.
And, I mean, your other players could maybe toughen up a bit? I don't know the precise extent of this bragging and annoying but it doesn't seem like something worth getting worked up about unless it's affecting the actual gameplay. If it is, they should ask him to stop, player to player. This is not an in character problem.
Okay, thanks, everyone, I'll definitely use some of your advice.
Just have the wizard fireball him the next time he brags. Then the cleric can stand over his singed body and ask him which is better, running really fast or being able to heal?
Unless the rogue already has evasion as well... Then the high dexterity (and saving throw proficient) rogue takes no damage when he makes his saving throw against the fireball and starts bragging about that, too.
The rogue in question is level 4; Evasion comes at level 7.
Yeah... and the party doesn't have a wizard or a cleric, so...
The party is split up into a couple different groups at the moment... The Rogue in question is with a Berserker Barbarian, a Hunter Ranger, and an Eldritch Knight pacifist.
Derp... Much obliged, Kenclary. Would probably have helped if I reread the original post for the detail on the rogue's current level.
Less impactful of an example, but the point of my previous post still remains that infighting among the players is only going to feed the rogue's ego (or lead to hurt feelings). Agree with the previous statements about needing to talk to the player directly if their behavior continues to be an issue.
I was just joking. Definitely talk to the player.
A berserker barbarian and eldritch knight pacifist sounds like a fun combo.
The barbarian is the centaur who tries to climb cliffs all the time. She's trying to balance her rage, though, with calm, so she might do a monk multiclass. I'm really enjoying the current assortment of characters.
Yeah, I'll talk to the player.
Can we get some context of the bragging? Like others were saying it doesn't seem to be anything overpowered or game breaking, but rather the player just being annoying. But even then it's hard to picture because unless he's just trolling what would he even be bragging about?