Second, spells are some of the longest lists out there - and can already be overwhelming to some players. Increasing the length of a list with only a couple dozen entries is not a big deal. Increasing the length of an extremely long list is - it makes something overwhelming even more so
Finally, spells, more than anything else, were really adjusted for power, with the new versions fixing some pretty big problems. Wizards does not want folks to accidentally choose the criminally underpowered 2014 healing spells, simply because they don’t know the systems that well and just select one of the two similarly names options. Nor do they want folks intentionally choosing the ridiculous 2014 version of spiritual weapon, which always should have had concentration.
With those two points, the legacy tab option is a perfect fix for that issue. Have legacy off by default so that a newbie doesn't see the current spells.
And then for those that want the current spells, let's assume we're smart enough to check the source of duplicate-named spells.
Problem solved.
For the tooltips that currently link things like hex or my custom title for the spell hex I'll grant things could get a bit tricky. I believe there's still monsters that'll link to Volo's/Tome of Foes instead of Multiverse versions and I'm not sure there's any tags within to specify which version. But that's a separate issue from the functionality of the character sheet.
Honestly, nothing here seems like that big of a deal. There’s some minor inconveniences if you want to stick with the older versions of spells, but nothing that seems all that difficult to implement through the homebrewing system. Granted, the fact the inconveniences are minor clearly hasn’t stopped the “we want Wizards to fail for.. reasons…” crowd from making a mountain out of this molehill
Making homebrew copies of 400 spells and 300 items isn't a minor inconvenience, it is a clear deterrent for people who want to use 5e 2014. Add to that, that they will change the character sheet to not reference 2014 rules and not give an option for those who want it, is a very clear way for them to start forcing people to move to 2024
You're right it's not difficult to implement through homebrew so why didn't they just do that for us. It is much easier for them to keep the old spells and items, tag them as legacy (they already have a tagging system in place) and just create new versions. They already have the systems in place, they have duplicate spells when it comes to named spells in phb vs basic rules (e.g. Hideous Laughter Vs Tasha's Hideous Laughter) and you can already filter by sourcebook so why is this any different? It's not, they have just made the decision that best suits their bottom line that's all
Well, for starters, having to homebrew several hundred spells isn’t what they said is happening at all - they are saying you will have to homebrew when there is a new version replacing the old.
A simple application of common sense can derive at least three reasons why spells are getting treated differently.
First, spells show up as dependent objects for lots of other things - feats, racial features, class features, etc. Having two different versions of a spell could confuse players - particularly new players - trying to figure out what their character’s features will do. It is far easier to have those systems link to a singular default, rather than have the system link to one version of the spells, when players might think they want another.
Second, spells are some of the longest lists out there - and can already be overwhelming to some players. Increasing the length of a list with only a couple dozen entries is not a big deal. Increasing the length of an extremely long list is - it makes something overwhelming even more so
Finally, spells, more than anything else, were really adjusted for power, with the new versions fixing some pretty big problems. Wizards does not want folks to accidentally choose the criminally underpowered 2014 healing spells, simply because they don’t know the systems that well and just select one of the two similarly names options. Nor do they want folks intentionally choosing the ridiculous 2014 version of spiritual weapon, which always should have had concentration.
All told, this really is not that big of a deal - and there are plenty of solid reasons why the new spells should, by default, supersede the old.
It may not be a big deal to some, but it obviously is to others. Dismissing others concerns doesn't make them go away. This is just another straw on the camel's back for many, It's not errata, and it's not a new edition, but you can't use what you already own without HBing it. what a trainwreck of implementation and a slap in the face for those that just want to use what they paid for.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
CENSORSHIP IS THE TOOL OF COWARDS and WANNA BE TYRANTS.
Second, spells are some of the longest lists out there - and can already be overwhelming to some players. Increasing the length of a list with only a couple dozen entries is not a big deal. Increasing the length of an extremely long list is - it makes something overwhelming even more so
Finally, spells, more than anything else, were really adjusted for power, with the new versions fixing some pretty big problems. Wizards does not want folks to accidentally choose the criminally underpowered 2014 healing spells, simply because they don’t know the systems that well and just select one of the two similarly names options. Nor do they want folks intentionally choosing the ridiculous 2014 version of spiritual weapon, which always should have had concentration.
With those two points, the legacy tab option is a perfect fix for that issue. Have legacy off by default so that a newbie doesn't see the current spells.
And then for those that want the current spells, let's assume we're smart enough to check the source of duplicate-named spells.
Problem solved.
For the tooltips that currently link things like hex or my custom title for the spell hex I'll grant things could get a bit tricky. I believe there's still monsters that'll link to Volo's/Tome of Foes instead of Multiverse versions and I'm not sure there's any tags within to specify which version. But that's a separate issue from the functionality of the character sheet.
Problem, of course, not solved if you apply common sense. The legacy tab is an all or none option - it does not have a toggle. “Fixing” the spell issues by saying “you can’t use any other legacy options either” is not a great solution either.
Second, spells are some of the longest lists out there - and can already be overwhelming to some players. Increasing the length of a list with only a couple dozen entries is not a big deal. Increasing the length of an extremely long list is - it makes something overwhelming even more so
Finally, spells, more than anything else, were really adjusted for power, with the new versions fixing some pretty big problems. Wizards does not want folks to accidentally choose the criminally underpowered 2014 healing spells, simply because they don’t know the systems that well and just select one of the two similarly names options. Nor do they want folks intentionally choosing the ridiculous 2014 version of spiritual weapon, which always should have had concentration.
With those two points, the legacy tab option is a perfect fix for that issue. Have legacy off by default so that a newbie doesn't see the current spells.
And then for those that want the current spells, let's assume we're smart enough to check the source of duplicate-named spells.
Problem solved.
For the tooltips that currently link things like hex or my custom title for the spell hex I'll grant things could get a bit tricky. I believe there's still monsters that'll link to Volo's/Tome of Foes instead of Multiverse versions and I'm not sure there's any tags within to specify which version. But that's a separate issue from the functionality of the character sheet.
Problem, of course, not solved if you apply common sense. The legacy tab is an all or none option - it does not have a toggle. “Fixing” the spell issues by saying “you can’t use any other legacy options either” is not a great solution either.
[REDACTED]
They could set a toggle for the entire thing or individual choices (Spells, Items, conditions, etc...). It would be way user-friendly and would not rob the user of stuff they already paid off. Do you understand that? Wizards it throwing users PHB in the trash and saying "you can write down what you wish to use on a small piece of paper, one by one".
"It would be difficult to implement :(((((", that's why they have billions of dollars, I'm certain it is possible. They don't do it because they don't want to. The character sheets already have a toggle for stuff you don't even imagine, like separate coins in containers. Implement a filter is something they could do, but they won't, because people like you are willing to do their bidding.
(And I'm not even touching the fact that you want to use "some" of the Legacy content, you fall for the illusion that they are compatible).
Second, spells are some of the longest lists out there - and can already be overwhelming to some players. Increasing the length of a list with only a couple dozen entries is not a big deal. Increasing the length of an extremely long list is - it makes something overwhelming even more so
Finally, spells, more than anything else, were really adjusted for power, with the new versions fixing some pretty big problems. Wizards does not want folks to accidentally choose the criminally underpowered 2014 healing spells, simply because they don’t know the systems that well and just select one of the two similarly names options. Nor do they want folks intentionally choosing the ridiculous 2014 version of spiritual weapon, which always should have had concentration.
With those two points, the legacy tab option is a perfect fix for that issue. Have legacy off by default so that a newbie doesn't see the current spells.
And then for those that want the current spells, let's assume we're smart enough to check the source of duplicate-named spells.
Problem solved.
For the tooltips that currently link things like hex or my custom title for the spell hex I'll grant things could get a bit tricky. I believe there's still monsters that'll link to Volo's/Tome of Foes instead of Multiverse versions and I'm not sure there's any tags within to specify which version. But that's a separate issue from the functionality of the character sheet.
Problem, of course, not solved if you apply common sense. The legacy tab is an all or none option - it does not have a toggle. “Fixing” the spell issues by saying “you can’t use any other legacy options either” is not a great solution either.
You are clearly dodging the point...
They could set a toggle for the entire thing or individual choices (Spells, Items, conditions, etc...). It would be way user-friendly and would not rob the user of stuff they already paid off. Do you understand that? Wizards it throwing users PHB in the trash and saying "you can write down what you wish to use on a small piece of paper, one by one".
"It would be difficult to implement :(((((", that's why they have billions of dollars, I'm certain it is possible. They don't do it because they don't want to. The character sheets already have a toggle for stuff you don't even imagine, like separate coins in containers. Implement a filter is something they could do, but they won't, because people like you are willing to do their bidding.
(And I'm not even touching the fact that you want to use "some" of the Legacy content, you fall for the illusion that they are compatible).
Once again, this seems like a “solution” that clearly is not considering the realities of this situation. Building an entirely new system is not free - it takes resources, leads to potential new points of failure, and requires maintenance to ensure the system functions. More toggles, more money spent, more points of failure. You can pretend that is a non-issue by falsely implying Wizards has billions at their disposal (they don’t; Hasbro is actually a cash poor company, and Beyond is only a small part, with no where close to billions at its disposal) - but pretending doesn’t make the issue go away.
And, what does would this investment get you? Diminishing returns as time progresses. As more and more people adopt the new version, any efforts expended to maintain the old become increasingly outdated, supporting an increasingly small segment of the community. Creating entirely new systems for those who choose to use the old system is a bad investment - especially when those players have a really easy work around to support their style of play.
Ultimately, yes. This will be annoying for some people - but that’s almost certainly going to be an ever-decreasing minority of players. The common sense answer is for Wizards to put their resources where if actually matters, building forward-thinking systems designed to support the long-term health of the game, while also minimizing the impact on existing players. However, when there is a conflict between the forward-looking and the backward-looking - as exists between “make it easy to choose spells without being overloaded” and “access to legacy spells” - you go with the simple forward looking solution rather than waste your money, time, and resources building backwards-facing infrastructure.
Great! If we need to homebrew in order to continue playing 5e then I guess that's easier to do elsewhere without the need to purchase content or a DDB subscription! 🙃
I specifically purchased the books to use on beyond, including the spells. Now, you want me to use the terrible homebrew tools to remake what is already there but you want to delete for some arbitrary reason? What a joke this website is.
Second, spells are some of the longest lists out there - and can already be overwhelming to some players. Increasing the length of a list with only a couple dozen entries is not a big deal. Increasing the length of an extremely long list is - it makes something overwhelming even more so
Finally, spells, more than anything else, were really adjusted for power, with the new versions fixing some pretty big problems. Wizards does not want folks to accidentally choose the criminally underpowered 2014 healing spells, simply because they don’t know the systems that well and just select one of the two similarly names options. Nor do they want folks intentionally choosing the ridiculous 2014 version of spiritual weapon, which always should have had concentration.
With those two points, the legacy tab option is a perfect fix for that issue. Have legacy off by default so that a newbie doesn't see the current spells.
And then for those that want the current spells, let's assume we're smart enough to check the source of duplicate-named spells.
Problem solved.
For the tooltips that currently link things like hex or my custom title for the spell hex I'll grant things could get a bit tricky. I believe there's still monsters that'll link to Volo's/Tome of Foes instead of Multiverse versions and I'm not sure there's any tags within to specify which version. But that's a separate issue from the functionality of the character sheet.
Problem, of course, not solved if you apply common sense. The legacy tab is an all or none option - it does not have a toggle. “Fixing” the spell issues by saying “you can’t use any other legacy options either” is not a great solution either.
You are clearly dodging the point...
They could set a toggle for the entire thing or individual choices (Spells, Items, conditions, etc...). It would be way user-friendly and would not rob the user of stuff they already paid off. Do you understand that? Wizards it throwing users PHB in the trash and saying "you can write down what you wish to use on a small piece of paper, one by one".
"It would be difficult to implement :(((((", that's why they have billions of dollars, I'm certain it is possible. They don't do it because they don't want to. The character sheets already have a toggle for stuff you don't even imagine, like separate coins in containers. Implement a filter is something they could do, but they won't, because people like you are willing to do their bidding.
(And I'm not even touching the fact that you want to use "some" of the Legacy content, you fall for the illusion that they are compatible).
Once again, this seems like a “solution” that clearly is not considering the realities of this situation. Building an entirely new system is not free - it takes resources, leads to potential new points of failure, and requires maintenance to ensure the system functions. More toggles, more money spent, more points of failure. You can pretend that is a non-issue by falsely implying Wizards has billions at their disposal (they don’t; Hasbro is actually a cash poor company, and Beyond is only a small part, with no where close to billions at its disposal) - but pretending doesn’t make the issue go away.
And, what does would this investment get you? Diminishing returns as time progresses. As more and more people adopt the new version, any efforts expended to maintain the old become increasingly outdated, supporting an increasingly small segment of the community. Creating entirely new systems for those who choose to use the old system is a bad investment - especially when those players have a really easy work around to support their style of play.
Ultimately, yes. This will be annoying for some people - but that’s almost certainly going to be an ever-decreasing minority of players. The common sense answer is for Wizards to put their resources where if actually matters, building forward-thinking systems designed to support the long-term health of the game, while also minimizing the impact on existing players. However, when there is a conflict between the forward-looking and the backward-looking - as exists between “make it easy to choose spells without being overloaded” and “access to legacy spells” - you go with the simple forward looking solution rather than waste your money, time, and resources building backwards-facing infrastructure.
The argument you're making is putting the cart before the horse here.
If this was 10 years down the line, 99.9% of users were using 5.5 rules, and a new software change was going to break the systems in place so they said, "Hey, we gotta retire this." That's one thing.
But right now 100% of users are using 5.0 not 5.5 and I'd guess the percent that purchases 5.5 books right after release won't break even 25%. Further of those that do purchase the new books, it's reasonable to assume many will want to use current rules too for campaigns that are swapping over to 5.5 any time soon.
It's pretty hard to make the "Why should we support a minority of players?" case way before it's even true.
What the hell is this? So I PAID for stuff specifically because of how easy it is to use it on the website, and now I will not be able to use it because you want to force everyone to switch to 5.5? All of this could be avoided if you just make legacy versions of the spells we already gave you the money for. If that goes through I am definitely not sourcing my future books through DnDBeyond...
I wonder how would it be for people that isn't buying the 2024 PHB in regards of the updated spells. I seems strange that they would lose access to these spells at all and it also seems strange that D&D Beyond simply gives the updated spells free.
So it mafe me wonder: has anyone checked if all the spells that have been updated are, by any means, spells in the Basic rules / SRD? Because if that's the case, then they don't need to give spells for free to anyone, nor would anyone lose access to the updated spells.
I'm not saying that's a solution, but would be better than the worse scenario pictured.
Hi, I don't want this to sound like another rant post, but I would appreciate some clarity that isn't provided in the linked blog post.
...so that you can jump into play as soon as the new core rulebooks become available...
Does this mean that the rules are implemented for everyone, even those people who are part way through a campaign? I don't particularly want to explain all this to my players, when we started with 5th edition and it sounds like the site is being updated to 6th edition wholesale. Is it the case that the characters will stay under 5th edition but receive that legacy badge? I.e. the Character sheets visually won't change?
The below section seems to back up my main concern from above:
This change impacts the information you’ll find on your character sheet, in tooltips, and that is linked in the compendium.
This seems to imply that players who are partway through a campaign are about to see all the 6th edition rules instead of the 5th edition rules? Will it be possible to belay this change for ongoing games, so that the ruleset doesn't change partway through?
To give a real-world example, I usually have the books nearby as a quick reference, but some of my players reference the app. I don't have the new books yet so it feels like this might cause a break in gameplay while clarifications are sought, which is more hassle than it's worth.
(To clarify, I'm not against 6th edition, I would just like to start a fresh campaign with a new ruleset, not have to migrate away from D&D Beyond just to keep character sheets consistent for an ongoing game).
If you wish to use the old version of a magic item or spell that has been replaced by its 2024 counterpart, you will need to create a homebrew copy of it and enable homebrew content on your character sheet. Then, you can add it to your character sheet.
As others have already said, this seems a bit like you're undermining the convenience of D&D Beyond for DMs and Players. I realise you might think it's small, but preparation is already a bit of a time-consuming task, and putting additional overhead on users in this manner seems like a bad idea, especially when the spells are still in the source books, it just sounds like you're not bothering with the LEGACY tag for these things?
I like the update to the stat blocks. They look good.
Again, I don't mind the introduction of 6th Edition, but given the above assumptions (and please tell me if I'm wrong!) it seems like I might be best exporting all the character sheets and reverting to pen and paper for this current campaign, then renewing my subscription if/when the dust has settled for a new campaign and starting afresh when we're ready to start using the 6th Edition rules.
Second, spells are some of the longest lists out there - and can already be overwhelming to some players. Increasing the length of a list with only a couple dozen entries is not a big deal. Increasing the length of an extremely long list is - it makes something overwhelming even more so
Finally, spells, more than anything else, were really adjusted for power, with the new versions fixing some pretty big problems. Wizards does not want folks to accidentally choose the criminally underpowered 2014 healing spells, simply because they don’t know the systems that well and just select one of the two similarly names options. Nor do they want folks intentionally choosing the ridiculous 2014 version of spiritual weapon, which always should have had concentration.
With those two points, the legacy tab option is a perfect fix for that issue. Have legacy off by default so that a newbie doesn't see the current spells.
And then for those that want the current spells, let's assume we're smart enough to check the source of duplicate-named spells.
Problem solved.
For the tooltips that currently link things like hex or my custom title for the spell hex I'll grant things could get a bit tricky. I believe there's still monsters that'll link to Volo's/Tome of Foes instead of Multiverse versions and I'm not sure there's any tags within to specify which version. But that's a separate issue from the functionality of the character sheet.
Problem, of course, not solved if you apply common sense. The legacy tab is an all or none option - it does not have a toggle. “Fixing” the spell issues by saying “you can’t use any other legacy options either” is not a great solution either.
You are clearly dodging the point...
They could set a toggle for the entire thing or individual choices (Spells, Items, conditions, etc...). It would be way user-friendly and would not rob the user of stuff they already paid off. Do you understand that? Wizards it throwing users PHB in the trash and saying "you can write down what you wish to use on a small piece of paper, one by one".
"It would be difficult to implement :(((((", that's why they have billions of dollars, I'm certain it is possible. They don't do it because they don't want to. The character sheets already have a toggle for stuff you don't even imagine, like separate coins in containers. Implement a filter is something they could do, but they won't, because people like you are willing to do their bidding.
(And I'm not even touching the fact that you want to use "some" of the Legacy content, you fall for the illusion that they are compatible).
Once again, this seems like a “solution” that clearly is not considering the realities of this situation. Building an entirely new system is not free - it takes resources, leads to potential new points of failure, and requires maintenance to ensure the system functions. More toggles, more money spent, more points of failure. You can pretend that is a non-issue by falsely implying Wizards has billions at their disposal (they don’t; Hasbro is actually a cash poor company, and Beyond is only a small part, with no where close to billions at its disposal) - but pretending doesn’t make the issue go away.
And, what does would this investment get you? Diminishing returns as time progresses. As more and more people adopt the new version, any efforts expended to maintain the old become increasingly outdated, supporting an increasingly small segment of the community. Creating entirely new systems for those who choose to use the old system is a bad investment - especially when those players have a really easy work around to support their style of play.
Ultimately, yes. This will be annoying for some people - but that’s almost certainly going to be an ever-decreasing minority of players. The common sense answer is for Wizards to put their resources where if actually matters, building forward-thinking systems designed to support the long-term health of the game, while also minimizing the impact on existing players. However, when there is a conflict between the forward-looking and the backward-looking - as exists between “make it easy to choose spells without being overloaded” and “access to legacy spells” - you go with the simple forward looking solution rather than waste your money, time, and resources building backwards-facing infrastructure.
What resources are required? They already have a filtering system available in their backend since you can filter by sourcebook on the main spell search page. They already have source toggles available in the character sheet to allow/disallow content from certain sources. And most importantly they already have the 2014 spells and items available and ready to go.
Everything points to a relatively small amount of work for the devs to add a new toggle that for 2014/2024 spells/items. Instead they are removing existing content and telling their users to re-create that same content, a task that would take users an extremely long amount of time.
The only reason for this is to stop supporting 2014 and incentivize the move to 2024 which is a shitty move
Super disappointing. I understand the eagerness to push everyone into the new version, but removing so much content is going to make this platform useless to anyone still playing with the 2014 rules.
Thanks Team - really appreciate the thorough update. Prepping Beyond for the change must be a mammoth task.
I’m fine with the way you’re handling spells. I had been worrying about how new spells would work for monsters. Would 2014 monsters cast 2014 spells while 2024 monsters cast 2024 spells? What about non-MM monsters? The decision to replace the spells simplifies all of this.
No one is going to lose their online copies of the spells - they’ll just need to find them in the PHB 2014, instead of using tooltips. It’s annoying, but the alternatives would have been messy and complicated.
One detail I have wondered about that I want to flag - if warlock patron spells are going to become always prepared, I think that as things currently work the genie warlocks would get all 26 genie spells added to their lists instead of the 11 they should have.
This is the one and only reminder for this thread that all users are expected to interact with each other with respect and civility.
Anyone who fails to do so after this point will have their messages removed and may face warnings per site rules.
You are allowed to be unhappy/happy with the changes. You're allowed express your feelings about them. You are not allowed to be a garbage person about it, either to each other or to D&D Beyond staff.
Seconding what many other people have asked for - if spells, rules, and items are forcefully updating and we are expected to manually recreate what we want to keep of the old ones, please can we have a very clear guide of point-by-point which spell/rule/item is changing and how?
Saying "you can homebrew if you don't like the new ones" is useless if we haven't bought the new book and don't know what the new ones are that we'll need to homebrew, it just leads us to homebrewing the entire database.
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With those two points, the legacy tab option is a perfect fix for that issue. Have legacy off by default so that a newbie doesn't see the current spells.
And then for those that want the current spells, let's assume we're smart enough to check the source of duplicate-named spells.
Problem solved.
For the tooltips that currently link things like hex or my custom title for the spell hex I'll grant things could get a bit tricky. I believe there's still monsters that'll link to Volo's/Tome of Foes instead of Multiverse versions and I'm not sure there's any tags within to specify which version. But that's a separate issue from the functionality of the character sheet.
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Bombil, Hunt for Yeenoghu | Cherry Littleoak, Stormwreck | Phait, Lost Mine of Phandelver
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Get rickrolled here. Awesome music here. Track 36, 10/3/24, How Can I Keep From Singing?
It may not be a big deal to some, but it obviously is to others. Dismissing others concerns doesn't make them go away. This is just another straw on the camel's back for many, It's not errata, and it's not a new edition, but you can't use what you already own without HBing it. what a trainwreck of implementation and a slap in the face for those that just want to use what they paid for.
CENSORSHIP IS THE TOOL OF COWARDS and WANNA BE TYRANTS.
Problem, of course, not solved if you apply common sense. The legacy tab is an all or none option - it does not have a toggle. “Fixing” the spell issues by saying “you can’t use any other legacy options either” is not a great solution either.
[REDACTED]
They could set a toggle for the entire thing or individual choices (Spells, Items, conditions, etc...). It would be way user-friendly and would not rob the user of stuff they already paid off.
Do you understand that? Wizards it throwing users PHB in the trash and saying "you can write down what you wish to use on a small piece of paper, one by one".
"It would be difficult to implement :(((((", that's why they have billions of dollars, I'm certain it is possible. They don't do it because they don't want to. The character sheets already have a toggle for stuff you don't even imagine, like separate coins in containers. Implement a filter is something they could do, but they won't, because people like you are willing to do their bidding.
(And I'm not even touching the fact that you want to use "some" of the Legacy content, you fall for the illusion that they are compatible).
Once again, this seems like a “solution” that clearly is not considering the realities of this situation. Building an entirely new system is not free - it takes resources, leads to potential new points of failure, and requires maintenance to ensure the system functions. More toggles, more money spent, more points of failure. You can pretend that is a non-issue by falsely implying Wizards has billions at their disposal (they don’t; Hasbro is actually a cash poor company, and Beyond is only a small part, with no where close to billions at its disposal) - but pretending doesn’t make the issue go away.
And, what does would this investment get you? Diminishing returns as time progresses. As more and more people adopt the new version, any efforts expended to maintain the old become increasingly outdated, supporting an increasingly small segment of the community. Creating entirely new systems for those who choose to use the old system is a bad investment - especially when those players have a really easy work around to support their style of play.
Ultimately, yes. This will be annoying for some people - but that’s almost certainly going to be an ever-decreasing minority of players. The common sense answer is for Wizards to put their resources where if actually matters, building forward-thinking systems designed to support the long-term health of the game, while also minimizing the impact on existing players. However, when there is a conflict between the forward-looking and the backward-looking - as exists between “make it easy to choose spells without being overloaded” and “access to legacy spells” - you go with the simple forward looking solution rather than waste your money, time, and resources building backwards-facing infrastructure.
Great! If we need to homebrew in order to continue playing 5e then I guess that's easier to do elsewhere without the need to purchase content or a DDB subscription! 🙃
I specifically purchased the books to use on beyond, including the spells. Now, you want me to use the terrible homebrew tools to remake what is already there but you want to delete for some arbitrary reason? What a joke this website is.
Great changes, love to see it soon.
The argument you're making is putting the cart before the horse here.
If this was 10 years down the line, 99.9% of users were using 5.5 rules, and a new software change was going to break the systems in place so they said, "Hey, we gotta retire this." That's one thing.
But right now 100% of users are using 5.0 not 5.5 and I'd guess the percent that purchases 5.5 books right after release won't break even 25%. Further of those that do purchase the new books, it's reasonable to assume many will want to use current rules too for campaigns that are swapping over to 5.5 any time soon.
It's pretty hard to make the "Why should we support a minority of players?" case way before it's even true.
This is a signature. It was a simple signature. But it has been upgraded.
Belolonandalogalo, Sunny | Draíocht, Kholias | Eggo Lass, 100 Dungeons
Tendilius Mondhaven Paxaramus, Drakkenheim | Talorin Tebedi, Vecna: Eve
Bombil, Hunt for Yeenoghu | Cherry Littleoak, Stormwreck | Phait, Lost Mine of Phandelver
Beneath the Mountain | Let's Test Monsters!
Get rickrolled here. Awesome music here. Track 36, 10/3/24, How Can I Keep From Singing?
What the hell is this? So I PAID for stuff specifically because of how easy it is to use it on the website, and now I will not be able to use it because you want to force everyone to switch to 5.5? All of this could be avoided if you just make legacy versions of the spells we already gave you the money for. If that goes through I am definitely not sourcing my future books through DnDBeyond...
I wonder how would it be for people that isn't buying the 2024 PHB in regards of the updated spells. I seems strange that they would lose access to these spells at all and it also seems strange that D&D Beyond simply gives the updated spells free.
So it mafe me wonder: has anyone checked if all the spells that have been updated are, by any means, spells in the Basic rules / SRD? Because if that's the case, then they don't need to give spells for free to anyone, nor would anyone lose access to the updated spells.
I'm not saying that's a solution, but would be better than the worse scenario pictured.
Hi, I don't want this to sound like another rant post, but I would appreciate some clarity that isn't provided in the linked blog post.
Does this mean that the rules are implemented for everyone, even those people who are part way through a campaign? I don't particularly want to explain all this to my players, when we started with 5th edition and it sounds like the site is being updated to 6th edition wholesale. Is it the case that the characters will stay under 5th edition but receive that legacy badge? I.e. the Character sheets visually won't change?
The below section seems to back up my main concern from above:
This seems to imply that players who are partway through a campaign are about to see all the 6th edition rules instead of the 5th edition rules? Will it be possible to belay this change for ongoing games, so that the ruleset doesn't change partway through?
To give a real-world example, I usually have the books nearby as a quick reference, but some of my players reference the app. I don't have the new books yet so it feels like this might cause a break in gameplay while clarifications are sought, which is more hassle than it's worth.
(To clarify, I'm not against 6th edition, I would just like to start a fresh campaign with a new ruleset, not have to migrate away from D&D Beyond just to keep character sheets consistent for an ongoing game).
As others have already said, this seems a bit like you're undermining the convenience of D&D Beyond for DMs and Players. I realise you might think it's small, but preparation is already a bit of a time-consuming task, and putting additional overhead on users in this manner seems like a bad idea, especially when the spells are still in the source books, it just sounds like you're not bothering with the LEGACY tag for these things?
I like the update to the stat blocks. They look good.
Again, I don't mind the introduction of 6th Edition, but given the above assumptions (and please tell me if I'm wrong!) it seems like I might be best exporting all the character sheets and reverting to pen and paper for this current campaign, then renewing my subscription if/when the dust has settled for a new campaign and starting afresh when we're ready to start using the 6th Edition rules.
What resources are required? They already have a filtering system available in their backend since you can filter by sourcebook on the main spell search page. They already have source toggles available in the character sheet to allow/disallow content from certain sources. And most importantly they already have the 2014 spells and items available and ready to go.
Everything points to a relatively small amount of work for the devs to add a new toggle that for 2014/2024 spells/items. Instead they are removing existing content and telling their users to re-create that same content, a task that would take users an extremely long amount of time.
The only reason for this is to stop supporting 2014 and incentivize the move to 2024 which is a shitty move
Super disappointing. I understand the eagerness to push everyone into the new version, but removing so much content is going to make this platform useless to anyone still playing with the 2014 rules.
Thanks for the details, that really does help me understand where you are going with this
For those of us playing on Discord can we expect these changes to roll across with the Avrae bot?
Thanks Team - really appreciate the thorough update. Prepping Beyond for the change must be a mammoth task.
I’m fine with the way you’re handling spells. I had been worrying about how new spells would work for monsters. Would 2014 monsters cast 2014 spells while 2024 monsters cast 2024 spells? What about non-MM monsters? The decision to replace the spells simplifies all of this.
No one is going to lose their online copies of the spells - they’ll just need to find them in the PHB 2014, instead of using tooltips. It’s annoying, but the alternatives would have been messy and complicated.
One detail I have wondered about that I want to flag - if warlock patron spells are going to become always prepared, I think that as things currently work the genie warlocks would get all 26 genie spells added to their lists instead of the 11 they should have.
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Could we please have a full list of the spells that are definitely being changed in the 2024 update before the forced change goes live?
That would at least give us a chance to create homebrew copies of the spells we want to keep instead of making them from scratch.
Just to be absolutely clear: if one does not purchase the 2024 books, do we
1. Lose access to all spells in our current and future character sheets (unless each of us individually remake them in the homebrew creator)?
2. Loss access only to those spells that are changing between the 2104 and 2024 editions?
3. Get all the new versions of the spells for free?
Seconding what many other people have asked for - if spells, rules, and items are forcefully updating and we are expected to manually recreate what we want to keep of the old ones, please can we have a very clear guide of point-by-point which spell/rule/item is changing and how?
Saying "you can homebrew if you don't like the new ones" is useless if we haven't bought the new book and don't know what the new ones are that we'll need to homebrew, it just leads us to homebrewing the entire database.