I’ve heard bad things about the sorcerer and to just play a wizard it bardlock. Are they viable to play? For example, the ranger isn’t really viable although I love the class. Are sorcerers as bad as people think they are or are they just Ok? Or are they really good? I’m looking to play a damage caster that can debuff / buff in emergency.
The only real issue with sorcerers is their limited number of known spells and limited number of class features. In terms of power, they are on par (or even slightly ahead) with wizards. But they lack versatility compared to other casting classes.
That is probably why it is popular to dip a few levels into another class (like paladin or warlock).
I think sorcerers are just attack oriented wizards. They have abilities putting their damage ahead of wizards, like meta magics. The draconic bloodline even gives them more AC and helps elemental damage, letting them get really into combat. They don't have many utility spells compared to wizards, but they still get things like enlarge and reduce, or even wish.
I like sorcerers more than wizards, and they make backstories and role play more fun than wizards, when they mostly just do lots of studying for their power.
A lot depends on your play style. I like sorcerers, but I love warlocks. Yet a combat optimized sorcerer is probably more powerful than a combat optimized warlock is.
Okay. I’m fine with not being super versatile as long as I have 1-2 buffs like Haste and stuff and lots of dmg. Thanks.
Sorcerers can actually be really good buffers for spells like invisibility, haste, and fly because of twinned spell metamagic to buff 2 creatures instead of just one.
Sorcerers are a <insert playstyle>-focused class. Got a certain playstyle in mind? Sorcerer can do it.
.. if you build it right.
Almost everything is going to come down to what spells you actually learn. Unlike Wizards, Sorcerers don't have the benefit of preparing spells out of a spellbook. What a Sorcerer knows is what they know, and they don't get the opportunity to know a ton. Sorcerers don't have the luxury of swapping spells in & out during a long rest either, so every single choice matters when learning spells as you level up. You won't have the flexibility in spellcasting (ironic) that Wizards/Clerics/Druids have, but you'll absolutely excel in your chosen direction. I've come to think of the current Sorcerer as a skill class.
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You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
Sorcerer is excellent. Don't listen to the haters. The problem is they are not as versatile as wizards and people get hung up on that. A sorcerer can do something really well. it doesn't really matter what that one thing may be, the sorcerer does it well. A given sorcerer may not be able to do anything /else/ well, but the one role you pick, the sorc will be outstanding.
As long as you don't get caught up on the fact that you can't swap spells to deal with every little situation you see like a wizard, sorcerers are amazing. I /prefer/ them to wizards.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
It's up to you. They lack the useful tool spells. Like Leomund's Hut, Water Breathing, Mage Armor, stuff like that. They also, even though it may seem like it. Cast fewer spells than a wizard per day. The sorcery point cost for spells are INSANE and a wizard with arcane recovery gets the ability to throw more fireballs or generally spells than you. Wizards also get access to a much much larger spell list. Many awesome wizard spells aren't sorcerer spells. Many things they were good at in 3e, like more spell slots than wizards. Aren't there anymore. The only thing they get from their class (no, not talking about subclasses), is the pathetic Metamagic. The effects aren't even that good. And they cost sorcery points, which you need to buy spells for. Which again, counteracts the more spells than a wizard thingy.
They get so few spells, both known and their spell list that everytime I think of a build. I try to do it any other way than with a sorcerer. If you want to play a sorcerer, you should! Don't let other people tell you that it's bad! You like the ranger, and you love it! Why shouldn't you get to enjoy the ranger then? So you should ask yourself that question.
But if you want an answer. Yes. The sorcerer simply lacks in spells, features, and something that the wizard doesn't have. It's proficencies are the same, with the slight changes in what skills you can be proficient in, but the same armor, weapons and number of skills are the same as wizards. Which is fine of course. They lack a good spell list. So many REALLY good spells are missing from their spell list. Back in the day of 3e (which is mostly what I'm gonna be comparing this too) sorcerer and wizards shared a spell list. And both could have a familiar. I thought of letting my players use both wizards and sorcerer spell lists when playing a sorcerer, but they simply don't have enough spells known for it to be worth it.
Alright. Im repeating myself here. Basically. They are lack luster compared to a bard, they are weaker than a wizard in any spellcasting abilities. And even the warlock gets more spells than a sorcerer, and can cast more! But if you want to play one, go right ahead! Don't let us stop you! Maybe you will like it. Hell, maybe one day I'll realised the secret to the sorcerer! But if I were you. I would ask your DM if you two could work out some things. Maybe some more spells. Such as you get spells known equal to 1 + your sorcerer level + your charisma modifier. I also have one last idea that I've been sitting on for a few days. Here it is, if you want it that is:
Heritage. At say, 2nd level. You once again choose a source of arcane energy. Arcana, Draconic, Chaos. Each of these sources gives you, at every second level a spell. You can choose wild magic bloodline, but still chose draconic heritage as a power source (mostly because I have an idea for a character and she is part wild magic and part draconic heritage. So I wanted to make her work while also making sorcerer work. So maybe this is wayyyyy to weird. If so, this is why). Arcana is spells such as: Mage armor, or catapult. Magic missile. Bigby's hand, Telekinesis, teleport perhaps. Spells that are pure force and classic spells. They are probably more combat oriented spells or at least not as tool like as spells like: rope trick, pyrotechnics, gust of wind, etc. Draconic is probably chromatic based. Chromatic orb, dragon's breath, fly (or haste if you convince the DM), etc. At the very end it could be shapechange (best spell in the game btw xD) And Chaos would be well, chaotic. Stuff that blows up or twists the battlefield. Again, catapult, (I wanna say chaos bolt but eh) shadow blade, haste or slow, bestow curse, dimention door, polymorph, telekinesis, cone of cold, etc.
They would not count against you total number of spells known. So at every second level you would get a spell for your newest spell level. Say if you're level 7 you would get a new 4th level spell that didn't count against your total number of spell known. Maybe even get one in between 3rd, 5th, 7th, 9th, etc. That gave you an additional spell for your highest spell level. So at level 8 you would get an additional 4th level spell that didn't count against your known spells. Yes, this is a domain. Slower but that's how it use to be. You would get higher spell levels at one level higher than wizards. So a sorcerer got 2nd level spells at 4th level. But this so called, "Domain" would give you 6th, 7th, 8th and even 9th level spells. Unlike normal domains that only go up to 5th level.
It's not very fleshed out and I have only just gotten the idea. Use it if you want ^^ (just remember if you are using it online, remember to at least shout me out! ^^ Even if they don't like it xD) But again, we are just people on the internet. I don't agree with the ranger and my little brother went with a gloomstalker. He is now WAY TO OP xD! But, the UA ranger is pretty good. So don't take my word for it. I would recommend to talk with your DM, and say you want to test the sorcerer. If you don't like it, play around with it for a while with your DM. See what might and might not work and see if we were right or wrong. Don't judge the sorcerer based on people you've never met. I'm not professional game designer, and it could vary from game to game.
Anyway. Sorry for the vampire lengthy text. If you're still here then congraz! You certainly earn a congraz and a well deserved thank you! Best the loot and luck to you my friend! ^^
It's up to you. They lack the useful tool spells. Like Leomund's Hut, Water Breathing, Mage Armor, stuff like that. They also, even though it may seem like it. Cast fewer spells than a wizard per day. The sorcery point cost for spells are INSANE and a wizard with arcane recovery gets the ability to throw more fireballs or generally spells than you. Wizards also get access to a much much larger spell list. Many awesome wizard spells aren't sorcerer spells. Many things they were good at in 3e, like more spell slots than wizards. Aren't there anymore. The only thing they get from their class (no, not talking about subclasses), is the pathetic Metamagic. The effects aren't even that good. And they cost sorcery points, which you need to buy spells for. Which again, counteracts the more spells than a wizard thingy.
They get so few spells, both known and their spell list that everytime I think of a build. I try to do it any other way than with a sorcerer. If you want to play a sorcerer, you should! Don't let other people tell you that it's bad! You like the ranger, and you love it! Why shouldn't you get to enjoy the ranger then? So you should ask yourself that question.
But if you want an answer. Yes. The sorcerer simply lacks in spells, features, and something that the wizard doesn't have. It's proficencies are the same, with the slight changes in what skills you can be proficient in, but the same armor, weapons and number of skills are the same as wizards. Which is fine of course. They lack a good spell list. So many REALLY good spells are missing from their spell list. Back in the day of 3e (which is mostly what I'm gonna be comparing this too) sorcerer and wizards shared a spell list. And both could have a familiar. I thought of letting my players use both wizards and sorcerer spell lists when playing a sorcerer, but they simply don't have enough spells known for it to be worth it.
Alright. Im repeating myself here. Basically. They are lack luster compared to a bard, they are weaker than a wizard in any spellcasting abilities. And even the warlock gets more spells than a sorcerer, and can cast more! But if you want to play one, go right ahead! Don't let us stop you! Maybe you will like it. Hell, maybe one day I'll realised the secret to the sorcerer! But if I were you. I would ask your DM if you two could work out some things. Maybe some more spells. Such as you get spells known equal to 1 + your sorcerer level + your charisma modifier. I also have one last idea that I've been sitting on for a few days. Here it is, if you want it that is:
Heritage. At say, 2nd level. You once again choose a source of arcane energy. Arcana, Draconic, Chaos. Each of these sources gives you, at every second level a spell. You can choose wild magic bloodline, but still chose draconic heritage as a power source (mostly because I have an idea for a character and she is part wild magic and part draconic heritage. So I wanted to make her work while also making sorcerer work. So maybe this is wayyyyy to weird. If so, this is why). Arcana is spells such as: Mage armor, or catapult. Magic missile. Bigby's hand, Telekinesis, teleport perhaps. Spells that are pure force and classic spells. They are probably more combat oriented spells or at least not as tool like as spells like: rope trick, pyrotechnics, gust of wind, etc. Draconic is probably chromatic based. Chromatic orb, dragon's breath, fly (or haste if you convince the DM), etc. At the very end it could be shapechange (best spell in the game btw xD) And Chaos would be well, chaotic. Stuff that blows up or twists the battlefield. Again, catapult, (I wanna say chaos bolt but eh) shadow blade, haste or slow, bestow curse, dimention door, polymorph, telekinesis, cone of cold, etc.
They would not count against you total number of spells known. So at every second level you would get a spell for your newest spell level. Say if you're level 7 you would get a new 4th level spell that didn't count against your total number of spell known. Maybe even get one in between 3rd, 5th, 7th, 9th, etc. That gave you an additional spell for your highest spell level. So at level 8 you would get an additional 4th level spell that didn't count against your known spells. Yes, this is a domain. Slower but that's how it use to be. You would get higher spell levels at one level higher than wizards. So a sorcerer got 2nd level spells at 4th level. But this so called, "Domain" would give you 6th, 7th, 8th and even 9th level spells. Unlike normal domains that only go up to 5th level.
It's not very fleshed out and I have only just gotten the idea. Use it if you want ^^ (just remember if you are using it online, remember to at least shout me out! ^^ Even if they don't like it xD) But again, we are just people on the internet. I don't agree with the ranger and my little brother went with a gloomstalker. He is now WAY TO OP xD! But, the UA ranger is pretty good. So don't take my word for it. I would recommend to talk with your DM, and say you want to test the sorcerer. If you don't like it, play around with it for a while with your DM. See what might and might not work and see if we were right or wrong. Don't judge the sorcerer based on people you've never met. I'm not professional game designer, and it could vary from game to game.
Anyway. Sorry for the vampire lengthy text. If you're still here then congraz! You certainly earn a congraz and a well deserved thank you! Best the loot and luck to you my friend! ^^
I read it all. I enjoy long texts if they’re informative. I’m fine with not as much versatility but I’d like to be a blasted and I think a sorcerer would be good at that. Also sorcerers can twin buffs which seems OP. Maybe I’ll ask for more spell slots. Thanks for the reply
I’m fine with not as much versatility but I’d like to be a blasted and I think a sorcerer would be good at that. Also sorcerers can twin buffs which seems OP. Maybe I’ll ask for more spell slots. Thanks for the reply
If you want to be a blaster, I recomend sorcerer with 3 levels of warlock multiclass. 2 level 2 slots that recharge on short rest, more cantrips and spells, 2 invocations, and a pact boon. Not to mention subclass features which could be more cantrips, healing feature, armor and weapon proficiencies, etc. Not to mention you get a strictly better equivalent to the sorcerer's level 20 feature as early as level 5 or 6.
You're welcome! Twinned spell is a good one. But again, you have to spend sorcery points equal to a level. Which is a little funny because it means that you're doing it cheaper. Yeah a 12th level sorcerer can cast chain lightning, TWICE. But then again, a wizard can have more 6th level spells than you per day. And also cast two. Just needing a short rest to do so. However while casting chain lightning twice is nice. A wizard can get those 2 2nd level spells back, as well as that 1st level spell slot along with a 4th level spell slot. While a short rest for you contains. Hit dice. But, if you do play a sorcerer, I would love to hear to opinion on it. Someday I should play a pure sorcerer. But I think I'm gonna do that in a minimum level 14 game, cause then I can get those sweet sweet wings. ^^
You're welcome! Twinned spell is a good one. But again, you have to spend sorcery points equal to a level. Which is a little funny because it means that you're doing it cheaper. Yeah a 12th level sorcerer can cast chain lightning, TWICE. But then again, a wizard can have more 6th level spells than you per day. And also cast two. Just needing a short rest to do so. However while casting chain lightning twice is nice. A wizard can get those 2 2nd level spells back, as well as that 1st level spell slot along with a 4th level spell slot. While a short rest for you contains. Hit dice. But, if you do play a sorcerer, I would love to hear to opinion on it. Someday I should play a pure sorcerer. But I think I'm gonna do that in a minimum level 14 game, cause then I can get those sweet sweet wings. ^^
Wizards can't recover a spellslot higher than level 5 with arcane recovery, so they can only cast level 6 spells as many times as a sorcerer can.
You're welcome! Twinned spell is a good one. But again, you have to spend sorcery points equal to a level. Which is a little funny because it means that you're doing it cheaper. Yeah a 12th level sorcerer can cast chain lightning, TWICE. But then again, a wizard can have more 6th level spells than you per day. And also cast two. Just needing a short rest to do so. However while casting chain lightning twice is nice. A wizard can get those 2 2nd level spells back, as well as that 1st level spell slot along with a 4th level spell slot. While a short rest for you contains. Hit dice. But, if you do play a sorcerer, I would love to hear to opinion on it. Someday I should play a pure sorcerer. But I think I'm gonna do that in a minimum level 14 game, cause then I can get those sweet sweet wings. ^^
Wizards can't recover a spellslot higher than level 5 with arcane recovery, so they can only cast level 6 spells as many times as a sorcerer can.
Right! Sorry. An over sight on my part. One of my players is playing a forest gnome diviner. With his "Expert Divination" feature, and arcane recovery. He is going to town with mind spike, and when he gets arcane eye, it's gonna get out of hand I think! xD
I think that sorcerers are more than viable to play (I have been playing one for nearly 3 years from level 1 to level 12). What you have to realize is that you won't be a wizard. You won't be a swiss knife magical caster that can adapt on the fly and reflect every need of your adventuring party. The number of spells you will know will be limited. You won't be ultimate support that is bard or shapeshifting health sponge that can be a druid. But the sorcerer is unique in what he has and what he does because there are things that no other spellcaster can do.
Sorcerers break the rules of casting. Because of metamagic Twinned, Subtle and Quickened sorcerers can ignore some of the rules for casting and create unique effects that can really make difference. The sorcerer will be highly specialized and will do better what he chose to do than anybody else. The roles that are best suited for sorcerers basically are 1) Blaster and 2) Social Manipulator/Controller. With Divine Soul, you can probably become a very decent healer but the first two are where sorcerers truly shine. And you will be probably "Face" of the party being Charisma-based class.
Regardless of what is said above, you can have mage armor. You can offset your limited spell selection by taking Ritual casting feat which can give you 17 spells (if you take wizard spell list), including Find Familiar, Identify, Rary's Telepathic Bond, Detect Magic, Water Breathing, Leomund's Tiny Hut, and my favorite Unseen Servant.
Feats that only a sorcerer will be able to achieve are for example:
Casting Twinned Disintegrate, casting Haste on both your Fighter AND you Ranger, quickening both Disintegrate and cantrip in one turn.
And the best for the last: the most underrated metamagic which is Subtle spell. With Subtle spell, you can cast Detect thoughts in the middle of trade negotiations or game of chance and nobody will be able to detect that you are casting. You walk into the throne room and cast Dominate person a make king jump out of the window or you can make queen stab king and nobody will be able to tell it is your doing. You fight other spellcaster and you are immune to counterspell.
Conclusion: Sorcerers despite their numerous deficiencies (a small number of spells known, lack of versatility) are more than viable to play. The only thing to make them perfect would be taking Sorcerous restoration (which is laughable at level 20) and pushing it down to level 3 or 5 and getting proper class capstone.
Sorcerers are great, but have to be clever with spell selection. Pick hold monster, not hold person. Pick plane shift, not teleport for example. You want flexible spells with general uses.
in addition, use metamagic like there there is no Tomorrow. Subtle spell makes you near impossible to contain and counterspell. Quicken spell makes you deal lots of flash damage.
personal favourite is sorc18/warlock2 for eldritch blast with charisma. Then you can toss out a spell, and with a cheap quicken also shoot a powerful eldritch blast battery with your bonus action. Having eldritch blst also frees up spell slots for everything else than damage.
add on shadow sorcerer for a sick auto disadvantage on enemy saves just when you need it, and if you feel you lack utility take ritual caster to get a load of it.
here is an example spell list for the above build:
SORCERER SPELLS
LV0 Light, Minor Illusion, Prestidigitation, Booming Blade, Fire Bolt, Message LV1 Absorb Elements LV2 Suggestion WIS, Invisibility*, Mirror Image, Web DEX
LV3 Counterspell, Dispel Magic LV4 Banishment CHA, Confusion WIS LV5 Hold Monster WIS, Animate Objects
I’ve heard bad things about the sorcerer and to just play a wizard it bardlock. Are they viable to play? For example, the ranger isn’t really viable although I love the class. Are sorcerers as bad as people think they are or are they just Ok? Or are they really good? I’m looking to play a damage caster that can debuff / buff in emergency.
The only real issue with sorcerers is their limited number of known spells and limited number of class features. In terms of power, they are on par (or even slightly ahead) with wizards. But they lack versatility compared to other casting classes.
That is probably why it is popular to dip a few levels into another class (like paladin or warlock).
I think sorcerers are just attack oriented wizards. They have abilities putting their damage ahead of wizards, like meta magics. The draconic bloodline even gives them more AC and helps elemental damage, letting them get really into combat. They don't have many utility spells compared to wizards, but they still get things like enlarge and reduce, or even wish.
I like sorcerers more than wizards, and they make backstories and role play more fun than wizards, when they mostly just do lots of studying for their power.
Also known as CrafterB and DankMemer.
Here, have some homebrew classes! Subclasses to? Why not races. Feats, feats as well. I have a lot of magic items. Lastly I got monsters, fun, fun times.
Okay. I’m fine with not being super versatile as long as I have 1-2 buffs like Haste and stuff and lots of dmg. Thanks.
A lot depends on your play style. I like sorcerers, but I love warlocks. Yet a combat optimized sorcerer is probably more powerful than a combat optimized warlock is.
Professional computer geek
Sorcerers can actually be really good buffers for spells like invisibility, haste, and fly because of twinned spell metamagic to buff 2 creatures instead of just one.
Sorcerers are a <insert playstyle>-focused class. Got a certain playstyle in mind? Sorcerer can do it.
.. if you build it right.
Almost everything is going to come down to what spells you actually learn. Unlike Wizards, Sorcerers don't have the benefit of preparing spells out of a spellbook. What a Sorcerer knows is what they know, and they don't get the opportunity to know a ton. Sorcerers don't have the luxury of swapping spells in & out during a long rest either, so every single choice matters when learning spells as you level up. You won't have the flexibility in spellcasting (ironic) that Wizards/Clerics/Druids have, but you'll absolutely excel in your chosen direction. I've come to think of the current Sorcerer as a skill class.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
Sorcerer is excellent. Don't listen to the haters. The problem is they are not as versatile as wizards and people get hung up on that. A sorcerer can do something really well. it doesn't really matter what that one thing may be, the sorcerer does it well. A given sorcerer may not be able to do anything /else/ well, but the one role you pick, the sorc will be outstanding.
As long as you don't get caught up on the fact that you can't swap spells to deal with every little situation you see like a wizard, sorcerers are amazing. I /prefer/ them to wizards.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
It's up to you. They lack the useful tool spells. Like Leomund's Hut, Water Breathing, Mage Armor, stuff like that.
They also, even though it may seem like it. Cast fewer spells than a wizard per day. The sorcery point cost for spells are INSANE and a wizard with arcane recovery gets the ability to throw more fireballs or generally spells than you. Wizards also get access to a much much larger spell list. Many awesome wizard spells aren't sorcerer spells. Many things they were good at in 3e, like more spell slots than wizards. Aren't there anymore. The only thing they get from their class (no, not talking about subclasses), is the pathetic Metamagic.
The effects aren't even that good. And they cost sorcery points, which you need to buy spells for. Which again, counteracts the more spells than a wizard thingy.
They get so few spells, both known and their spell list that everytime I think of a build. I try to do it any other way than with a sorcerer. If you want to play a sorcerer, you should! Don't let other people tell you that it's bad! You like the ranger, and you love it! Why shouldn't you get to enjoy the ranger then? So you should ask yourself that question.
But if you want an answer. Yes. The sorcerer simply lacks in spells, features, and something that the wizard doesn't have. It's proficencies are the same, with the slight changes in what skills you can be proficient in, but the same armor, weapons and number of skills are the same as wizards. Which is fine of course.
They lack a good spell list. So many REALLY good spells are missing from their spell list. Back in the day of 3e (which is mostly what I'm gonna be comparing this too) sorcerer and wizards shared a spell list. And both could have a familiar. I thought of letting my players use both wizards and sorcerer spell lists when playing a sorcerer, but they simply don't have enough spells known for it to be worth it.
Alright. Im repeating myself here. Basically. They are lack luster compared to a bard, they are weaker than a wizard in any spellcasting abilities. And even the warlock gets more spells than a sorcerer, and can cast more! But if you want to play one, go right ahead! Don't let us stop you! Maybe you will like it. Hell, maybe one day I'll realised the secret to the sorcerer!
But if I were you. I would ask your DM if you two could work out some things. Maybe some more spells. Such as you get spells known equal to 1 + your sorcerer level + your charisma modifier. I also have one last idea that I've been sitting on for a few days. Here it is, if you want it that is:
Heritage. At say, 2nd level. You once again choose a source of arcane energy. Arcana, Draconic, Chaos. Each of these sources gives you, at every second level a spell. You can choose wild magic bloodline, but still chose draconic heritage as a power source (mostly because I have an idea for a character and she is part wild magic and part draconic heritage. So I wanted to make her work while also making sorcerer work. So maybe this is wayyyyy to weird. If so, this is why).
Arcana is spells such as: Mage armor, or catapult. Magic missile. Bigby's hand, Telekinesis, teleport perhaps. Spells that are pure force and classic spells. They are probably more combat oriented spells or at least not as tool like as spells like: rope trick, pyrotechnics, gust of wind, etc.
Draconic is probably chromatic based. Chromatic orb, dragon's breath, fly (or haste if you convince the DM), etc. At the very end it could be shapechange (best spell in the game btw xD)
And Chaos would be well, chaotic. Stuff that blows up or twists the battlefield. Again, catapult, (I wanna say chaos bolt but eh) shadow blade, haste or slow, bestow curse, dimention door, polymorph, telekinesis, cone of cold, etc.
They would not count against you total number of spells known. So at every second level you would get a spell for your newest spell level. Say if you're level 7 you would get a new 4th level spell that didn't count against your total number of spell known. Maybe even get one in between 3rd, 5th, 7th, 9th, etc. That gave you an additional spell for your highest spell level. So at level 8 you would get an additional 4th level spell that didn't count against your known spells. Yes, this is a domain. Slower but that's how it use to be. You would get higher spell levels at one level higher than wizards. So a sorcerer got 2nd level spells at 4th level. But this so called, "Domain" would give you 6th, 7th, 8th and even 9th level spells. Unlike normal domains that only go up to 5th level.
It's not very fleshed out and I have only just gotten the idea. Use it if you want ^^ (just remember if you are using it online, remember to at least shout me out! ^^ Even if they don't like it xD) But again, we are just people on the internet. I don't agree with the ranger and my little brother went with a gloomstalker. He is now WAY TO OP xD! But, the UA ranger is pretty good. So don't take my word for it. I would recommend to talk with your DM, and say you want to test the sorcerer. If you don't like it, play around with it for a while with your DM. See what might and might not work and see if we were right or wrong. Don't judge the sorcerer based on people you've never met. I'm not professional game designer, and it could vary from game to game.
Anyway. Sorry for the vampire lengthy text. If you're still here then congraz! You certainly earn a congraz and a well deserved thank you! Best the loot and luck to you my friend! ^^
I read it all. I enjoy long texts if they’re informative. I’m fine with not as much versatility but I’d like to be a blasted and I think a sorcerer would be good at that. Also sorcerers can twin buffs which seems OP. Maybe I’ll ask for more spell slots. Thanks for the reply
If you want to be a blaster, I recomend sorcerer with 3 levels of warlock multiclass. 2 level 2 slots that recharge on short rest, more cantrips and spells, 2 invocations, and a pact boon. Not to mention subclass features which could be more cantrips, healing feature, armor and weapon proficiencies, etc. Not to mention you get a strictly better equivalent to the sorcerer's level 20 feature as early as level 5 or 6.
Okay.
You're welcome! Twinned spell is a good one. But again, you have to spend sorcery points equal to a level. Which is a little funny because it means that you're doing it cheaper. Yeah a 12th level sorcerer can cast chain lightning, TWICE. But then again, a wizard can have more 6th level spells than you per day. And also cast two. Just needing a short rest to do so. However while casting chain lightning twice is nice. A wizard can get those 2 2nd level spells back, as well as that 1st level spell slot along with a 4th level spell slot. While a short rest for you contains. Hit dice. But, if you do play a sorcerer, I would love to hear to opinion on it. Someday I should play a pure sorcerer. But I think I'm gonna do that in a minimum level 14 game, cause then I can get those sweet sweet wings. ^^
Wizards can't recover a spellslot higher than level 5 with arcane recovery, so they can only cast level 6 spells as many times as a sorcerer can.
Right! Sorry. An over sight on my part. One of my players is playing a forest gnome diviner. With his "Expert Divination" feature, and arcane recovery. He is going to town with mind spike, and when he gets arcane eye, it's gonna get out of hand I think! xD
I think that sorcerers are more than viable to play (I have been playing one for nearly 3 years from level 1 to level 12). What you have to realize is that you won't be a wizard. You won't be a swiss knife magical caster that can adapt on the fly and reflect every need of your adventuring party. The number of spells you will know will be limited. You won't be ultimate support that is bard or shapeshifting health sponge that can be a druid. But the sorcerer is unique in what he has and what he does because there are things that no other spellcaster can do.
Sorcerers break the rules of casting. Because of metamagic Twinned, Subtle and Quickened sorcerers can ignore some of the rules for casting and create unique effects that can really make difference. The sorcerer will be highly specialized and will do better what he chose to do than anybody else. The roles that are best suited for sorcerers basically are 1) Blaster and 2) Social Manipulator/Controller. With Divine Soul, you can probably become a very decent healer but the first two are where sorcerers truly shine. And you will be probably "Face" of the party being Charisma-based class.
Regardless of what is said above, you can have mage armor. You can offset your limited spell selection by taking Ritual casting feat which can give you 17 spells (if you take wizard spell list), including Find Familiar, Identify, Rary's Telepathic Bond, Detect Magic, Water Breathing, Leomund's Tiny Hut, and my favorite Unseen Servant.
Feats that only a sorcerer will be able to achieve are for example:
Casting Twinned Disintegrate, casting Haste on both your Fighter AND you Ranger, quickening both Disintegrate and cantrip in one turn.
And the best for the last: the most underrated metamagic which is Subtle spell. With Subtle spell, you can cast Detect thoughts in the middle of trade negotiations or game of chance and nobody will be able to detect that you are casting. You walk into the throne room and cast Dominate person a make king jump out of the window or you can make queen stab king and nobody will be able to tell it is your doing. You fight other spellcaster and you are immune to counterspell.
Conclusion: Sorcerers despite their numerous deficiencies (a small number of spells known, lack of versatility) are more than viable to play. The only thing to make them perfect would be taking Sorcerous restoration (which is laughable at level 20) and pushing it down to level 3 or 5 and getting proper class capstone.
Sorcerers are great, but have to be clever with spell selection. Pick hold monster, not hold person. Pick plane shift, not teleport for example. You want flexible spells with general uses.
in addition, use metamagic like there there is no Tomorrow. Subtle spell makes you near impossible to contain and counterspell. Quicken spell makes you deal lots of flash damage.
personal favourite is sorc18/warlock2 for eldritch blast with charisma. Then you can toss out a spell, and with a cheap quicken also shoot a powerful eldritch blast battery with your bonus action. Having eldritch blst also frees up spell slots for everything else than damage.
add on shadow sorcerer for a sick auto disadvantage on enemy saves just when you need it, and if you feel you lack utility take ritual caster to get a load of it.
here is an example spell list for the above build:
SORCERER SPELLS
LV0 Light, Minor Illusion, Prestidigitation, Booming Blade, Fire Bolt, Message
LV1 Absorb Elements
LV2 Suggestion WIS, Invisibility*, Mirror Image, Web DEX
LV3 Counterspell, Dispel Magic
LV4 Banishment CHA, Confusion WIS
LV5 Hold Monster WIS, Animate Objects
LV6 True Seeing
LV7 Plane Shift CHA
LV8 Dominate Monster WIS
LV9 wish
WARLOCK SPELLS
LV0 Eldritch blast, Mage Hand
LV1 Shield, Hex, Expeditious Retreat