hey all, still a pretty new caster, Undead sailor warlock, L2, probably about to L3 and take Tome next session.
just wondering. this class from the start has tons of choices and customization it seems but at the cost of limitations. I'm a worrier so I'm constantly looking up advice articles, rankings of invocations and spells, etc.
so yeah, was interested to know, any warlock choices at leveling that seemed useful, popular, or powerful at the time, that you now regret? or just. didn't do it for you?
I'm not a power gamer at all, i usually pick for theme. but I'm also the only caster and maybe the most support-capable, so for the sake of my gang, thought I'd ask for your experiences.
Form me warlock are great as a few level dip but not so great as a class to 20. I think the best parts are front loaded and you get better play switching to soc bard or paladin after about 2-4 leveles and sometime Warlock should not be you level 1 pick but instead 2.
Take a lot of utility cantrips. You’ll learn quickly when you pick Pact of the Tome that you only use Eldritch Blast and one cantrip that requires a saving throw instead of an attack roll. Don’t make the mistake of having 4-5 cantrips that do damage.
and remember that Short rest.. If you play a slow game, heavy in exploration or other time using things the warlock can rest. a short rest. and regain the slots.
One time I ended in a community game having the warlock stealth as the party ran from a small; bugbear, hob, and goblin war camp. he actually used his illusion spells and sprite to lay them under siege. finally rescuing the prisoner.. and running back to the city carrying the person. And warning the city of the imminent arrival of the war band.
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Itinerant Deputy Shire-reave Tomas Burrfoot - world walker, Raft-captain, speaker to his dead
Toddy Shelfungus- Rider of the Order of Ill Luck, Speaker to Friends of Friends, and Horribly big nosed
Jarl Archi of Jenisis Glade Fee- Noble Knight of the Dragonborn Goldcrest Clan, Sorcerer of the Noble Investigator;y; Knightly order of the Wolfhound
The best thing about the Warlock class is that they can swap out an old spell and an old invocation every time they level up. So they're not just the most customizable class, they're also highly forgiving of mistakes and "buyer's remorse" situations. If you don't like one (or more) of your selections, you can replace it next time you level up.
I've had a few choices that didn't work out, but they were short-lived.
The best thing about the Warlock class is that they can swap out an old spell and an old invocation every time they level up. So they're not just the most customizable class, they're also highly forgiving of mistakes and "buyer's remorse" situations. If you don't like one (or more) of your selections, you can replace it next time you level up.
I've had a few choices that didn't work out, but they were short-lived.
If the player allows it you can even retrain your sub class ( all classes can).
are there any attractive seeming options anyone would recommend to not waste a level on? i know we can switch things out but having to still play a boring mistake for a few sessions would be a bummer. cheers 🍻
It all depends on your play styal and your party. being able to see in darkness May be fun but may suck if the others do not. I even had a party once that had a fun game where they specialized in sneaking around and one Player was a Fighter and the other was a Barbarian (he would mutter to himself offent "must not lose control must be sneaky". Mind you if you are the support and only cast for the group you may want to pick up some Bard. Also if have Agonizing Blast and Repelling Blast do not focuse on attack but more contol spells and abilitys. Forcing the npc into a simple grease (dex vs falling) or web (dex vs restain) form a soc (if multi), can let the rest of the party focuse on 1 npc whole you hold the others back.
I find it helpful not to think of yourself as a caster. More like an archer who can throw out a couple spells and has other funky things they can do. Try to understand what the rest of the party can do, and don’t take spells or invocations that duplicate them. And think about the campaign in general. For example, if you’re on a ship-based campaign, gift of the depths can be incredible — in the desert, not so much. If you’re just doing a lot of dungeon crawling, and combat focused campaign, stay away from mask of many faces, but if it’s an rp-heavy intrigue campaign, you should definitely pick it up. That kind of thing.
cool. yeah my character doesn't know he's a warlock so I'm just picking stuff that fits "hypervigilant uncomplicated sailor" and i have all my party skill gaps on a level by level spreadsheet, especially so i can take things to support the newbie in the gang.
So here are some things that weren't obvious to me.
Concentration: So all casters know that concentration is important. What I didn't realize was that ritual casting breaks concentration. So if you are pact of the tome and handling the exploration rituals (detect magic, identify, etc) then you don't get to maintain concentration from fight to fight. I offset that risk by having hex via fey touched. It gives me a disposable hex that I can use and not care about dropping concentration on after only one fight.
How little you need AC. Repelling blast, ranged attacks, you just don't need to be in melee. If you get fey touched you can get out of melee easy as well.
Repelling blast: I keep swapping it in and out of my selections, but its really, really great. I swapped it out for awhile and I couldn't use it to break a grapple and a player got his brain eaten.
Polymorph invocation: Super great spell, but the campaign I am in seems to be mostly enclosed places. No room for big things.
oh thanks that's all really helpful, i was planning to take fey touched w/ bless :) which also coz, we're playing witchlight. and i despise odd attributes.
i also took eldritch sight and eldritch mind, so those should free up choices.
great to know about AC. i've heard Lance of Lethargy is better than Repelling Blast from some people. Can anyone speak to this? Repelling does look awesome, but that's just what I heard.
Unpopular opinion; Hex and invocations that leverage it are not as good as you think. I've found as a leveled up I wanted the bonus action\concentration for other things. The extra damage is nice but it limits other options. I also took a level of bard at level 6 and it greatly expanded the utility options for my chainlock.
Once I took my first Bard level I found myself using Inspiration Dice and Healing Word tying up my Bonus Action more than I expected. And at lower levels, Misty Step was something I was using to avoid being pinned down in melee. I was thinking I could Hex and hold it for a multiple combats. But Invisibility, and the Medallion of Thoughts my character has often was tying up concentration. The allure of having Hex for extra damage gets marginalized when you have cool options around level 5.
Currently a Bardlock 6 Warlock/Bard 1. Our campaign is heavy RP and a couple years in. I plan to go the route of Eloquence Bard and keep the other 17 in Warlock. Just the one Bard level gave so much (Healing Word, a couple extra spell slots, ritual casting). I'll sprinkle in the other two levels when it makes sense. But it fits the character concept well, and does add dimension to what the Warlock lacks.
To your original point though; yeah I expected Hex was going to be a regular feature. It just swapped it out at level 7 along with Maddening Hex because it often was tying up action economy.
are there any attractive seeming options anyone would recommend to not waste a level on? i know we can switch things out but having to still play a boring mistake for a few sessions would be a bummer. cheers 🍻
Yes, ghostly gaze and trickster's escape. They seemed cool, but I almost never used them.
are there any attractive seeming options anyone would recommend to not waste a level on? i know we can switch things out but having to still play a boring mistake for a few sessions would be a bummer. cheers 🍻
Best advice I can give is to avoid any invocations that use one of your spell slots, especially at the earlier levels. Mask of Many Faces and Devil Sight (especially if you don't have Darkvision) are incredibly useful and you will get plenty of mileage from them.
i've heard Lance of Lethargy is better than Repelling Blast from some people. Can anyone speak to this? Repelling does look awesome, but that's just what I heard.
If you're only relying on using it to run away! There are much better options when using to run away though.
Repelling Blast not only creates that distance, but when you get multiple rays, you can knock one creature back 10 ft. per hit. Or you can knock back multiple creatures 10 ft. each. No save. It is also an extremely powerful battlefield control tool when you have just about anything else to pair with it. You can easily position to knock people into hazards, either natural or an AoE spell (cliffs, lava, river OR Spike Growth, Hunger of Hadar, Entangle, etc.)
The ability to forcibly move the enemy with no save should not be undervalued.
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hey all, still a pretty new caster, Undead sailor warlock, L2, probably about to L3 and take Tome next session.
just wondering. this class from the start has tons of choices and customization it seems but at the cost of limitations. I'm a worrier so I'm constantly looking up advice articles, rankings of invocations and spells, etc.
so yeah, was interested to know, any warlock choices at leveling that seemed useful, popular, or powerful at the time, that you now regret? or just. didn't do it for you?
I'm not a power gamer at all, i usually pick for theme. but I'm also the only caster and maybe the most support-capable, so for the sake of my gang, thought I'd ask for your experiences.
thanks for reading, cheers :)
Form me warlock are great as a few level dip but not so great as a class to 20. I think the best parts are front loaded and you get better play switching to soc bard or paladin after about 2-4 leveles and sometime Warlock should not be you level 1 pick but instead 2.
I spell Goodly.
Take a lot of utility cantrips. You’ll learn quickly when you pick Pact of the Tome that you only use Eldritch Blast and one cantrip that requires a saving throw instead of an attack roll. Don’t make the mistake of having 4-5 cantrips that do damage.
Professional computer geek
and remember that Short rest..
If you play a slow game, heavy in exploration or other time using things the warlock can rest. a short rest. and regain the slots.
One time I ended in a community game having the warlock stealth as the party ran from a small; bugbear, hob, and goblin war camp.
he actually used his illusion spells and sprite to lay them under siege.
finally rescuing the prisoner..
and running back to the city carrying the person.
And warning the city of the imminent arrival of the war band.
Itinerant Deputy Shire-reave Tomas Burrfoot - world walker, Raft-captain, speaker to his dead
Toddy Shelfungus- Rider of the Order of Ill Luck, Speaker to Friends of Friends, and Horribly big nosed
Jarl Archi of Jenisis Glade Fee- Noble Knight of the Dragonborn Goldcrest Clan, Sorcerer of the Noble Investigator;y; Knightly order of the Wolfhound
The best thing about the Warlock class is that they can swap out an old spell and an old invocation every time they level up. So they're not just the most customizable class, they're also highly forgiving of mistakes and "buyer's remorse" situations. If you don't like one (or more) of your selections, you can replace it next time you level up.
I've had a few choices that didn't work out, but they were short-lived.
Behind every successful Warlock, there's an angry mob.
If the player allows it you can even retrain your sub class ( all classes can).
I spell Goodly.
are there any attractive seeming options anyone would recommend to not waste a level on? i know we can switch things out but having to still play a boring mistake for a few sessions would be a bummer. cheers 🍻
It all depends on your play styal and your party. being able to see in darkness May be fun but may suck if the others do not. I even had a party once that had a fun game where they specialized in sneaking around and one Player was a Fighter and the other was a Barbarian (he would mutter to himself offent "must not lose control must be sneaky". Mind you if you are the support and only cast for the group you may want to pick up some Bard. Also if have Agonizing Blast and Repelling Blast do not focuse on attack but more contol spells and abilitys. Forcing the npc into a simple grease (dex vs falling) or web (dex vs restain) form a soc (if multi), can let the rest of the party focuse on 1 npc whole you hold the others back.
I spell Goodly.
I find it helpful not to think of yourself as a caster. More like an archer who can throw out a couple spells and has other funky things they can do.
Try to understand what the rest of the party can do, and don’t take spells or invocations that duplicate them. And think about the campaign in general. For example, if you’re on a ship-based campaign, gift of the depths can be incredible — in the desert, not so much. If you’re just doing a lot of dungeon crawling, and combat focused campaign, stay away from mask of many faces, but if it’s an rp-heavy intrigue campaign, you should definitely pick it up. That kind of thing.
cool. yeah my character doesn't know he's a warlock so I'm just picking stuff that fits "hypervigilant uncomplicated sailor" and i have all my party skill gaps on a level by level spreadsheet, especially so i can take things to support the newbie in the gang.
So here are some things that weren't obvious to me.
Concentration: So all casters know that concentration is important. What I didn't realize was that ritual casting breaks concentration. So if you are pact of the tome and handling the exploration rituals (detect magic, identify, etc) then you don't get to maintain concentration from fight to fight. I offset that risk by having hex via fey touched. It gives me a disposable hex that I can use and not care about dropping concentration on after only one fight.
How little you need AC. Repelling blast, ranged attacks, you just don't need to be in melee. If you get fey touched you can get out of melee easy as well.
Repelling blast: I keep swapping it in and out of my selections, but its really, really great. I swapped it out for awhile and I couldn't use it to break a grapple and a player got his brain eaten.
Polymorph invocation: Super great spell, but the campaign I am in seems to be mostly enclosed places. No room for big things.
oh thanks that's all really helpful, i was planning to take fey touched w/ bless :) which also coz, we're playing witchlight. and i despise odd attributes.
i also took eldritch sight and eldritch mind, so those should free up choices.
great to know about AC. i've heard Lance of Lethargy is better than Repelling Blast from some people. Can anyone speak to this? Repelling does look awesome, but that's just what I heard.
Unpopular opinion; Hex and invocations that leverage it are not as good as you think. I've found as a leveled up I wanted the bonus action\concentration for other things. The extra damage is nice but it limits other options. I also took a level of bard at level 6 and it greatly expanded the utility options for my chainlock.
being a supportlock i have hex but always meant to switch it for bless at L4. what better uses for BA/conc do you like?
and i have been looking at dipping bard or divine soul at 6. what did you take?
Once I took my first Bard level I found myself using Inspiration Dice and Healing Word tying up my Bonus Action more than I expected. And at lower levels, Misty Step was something I was using to avoid being pinned down in melee. I was thinking I could Hex and hold it for a multiple combats. But Invisibility, and the Medallion of Thoughts my character has often was tying up concentration. The allure of having Hex for extra damage gets marginalized when you have cool options around level 5.
Currently a Bardlock 6 Warlock/Bard 1. Our campaign is heavy RP and a couple years in. I plan to go the route of Eloquence Bard and keep the other 17 in Warlock. Just the one Bard level gave so much (Healing Word, a couple extra spell slots, ritual casting). I'll sprinkle in the other two levels when it makes sense. But it fits the character concept well, and does add dimension to what the Warlock lacks.
To your original point though; yeah I expected Hex was going to be a regular feature. It just swapped it out at level 7 along with Maddening Hex because it often was tying up action economy.
Yes, ghostly gaze and trickster's escape. They seemed cool, but I almost never used them.
Best advice I can give is to avoid any invocations that use one of your spell slots, especially at the earlier levels. Mask of Many Faces and Devil Sight (especially if you don't have Darkvision) are incredibly useful and you will get plenty of mileage from them.
Funny I use trickster's escape every day. I must have a DM that is more Grapple happy
good point, I've can't remember any of my usual pals ever grappling in any session. interesting differences.
If you're only relying on using it to run away! There are much better options when using to run away though.
Repelling Blast not only creates that distance, but when you get multiple rays, you can knock one creature back 10 ft. per hit. Or you can knock back multiple creatures 10 ft. each. No save. It is also an extremely powerful battlefield control tool when you have just about anything else to pair with it. You can easily position to knock people into hazards, either natural or an AoE spell (cliffs, lava, river OR Spike Growth, Hunger of Hadar, Entangle, etc.)
The ability to forcibly move the enemy with no save should not be undervalued.