This post is aimed at the DnD Beyond and WotC team and whomever it may concern.
After talking about backwards compatibility for 2014 content in the new system for so long, throwing this change at us is just... disappointing:
WHAT IF I WANT TO USE THE 2014 VERSION OF A SPELL OR MAGIC ITEM?
If you wish to use the old version of a magic item or spell that has been replaced by its 2024 counterpart, you will need to create a homebrew copy of it and enable homebrew content on your character sheet. Then, you can add it to your character sheet.
I have two main complaints about this change:
It reeks of laziness. You are telling every single player to create homebrew versions of the 2014 spells. This is just unnecessary work pushed on players and DMs. And it is not a small amount of work. There are likely over 200 spells and cantrips in DnD (>150 leveled spells for the cleric alone) and this just takes time.
It takes away agency. My DM and I (the most experienced player in our group) share the opinion that we would likely change to 2024 eventually. But we want to do this in our own time. After discussing with players, checking in and making sure everybody is up to date about what the changes are. 2-3 weeks notice period just doesn't cut it for every group playing DnD.
It feels misleading. You have consistently emphasized backwards compatibility. And now you tell us that while we can still use old content it will not be officially supported / provided on the main platform for a big part of the player base.
Here are my suggestions:
I would very much like to have the option to switch between versions. This is honestly what I would have expected. You already offer that option for almost all content. Why not the spells as well? Give each group the option to choose when and if they want to transfer to 2024.
Apart form that: It is much easier for you to create those homebrew spells. I do not know your exact database architecture but doing a mass copy of existing spells and adding a (2014) to the name is not hard. That is a relatively simple query and it will take no time for you to do while saving a ton of time for all players and DMs This is the very minimum you could do for your player base (your customers).
My final words:
To me DnD Beyond is first and foremost a convenience for DMs and players alike. That is your main feature and why I use it. Players can more easily create characters and benefit from an easier entry to the game. DMs can buy books (read: character options) and share that with players. It is fun and I personally really like the character creator. It looks nice and it makes it relatively easy to create characters - but it offers nothing that couldn't be done using actual pens and paper with a bit more effort.
But this change is the opposite of all of that. At best it gives us an easy way to start using the new spells. At worst it creates a lot of overhead to keep playing the way we have been playing.
Again, convenience is the feature, convenience is why I and so many other people use DnD Beyond.
This change does not add convenience. It reduces it.
I hope you take this into consideration and make appropriate adjustments.
The above message is listed on the product details of every single rulebook purchased in the D&D Beyond marketplace. When we all bought into the digital copies of these books at their full price, we did so with the understanding that we would be able to use this specific content within D&D Beyond's 'digital toolset'.
This is what is being taken from us, and this is what 99% of people upset are angry about. Up until April of this year, those who Only wanted Compendium access could pay a significantly reduced price for the content of these books with the understanding that they would not be able to use the content in the Digital toolset. Many of us (rightly) feel like we have been taken advantage of due to this, and the only official response to our concerns thus far has been:
"If you don't like it, re-invent the wheel by manually homebrewing every single thing we change yourself."
So people who want to use the old versions of these mechanics will no longer be able to. This upsets me greatly as I've grown accustomed to how these mechanics function. I pray that there is enough backlash from players that DnDBeyond reconsiders. They've been assuring us about backwards compatibility for so long, and for them to pull the rug out from under us just like that makes me feel lied to.
I'll probably make a separate thread to spread awareness. I'm not sure how many people know that these mechanics will be affected too.
So people who want to use the old versions of these mechanics will no longer be able to. This upsets me greatly as I've grown accustomed to how these mechanics function. I pray that there is enough backlash from players that DnDBeyond reconsiders. They've been assuring us about backwards compatibility for so long, and for them to pull the rug out from under us just like that makes me feel lied to.
I'll probably make a separate thread to spread awareness. I'm not sure how many people know that these mechanics will be affected too.
You're correct!
Even if we were to JUST have to worry about spells, it's not just "a few dozen" as many people are claiming. It's 121 spells (and counting) per this list:
"Purchasing a digital copy of this book unlocks it for use in the D&D BEYOND compendium and toolset." This is the problem for me. They say that buying the books allows them to be used in the toolsets, but now that will no longer be true for items being replaced with 2024 specs.
I am unsubscribing for the second time in a year. I gave WOTC another chance after the OGL scandal. The 2024 material does not impress me and it is clear that as a 5e player, DDB no longer values my user experience.
Players who only have access to the 2014 Player's Handbook will maintain their character options, spells, and magical items in their character sheets. Players with access to the 2024 and 2014 Digital Player's Handbook can select from both sources when creating new characters.
Players will not need to rely on homebrew to use their 2014 player options, including spells and magic items. As recommended in previous changelogs.
Just saw this as well. Another small victory. I'm glad they reacted this quickly to the complaints but I'm sad this is always needed... It just doesn't feel like customer oriented thinking which is what we all would really like.
Also I'll summarize here: Thank you all for replying and your inputs. Didn't get to reply to them earlier. But some of you made some valuable additions and others gave words of support. :)
I wasn't aware of product description that FrostedPhoenix mentioned, which honestly just makes it worse.
For me personally it was about decreasing convenience this platform offers and the audacity to tell us to simply homebrew things if we want to keep using them.
Anyway: Thanks for your replies to my first ever post on this forum :D
Hi all
This post is aimed at the DnD Beyond and WotC team and whomever it may concern.
After talking about backwards compatibility for 2014 content in the new system for so long, throwing this change at us is just... disappointing:
I have two main complaints about this change:
Here are my suggestions:
This is the very minimum you could do for your player base (your customers).
My final words:
To me DnD Beyond is first and foremost a convenience for DMs and players alike. That is your main feature and why I use it.
Players can more easily create characters and benefit from an easier entry to the game.
DMs can buy books (read: character options) and share that with players.
It is fun and I personally really like the character creator. It looks nice and it makes it relatively easy to create characters - but it offers nothing that couldn't be done using actual pens and paper with a bit more effort.
But this change is the opposite of all of that.
At best it gives us an easy way to start using the new spells. At worst it creates a lot of overhead to keep playing the way we have been playing.
Again, convenience is the feature, convenience is why I and so many other people use DnD Beyond.
This change does not add convenience. It reduces it.
I hope you take this into consideration and make appropriate adjustments.
Best regards,
Noctua
Be kind <3
Also, spreading this around:
The above message is listed on the product details of every single rulebook purchased in the D&D Beyond marketplace. When we all bought into the digital copies of these books at their full price, we did so with the understanding that we would be able to use this specific content within D&D Beyond's 'digital toolset'.
This is what is being taken from us, and this is what 99% of people upset are angry about. Up until April of this year, those who Only wanted Compendium access could pay a significantly reduced price for the content of these books with the understanding that they would not be able to use the content in the Digital toolset. Many of us (rightly) feel like we have been taken advantage of due to this, and the only official response to our concerns thus far has been:
"If you don't like it, re-invent the wheel by manually homebrewing every single thing we change yourself."
We deserve better.
And it's not just spells and magic items either. According to the changelog, here's a list of things that will be updated on all character sheets:
So people who want to use the old versions of these mechanics will no longer be able to. This upsets me greatly as I've grown accustomed to how these mechanics function. I pray that there is enough backlash from players that DnDBeyond reconsiders. They've been assuring us about backwards compatibility for so long, and for them to pull the rug out from under us just like that makes me feel lied to.
I'll probably make a separate thread to spread awareness. I'm not sure how many people know that these mechanics will be affected too.
You're correct!
Even if we were to JUST have to worry about spells, it's not just "a few dozen" as many people are claiming. It's 121 spells (and counting) per this list:
https://rpgbot.net/2024-dnd-5e-transition-guide-and-change-log-everything-thats-different-in-the-new-players-handbook/#spell-changes
---
But that is not all.
- Every subclass that grants additional spells would need to be homebrewed.
- Warlock's Eldritch Invocations that grant additional spells would need to be homebrewed (AND ARE CURRENTLY UNABLE TO BE HOMEBREWED)
- Any Class features that grant extra spells via Tasha's rules would need to be homebrewed (and ALSO currently cannot be homebrewed)
"Purchasing a digital copy of this book unlocks it for use in the D&D BEYOND compendium and toolset." This is the problem for me. They say that buying the books allows them to be used in the toolsets, but now that will no longer be true for items being replaced with 2024 specs.
Thank you for putting this letter together.
I am unsubscribing for the second time in a year. I gave WOTC another chance after the OGL scandal. The 2024 material does not impress me and it is clear that as a 5e player, DDB no longer values my user experience.
I agree. There needs to be backwards compatibility!
As of 9pm PST on IG:
Thank you DDB.
Just saw this as well. Another small victory. I'm glad they reacted this quickly to the complaints but I'm sad this is always needed... It just doesn't feel like customer oriented thinking which is what we all would really like.
Also I'll summarize here: Thank you all for replying and your inputs. Didn't get to reply to them earlier. But some of you made some valuable additions and others gave words of support. :)
I wasn't aware of product description that FrostedPhoenix mentioned, which honestly just makes it worse.
For me personally it was about decreasing convenience this platform offers and the audacity to tell us to simply homebrew things if we want to keep using them.
Anyway: Thanks for your replies to my first ever post on this forum :D
Be kind <3