I have this idea where my PC's find a magical grove in a small, otherwise insignificant town, that possibly radiates evil but some of the towns people worship this grove and conduct rituals inside. The only people allowed inside to the sacred inner depths must be given the right by some sort of dark priest or other nefarious character (haven't really worked out all the flavor, but that's not the important part). I'm wondering if anyone can help me think of an idea or game mechanic that would stop my PC's from entering the inner circle of this grove without being aware. I'm trying to make it like some sort of ward where they can enter the grove, but just pop out the other side in no less than 5 steps or something without realizing or finding the magic of it. Obviously I want to convey that something suspicious is going on, and maybe with a good investigation or some kind of detect they can find out the magic, I just wasn't finding any spells or otherwise that described exactly what I was intending or going for. If need be, I might just chalk it up to some kind of illusion magic that just makes people think they are walking deeper where in fact they are being lead around and out the another side (again, unless you're permitted by some sort high priest), but I just didn't know if anyone had come up with a good mechanic that has this function as well as ideas of how my PC's might go about solving this puzzle. I did have an idea of them needing to find some sort of anti warding item that repels the magic that keeps them from properly entering the grove, but again, open to ideas
Well, if you know the effect you want to create, you don't need to find a specific spell or item or anything that creates it, just describe it as the DM.
Yeah, and obviously I just need to write it out/figure out what exactly it does. I just didn't know if there was a specific spell that accomplished this because I was thinking of rewarding one of my spell casters with an item that creates it. Regardless, any opinions on what they could do to "solve" the magic? I'm wondering if I want to make it a check they can make or if it can only be discerned through the use of some magical item or ancient spell.
They walk into the grove, they see a very nice, normal. boring grove.
Someone who is initiated? They walk in and see the true grove.
An important question here is whether or not discovering the true grove is optional, or an integral part of the adventure? If it's integral, then you need multiple means of discovering the true grove - one of which they can't fail, and only kicks in when other possibilities are exhausted - since them not finding it stops the adventure ( and who wants that? ).
They roll high on perception? Maybe something about this grove seems off. It's too regular, too perfect - there are patterns in the undergrowth that repeat ( like someone cut and paste pieces of the underbrush ), etc.
Maybe a successful high investigation or high Arcana roll, and they can figure out it's an illusion.
Still no luck, and the party needs to find this grove to continue the adventure? Maybe they're finally contacted by one of the townspeople who wants their help as "something just isn't right with the people of this town, and I think the grove has something to do with it!" Turns out - according to the townsperson ( at least according to stories they heard from their Grandmother ) that there is a semi-mystical plant that only grows in this one cave, down the coast a bit, and is guarded by a "fearsome beast" ( something that will give the party a little exercise, but that they can defeat without getting chewed up too much ), which when consumed grants powers of clarity of vision. Guess what? Eat the noxious weed, and you can see the true grove! Oh, and the mystical plant only grows as part of a symbiotic relationship with the "fearsome beast", so sadly, it will die out now that the beast is gone, so your players aren't trying to cultivate it, or stock up on it, or keep coming back for more of the stuff so they can see through all illusions, in perpetuity.
Oh, and giving the spellcaster the ability to create such an illusion in the future? First - is that something that's really useful for the party? OK, the whole illusion is radiating out of a consecrated stone tablet, which requires identify to figure out the command words to turn on and off, but the "fake grove field generator" is portable - although it weighs a good 40lbs ( 18Kg ).
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Good ideas there. I'll add that if it's a "big" part of the adventure, it shouldn't be resolved by a single dice roll. If it's just a "simple" obstacle, then sure, a single good-enough Perception, or Arcana, or Investigation roll should pierce it, but if your idea is that this is an important part of the adventure, make it more interesting by requiring several "pieces" before "unlocking" it. Maybe a Perception/Investigation to notice it, an Arcana/Religion/History to figure out how to solve it, once it's found, and maybe some Investigation rolls, maybe combat, or some social skills to get all the required components to "solve" the illusion.
You can also go somewhere in between, doing what is apparently called a "Skill Challenge", where players describe what they're trying to do, you have them roll an appropriate skill roll, and when they reach a certain number of successes, they "solve" the problem, but if they get a certain number of failures, they suffer some setback. I recently did something similar when the party I was DMing for tried following some signs they were perceiving. 5 successes meant they found what they were looking for, 3 failures meant they took a wrong turn and encountered some bad guys along the way. Naturally, the tracker used Survival to track them, but they can only use each skill once, so after that, the Druid tried Nature to try to figure out where such creatures could be found, someone tried Perception to see if they could more clearly hear where the sounds where coming from, etc, but after several rolls, they missed three, so they ran into some demons. Was fun, didn't take too long, the players felt engaged, and they weren't sure whether the encounter was "random" or "planned", which is, in my opinion, perfect. :D
Wow! These are wonderful ideas, thank you both. Yeah I think I want it to be somewhat important to my main story/quest they are on. Not pivotal but definitely reveal some truths to the overall world so i'm definitely going to set some checks that while they might perceive or figure out that something is weird about this grove, they can't figure out how to "see past" it and into the true grove.
Vedexent I love that use of a symbiotic relationship or just a leash of some sort on a powerful item so that they can use it here to gain access, but only works in a specific spot to avoid farming or storing of it.
Well I think I have some good info to go off of, so thank you both again for helping me spark some ideas and get more of a concrete plan of how to implement it!
Hello,
I have this idea where my PC's find a magical grove in a small, otherwise insignificant town, that possibly radiates evil but some of the towns people worship this grove and conduct rituals inside. The only people allowed inside to the sacred inner depths must be given the right by some sort of dark priest or other nefarious character (haven't really worked out all the flavor, but that's not the important part). I'm wondering if anyone can help me think of an idea or game mechanic that would stop my PC's from entering the inner circle of this grove without being aware. I'm trying to make it like some sort of ward where they can enter the grove, but just pop out the other side in no less than 5 steps or something without realizing or finding the magic of it. Obviously I want to convey that something suspicious is going on, and maybe with a good investigation or some kind of detect they can find out the magic, I just wasn't finding any spells or otherwise that described exactly what I was intending or going for. If need be, I might just chalk it up to some kind of illusion magic that just makes people think they are walking deeper where in fact they are being lead around and out the another side (again, unless you're permitted by some sort high priest), but I just didn't know if anyone had come up with a good mechanic that has this function as well as ideas of how my PC's might go about solving this puzzle. I did have an idea of them needing to find some sort of anti warding item that repels the magic that keeps them from properly entering the grove, but again, open to ideas
Thanks!
Well, if you know the effect you want to create, you don't need to find a specific spell or item or anything that creates it, just describe it as the DM.
Yeah, and obviously I just need to write it out/figure out what exactly it does. I just didn't know if there was a specific spell that accomplished this because I was thinking of rewarding one of my spell casters with an item that creates it. Regardless, any opinions on what they could do to "solve" the magic? I'm wondering if I want to make it a check they can make or if it can only be discerned through the use of some magical item or ancient spell.
I think Tonio has it right; just describe it.
They walk into the grove, they see a very nice, normal. boring grove.
Someone who is initiated? They walk in and see the true grove.
An important question here is whether or not discovering the true grove is optional, or an integral part of the adventure? If it's integral, then you need multiple means of discovering the true grove - one of which they can't fail, and only kicks in when other possibilities are exhausted - since them not finding it stops the adventure ( and who wants that? ).
They roll high on perception? Maybe something about this grove seems off. It's too regular, too perfect - there are patterns in the undergrowth that repeat ( like someone cut and paste pieces of the underbrush ), etc.
Maybe a successful high investigation or high Arcana roll, and they can figure out it's an illusion.
Still no luck, and the party needs to find this grove to continue the adventure? Maybe they're finally contacted by one of the townspeople who wants their help as "something just isn't right with the people of this town, and I think the grove has something to do with it!" Turns out - according to the townsperson ( at least according to stories they heard from their Grandmother ) that there is a semi-mystical plant that only grows in this one cave, down the coast a bit, and is guarded by a "fearsome beast" ( something that will give the party a little exercise, but that they can defeat without getting chewed up too much ), which when consumed grants powers of clarity of vision. Guess what? Eat the noxious weed, and you can see the true grove! Oh, and the mystical plant only grows as part of a symbiotic relationship with the "fearsome beast", so sadly, it will die out now that the beast is gone, so your players aren't trying to cultivate it, or stock up on it, or keep coming back for more of the stuff so they can see through all illusions, in perpetuity.
Oh, and giving the spellcaster the ability to create such an illusion in the future? First - is that something that's really useful for the party? OK, the whole illusion is radiating out of a consecrated stone tablet, which requires identify to figure out the command words to turn on and off, but the "fake grove field generator" is portable - although it weighs a good 40lbs ( 18Kg ).
My DM Philosophy, as summed up by other people: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rN5w4-azTq3Kbn0Yvk9nfqQhwQ1R5by1/view
Disclaimer: This signature is a badge of membership in the Forum Loudmouth Club. We are all friends. We are not attacking each other. We are engaging in spirited, friendly debate with one another. We may get snarky, but these are not attacks. Thank you for not reporting us.
Good ideas there. I'll add that if it's a "big" part of the adventure, it shouldn't be resolved by a single dice roll. If it's just a "simple" obstacle, then sure, a single good-enough Perception, or Arcana, or Investigation roll should pierce it, but if your idea is that this is an important part of the adventure, make it more interesting by requiring several "pieces" before "unlocking" it. Maybe a Perception/Investigation to notice it, an Arcana/Religion/History to figure out how to solve it, once it's found, and maybe some Investigation rolls, maybe combat, or some social skills to get all the required components to "solve" the illusion.
You can also go somewhere in between, doing what is apparently called a "Skill Challenge", where players describe what they're trying to do, you have them roll an appropriate skill roll, and when they reach a certain number of successes, they "solve" the problem, but if they get a certain number of failures, they suffer some setback. I recently did something similar when the party I was DMing for tried following some signs they were perceiving. 5 successes meant they found what they were looking for, 3 failures meant they took a wrong turn and encountered some bad guys along the way. Naturally, the tracker used Survival to track them, but they can only use each skill once, so after that, the Druid tried Nature to try to figure out where such creatures could be found, someone tried Perception to see if they could more clearly hear where the sounds where coming from, etc, but after several rolls, they missed three, so they ran into some demons. Was fun, didn't take too long, the players felt engaged, and they weren't sure whether the encounter was "random" or "planned", which is, in my opinion, perfect. :D
Wow! These are wonderful ideas, thank you both. Yeah I think I want it to be somewhat important to my main story/quest they are on. Not pivotal but definitely reveal some truths to the overall world so i'm definitely going to set some checks that while they might perceive or figure out that something is weird about this grove, they can't figure out how to "see past" it and into the true grove.
Vedexent I love that use of a symbiotic relationship or just a leash of some sort on a powerful item so that they can use it here to gain access, but only works in a specific spot to avoid farming or storing of it.
Well I think I have some good info to go off of, so thank you both again for helping me spark some ideas and get more of a concrete plan of how to implement it!
M