Hasbro can take a flying leap on this one. I don't mind trying to monetize D&D for improvement but a Master Tier at $30 per month is offensive and will cause a mass exodus from a fine tool like D&D Beyond.
$15/mo for Wow gives you a solid 24 hours of play per day or you can pay $30/mo for at best 24 hours total content put out per month, and this is being generous. Assuming they are putting out multiple campaigns and you have multiple DM's running said campaigns. It's simply going to be a poor value prospect.
Read your own title: "$30 per month rumor for Master Tier".
Rumor.
RUMOR!!!!
Do we really need yet another thread about RUMORS and speculation??? As it is already, 80% of the Gott Dang threads on the Forums are just a torrent of RUMORS and gott dang speculation. Because god forbid anyone on this entire website ever bother to take a deep breath and just wait for some actual FACTS to come out to base your decisions on!
Enough already. For hecksake, Mods, please - PLEASE - make one category to put all these threads into.
Read your own title: "$30 per month rumor for Master Tier".
Rumor.
RUMOR!!!!
Do we really need yet another thread about RUMORS and speculation??? As it is already, 80% of the Gott Dang threads on the Forums are just a torrent of RUMORS and gott dang speculation. Because god forbid anyone on this entire website ever bother to take a deep breath and just wait for some actual FACTS to come out to base your decisions on!
Enough already. For hecksake, Mods, please - PLEASE - make one category to put all these threads into.
Who's forcing you to pay attention and isn't that the person you should be upset with??
Read your own title: "$30 per month rumor for Master Tier".
Rumor.
RUMOR!!!!
Do we really need yet another thread about RUMORS and speculation??? As it is already, 80% of the Gott Dang threads on the Forums are just a torrent of RUMORS and gott dang speculation. Because god forbid anyone on this entire website ever bother to take a deep breath and just wait for some actual FACTS to come out to base your decisions on!
Enough already. For hecksake, Mods, please - PLEASE - make one category to put all these threads into.
The post was confirmed by DND_Shorts, he's a reliable source of information. Do you have a problem with DND_Shorts, if so show you evidence.
$15/mo for Wow gives you a solid 24 hours of play per day or you can pay $30/mo for at best 24 hours total content put out per month, and this is being generous. Assuming they are putting out multiple campaigns and you have multiple DM's running said campaigns. It's simply going to be a poor value prospect.
If it meant, for example, being able to access adventure paths without needing to buy them, along with the VTT, the AI DM and early access to new releases, then I could see that being worth it. But overall I agree, $15/mo is probably the ceiling of what they'll be able to get away with charging in practice.
As an update, it was shifted to Wednesday. Also, it is perfectly reasonable to wait, they have all the rights and reason too. This was framed as a question for a reason, and verfication is essential.
Read your own title: "$30 per month rumor for Master Tier".
Rumor.
RUMOR!!!!
Do we really need yet another thread about RUMORS and speculation??? As it is already, 80% of the Gott Dang threads on the Forums are just a torrent of RUMORS and gott dang speculation. Because god forbid anyone on this entire website ever bother to take a deep breath and just wait for some actual FACTS to come out to base your decisions on!
Enough already. For hecksake, Mods, please - PLEASE - make one category to put all these threads into.
Every single rumor regarding OGL, DNDB or these days bad news have become true. All of them. From all the spectrum of choices and corporate decissions, WotC has picked the most painful for customers and creators. And you tell us to stop talking about rumors?
It is not a rumor. They want us to pay with blood, enormous amount of money. Mark my words, because the sources are trustable 100%.
I am sincerely hoping this is just rumor and a trial balloon floated by some guy in accounting at Hasbro to see what they can get. I really wanted the fanbase that loves D&D, loves most of the things WOTC has done and likes the direction D&D Beyond is going. I was hoping to generate reaction by our fan base that this is a really unenlightened idea or STUPID if you want to let the chips fall where they may. Where I got this from was another feed quoting supposedly reliable sources. The fan base has already sounded the alarm on the Open Gaming License but I had not seen this one here.
I was hoping our esteemed fan base here could give Hasbro and WOTC some feedback on this idea if it has been discussed before we see it in a coming soon to D&D Beyond announcement. There were also other red flags about limiting the free and Hero tiers but I figured let's just try to hammer this one out.
I have been a player and DM in the game since the three little books in the pretty white box (which I sadly no longer have) and I want to see the game continue at a healthy pace. I don't post often but when I get concerned about something I really love, I had to post it.
I just pray to the Greyhawk gods and the pantheon of others in the D&D realms I am behaving like Chicken Little.
$15/mo for Wow gives you a solid 24 hours of play per day or you can pay $30/mo for at best 24 hours total content put out per month, and this is being generous. Assuming they are putting out multiple campaigns and you have multiple DM's running said campaigns. It's simply going to be a poor value prospect.
If it meant, for example, being able to access adventure paths without needing to buy them, along with the VTT, the AI DM and early access to new releases, then I could see that being worth it. But overall I agree, $15/mo is probably the ceiling of what they'll be able to get away with charging in practice.
The post was confirmed by DND_Shorts, he's a reliable source of information. Do you have a problem with DND_Shorts, if so show you evidence.
I'm not saying he hasn't been credible in the past, but at the end of the day he doesn't work for WotC and thus can't actually "confirm" anything.
- 30USD/month, means 360 usd/year.
- Most books have price (based on the recommended price at the WotC web, yeah i know, regional pricing/shipping and other stuff..) set at 50 USD.
- That means you can get a year of subscription or 7 books (phb+xan+tasha+MM+dmg+2 extra books - you really don't need much more for your whole DnD Career).
I really can't think of anything which would make the 30usd (and even 15USD) worth it tbh.
If it meant, for example, being able to access adventure paths without needing to buy them, along with the VTT, the AI DM and early access to new releases, then I could see that being worth it. But overall I agree, $15/mo is probably the ceiling of what they'll be able to get away with charging in practice.
Ehhh...I don't think I can agree with that. Let's break it down a bit.
At any given time, you're only realistically going to be using one adventure at a time (sure, there are those that run multiple, but the majority of us won't be, and there's downtime to consider as well). I've looked up the runtime for my current adventure, Rime of the Frostmaiden, and it's about a year. Let's say, to account for people who do run multiple campaigns, maybe RotFM is particularly long, maybe you like to go through sessions faster, etc, that you go through an adventure every 6 months or so.
Your intial cost is $90 for the core books, plus $60 per year. That's $150 for your first year. At $30 a month, that's $360 per year. Even for your first year, which is your most expensive one if you go the permanent route, you're paying $210 for a year of access to...the VTT? That's pretty darn steep. $17.50 per month. And, unlike buying the books outright, you don't get anything at the end of it. If you quit after sinking that $360 into the game, you're left with nothing. With buying the books, you can then play for free - or pay however much you want into the game. For your second year on, you're effectively paying $30 a month for your VTT. That's...a AAA videogame, every other month. Or enough to buy a new adventure, every month.
That's incredibly steep. Bearing in mind that D&D, if not done stingily, is already a reasonably expensive hobby. Also, is this $30 meant to be just the DM, or would they be expecting players to be contributing as well?
Maybe I'm just tight. I do look at what people want to buy on here and raise an eyebrow - even the hero tier seems to be a waste to me - so perhaps it is just me. However, $17.50 a month, rising to $30 a month to access a VTT seems awfully expensive, especially when it's free on Roll20 (albeit with substantially worse graphics, but still). The footage they showed seemed PlayStation era graphics, so I'm not terribly excited for it. I'd be willing to try it - but not at $30 for a month.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
I pay the equivalent of 30 of whatever weird exchangable pass for currency in the broader foreign world for my gym subscription. Those guys have buildings and machines to maintain, wages to pay, floors to mop, bills for power and heating, and they provide nice customer service.
For an online platform I'd pay ... nothing? Basically that. For something extraordinarily good - like the Sago mini - I'd be willing to shell out maybe 3,99. DNDB is nowhere near.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
I would be willing to pay $20 a month for an online virtual tabletop that is at least as good in terms of functionality as Foundry’s Virtual Tabletop. But I want more. For that much money? Yeah, I want more.
I want 3D rendering of the tabletop with robust character and monster customization features, as well as full HD renderings. I want it in full color with filters.
I want animations. I want unique animations for every spell, and a healthy plethora of attack animations as well as unique animations for maneuvers, powers, and ki powers, and so on. I want animations on all the monsters, too. I want good idling animations as well. I want options to turn the animations on and off. I want those animations to be easy to navigate, choose from, and select.
I want pop ups onscreen on various active conditions and other options.
I want a library of music for game sessions.
I want selectable theme music for creatures, monsters, and characters.
I want a healthy selection of customization for every attack and spell. I don’t want just one good animation for Magic Missile. I want lots. I want at least 20. I want that for every spell, attack, and move.
I want a short animated adventure module every month. I want it downloadable in print form, available in app form in case I want to run it live, and on a virtual tabletop with animations if I want to run it online.
I want themed events with player, creature, environment, and monster options. There ought to be at least one per holiday, in addition to the monthly adventure.
I want multiple optional tie-ins between adventures. Not sidebars, either, I want boxed text I can relate to my players, auto-adjustment for all printed campaign settings, and timeline adjustments for when I decide to play them.
And you know what? Sure. I’m game with having an adventure be automated in a certain fashion so I can play them solo, or a bunch of us can play it without a human DM.
These are minimum asks. Not ideal. Minimum. If WotC can’t offer this much, people will walk. I’m already looking into Pathfinder. They have a better offer.
Not a rumor, the sources of the leaks are 100% acurate. Mark my words.
We'll all leave DnD. Period.
Then it's still a rumour. Unless you have proof that this is happening... it's a still a rumour. It could be a true one, you may be convinced by it, but that doesn't change what it is.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
Trying to put a different spin on this I wonder if the $30 tier would also include the VTT and other new tools for one DnD and, if instead of replacing the current Master tier, it just means there will be additional tiers on top of the current top level one. It seems a very big jump from 5.99 to 30.
Jesus Christ WotC is greedy, $30 sub??? Who in thier righting can afford that. That's same as 2 world of warcraft account subs, or breakfast, lunch and dinner for a day, and 3 Netflix subscriptions!
I love the idea of an awesome tabletop virtual gameboard, but it's not worth it for $30 when there others who cheaper and permanent (not sub). Not to mention, this game is for pen and paper or theater of the mind and those free (minus cost of pen and paper lol).
I'm ok with WotC seeking monetization from company's that use d&d content so long as its a FAIR price, but this is just awful. Whomever decided to set prices like this should be demoted, not fired cause folks at wotc people but demoted or removed from d&d projects.
WotC, you want to win back the community and not lose more money, then invest in the community. Offer a 1 time purchase, not a subscription, for one dnd and the virtual tabletop. Make it a reasonable price, make sure character creations, assets, and maps are open for creative use by creators so they can make their own freely and then have a market to sell characters or maps created in one d&d to which you get royalty from that. This promotes oned&d, protes the artist who makes the 3d map, and allows you to get revenue without being such a greedy tool.
You can also sell prade 3d maps for the 5e and newer campaigns in this digital marker and bundle them with dndbeyond books too, agiana great way to get revenue. Steal this idea from me, I give permission for ya too, just LISTEN to the community for once.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Hasbro can take a flying leap on this one. I don't mind trying to monetize D&D for improvement but a Master Tier at $30 per month is offensive and will cause a mass exodus from a fine tool like D&D Beyond.
Rumor police. Please tell me I am wrong.
I definitely wouldn't for the current Master Tier - but could they come up with some product offering to make it worthwhile, that's a maybe.
$15/mo for Wow gives you a solid 24 hours of play per day or you can pay $30/mo for at best 24 hours total content put out per month, and this is being generous. Assuming they are putting out multiple campaigns and you have multiple DM's running said campaigns. It's simply going to be a poor value prospect.
Stop. Please. Enough.
Read your own title: "$30 per month rumor for Master Tier".
Rumor.
RUMOR!!!!
Do we really need yet another thread about RUMORS and speculation??? As it is already, 80% of the Gott Dang threads on the Forums are just a torrent of RUMORS and gott dang speculation. Because god forbid anyone on this entire website ever bother to take a deep breath and just wait for some actual FACTS to come out to base your decisions on!
Enough already. For hecksake, Mods, please - PLEASE - make one category to put all these threads into.
Anzio Faro. Protector Aasimar light cleric. Lvl 18.
Viktor Gavriil. White dragonborn grave cleric. Lvl 20.
Ikram Sahir ibn-Malik al-Sayyid Ra'ad. Brass dragonborn draconic sorcerer Lvl 9. Fire elemental devil.
Wrangler of cats.
Who's forcing you to pay attention and isn't that the person you should be upset with??
The post was confirmed by DND_Shorts, he's a reliable source of information. Do you have a problem with DND_Shorts, if so show you evidence.
If it meant, for example, being able to access adventure paths without needing to buy them, along with the VTT, the AI DM and early access to new releases, then I could see that being worth it. But overall I agree, $15/mo is probably the ceiling of what they'll be able to get away with charging in practice.
I'm not saying he hasn't been credible in the past, but at the end of the day he doesn't work for WotC and thus can't actually "confirm" anything.
Dungeon Scribe and Nerd Immersion have also confirmed the price increase.
I find the information credible.
I've cancelled my subscription and made sure they know why I cancelled.
Btw
https://twitter.com/DungeonScribe/status/1615401964463849472
Every single rumor regarding OGL, DNDB or these days bad news have become true. All of them. From all the spectrum of choices and corporate decissions, WotC has picked the most painful for customers and creators. And you tell us to stop talking about rumors?
It is not a rumor. They want us to pay with blood, enormous amount of money. Mark my words, because the sources are trustable 100%.
I am sincerely hoping this is just rumor and a trial balloon floated by some guy in accounting at Hasbro to see what they can get. I really wanted the fanbase that loves D&D, loves most of the things WOTC has done and likes the direction D&D Beyond is going. I was hoping to generate reaction by our fan base that this is a really unenlightened idea or STUPID if you want to let the chips fall where they may. Where I got this from was another feed quoting supposedly reliable sources. The fan base has already sounded the alarm on the Open Gaming License but I had not seen this one here.
I was hoping our esteemed fan base here could give Hasbro and WOTC some feedback on this idea if it has been discussed before we see it in a coming soon to D&D Beyond announcement. There were also other red flags about limiting the free and Hero tiers but I figured let's just try to hammer this one out.
I have been a player and DM in the game since the three little books in the pretty white box (which I sadly no longer have) and I want to see the game continue at a healthy pace. I don't post often but when I get concerned about something I really love, I had to post it.
I just pray to the Greyhawk gods and the pantheon of others in the D&D realms I am behaving like Chicken Little.
Thanks.
- 30USD/month, means 360 usd/year.
- Most books have price (based on the recommended price at the WotC web, yeah i know, regional pricing/shipping and other stuff..) set at 50 USD.
- That means you can get a year of subscription or 7 books (phb+xan+tasha+MM+dmg+2 extra books - you really don't need much more for your whole DnD Career).
I really can't think of anything which would make the 30usd (and even 15USD) worth it tbh.
Ehhh...I don't think I can agree with that. Let's break it down a bit.
At any given time, you're only realistically going to be using one adventure at a time (sure, there are those that run multiple, but the majority of us won't be, and there's downtime to consider as well). I've looked up the runtime for my current adventure, Rime of the Frostmaiden, and it's about a year. Let's say, to account for people who do run multiple campaigns, maybe RotFM is particularly long, maybe you like to go through sessions faster, etc, that you go through an adventure every 6 months or so.
Your intial cost is $90 for the core books, plus $60 per year. That's $150 for your first year. At $30 a month, that's $360 per year. Even for your first year, which is your most expensive one if you go the permanent route, you're paying $210 for a year of access to...the VTT? That's pretty darn steep. $17.50 per month. And, unlike buying the books outright, you don't get anything at the end of it. If you quit after sinking that $360 into the game, you're left with nothing. With buying the books, you can then play for free - or pay however much you want into the game. For your second year on, you're effectively paying $30 a month for your VTT. That's...a AAA videogame, every other month. Or enough to buy a new adventure, every month.
That's incredibly steep. Bearing in mind that D&D, if not done stingily, is already a reasonably expensive hobby. Also, is this $30 meant to be just the DM, or would they be expecting players to be contributing as well?
Maybe I'm just tight. I do look at what people want to buy on here and raise an eyebrow - even the hero tier seems to be a waste to me - so perhaps it is just me. However, $17.50 a month, rising to $30 a month to access a VTT seems awfully expensive, especially when it's free on Roll20 (albeit with substantially worse graphics, but still). The footage they showed seemed PlayStation era graphics, so I'm not terribly excited for it. I'd be willing to try it - but not at $30 for a month.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
I pay the equivalent of 30 of whatever weird exchangable pass for currency in the broader foreign world for my gym subscription. Those guys have buildings and machines to maintain, wages to pay, floors to mop, bills for power and heating, and they provide nice customer service.
For an online platform I'd pay ... nothing? Basically that. For something extraordinarily good - like the Sago mini - I'd be willing to shell out maybe 3,99. DNDB is nowhere near.
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
I would be willing to pay $20 a month for an online virtual tabletop that is at least as good in terms of functionality as Foundry’s Virtual Tabletop. But I want more. For that much money? Yeah, I want more.
I want 3D rendering of the tabletop with robust character and monster customization features, as well as full HD renderings. I want it in full color with filters.
I want animations. I want unique animations for every spell, and a healthy plethora of attack animations as well as unique animations for maneuvers, powers, and ki powers, and so on. I want animations on all the monsters, too. I want good idling animations as well. I want options to turn the animations on and off. I want those animations to be easy to navigate, choose from, and select.
I want pop ups onscreen on various active conditions and other options.
I want a library of music for game sessions.
I want selectable theme music for creatures, monsters, and characters.
I want a healthy selection of customization for every attack and spell. I don’t want just one good animation for Magic Missile. I want lots. I want at least 20. I want that for every spell, attack, and move.
I want a short animated adventure module every month. I want it downloadable in print form, available in app form in case I want to run it live, and on a virtual tabletop with animations if I want to run it online.
I want themed events with player, creature, environment, and monster options. There ought to be at least one per holiday, in addition to the monthly adventure.
I want multiple optional tie-ins between adventures. Not sidebars, either, I want boxed text I can relate to my players, auto-adjustment for all printed campaign settings, and timeline adjustments for when I decide to play them.
And you know what? Sure. I’m game with having an adventure be automated in a certain fashion so I can play them solo, or a bunch of us can play it without a human DM.
These are minimum asks. Not ideal. Minimum. If WotC can’t offer this much, people will walk. I’m already looking into Pathfinder. They have a better offer.
Not a rumor, the sources of the leaks are 100% acurate. Mark my words.
We'll all leave DnD. Period.
Still gonna play and enjoy the game, but if THAT comes by, not via DDB.
Then it's still a rumour. Unless you have proof that this is happening... it's a still a rumour. It could be a true one, you may be convinced by it, but that doesn't change what it is.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
Trying to put a different spin on this I wonder if the $30 tier would also include the VTT and other new tools for one DnD and, if instead of replacing the current Master tier, it just means there will be additional tiers on top of the current top level one. It seems a very big jump from 5.99 to 30.
Jesus Christ WotC is greedy, $30 sub??? Who in thier righting can afford that. That's same as 2 world of warcraft account subs, or breakfast, lunch and dinner for a day, and 3 Netflix subscriptions!
I love the idea of an awesome tabletop virtual gameboard, but it's not worth it for $30 when there others who cheaper and permanent (not sub). Not to mention, this game is for pen and paper or theater of the mind and those free (minus cost of pen and paper lol).
I'm ok with WotC seeking monetization from company's that use d&d content so long as its a FAIR price, but this is just awful. Whomever decided to set prices like this should be demoted, not fired cause folks at wotc people but demoted or removed from d&d projects.
WotC, you want to win back the community and not lose more money, then invest in the community. Offer a 1 time purchase, not a subscription, for one dnd and the virtual tabletop. Make it a reasonable price, make sure character creations, assets, and maps are open for creative use by creators so they can make their own freely and then have a market to sell characters or maps created in one d&d to which you get royalty from that. This promotes oned&d, protes the artist who makes the 3d map, and allows you to get revenue without being such a greedy tool.
You can also sell prade 3d maps for the 5e and newer campaigns in this digital marker and bundle them with dndbeyond books too, agiana great way to get revenue. Steal this idea from me, I give permission for ya too, just LISTEN to the community for once.