Interesting take on the removal of a feature that not only has been here close to if not as long as this site has been live, but also has clearly been a huge draw to this site for many, but as you have stated it didn't affect you so it is a non-issue, I am still scratching my head about this viewpoint/dismissiveness towards others that have actually been affected and are unhappy about it. I guess their experience is just wrong, not different but wrong?
I'm not dismissive of the viewpoint of "this sucks"; removing an option people like obviously sucks for the people who like it. I'm dismissive of the viewpoint of "this is an evil Hasbro plot", as opposed to the bog-standard product management decision of "this product isn't worth the effort to support any more".
I disagree, there are many posting from the platform of dissent about this that see this as a continuation of the heavy anti consumer direction that wotc has taken in the last couple of years. If you choose to look at each blunder in a vacuum then I can see where the sympathetic view comes from, but from a system theory view (ie looking at the whole system, not the individual parts) it paints a very different picture than the wotc sympathizers are portraying.
I have said it before and I will say it again, unless you and/or those in your camp have access to information those of us upset about the changes do not then we all are on equal footing and your speculation carries no more weight than those you oppose.
Exactly. As a system, the decline since DDB was purchased is undeniable.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
DId you know? The DDB marketplace has REMOVED the option for purchasing one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters "a la carte". Now you ALWAYS have to buy the ENTIRE book instead.
Unhappy? UNSUBSCRIBE and Let them know your thoughts!
This is why I just don't get the people saying it couldn't possibly be financially motivated and that we don't understand because they have the numbers in front of them and we don't.
Companies are near universally motivated by finance, it's not a "conspiracy theory" to know this and speculate based off of it especially since there's no other inherent benefit to them for removing this option.
Again, they didn't remove the option. They didn't implement the option, and the inherent benefit is "didn't need to spend money and development resources on implementing it"; their win isn't increasing sales, it's reducing expenses. Now, I wouldn't be shocked if someone is hostile to the option, but if that was a major motivating factor, they wouldn't have waited until the new store came online.
Whether you honestly believe this semantic contortion, or are merely shilling dishonestly, the only thing you have convinced me of is to skip past anything with your name on it.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
DId you know? The DDB marketplace has REMOVED the option for purchasing one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters "a la carte". Now you ALWAYS have to buy the ENTIRE book instead.
Unhappy? UNSUBSCRIBE and Let them know your thoughts!
Nooo, It's called word of mouth, which carries far further than your individual dollar. It makes other consumers aware of a shitty/greedy/exploitative deal. And it is killing shareholders the world over right now.
Both. Both have power in different ways.
You're right. But apologists like to pretend you only have the one, because they really want you to shut up and not influence others.
Do you think everyone who disagrees with you is a corporate puppet?
Not at all. If someone parrots lines of botlike corporate subservience, however, I don't let it pass without contest.
I still think this is a trial balloon being floated by wotc. They have a full financial quarter to analyze the impact, before the Sept rollout of 6e. If the sales numbers in the next quarter are not impacted by this, or are stronger, then this thing sticks. If there is a sharp falloff in sales, this might be backed out before Sept. That is the only thing that matters to wotc is profits, or any other corporation operating in a capitalist model, also known as the modern world.
If there was a trial balloon, it was book of many things.
But I think they have, for whatever reason, decided to do it. This doesn't mean they won't change their minds if it turns out to fare poorly, but it won't be back by September -- there's not enough time to get a good measure of results, then develop and test a new new marketplace (because the current one can't even really do the much simpler digital-physical bundle as a single item), and roll it out, fixing the inevitable problems, all before the new PHB drops.
Also, the new PHB is likely the single biggest potential financial beneficiary of not having piecemeal purchasing -- it's probably the only book where significant numbers of people will say "I want X now, so I might as well buy the whole thing, because it'll get used eventually."
If they do reverse course, we're probably looking at a year minimum, and likely longer. (Also, the runup to a new edition and then the release of said edition are the worst time to get reliable numbers on how this is going to affect sales.)
I still think this is a trial balloon being floated by wotc. They have a full financial quarter to analyze the impact, before the Sept rollout of 6e. If the sales numbers in the next quarter are not impacted by this, or are stronger, then this thing sticks. If there is a sharp falloff in sales, this might be backed out before Sept. That is the only thing that matters to wotc is profits, or any other corporation operating in a capitalist model, also known as the modern world.
If there was a trial balloon, it was book of many things.
But I think they have, for whatever reason, decided to do it. This doesn't mean they won't change their minds if it turns out to fare poorly, but it won't be back by September -- there's not enough time to get a good measure of results, then develop and test a new new marketplace (because the current one can't even really do the much simpler digital-physical bundle as a single item), and roll it out, fixing the inevitable problems, all before the new PHB drops.
Also, the new PHB is likely the single biggest potential financial beneficiary of not having piecemeal purchasing -- it's probably the only book where significant numbers of people will say "I want X now, so I might as well buy the whole thing, because it'll get used eventually."
If they do reverse course, we're probably looking at a year minimum, and likely longer. (Also, the runup to a new edition and then the release of said edition are the worst time to get reliable numbers on how this is going to affect sales.)
Probably so. It will be the digital results that interest them though. They're not as interested in publishing (market observers have said) just digital. So a clear signal will be subs lapsing and drop in digital sales at DDB. In a game of dense wordy texts, a la carte was the core of the DDB onboarding experience.
DId you know? The DDB marketplace has REMOVED the option for purchasing one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters "a la carte". Now you ALWAYS have to buy the ENTIRE book instead.
Unhappy? UNSUBSCRIBE and Let them know your thoughts!
Probably so. It will be the digital results that interest them though. They're not as interested in publishing (market observers have said) just digital. So a clear signal will be subs lapsing and drop in digital sales at DDB. In a game of dense wordy texts, a la carte was the core of the DDB onboarding experience.
I would not say 'the' core, but definitely a key part of it.
DId you know? The DDB marketplace has REMOVED the option for purchasing one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters "a la carte". Now you ALWAYS have to buy the ENTIRE book instead.
Unhappy? UNSUBSCRIBE and Let them know your thoughts!
Nooo, It's called word of mouth, which carries far further than your individual dollar. It makes other consumers aware of a shitty/greedy/exploitative deal. And it is killing shareholders the world over right now.
Both. Both have power in different ways.
You're right. But apologists like to pretend you only have the one, because they really want you to shut up and not influence others.
Do you think everyone who disagrees with you is a corporate puppet?
Not at all. If someone parrots lines of botlike corporate subservience, however, I don't let it pass without contest.
I still think this is a trial balloon being floated by wotc. They have a full financial quarter to analyze the impact, before the Sept rollout of 6e. If the sales numbers in the next quarter are not impacted by this, or are stronger, then this thing sticks. If there is a sharp falloff in sales, this might be backed out before Sept. That is the only thing that matters to wotc is profits, or any other corporation operating in a capitalist model, also known as the modern world.
If there was a trial balloon, it was book of many things.
But I think they have, for whatever reason, decided to do it. This doesn't mean they won't change their minds if it turns out to fare poorly, but it won't be back by September -- there's not enough time to get a good measure of results, then develop and test a new new marketplace (because the current one can't even really do the much simpler digital-physical bundle as a single item), and roll it out, fixing the inevitable problems, all before the new PHB drops.
Also, the new PHB is likely the single biggest potential financial beneficiary of not having piecemeal purchasing -- it's probably the only book where significant numbers of people will say "I want X now, so I might as well buy the whole thing, because it'll get used eventually."
If they do reverse course, we're probably looking at a year minimum, and likely longer. (Also, the runup to a new edition and then the release of said edition are the worst time to get reliable numbers on how this is going to affect sales.)
I still think this is a trial balloon being floated by wotc. They have a full financial quarter to analyze the impact, before the Sept rollout of 6e. If the sales numbers in the next quarter are not impacted by this, or are stronger, then this thing sticks. If there is a sharp falloff in sales, this might be backed out before Sept. That is the only thing that matters to wotc is profits, or any other corporation operating in a capitalist model, also known as the modern world.
If there was a trial balloon, it was book of many things.
But I think they have, for whatever reason, decided to do it. This doesn't mean they won't change their minds if it turns out to fare poorly, but it won't be back by September -- there's not enough time to get a good measure of results, then develop and test a new new marketplace (because the current one can't even really do the much simpler digital-physical bundle as a single item), and roll it out, fixing the inevitable problems, all before the new PHB drops.
Also, the new PHB is likely the single biggest potential financial beneficiary of not having piecemeal purchasing -- it's probably the only book where significant numbers of people will say "I want X now, so I might as well buy the whole thing, because it'll get used eventually."
If they do reverse course, we're probably looking at a year minimum, and likely longer. (Also, the runup to a new edition and then the release of said edition are the worst time to get reliable numbers on how this is going to affect sales.)
Probably so. It will be the digital results that interest them though. They're not as interested in publishing (market observers have said) just digital. So a clear signal will be subs lapsing and drop in digital sales at DDB. In a game of dense wordy texts, a la carte was the core of the DDB onboarding experience.
Do some googling on the financial results of the app Monopoly Go, with obviously the rights to Monopoly owned by Hasbro. To suggest it is a game of Monopoly, is well, just silly. But Hasbro has generated literally billions in revenue from it. There is no doubt that wotc is eyeing the D&D IP and wondering if an app called D&D Go would have the same results. Remember, the ex-head of wotc stated many many times that she and her boss thought that the D&D IP was under-monetized and it should be a billion dollar brand, just like its stablemate, Magic the Gathering. The only way that is going to happen is license, license, license, and of course, digital apps.
Exactly. As a system, the decline since DDB was purchased is undeniable.
I think all the people who use the maps system would deny this claim. I think all the people who like the addition of third party content to Beyond would deny this claim.
I am not fond of the removal of a la carte purchases. But saying the site has “undeniably” gotten worse since the purchase is an extremely silly thing to say. Even if you do not personally use these systems, they are strict upgrades to the older system that you cannot just ignore. From an objective analysis, D&D Beyond has, as a whole, been improved sim e the purchase. And, considering Wizards is presently hiring a number of positions for D&D Beyond to help prepare for the revised 5e release, I would not be surprised if more improvements are on the horizon.
Ill-informed anger, like the kind demonstrated by this categorically incorrect line, only works of the issue is interesting enough that the anger draws the attention of the mainstream press. That worked in the OGL situation because the underlying issue was interest - here, it is a company changing their pricing model and not implementing an old feature when building their new marketplace. Hardly an exciting story.
Since the Washington Post is not going to sail to our side and help a la carte purchasing return, players should be making it clear to Wizards that are displeased… but, just as importantly, that they are willing to forgive Wizards and return to their prior purchasing habits on this site should the system return—after all, if you are the kind of angry person who will not return even should Wizards change their purchasing model, then you are already a write-off.
Saying absolutist statements which fall apart under even a modicum of scrutiny makes you look like someone Wizards can just write off and thus ignore, drowning out the many (though, increasingly infrequent) new voices on this thread who are trying to contribute something helpful to this conversation.
Exactly. As a system, the decline since DDB was purchased is undeniable.
I think all the people who use the maps system would deny this claim. I think all the people who like the addition of third party content to Beyond would deny this claim.
I am not fond of the removal of a la carte purchases. But saying the site has “undeniably” gotten worse since the purchase is an extremely silly thing to say. Even if you do not personally use these systems, they are strict upgrades to the older system that you cannot just ignore. From an objective analysis, D&D Beyond has, as a whole, been improved sim e the purchase. And, considering Wizards is presently hiring a number of positions for D&D Beyond to help prepare for the revised 5e release, I would not be surprised if more improvements are on the horizon.
Ill-informed anger, like the kind demonstrated by this categorically incorrect line, only works of the issue is interesting enough that the anger draws the attention of the mainstream press. That worked in the OGL situation because the underlying issue was interest - here, it is a company changing their pricing model and not implementing an old feature when building their new marketplace. Hardly an exciting story.
Since the Washington Post is not going to sail to our side and help a la carte purchasing return, players should be making it clear to Wizards that are displeased… but, just as importantly, that they are willing to forgive Wizards and return to their prior purchasing habits on this site should the system return—after all, if you are the kind of angry person who will not return even should Wizards change their purchasing model, then you are already a write-off.
Saying absolutist statements which fall apart under even a modicum of scrutiny makes you look like someone Wizards can just write off and thus ignore, drowning out the many (though, increasingly infrequent) new voices on this thread who are trying to contribute something helpful to this conversation.
Every single poster here, well, their opinion and statements matter as much as yours. Please stop trying to gatekeep this discussion.
Do some googling on the financial results of the app Monopoly Go, with obviously the rights to Monopoly owned by Hasbro. To suggest it is a game of Monopoly, is well, just silly. But Hasbro has generated literally billions in revenue from it. There is no doubt that wotc is eyeing the D&D IP and wondering if an app called D&D Go would have the same results. Remember, the ex-head of wotc stated many many times that she and her boss thought that the D&D IP was under-monetized and it should be a billion dollar brand, just like its stablemate, Magic the Gathering. The only way that is going to happen is license, license, license, and of course, digital apps.
Sure, they're probably looking at that. But it's a side business; they're no more going to turn D&D into that than they turned Monopoly into Monopoly Go.
Expanding a brand still requires the core thing to exist. This is especially true of D&D. With something like Transformers, they could stop making the toys, and keep the characters going as a media franchise. D&D hasn't got that. If you don't have the core experience of D&D to keep people interested in it, the brand will fade. And you can't give people anything like the core D&D experience in a mobile game.
Probably so. It will be the digital results that interest them though. They're not as interested in publishing (market observers have said) just digital. So a clear signal will be subs lapsing and drop in digital sales at DDB. In a game of dense wordy texts, a la carte was the core of the DDB onboarding experience.
I'm sure some market observers have said such. They are not to be trusted as analysts.
Print is by far the lion's share of WotC's business, both D&D and Magic. Digital is getting attention because it's a place they can grow more easily, but I find it hard to believe they don't think print is a big deal for them.
This makes this tool almost unusable for me and my friends. I have more friends asking me about DND than ever, and I've always been able to tell them that the barrier to entry is a lot less than they expect because tools like DND beyond. Until now. One of the most attractive aspects of the game is the ability to craft interesting and engaging characters. This change severely limits the ability of new players to explore the world of DND which will further raise the barrier to entry which is already exclusionary to new players.
This makes this tool almost unusable for me and my friends. I have more friends asking me about DND than ever, and I've always been able to tell them that the barrier to entry is a lot less than they expect because tools like DND beyond. Until now. One of the most attractive aspects of the game is the ability to craft interesting and engaging characters. This change severely limits the ability of new players to explore the world of DND which will further raise the barrier to entry which is already exclusionary to new players.
Actually, that is not true. And trust me, look at my posts. I am no white knight of wotc. My opinion of the competency and honesty of the leaders of that corporate group are loud and clear.
But it is an undisputed fact that ANYONE can get into D&D (and it is D&D, not DnD), without buying a single wotc product. The SRD is free and covers all the mechanics, the main classes, and a very select few subclasses. To learn the game, and to have a great time, that is all anyone needs. Oh, and I guess 10 bucks for a set of dice, a pencil, and some paper.
This makes this tool almost unusable for me and my friends. I have more friends asking me about DND than ever, and I've always been able to tell them that the barrier to entry is a lot less than they expect because tools like DND beyond. Until now. One of the most attractive aspects of the game is the ability to craft interesting and engaging characters. This change severely limits the ability of new players to explore the world of DND which will further raise the barrier to entry which is already exclusionary to new players.
Actually, that is not true. And trust me, look at my posts. I am no white knight of wotc. My opinion of the competency and honesty of the leaders of that corporate group are loud and clear.
But it is an undisputed fact that ANYONE can get into D&D (and it is D&D, not DnD), without buying a single wotc product. The SRD is free and covers all the mechanics, the main classes, and a very select few subclasses. To learn the game, and to have a great time, that is all anyone needs. Oh, and I guess 10 bucks for a set of dice, a pencil, and some paper.
You are right that anyone who has a strong desire to get involved with D&D can do so without the use of tools that make it more approachable. Whether or not they can is not the same as whether or not they will.
My point is that there are lots of potential players who are not as dedicated and who might be overwhelmed by or disinterested in the prospect of playing without tools that make it more accessible. Playing that way requires a larger investment of time, for an arguably less robust player experience. Some people don't even care enough to spell the name of the game correctly :), let alone take hours reading books and building out paper character sheets. Of course, these people could do these things, but they don't want to. Some people are simply open to a means of entertainment when it is approachable and less open when it is less approachable. I believe this change makes D&D Beyond the tool and therefore the game less approachable to some potential players. I think this will create a barrier to entry for some.
I think all the people who use the maps system would deny this claim. I think all the people who like the addition of third party content to Beyond would deny this claim.
As someone who uses Maps, and has bought third party (Critical Role and Acquisitions Incorporated) content in the past I would dispute this; the Maps feature is nice, but it's not something I can't manage without as there are plenty of other options.
And on third party content, I own Critical Role and Acq. Inc. books as a result of piecemeal purchasing; I would have pounced on the Humblewood races and sub-classes in a heartbeat, but because D&D Beyond is demanding the full piece of the book I haven't and won't, because I own a physical copy.
Access to content is the primary feature of this site, and they have made it harder to access content. I don't care about anything else the site offers as long as that remains the case, as everything else was a secondary benefit.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
I think all the people who use the maps system would deny this claim. I think all the people who like the addition of third party content to Beyond would deny this claim.
As someone who uses Maps, and has bought third party (Critical Role and Acquisitions Incorporated) content in the past I would dispute this; the Maps feature is nice, but it's not something I can manage without as there are plenty of other options.
And on third party content, I own Critical Role and Acq. Inc. books as a result of piecemeal purchasing; I would have pounced on the Humblewood races and sub-classes in a heartbeat, but because D&D Beyond is demanding the full piece of the book I haven't and won't, because I own a physical copy.
Access to content is the primary feature of this site, and they have made it harder to access content. I don't care about anything else the site offers as long as that remains the case, as everything else was a secondary benefit.
This exactly, there are several bits of Humblewood I would have purchased if I could do so on a piecemeal basis, but I can't and I'm not going to buy the parts of the book I don't really need to get to the bits I want.
The entire point of using this site over just having a physical sheet is convenience, and they've made the active choice to be a less convenient option without making it up in other areas. (The new marketplace in and of itself does not make up for it.)
I think all the people who use the maps system would deny this claim. I think all the people who like the addition of third party content to Beyond would deny this claim.
As someone who uses Maps, and has bought third party (Critical Role and Acquisitions Incorporated) content in the past I would dispute this; the Maps feature is nice, but it's not something I can manage without as there are plenty of other options.
And on third party content, I own Critical Role and Acq. Inc. books as a result of piecemeal purchasing; I would have pounced on the Humblewood races and sub-classes in a heartbeat, but because D&D Beyond is demanding the full piece of the book I haven't and won't, because I own a physical copy.
Access to content is the primary feature of this site, and they have made it harder to access content. I don't care about anything else the site offers as long as that remains the case, as everything else was a secondary benefit.
This exactly, there are several bits of Humblewood I would have purchased if I could do so on a piecemeal basis, but I can't and I'm not going to buy the parts of the book I don't really need to get to the bits I want.
The entire point of using this site over just having a physical sheet is convenience, and they've made the active choice to be a less convenient option without making it up in other areas. (The new marketplace in and of itself does not make up for it.)
Humblewood, being 3rd party, was never available a la carte. If it had been I would already have at least some of it.
This makes this tool almost unusable for me and my friends. I have more friends asking me about DND than ever, and I've always been able to tell them that the barrier to entry is a lot less than they expect because tools like DND beyond. Until now. One of the most attractive aspects of the game is the ability to craft interesting and engaging characters. This change severely limits the ability of new players to explore the world of DND which will further raise the barrier to entry which is already exclusionary to new players.
Actually, that is not true. And trust me, look at my posts. I am no white knight of wotc. My opinion of the competency and honesty of the leaders of that corporate group are loud and clear.
But it is an undisputed fact that ANYONE can get into D&D (and it is D&D, not DnD), without buying a single wotc product. The SRD is free and covers all the mechanics, the main classes, and a very select few subclasses. To learn the game, and to have a great time, that is all anyone needs. Oh, and I guess 10 bucks for a set of dice, a pencil, and some paper.
You are right that anyone who has a strong desire to get involved with D&D can do so without the use of tools that make it more approachable. Whether or not they can is not the same as whether or not they will.
My point is that there are lots of potential players who are not as dedicated and who might be overwhelmed by or disinterested in the prospect of playing without tools that make it more accessible. Playing that way requires a larger investment of time, for an arguably less robust player experience. Some people don't even care enough to spell the name of the game correctly :), let alone take hours reading books and building out paper character sheets. Of course, these people could do these things, but they don't want to. Some people are simply open to a means of entertainment when it is approachable and less open when it is less approachable. I believe this change makes D&D Beyond the tool and therefore the game less approachable to some potential players. I think this will create a barrier to entry for some.
I think this is the thing for me.
Beyond isn't necessary to play D&D, it's just a tool that makes it more accessible for players and GMs. Personally, all Beyond does is save me the time I'd have spent making a Google sheet for my character (if I didn't find one already available online).
I know I wouldn't have spent any money on Beyond if it wasn't for the à la carte purchases because I'm not spending potentially hundreds of dollars on a character sheet tool, especially given I'd have to consider if that'd be the only character I play using Beyond. I'm also certain that none of the people I've played with who use it would be either if they were starting now, we'd have just used the content we could access. But over time I spent more and more money, I've got a couple of full books now but those piecemeal/microtransaction purchases also add up to a few extra full books on their own.
Which is where this decision gets so weird for me, WOTC found a way to get me to give them money because it was more convenient than a free option and now they've made the free option better because the cost is too high. And yeah, free, there's content I paid for so I could use it on Beyond that I could have just borrowed a book from a friend for instead where Beyond meant needing to pay for that content. The GM wasn't paying for Master tier because he'd bought books and didn't want to pay twice just to unlock the content in beyond. Really feels like if they're thinking about profit the question should be more "how can we get more people using beyond?"
I bought a few options piecemeal, and was planning to accumulate more - until I might as well buy the whole book, and would do. Seems bizarre that they'd give up a good micro-transaction model that had a built-in pipeline to whole-book purchases. A couple of items here, a feat or subclass there - it was affordable and enjoyable. Fingers crossed they reinstate it.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Currently homebrewing the Mistveil Rogue, an elusive infiltrator that can vanish into thin air.
Humblewood, being 3rd party, was never available a la carte. If it had been I would already have at least some of it.
This was never a rule specific to third party content; Critical Role and Acquisitions Incorporated are also third party content, and both fully supported piecemeal purchasing.
The lack of piecemeal purchasing on some recent third party content isn't specific to third party content, because piecemeal purchasing also wasn't available on several first party releases as well (Book of Many Things etc.).
This is what makes it so obvious that dropping the feature was entirely planned and fully 100% intentional – because the new storefront wasn't when it actually happened, we just didn't realise because we could still buy piecemeal from older books. I never really wanted anything from the Book of Many Things, I was interested by Planescape but hadn't got around to thinking about anything I would do using it yet etc., Humblewood was the only book I noticed I couldn't buy from, so I too thought it was just third party content, but it really, really, wasn't.
They knew they were doing this, and they knew months in advance, because they'd planned it, and they didn't give two shits about talking to their customers about it – they just expect us to roll over and take it. But we don't have to.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
Do some googling on the financial results of the app Monopoly Go, with obviously the rights to Monopoly owned by Hasbro. To suggest it is a game of Monopoly, is well, just silly. But Hasbro has generated literally billions in revenue from it. There is no doubt that wotc is eyeing the D&D IP and wondering if an app called D&D Go would have the same results. Remember, the ex-head of wotc stated many many times that she and her boss thought that the D&D IP was under-monetized and it should be a billion dollar brand, just like its stablemate, Magic the Gathering. The only way that is going to happen is license, license, license, and of course, digital apps.
Sure, they're probably looking at that. But it's a side business; they're no more going to turn D&D into that than they turned Monopoly into Monopoly Go.
Expanding a brand still requires the core thing to exist. This is especially true of D&D. With something like Transformers, they could stop making the toys, and keep the characters going as a media franchise. D&D hasn't got that. If you don't have the core experience of D&D to keep people interested in it, the brand will fade. And you can't give people anything like the core D&D experience in a mobile game.
Probably so. It will be the digital results that interest them though. They're not as interested in publishing (market observers have said) just digital. So a clear signal will be subs lapsing and drop in digital sales at DDB. In a game of dense wordy texts, a la carte was the core of the DDB onboarding experience.
I'm sure some market observers have said such. They are not to be trusted as analysts.
Print is by far the lion's share of WotC's business, both D&D and Magic. Digital is getting attention because it's a place they can grow more easily, but I find it hard to believe they don't think print is a big deal for them.
With respect, your "I find it hard to believe" in no way trumps actual analysis by people who trade on their reputation. As far as **Hasbros" interest in print (that's what we're talking about here), actions speak louder than your words. I suggest anyone interested in this point go do some browsing, make up their own mind whether they bought dndbeyond for it to come second to paper.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
DId you know? The DDB marketplace has REMOVED the option for purchasing one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters "a la carte". Now you ALWAYS have to buy the ENTIRE book instead.
Unhappy? UNSUBSCRIBE and Let them know your thoughts!
Humblewood, being 3rd party, was never available a la carte. If it had been I would already have at least some of it.
This was never a rule specific to third party content; Critical Role and Acquisitions Incorporated are also third party content, and both fully supported piecemeal purchasing.
The lack of piecemeal purchasing on some recent third party content isn't specific to third party content, because piecemeal purchasing also wasn't available on several first party releases as well (Book of Many Things etc.).
This is what makes it so obvious that dropping the feature was entirely planned and fully 100% intentional – because the new storefront wasn't when it actually happened, we just didn't realise because we could still buy piecemeal from older books. I never really wanted anything from the Book of Many Things, I was interested by Planescape but hadn't got around to thinking about anything I would do using it yet etc., Humblewood was the only book I noticed I couldn't buy from, so I too thought it was just third party content, but it really, really, wasn't.
They knew they were doing this, and they knew months in advance, because they'd planned it, and they didn't give two shits about talking to their customers about it – they just expect us to roll over and take it. But we don't have to.
Nah, because as you say, other third party content is available piecemeal and this was before the new store interface so it makes far more sense to be something regarding that 3rd party specific publisher.
Having access to the book through another DM, I am tempted to pick it up regardless. It seems pretty much entirely useful, in contrast to pretty much every recent WotC publication. Not for everyone though. If you are not into animal based races, it is likely not much for you.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Exactly. As a system, the decline since DDB was purchased is undeniable.
DId you know?
The DDB marketplace has REMOVED the option for purchasing one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters "a la carte".
Now you ALWAYS have to buy the ENTIRE book instead.
Unhappy? UNSUBSCRIBE and
Let them know your thoughts!
Whether you honestly believe this semantic contortion,
or are merely shilling dishonestly,
the only thing you have convinced me of is
to skip past anything with your name on it.
DId you know?
The DDB marketplace has REMOVED the option for purchasing one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters "a la carte".
Now you ALWAYS have to buy the ENTIRE book instead.
Unhappy? UNSUBSCRIBE and
Let them know your thoughts!
Not at all.
If someone parrots lines of botlike corporate subservience, however, I don't let it pass without contest.
Probably so. It will be the digital results that interest them though. They're not as interested in publishing (market observers have said) just digital.
So a clear signal will be subs lapsing and drop in digital sales at DDB.
In a game of dense wordy texts, a la carte was the core of the DDB onboarding experience.
DId you know?
The DDB marketplace has REMOVED the option for purchasing one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters "a la carte".
Now you ALWAYS have to buy the ENTIRE book instead.
Unhappy? UNSUBSCRIBE and
Let them know your thoughts!
I would not say 'the' core, but definitely a key part of it.
You're right - at the core, with other features.
DId you know?
The DDB marketplace has REMOVED the option for purchasing one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters "a la carte".
Now you ALWAYS have to buy the ENTIRE book instead.
Unhappy? UNSUBSCRIBE and
Let them know your thoughts!
Do some googling on the financial results of the app Monopoly Go, with obviously the rights to Monopoly owned by Hasbro. To suggest it is a game of Monopoly, is well, just silly. But Hasbro has generated literally billions in revenue from it. There is no doubt that wotc is eyeing the D&D IP and wondering if an app called D&D Go would have the same results. Remember, the ex-head of wotc stated many many times that she and her boss thought that the D&D IP was under-monetized and it should be a billion dollar brand, just like its stablemate, Magic the Gathering. The only way that is going to happen is license, license, license, and of course, digital apps.
I think all the people who use the maps system would deny this claim. I think all the people who like the addition of third party content to Beyond would deny this claim.
I am not fond of the removal of a la carte purchases. But saying the site has “undeniably” gotten worse since the purchase is an extremely silly thing to say. Even if you do not personally use these systems, they are strict upgrades to the older system that you cannot just ignore. From an objective analysis, D&D Beyond has, as a whole, been improved sim e the purchase. And, considering Wizards is presently hiring a number of positions for D&D Beyond to help prepare for the revised 5e release, I would not be surprised if more improvements are on the horizon.
Ill-informed anger, like the kind demonstrated by this categorically incorrect line, only works of the issue is interesting enough that the anger draws the attention of the mainstream press. That worked in the OGL situation because the underlying issue was interest - here, it is a company changing their pricing model and not implementing an old feature when building their new marketplace. Hardly an exciting story.
Since the Washington Post is not going to sail to our side and help a la carte purchasing return, players should be making it clear to Wizards that are displeased… but, just as importantly, that they are willing to forgive Wizards and return to their prior purchasing habits on this site should the system return—after all, if you are the kind of angry person who will not return even should Wizards change their purchasing model, then you are already a write-off.
Saying absolutist statements which fall apart under even a modicum of scrutiny makes you look like someone Wizards can just write off and thus ignore, drowning out the many (though, increasingly infrequent) new voices on this thread who are trying to contribute something helpful to this conversation.
Every single poster here, well, their opinion and statements matter as much as yours. Please stop trying to gatekeep this discussion.
Sure, they're probably looking at that. But it's a side business; they're no more going to turn D&D into that than they turned Monopoly into Monopoly Go.
Expanding a brand still requires the core thing to exist. This is especially true of D&D. With something like Transformers, they could stop making the toys, and keep the characters going as a media franchise. D&D hasn't got that. If you don't have the core experience of D&D to keep people interested in it, the brand will fade. And you can't give people anything like the core D&D experience in a mobile game.
I'm sure some market observers have said such. They are not to be trusted as analysts.
Print is by far the lion's share of WotC's business, both D&D and Magic. Digital is getting attention because it's a place they can grow more easily, but I find it hard to believe they don't think print is a big deal for them.
This makes this tool almost unusable for me and my friends. I have more friends asking me about DND than ever, and I've always been able to tell them that the barrier to entry is a lot less than they expect because tools like DND beyond. Until now. One of the most attractive aspects of the game is the ability to craft interesting and engaging characters. This change severely limits the ability of new players to explore the world of DND which will further raise the barrier to entry which is already exclusionary to new players.
Actually, that is not true. And trust me, look at my posts. I am no white knight of wotc. My opinion of the competency and honesty of the leaders of that corporate group are loud and clear.
But it is an undisputed fact that ANYONE can get into D&D (and it is D&D, not DnD), without buying a single wotc product. The SRD is free and covers all the mechanics, the main classes, and a very select few subclasses. To learn the game, and to have a great time, that is all anyone needs. Oh, and I guess 10 bucks for a set of dice, a pencil, and some paper.
You are right that anyone who has a strong desire to get involved with D&D can do so without the use of tools that make it more approachable. Whether or not they can is not the same as whether or not they will.
My point is that there are lots of potential players who are not as dedicated and who might be overwhelmed by or disinterested in the prospect of playing without tools that make it more accessible. Playing that way requires a larger investment of time, for an arguably less robust player experience. Some people don't even care enough to spell the name of the game correctly :), let alone take hours reading books and building out paper character sheets. Of course, these people could do these things, but they don't want to. Some people are simply open to a means of entertainment when it is approachable and less open when it is less approachable. I believe this change makes D&D Beyond the tool and therefore the game less approachable to some potential players. I think this will create a barrier to entry for some.
As someone who uses Maps, and has bought third party (Critical Role and Acquisitions Incorporated) content in the past I would dispute this; the Maps feature is nice, but it's not something I can't manage without as there are plenty of other options.
And on third party content, I own Critical Role and Acq. Inc. books as a result of piecemeal purchasing; I would have pounced on the Humblewood races and sub-classes in a heartbeat, but because D&D Beyond is demanding the full piece of the book I haven't and won't, because I own a physical copy.
Access to content is the primary feature of this site, and they have made it harder to access content. I don't care about anything else the site offers as long as that remains the case, as everything else was a secondary benefit.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
This exactly, there are several bits of Humblewood I would have purchased if I could do so on a piecemeal basis, but I can't and I'm not going to buy the parts of the book I don't really need to get to the bits I want.
The entire point of using this site over just having a physical sheet is convenience, and they've made the active choice to be a less convenient option without making it up in other areas. (The new marketplace in and of itself does not make up for it.)
Humblewood, being 3rd party, was never available a la carte. If it had been I would already have at least some of it.
I think this is the thing for me.
Beyond isn't necessary to play D&D, it's just a tool that makes it more accessible for players and GMs. Personally, all Beyond does is save me the time I'd have spent making a Google sheet for my character (if I didn't find one already available online).
I know I wouldn't have spent any money on Beyond if it wasn't for the à la carte purchases because I'm not spending potentially hundreds of dollars on a character sheet tool, especially given I'd have to consider if that'd be the only character I play using Beyond. I'm also certain that none of the people I've played with who use it would be either if they were starting now, we'd have just used the content we could access. But over time I spent more and more money, I've got a couple of full books now but those piecemeal/microtransaction purchases also add up to a few extra full books on their own.
Which is where this decision gets so weird for me, WOTC found a way to get me to give them money because it was more convenient than a free option and now they've made the free option better because the cost is too high. And yeah, free, there's content I paid for so I could use it on Beyond that I could have just borrowed a book from a friend for instead where Beyond meant needing to pay for that content. The GM wasn't paying for Master tier because he'd bought books and didn't want to pay twice just to unlock the content in beyond. Really feels like if they're thinking about profit the question should be more "how can we get more people using beyond?"
I bought a few options piecemeal, and was planning to accumulate more - until I might as well buy the whole book, and would do. Seems bizarre that they'd give up a good micro-transaction model that had a built-in pipeline to whole-book purchases. A couple of items here, a feat or subclass there - it was affordable and enjoyable. Fingers crossed they reinstate it.
Currently homebrewing the Mistveil Rogue, an elusive infiltrator that can vanish into thin air.
This was never a rule specific to third party content; Critical Role and Acquisitions Incorporated are also third party content, and both fully supported piecemeal purchasing.
The lack of piecemeal purchasing on some recent third party content isn't specific to third party content, because piecemeal purchasing also wasn't available on several first party releases as well (Book of Many Things etc.).
This is what makes it so obvious that dropping the feature was entirely planned and fully 100% intentional – because the new storefront wasn't when it actually happened, we just didn't realise because we could still buy piecemeal from older books. I never really wanted anything from the Book of Many Things, I was interested by Planescape but hadn't got around to thinking about anything I would do using it yet etc., Humblewood was the only book I noticed I couldn't buy from, so I too thought it was just third party content, but it really, really, wasn't.
They knew they were doing this, and they knew months in advance, because they'd planned it, and they didn't give two shits about talking to their customers about it – they just expect us to roll over and take it. But we don't have to.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
With respect,
your "I find it hard to believe" in no way trumps actual analysis by people who trade on their reputation.
As far as **Hasbros" interest in print (that's what we're talking about here), actions speak louder than your words. I suggest anyone interested in this point go do some browsing, make up their own mind whether they bought dndbeyond for it to come second to paper.
DId you know?
The DDB marketplace has REMOVED the option for purchasing one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters "a la carte".
Now you ALWAYS have to buy the ENTIRE book instead.
Unhappy? UNSUBSCRIBE and
Let them know your thoughts!
Nah, because as you say, other third party content is available piecemeal and this was before the new store interface so it makes far more sense to be something regarding that 3rd party specific publisher.
Having access to the book through another DM, I am tempted to pick it up regardless. It seems pretty much entirely useful, in contrast to pretty much every recent WotC publication. Not for everyone though. If you are not into animal based races, it is likely not much for you.