So I DM a campaign that takes place in one big megacity. I have a player who is Cleric/Sorc who's story I'm not sure where to lead. He is an Aasimar born from a storm god and a human. while he was young, his father (The god) trained him as a cleric in hopes that eventually the PC would ascend and join him. HOWEVER, after training him for a bit, the PC learned that the Father viewed mortals as lesser lifeforms that only existed to worship and even PC's mother was more of a pet to him (think INVINCIBLE, Guardians of galaxy 2, the beginning of the new Thor movie...). He also discovered that his father was on a mission to basically conquer the other gods. so he fled his father and focused on honing his own innate magic rather than the power given by his father. His goal is to completely rid himself of his father's influence as well as do whatever he can to throw a wrench in his plan.
I have NO clue how to work with this lol. Last session I threw him a bone by introducing an NPC who studies Theology at an important university, the NPC referred PC to his professor.
and that's all I've got! This is a LONG term campaign that JUST started so I'm looking for some small breadcrumbs to give him for now, but eventually imma have to expand on this more. Anyone here got some excess creative juices they're willing to donate xD?
Is the player looking to reject the father mechanically, or just in story terms? Mechanically, he could perhaps switch to a different god (you let him keep his cleric levels but change domains). Or just reject the gods outright. (You let him swap his cleric levels for levels in a different class) The theology professor might have some suggestions for how this would have to happen, explaining that such things are rare, but if the PC works hard enough, he might be able to find a different god and find a way into that new god's service, but he'll need to prove himself somehow. How will depend on the new god, of course. Or he can completely throw off the shackles of gods altogether, but that's even harder: the easiest solution is to make a deal with some other powerful creature (swap cleric levels for warlock) though it can also be possible to swear a solemn oath (swap for pally) or train himself to draw upon his own inner strength (monk), etc. Id' say you can throw those sorts of options out there, and see which one the player picks up on, so you only need to actually develop the one he ends up doing.
Considering clerics get their powers from a god, one of those might have to happen, if the godfather (yeah, I said it) gets vindictive he could simply strip away the cleric powers and spells. Though he might also be a more forgiving type who is willing to let his son throw a temper tantrum but will welcome him back once the boy gets this foolishness out of his system, that option might buy you some time to figure out how to play it.
Story-wise, is the godfather the BBEG of the campaign? If so, well, then, you're on your way. If not, I might not get too, too deep into throwing a wrench into the plans. Trying to take down a god seems like it would be a pretty intense personal side quest and it could really push the rest of the characters to the margins. You could say the god's plans to do this are set to play out over millennia. (That could be a reason he might not care too much about the son's betrayal. He's got time to make plenty more kids, one of them will eventually do what he wants.) So maybe this character, with the help of the party, can steal an artifact, or something else that will basically give his dad the finger. Then he can fulfill the objective of throwing a wrench in the plans, but not have that thread completely take over the campaign.
Woah that is some big-time backstory for your cleric/sorc to be rocking. Very cool but I see how its tricky. I think it helps to boil it down to a few basic elements to think about: motivation (to deny his father, therefore gods in general, or maybe just to emphasize that his humanity is precious? Some different angles to explore), tropes/themes (found family, choosing simplicity over greatness etc), confrontations/conflict (put him in situations where using his godly powers will be more in-the-moment beneficial but may carry some cost, or just reflect poorly on his principles).
If it were me, I’d sit down with the player and discuss what they see being the most interesting way to explore this and perhaps even home brewing some rules for them. Maybe the more he uses the cleric magic the more “charmed” or swayed he is by the godly side of himself, and he can power up in some unique ways while losing empathy (maybe reflected in an insight score change?) Whereas if he refuses to use his cleric spells perhaps he slowly transitions to be more mortal and therefore those cleric levels become sorcerer levels. Lots of directions you can go, honestly really exciting! I think #1 is talk it out with the player, they will know what will be mechanically more interesting and if there are any conflicts they’d eventually like to explore.
Final piece of advice: look for examples of this in media. Zuko from Avatar is relatable here in some ways, lots of Demi-gods in mythology had similar issues, even characters like Todoroki from My Hero Academia have this character arc about grappling with an inherited dual-nature.
Ultimately, for me, I think a great way to play this arc out is allowing the player to grapple with cost-benefit analysis, showing over time that their godly nature can actually be a tool for good if they choose to use it that way, and ultimately they can use the powers their father gives them to unseat/overthrow/upset him— its their power and they shouldn’t let their parentage define who they are.
Your call! I’d love to see some updates on this thread for what you decide to do!
Sorry, didn’t see your request for small breadcrumbs for now— I’d say a great NPC to toss him would be somebody in a relatable situation, maybe an ex-priest of a god who lost faith in his patron after meeting them. Somebody really jaded but helpful to the party who can kinda press on the player to make them open up about the situation. For long campaigns though, you don’t necessarily need to touch on this stuff too much until a future arc can center on it more fully. Go your own pace with this stuff
I agree with Xalthu's points. Transitioning to a lawful monk would be an interesting way to counter the ideals of his divine father, who embodies storms (and thus chaos). From there, perhaps exploring the different tendrils of alignment. As noted above, Lawful warlock patrons or a paladin oath could be interesting.
I also agree that taking down a god is probably best reserved for a central campaign theme, as opposed to a single character arc. But what if you make it more personal and less cataclysmic? Maybe this theology professor offers words of wisdom that speak to the beauty of mortality. Instead of killing his father, perhaps the PC now ventures to become a full mortal, in a less direct way to denounce his father. His father sees mortals as lessers? Behold, for his son is now a full mortal - the other gods will mock him.
There can be lots of ways to go about exercising the divinity from one's blood such as tasks that take the PC across the planes. Could be fun for the whole group to get in on.
To explain a little: mechanical changes will probably happen as the PC gets closer to his goal, but this is mainly a story based thing. At my table, we're really big on reflavoring things to fit the character concept better so the "cleric" levels in him aren't really CLERIC-y. They're more reflective of training and tutelage received from the Godfather (how did I not see the pun earlier???) so it wouldn't be something he could take away exactly. In character he's already very reluctant to use anything from the cleric side (He's a good RPer and will pick the RP route over optimal route any day).
While all these points are helping me long-term, I think I needed to be a bit more specific on what I need right now...
What should this professor tell him? Does he know about a lead to ritual to remove the divine influence? does he know strange rumors about followers of the godfather? or what? Picture yourselves DMing this session lol. What would you lead him to?
If this is early in the campaign, you don't want to make it too easy, would be my assumption.
Maybe the professor examines Sonny (couldn't resist) and finds something in a strange place, like looking up his nose, or in his ear, or it can only be seen looking through some divine magical apparatus, and says he's definitely been marked by the godfather. All the gods do this sort of thing sometimes to people they consider to be important to them, so while very unusual, it's not unheard of. About the only way to remove such a mark, is to get the heads of the rest of the five families (I can't stop myself), aka, other gods, to work together to remove the mark. This is very hard to do, because gods have their own politics, most of them oppose each other so they don't want to work together, and most important, they don't want to set a precedent and have the other gods be willing to remove their marks.
If you want it easier, professor actually has the ritual written down and is willing to share it, and now the player just needs to convince high priests of a few other gods (how many depends on how long you want to draw it out) to help him. If you want it harder, the professor needs a favor to part with the ritual. Harder still, the professor has heard of the ritual, but doesn't have it, but knows where to find it. Then each of the various high priests will have his or her own reasons for helping and will need favors in order to be willing to help. the only reason they're willing at all is because all the other gods know godfather is working to destroy them, so they're willing to stick a thumb in his eye. Some high priests are more willing than others, likely based on their god's relations with godfather.
Another thought I had is the player probably has a few siblings out there (Baulder's Gate style) and at least one of them is a believer who is working to help the godfather. Gives you a recurring enemy NPC.
Also, personally, I really like the easy way out of a warlock pact, because the dark side is always easier. Something in opposition to the character's general behavior. Like if he's good, it has to be the fiend kind of thing. Player can just do that with about one long rest worth of making the pact. But then, maybe his patron, unbeknownst to the PC, is actually supporting the godfather.
I'm loving the idea of him trying to get the OTHER gods on his side to remove the influence. This character has become very turned off of gods after his upbringing, and it would cause some good ol'fashioned internal turmoil to get him to work with MORE gods. its juicy drama and i love it lol
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IF YOU PLAY WITH ME, DONT READ!!
So I DM a campaign that takes place in one big megacity. I have a player who is Cleric/Sorc who's story I'm not sure where to lead. He is an Aasimar born from a storm god and a human. while he was young, his father (The god) trained him as a cleric in hopes that eventually the PC would ascend and join him. HOWEVER, after training him for a bit, the PC learned that the Father viewed mortals as lesser lifeforms that only existed to worship and even PC's mother was more of a pet to him (think INVINCIBLE, Guardians of galaxy 2, the beginning of the new Thor movie...). He also discovered that his father was on a mission to basically conquer the other gods. so he fled his father and focused on honing his own innate magic rather than the power given by his father. His goal is to completely rid himself of his father's influence as well as do whatever he can to throw a wrench in his plan.
I have NO clue how to work with this lol. Last session I threw him a bone by introducing an NPC who studies Theology at an important university, the NPC referred PC to his professor.
and that's all I've got! This is a LONG term campaign that JUST started so I'm looking for some small breadcrumbs to give him for now, but eventually imma have to expand on this more. Anyone here got some excess creative juices they're willing to donate xD?
Is the player looking to reject the father mechanically, or just in story terms? Mechanically, he could perhaps switch to a different god (you let him keep his cleric levels but change domains). Or just reject the gods outright. (You let him swap his cleric levels for levels in a different class) The theology professor might have some suggestions for how this would have to happen, explaining that such things are rare, but if the PC works hard enough, he might be able to find a different god and find a way into that new god's service, but he'll need to prove himself somehow. How will depend on the new god, of course. Or he can completely throw off the shackles of gods altogether, but that's even harder: the easiest solution is to make a deal with some other powerful creature (swap cleric levels for warlock) though it can also be possible to swear a solemn oath (swap for pally) or train himself to draw upon his own inner strength (monk), etc. Id' say you can throw those sorts of options out there, and see which one the player picks up on, so you only need to actually develop the one he ends up doing.
Considering clerics get their powers from a god, one of those might have to happen, if the godfather (yeah, I said it) gets vindictive he could simply strip away the cleric powers and spells. Though he might also be a more forgiving type who is willing to let his son throw a temper tantrum but will welcome him back once the boy gets this foolishness out of his system, that option might buy you some time to figure out how to play it.
Story-wise, is the godfather the BBEG of the campaign? If so, well, then, you're on your way. If not, I might not get too, too deep into throwing a wrench into the plans. Trying to take down a god seems like it would be a pretty intense personal side quest and it could really push the rest of the characters to the margins. You could say the god's plans to do this are set to play out over millennia. (That could be a reason he might not care too much about the son's betrayal. He's got time to make plenty more kids, one of them will eventually do what he wants.) So maybe this character, with the help of the party, can steal an artifact, or something else that will basically give his dad the finger. Then he can fulfill the objective of throwing a wrench in the plans, but not have that thread completely take over the campaign.
Woah that is some big-time backstory for your cleric/sorc to be rocking. Very cool but I see how its tricky. I think it helps to boil it down to a few basic elements to think about: motivation (to deny his father, therefore gods in general, or maybe just to emphasize that his humanity is precious? Some different angles to explore), tropes/themes (found family, choosing simplicity over greatness etc), confrontations/conflict (put him in situations where using his godly powers will be more in-the-moment beneficial but may carry some cost, or just reflect poorly on his principles).
If it were me, I’d sit down with the player and discuss what they see being the most interesting way to explore this and perhaps even home brewing some rules for them. Maybe the more he uses the cleric magic the more “charmed” or swayed he is by the godly side of himself, and he can power up in some unique ways while losing empathy (maybe reflected in an insight score change?) Whereas if he refuses to use his cleric spells perhaps he slowly transitions to be more mortal and therefore those cleric levels become sorcerer levels. Lots of directions you can go, honestly really exciting! I think #1 is talk it out with the player, they will know what will be mechanically more interesting and if there are any conflicts they’d eventually like to explore.
Final piece of advice: look for examples of this in media. Zuko from Avatar is relatable here in some ways, lots of Demi-gods in mythology had similar issues, even characters like Todoroki from My Hero Academia have this character arc about grappling with an inherited dual-nature.
Ultimately, for me, I think a great way to play this arc out is allowing the player to grapple with cost-benefit analysis, showing over time that their godly nature can actually be a tool for good if they choose to use it that way, and ultimately they can use the powers their father gives them to unseat/overthrow/upset him— its their power and they shouldn’t let their parentage define who they are.
Your call! I’d love to see some updates on this thread for what you decide to do!
Sorry, didn’t see your request for small breadcrumbs for now— I’d say a great NPC to toss him would be somebody in a relatable situation, maybe an ex-priest of a god who lost faith in his patron after meeting them. Somebody really jaded but helpful to the party who can kinda press on the player to make them open up about the situation. For long campaigns though, you don’t necessarily need to touch on this stuff too much until a future arc can center on it more fully. Go your own pace with this stuff
I agree with Xalthu's points. Transitioning to a lawful monk would be an interesting way to counter the ideals of his divine father, who embodies storms (and thus chaos). From there, perhaps exploring the different tendrils of alignment. As noted above, Lawful warlock patrons or a paladin oath could be interesting.
I also agree that taking down a god is probably best reserved for a central campaign theme, as opposed to a single character arc. But what if you make it more personal and less cataclysmic? Maybe this theology professor offers words of wisdom that speak to the beauty of mortality. Instead of killing his father, perhaps the PC now ventures to become a full mortal, in a less direct way to denounce his father. His father sees mortals as lessers? Behold, for his son is now a full mortal - the other gods will mock him.
There can be lots of ways to go about exercising the divinity from one's blood such as tasks that take the PC across the planes. Could be fun for the whole group to get in on.
Thanks all!
To explain a little: mechanical changes will probably happen as the PC gets closer to his goal, but this is mainly a story based thing. At my table, we're really big on reflavoring things to fit the character concept better so the "cleric" levels in him aren't really CLERIC-y. They're more reflective of training and tutelage received from the Godfather (how did I not see the pun earlier???) so it wouldn't be something he could take away exactly. In character he's already very reluctant to use anything from the cleric side (He's a good RPer and will pick the RP route over optimal route any day).
While all these points are helping me long-term, I think I needed to be a bit more specific on what I need right now...
What should this professor tell him? Does he know about a lead to ritual to remove the divine influence? does he know strange rumors about followers of the godfather? or what?
Picture yourselves DMing this session lol. What would you lead him to?
If this is early in the campaign, you don't want to make it too easy, would be my assumption.
Maybe the professor examines Sonny (couldn't resist) and finds something in a strange place, like looking up his nose, or in his ear, or it can only be seen looking through some divine magical apparatus, and says he's definitely been marked by the godfather. All the gods do this sort of thing sometimes to people they consider to be important to them, so while very unusual, it's not unheard of. About the only way to remove such a mark, is to get the heads of the rest of the five families (I can't stop myself), aka, other gods, to work together to remove the mark. This is very hard to do, because gods have their own politics, most of them oppose each other so they don't want to work together, and most important, they don't want to set a precedent and have the other gods be willing to remove their marks.
If you want it easier, professor actually has the ritual written down and is willing to share it, and now the player just needs to convince high priests of a few other gods (how many depends on how long you want to draw it out) to help him. If you want it harder, the professor needs a favor to part with the ritual. Harder still, the professor has heard of the ritual, but doesn't have it, but knows where to find it. Then each of the various high priests will have his or her own reasons for helping and will need favors in order to be willing to help. the only reason they're willing at all is because all the other gods know godfather is working to destroy them, so they're willing to stick a thumb in his eye. Some high priests are more willing than others, likely based on their god's relations with godfather.
Another thought I had is the player probably has a few siblings out there (Baulder's Gate style) and at least one of them is a believer who is working to help the godfather. Gives you a recurring enemy NPC.
Also, personally, I really like the easy way out of a warlock pact, because the dark side is always easier. Something in opposition to the character's general behavior. Like if he's good, it has to be the fiend kind of thing. Player can just do that with about one long rest worth of making the pact. But then, maybe his patron, unbeknownst to the PC, is actually supporting the godfather.
This was EXACTLY what I was looking for! Thanks!!
I'm loving the idea of him trying to get the OTHER gods on his side to remove the influence. This character has become very turned off of gods after his upbringing, and it would cause some good ol'fashioned internal turmoil to get him to work with MORE gods. its juicy drama and i love it lol