It does not matter if the item is permanent or not. They are free or close to it. They last until the artificer decides they do not and other people can use them.
How good would the artificer be if they could only make one item for one day and only they could use it? Take away the party buff feature and they are poo.
Again, it seems like you're arguing against rules that don't exist. A wizard can absolutely make a bag of holding. They do it using the exact same rules that an artificer would use.
If you're talking about infusions, those are not permanent. Since you brought it up, infusions are effectively equivalent to shillelagh. A temporary enchantment.
And for your initial statement, this could be applied to any class. Can you believe that clerics get to heal their allies at level 1 while Fighters have to jump through all these hoops to do the same thing? Can you believe rogues get to Sneak Attack? Why can't every class get Sneak Attack?! Classes boil down to their specialties. They are defined by the fact that they can do things the other classes can't do right off the bat. Artificers are no different in that regard.
The infusions are, practically speaking, permanent. Technically not since they only last until you die, but at that point you're splitting hairs. Shillelagh lasts for 1 minute, though you can cast it over and over.
Artificers can instantly create a bag of holding just using one of their infusions. How do you figure Wizards can do so using the same rules?
With that said, I don't have a problem with any of this. Their base class has no martial abilities whatsoever, and they're only half casters. If anything I think they should get more.
You seem like a reasonable person, so let's step back for a minute. Your statements in blue are about an imaginary class that doesn't exist. 5e artificers get literally zero class features that concern the creation of permanent magical items until level 10, and that one simply reduces the time and money cost for a small subset of items.
They can infuse a very limited amount of items, but those are not permanent and the feature was designed so that you couldn't just make them and sell them.
There is a lot of misunderstanding here around what artificers can do compared to every other class. If you allow magic item crafting in your game, artificers follow exactly the same rules as everyone else until level 10. If you don't allow magic item crafting in your game, artificers still work fine and the integrity of your setting is maintained. You guys are arguing about strawmen, not artificers.
You seem to be trying to tell me I need to actually read the class in order to argue my point. Alright.
Tinkering literally let's you make permanent - but very minor - magic items.
Infusion let's you create effectively permanent magic items. It only ends if you chose so, or die.
But the real issue is you have the ability to create a magic item on demand. Need an eversmoking bottle, or a chime of opening? Just conjure one out of thin air! (I didn't check if those examples are on the list - and I realise you need an item to infuse).
And then, at level 10, you get the Magic Item Adept.
I'm not sure I agree with you. It seems to me they literally have magic items coming out of their caboose =)
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Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
You seem like a reasonable person, so let's step back for a minute. Your statements in blue are about an imaginary class that doesn't exist. 5e artificers get literally zero class features that concern the creation of permanent magical items until level 10, and that one simply reduces the time and money cost for a small subset of items.
They can infuse a very limited amount of items, but those are not permanent and the feature was designed so that you couldn't just make them and sell them.
There is a lot of misunderstanding here around what artificers can do compared to every other class. If you allow magic item crafting in your game, artificers follow exactly the same rules as everyone else until level 10. If you don't allow magic item crafting in your game, artificers still work fine and the integrity of your setting is maintained. You guys are arguing about strawmen, not artificers.
You seem to be trying to tell me I need to actually read the class in order to argue my point. Alright.
Tinkering literally let's you make permanent - but very minor - magic items.
Infusion let's you create effectively permanent magic items. It only ends if you chose so, or die.
But the real issue is you have the ability to create a magic item on demand. Need an eversmoking bottle, or a chime of opening? Just conjure one out of thin air! (I didn't check if those examples are on the list - and I realise you need an item to infuse).
And then, at level 10, you get the Magic Item Adept.
I'm not sure I agree with you. It seems to me they literally have magic items coming out of their caboose =)
Plus, you can't actually make an infusion on demand. They're "made" at the end of a long rest, similarly to how they prepare their spells...except, unlike spells, you have to learn them first in order to be able to prepare them. Unless you have an INCREDIBLY generous DM (even moreso that I am), you are going to have a *very* limited number of infusions you can use throughout the campaign. And they need a preexisting mundane item to be infused into.
Plus, you can't actually make an infusion on demand. They're "made" at the end of a long rest, similarly to how they prepare their spells...except, unlike spells, you have to learn them first in order to be able to prepare them. Unless you have an INCREDIBLY generous DM (even moreso that I am), you are going to have a *very* limited number of infusions you can use throughout the campaign. And they need a preexisting mundane item to be infused into.
My headcanon for infusions is that they scrawl some runes or something on the mundane item to turn into the magic item, but the runes are just a shortcut, and they need the actual formula and special ingredient to make it truly permanent.
Personally I like the "standard" artificer as a steampunk inventor, but if the concept doesn't fit your setting, the artificer could also be Daedalus in a setting based on Greek Mythology or a dwarven master smith.
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+ Instaboot to murderhobos + I don't watch Critical Role, and no, I really shouldn't either +
My headcanon for infusions is that they scrawl some runes or something on the mundane item to turn into the magic item, but the runes are just a shortcut, and they need the actual formula and special ingredient to make it truly permanent.
In the campaign I'm running right now, the artificer player flavors it as attaching magically-enhanced semiprecious stones to otherwise nonmagical items.
My headcanon for infusions is that they scrawl some runes or something on the mundane item to turn into the magic item, but the runes are just a shortcut, and they need the actual formula and special ingredient to make it truly permanent.
In the campaign I'm running right now, the artificer player flavors it as attaching magically-enhanced semiprecious stones to otherwise nonmagical items.
Makes sense to me. I'm guessing those stones are tied to their life force or something, which is why they stop working when that character dies?
Something pretty close to that effect, yeah. They're playing an Alchemist, but also took proficiency in Jeweler's tools and decided to lean into that for their infusions.
Meh. Doesn't affect the point I'm making in any way.
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Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
You seem like a reasonable person, so let's step back for a minute. Your statements in blue are about an imaginary class that doesn't exist. 5e artificers get literally zero class features that concern the creation of permanent magical items until level 10, and that one simply reduces the time and money cost for a small subset of items.
They can infuse a very limited amount of items, but those are not permanent and the feature was designed so that you couldn't just make them and sell them.
There is a lot of misunderstanding here around what artificers can do compared to every other class. If you allow magic item crafting in your game, artificers follow exactly the same rules as everyone else until level 10. If you don't allow magic item crafting in your game, artificers still work fine and the integrity of your setting is maintained. You guys are arguing about strawmen, not artificers.
You seem to be trying to tell me I need to actually read the class in order to argue my point. Alright.
Tinkering literally let's you make permanent - but very minor - magic items.
Infusion let's you create effectively permanent magic items. It only ends if you chose so, or die.
But the real issue is you have the ability to create a magic item on demand. Need an eversmoking bottle, or a chime of opening? Just conjure one out of thin air! (I didn't check if those examples are on the list - and I realise you need an item to infuse).
And then, at level 10, you get the Magic Item Adept.
I'm not sure I agree with you. It seems to me they literally have magic items coming out of their caboose =)
Tinkering literally let's you make permanent - but very minor - magic items.: Okay, this one I can't exactly refute, because you are correct.
But the real issue is you have the ability to create a magic item on demand.: Except you can't, because you only know so many, can only have so many active at a time, and it takes a long rest to make them.
And then, at level 10, you get the Magic Item Adept.: oh no, you can craft up to Uncommon items for half cost and time... but you still need a formula (so DM dependant), a component that may or may not take an adventure to get (also DM dependent), the MONEY, and sufficient time to work on it.
I play artificers on a pretty regular basis and I still don't have magic items coming out of my caboose.
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Formerly Devan Avalon.
Trying to get your physical content on Beyond is like going to Microsoft and saying "I have a physical Playstation disk, give me a digital Xbox version!"
I play artificers on a pretty regular basis and I still don't have magic items coming out of my caboose.
But it's not about your character. I mean, it might be, but that's hardly related to my point.
Let's start with your character though: An artificer has unparalleled utility. That's my honest opinion - not even bards or wizards can do all the stuff an artificer can do. Now, that's by design, artificers are meant to be versatile. Is it too much? Meh, I couldn't really say. As you may have noticed, I've never even read the class in 5e, and never played one or with one.
But my point is really in terms of world building. And in terms of world building, artificers really do have magic items coming out of their caboose. Your character does his or her thing based on need and situation - but an npc will make magic items for pay, all day long, every day. You can rent or lease an infused item, or you can buy a permanent magic item, or you can buy trinkets of very minor magical ability for parties or to entertain kids.
There is no escaping that Artificer Class = Industrial Level Magic Item Production. There simply isn't any sort of argument that works. If you have the artificer class, then you also have Ol' Ben from down the lane, who makes legendary magic items for a living. The One Ring is not unique, it's just a case of an-artificer-did-it.
Edit: Seriously. I belive it says somewhere in the Eberron book that most packets of cereal come with little magical items for kids to play with. Like, in a side bar or something.
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
I play artificers on a pretty regular basis and I still don't have magic items coming out of my caboose.
But it's not about your character. I mean, it might be, but that's hardly related to my point.
Let's start with your character though: An artificer has unparalleled utility. That's my honest opinion - not even bards or wizards can do all the stuff an artificer can do. Now, that's by design, artificers are meant to be versatile. Is it too much? Meh, I couldn't really say. As you may have noticed, I've never even read the class in 5e, and never played one or with one.
But my point is really in terms of world building. And in terms of world building, artificers really do have magic items coming out of their caboose. Your character does his or her thing based on need and situation - but an npc will make magic items for pay, all day long, every day. You can rent or lease an infused item, or you can buy a permanent magic item, or you can buy trinkets of very minor magical ability for parties or to entertain kids.
There is no escaping that Artificer Class = Industrial Level Magic Item Production. There simply isn't any sort of argument that works. If you have the artificer class, then you also have Ol' Ben from down the lane, who makes legendary magic items for a living. The One Ring is not unique, it's just a case of an-artificer-did-it.
As you may have noticed, I've never even read the class in 5e, and never played one or with one. then why are you commenting on this thread at all?! You literally are arguing something you don't understand the mechanics or balance of!
and that's just one problem considering you didn't acknowledge literally any of the points in my post.
There is no escaping that Artificer Class = Industrial Level Magic Item Production. There simply isn't any sort of argument that works. If you have the artificer class, then you also have Ol' Ben from down the lane, who makes legendary magic items for a living. The One Ring is not unique, it's just a case of an-artificer-did-it.: Even before Artificer class, you have Ol' Ben from the wizard tower in the desert who makes legendary magic items for a living... provided he has the money, time, and expensive components that may or may not require monster slaying to make.
OH WAIT, ARTIFICERS NEED THAT TOO.
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Formerly Devan Avalon.
Trying to get your physical content on Beyond is like going to Microsoft and saying "I have a physical Playstation disk, give me a digital Xbox version!"
then why are you commenting on this thread at all?!
and that's just one problem considering you didn't acknowledge literally any of the points in my post.
Even before Artificer class, you have Ol' Ben from the wizard tower in the desert who makes legendary magic items for a living... provided he has the money, time, and expensive components that may or may not require monster slaying to make.
OH WAIT, ARTIFICERS NEED THAT TOO.
Oh, I'm sorry - if you feel it's up to you to decide whether I'm entitled to an opinion, go right ahead and don't reply to me.
I didn't acknowledge your points because I think you're wrong.
Yes, wizards can do the same thing - but less so. The whole point of the artificer is to make magic items, with ease. Whereas wizards have to make somewhat more of a real investment - plus it's not the main trope of their class.
And don't try to argue ressources: Since it always pays more than it costs, that's not an argument you can use.
See, I did it again. Didn't concede your points, because it so happens I don't agree with you.
Wizards can make magic items on a sort of craftsman level. Artificers boost that to actual industrial levels. And if you want a world where legendary magic items were made by long forgotten heroes from prehistory - then you quite simply cannot also have an artificer down the lane who can do the same thing before lunch (provided you bring him the heart of a hag, 12 black spider legs and the song of a maiden fair).
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Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
Seriously. I belive it says somewhere in the Eberron book that most packets of cereal come with little magical items for kids to play with. Like, in a side bar or something.
That has literally nothing to do with artificers, and everything to do with Eberron being a world where magic is industrialized. That sidebar would still exist even if artificers didn't
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Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock) Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric) Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue) Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
To expand on this, WoTC deliberately picked some of the tamest magic items of their rarity category, because they felt those would be the most appropriate to give automatic access to players. You could even say that the Replicate Magic Items tables, moreso than the Random Magic Items table in the DMG, is a decent guide to what magic items you can safely give players at different tiers of play.
In any case, the artificer can infuse a limited number of items to make those things or any common magic item, but to make any of the plethora of magic items beyond that, they need to follow the same magic item crafting rules as anyone else (minus the 10th level discount to time and money for common and uncommon items). Notice as well that there are zero very rare or legendary items on the Replicate Magic Items list, and you get no discounts on time and money for rare or above magic items either.
Wizards can make magic items on a sort of craftsman level. Artificers boost that to actual industrial levels. And if you want a world where legendary magic items were made by long forgotten heroes from prehistory - then you quite simply cannot also have an artificer down the lane who can do the same thing before lunch (provided you bring him the heart of a hag, 12 black spider legs and the song of a maiden fair).
This would be the crux of the matter, methinks.
To a great many people, something that's so intrinsic to the fantasy genre that they don't even realize it's a vital underpinning to their entire understanding of the genre is that Time Doesn't Exist. Everything is the same as it always was and always will be. No one and nothing ever progresses, understanding does not improve or evolve. The greatest sword ever forged was made ten thousand years ago by a conclave of master smiths in a Fallen Age, and that confluence of expertise, materials, andwillingness will never occur again. Fantasy worlds are locked in stasis, never growing or adapting. There's always a Fallen Age in which Heroes lived and the greatest things that have ever been made were all created, and the party is always adventuring in that world tens or hundreds of thousands of years after that Fallen Age, where everybody is all "Yeah...things were dope back then. Now they're not. Oh well" and simply accept that living their squalid little points-of-light lives is what they're destined for. That sense of timelessness, that sense that the history of civilization can be hundreds of thousands of years long and yet nothing has ever happened since a half-forgotten, myth-shrouded Fallen Age, IS "Fantasy" to many people.
Wizards are an intrinsic part of that because they're the world's secret lore-keepers. Much like Sith, there is one wizard and one wizard's apprentice, they live apart from society and ensure that the dangers of the Fallen Age are never brought into light. They chase knowledge but they do not share it, nor use it to try and improve the world. One of the core tenets of fantasy wizardry is secrecy, the idea that the common man is suspicious of 'witchcraft' and that wizards are the rare few who can handle knowing the secrets of the world. They seek to preserve the timelessness of Fantasy, and thus they're important agents in a fantasy world. Whereas when you tell people about the core ideals of artificers? Well, we've seen it in this thread. Acromos hasn't even bothered to read the class (and no, you don't get an opinion anyone else needs to take seriously if you can't be assed to spend five f@#$ing minutes reading the class, duder) because he's convinced artificers represent progress. They represent knowledge, learning, and the existence of time, the idea that the best days of civilization are in front of them and not many thousands of years in the past.
That's not at all true - artificers can be just as secretive as wizards, and in fact the average layperson would have a great deal of difficulty telling "wizard" and "artificer" apart - but the artificer is bound up in the minds of those who hate it with the idea of the scientific method and an inquisitive, engineering, problem-solving mindset. As the man said - you can't have 'Legendary items forged by mythical heroes before recorded history' if your world is actively chasing knowledge and improving itself. The best sword ever made can't be ten thousand years old if modern smiths have been building on the knowledge of metallurgy, magicraft, and swordmaking methods for those ten thousand years and have gained insights, techniques, and methods that ten thousand year conclave of nonhuman smiths couldn't have dreamed of. If Time Exists, then eventually the Fallen Age must be replaced with a Rising Age as people decide they're fed up with breaking their backs growing turnips in a field whilst being devoured by owlbears every third Tuesday and turn their collective will towards reclaiming what was lost - or building it up in the first place.
Now, again - you can have an artificer who's every bit as secretive with their methods as a typical wizard, and you can have a wizard that's willing to teach any village kid who asks a little bit of Prestidigitation. In fact I'd argue it can make more sense for a spellcaster in the shadow of a Fallen Age to require things to focus their half-understood magic, objects of power to help them channel that which the lords of the Fallen Age could do with merely a word and a gesture. But that's not really what people are arguing in this thread. People are arguing about whether Fantasy can exist if Time also exists. The answer is obviously yes - but the classic Tolkienesque Standard Eurofantasy? That does not tolerate the passage of time well. One of the coremost tenets of Tolkienite Eurofantasy is "everything was cool once, but now it's shit and we'll never fix that". Artificers, in their traditional sense, are about Fixing That, and so people will never accept them because they don't want the world fixed. They WANT it Fallen, broken, and a terrible place to live. Elsewise how can someone create a heroic fantasy about defeating an ancient evil, slumbering since the Fall, so that people being able to continue leading their wretched lives as squalid subsistence farmers is seen as an uneqivocable win?
It does not matter if the item is permanent or not. They are free or close to it. They last until the artificer decides they do not and other people can use them.
How good would the artificer be if they could only make one item for one day and only they could use it? Take away the party buff feature and they are poo.
The infusions are, practically speaking, permanent. Technically not since they only last until you die, but at that point you're splitting hairs. Shillelagh lasts for 1 minute, though you can cast it over and over.
Artificers can instantly create a bag of holding just using one of their infusions. How do you figure Wizards can do so using the same rules?
With that said, I don't have a problem with any of this. Their base class has no martial abilities whatsoever, and they're only half casters. If anything I think they should get more.
You seem to be trying to tell me I need to actually read the class in order to argue my point. Alright.
Tinkering literally let's you make permanent - but very minor - magic items.
Infusion let's you create effectively permanent magic items. It only ends if you chose so, or die.
But the real issue is you have the ability to create a magic item on demand. Need an eversmoking bottle, or a chime of opening? Just conjure one out of thin air! (I didn't check if those examples are on the list - and I realise you need an item to infuse).
And then, at level 10, you get the Magic Item Adept.
I'm not sure I agree with you. It seems to me they literally have magic items coming out of their caboose =)
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
The eversmoking bottle and chime of opening aren't included.
Plus, you can't actually make an infusion on demand. They're "made" at the end of a long rest, similarly to how they prepare their spells...except, unlike spells, you have to learn them first in order to be able to prepare them. Unless you have an INCREDIBLY generous DM (even moreso that I am), you are going to have a *very* limited number of infusions you can use throughout the campaign. And they need a preexisting mundane item to be infused into.
My headcanon for infusions is that they scrawl some runes or something on the mundane item to turn into the magic item, but the runes are just a shortcut, and they need the actual formula and special ingredient to make it truly permanent.
Personally I like the "standard" artificer as a steampunk inventor, but if the concept doesn't fit your setting, the artificer could also be Daedalus in a setting based on Greek Mythology or a dwarven master smith.
+ Instaboot to murderhobos + I don't watch Critical Role, and no, I really shouldn't either +
In the campaign I'm running right now, the artificer player flavors it as attaching magically-enhanced semiprecious stones to otherwise nonmagical items.
Makes sense to me. I'm guessing those stones are tied to their life force or something, which is why they stop working when that character dies?
Something pretty close to that effect, yeah. They're playing an Alchemist, but also took proficiency in Jeweler's tools and decided to lean into that for their infusions.
Meh. Doesn't affect the point I'm making in any way.
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
Yes it does, actually.
Tinkering literally let's you make permanent - but very minor - magic items.: Okay, this one I can't exactly refute, because you are correct.
But the real issue is you have the ability to create a magic item on demand.: Except you can't, because you only know so many, can only have so many active at a time, and it takes a long rest to make them.
And then, at level 10, you get the Magic Item Adept.: oh no, you can craft up to Uncommon items for half cost and time... but you still need a formula (so DM dependant), a component that may or may not take an adventure to get (also DM dependent), the MONEY, and sufficient time to work on it.
I play artificers on a pretty regular basis and I still don't have magic items coming out of my caboose.
Formerly Devan Avalon.
Trying to get your physical content on Beyond is like going to Microsoft and saying "I have a physical Playstation disk, give me a digital Xbox version!"
But it's not about your character. I mean, it might be, but that's hardly related to my point.
Let's start with your character though: An artificer has unparalleled utility. That's my honest opinion - not even bards or wizards can do all the stuff an artificer can do. Now, that's by design, artificers are meant to be versatile. Is it too much? Meh, I couldn't really say. As you may have noticed, I've never even read the class in 5e, and never played one or with one.
But my point is really in terms of world building. And in terms of world building, artificers really do have magic items coming out of their caboose. Your character does his or her thing based on need and situation - but an npc will make magic items for pay, all day long, every day. You can rent or lease an infused item, or you can buy a permanent magic item, or you can buy trinkets of very minor magical ability for parties or to entertain kids.
There is no escaping that Artificer Class = Industrial Level Magic Item Production. There simply isn't any sort of argument that works. If you have the artificer class, then you also have Ol' Ben from down the lane, who makes legendary magic items for a living. The One Ring is not unique, it's just a case of an-artificer-did-it.
Edit: Seriously. I belive it says somewhere in the Eberron book that most packets of cereal come with little magical items for kids to play with. Like, in a side bar or something.
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
As you may have noticed, I've never even read the class in 5e, and never played one or with one. then why are you commenting on this thread at all?! You literally are arguing something you don't understand the mechanics or balance of!
and that's just one problem considering you didn't acknowledge literally any of the points in my post.
There is no escaping that Artificer Class = Industrial Level Magic Item Production. There simply isn't any sort of argument that works. If you have the artificer class, then you also have Ol' Ben from down the lane, who makes legendary magic items for a living. The One Ring is not unique, it's just a case of an-artificer-did-it.: Even before Artificer class, you have Ol' Ben from the wizard tower in the desert who makes legendary magic items for a living... provided he has the money, time, and expensive components that may or may not require monster slaying to make.
OH WAIT, ARTIFICERS NEED THAT TOO.
Formerly Devan Avalon.
Trying to get your physical content on Beyond is like going to Microsoft and saying "I have a physical Playstation disk, give me a digital Xbox version!"
Oh, I'm sorry - if you feel it's up to you to decide whether I'm entitled to an opinion, go right ahead and don't reply to me.
I didn't acknowledge your points because I think you're wrong.
Yes, wizards can do the same thing - but less so. The whole point of the artificer is to make magic items, with ease. Whereas wizards have to make somewhat more of a real investment - plus it's not the main trope of their class.
And don't try to argue ressources: Since it always pays more than it costs, that's not an argument you can use.
See, I did it again. Didn't concede your points, because it so happens I don't agree with you.
Wizards can make magic items on a sort of craftsman level. Artificers boost that to actual industrial levels. And if you want a world where legendary magic items were made by long forgotten heroes from prehistory - then you quite simply cannot also have an artificer down the lane who can do the same thing before lunch (provided you bring him the heart of a hag, 12 black spider legs and the song of a maiden fair).
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
That has literally nothing to do with artificers, and everything to do with Eberron being a world where magic is industrialized. That sidebar would still exist even if artificers didn't
Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock)
Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric)
Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue)
Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
To expand on this, WoTC deliberately picked some of the tamest magic items of their rarity category, because they felt those would be the most appropriate to give automatic access to players. You could even say that the Replicate Magic Items tables, moreso than the Random Magic Items table in the DMG, is a decent guide to what magic items you can safely give players at different tiers of play.
In any case, the artificer can infuse a limited number of items to make those things or any common magic item, but to make any of the plethora of magic items beyond that, they need to follow the same magic item crafting rules as anyone else (minus the 10th level discount to time and money for common and uncommon items). Notice as well that there are zero very rare or legendary items on the Replicate Magic Items list, and you get no discounts on time and money for rare or above magic items either.
All classes have unparalleled utility. That's the point of a class-based system.
This would be the crux of the matter, methinks.
To a great many people, something that's so intrinsic to the fantasy genre that they don't even realize it's a vital underpinning to their entire understanding of the genre is that Time Doesn't Exist. Everything is the same as it always was and always will be. No one and nothing ever progresses, understanding does not improve or evolve. The greatest sword ever forged was made ten thousand years ago by a conclave of master smiths in a Fallen Age, and that confluence of expertise, materials, andwillingness will never occur again. Fantasy worlds are locked in stasis, never growing or adapting. There's always a Fallen Age in which Heroes lived and the greatest things that have ever been made were all created, and the party is always adventuring in that world tens or hundreds of thousands of years after that Fallen Age, where everybody is all "Yeah...things were dope back then. Now they're not. Oh well" and simply accept that living their squalid little points-of-light lives is what they're destined for. That sense of timelessness, that sense that the history of civilization can be hundreds of thousands of years long and yet nothing has ever happened since a half-forgotten, myth-shrouded Fallen Age, IS "Fantasy" to many people.
Wizards are an intrinsic part of that because they're the world's secret lore-keepers. Much like Sith, there is one wizard and one wizard's apprentice, they live apart from society and ensure that the dangers of the Fallen Age are never brought into light. They chase knowledge but they do not share it, nor use it to try and improve the world. One of the core tenets of fantasy wizardry is secrecy, the idea that the common man is suspicious of 'witchcraft' and that wizards are the rare few who can handle knowing the secrets of the world. They seek to preserve the timelessness of Fantasy, and thus they're important agents in a fantasy world. Whereas when you tell people about the core ideals of artificers? Well, we've seen it in this thread. Acromos hasn't even bothered to read the class (and no, you don't get an opinion anyone else needs to take seriously if you can't be assed to spend five f@#$ing minutes reading the class, duder) because he's convinced artificers represent progress. They represent knowledge, learning, and the existence of time, the idea that the best days of civilization are in front of them and not many thousands of years in the past.
That's not at all true - artificers can be just as secretive as wizards, and in fact the average layperson would have a great deal of difficulty telling "wizard" and "artificer" apart - but the artificer is bound up in the minds of those who hate it with the idea of the scientific method and an inquisitive, engineering, problem-solving mindset. As the man said - you can't have 'Legendary items forged by mythical heroes before recorded history' if your world is actively chasing knowledge and improving itself. The best sword ever made can't be ten thousand years old if modern smiths have been building on the knowledge of metallurgy, magicraft, and swordmaking methods for those ten thousand years and have gained insights, techniques, and methods that ten thousand year conclave of nonhuman smiths couldn't have dreamed of. If Time Exists, then eventually the Fallen Age must be replaced with a Rising Age as people decide they're fed up with breaking their backs growing turnips in a field whilst being devoured by owlbears every third Tuesday and turn their collective will towards reclaiming what was lost - or building it up in the first place.
Now, again - you can have an artificer who's every bit as secretive with their methods as a typical wizard, and you can have a wizard that's willing to teach any village kid who asks a little bit of Prestidigitation. In fact I'd argue it can make more sense for a spellcaster in the shadow of a Fallen Age to require things to focus their half-understood magic, objects of power to help them channel that which the lords of the Fallen Age could do with merely a word and a gesture. But that's not really what people are arguing in this thread. People are arguing about whether Fantasy can exist if Time also exists. The answer is obviously yes - but the classic Tolkienesque Standard Eurofantasy? That does not tolerate the passage of time well. One of the coremost tenets of Tolkienite Eurofantasy is "everything was cool once, but now it's shit and we'll never fix that". Artificers, in their traditional sense, are about Fixing That, and so people will never accept them because they don't want the world fixed. They WANT it Fallen, broken, and a terrible place to live. Elsewise how can someone create a heroic fantasy about defeating an ancient evil, slumbering since the Fall, so that people being able to continue leading their wretched lives as squalid subsistence farmers is seen as an uneqivocable win?
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