So I'm still fairly new to DMing. I've created a homebrew campaign and so far the players in my group are loving it. My only concern is that whenever conflict arises, all but one resort to using their bows.
Normally this wouldn't bother me but our party consist of a bard, a druid, a fighter and a barbarian. Whenever combat takes place, the barbarian is the only one to charge in for melee while the others sit back and launch arrows at the enemies. Often times this leaves the barbarian to take a large amount of damage being that's hes the only one that charges in.
I'm all for letting the players play how they want to, this is their campaign, but I'm wondering if I should try to encourage them away from relying solely on bows. Any advice from any veteran DMs out there.
Is the druid an elf? Otherwise they wouldn't have proficiency with any bow.
As the DM, don't have your monsters just let arrows rain down on them while they mindlessly attack the toughest target. Smart monsters will avoid the barbarian and move for the archers. Sneaky monsters might ambush the group mid battle. And once a few monsters are close to the archers, they will have disadvantage on all range attacks.
Thrown in some monsters with higher AC. If the archers are missing the target they need to change tactics. As DxJxC suggested use multiple monsters as well.
There is nothing wrong with what the players are doing. Bards don't always want to get in the down and dirty and Fighters have bow subclass - maybe that's what the player is aiming for.
On the flip side, you can always have some melee monsters for the Barb and throw in some ranged attacks to shoot the Barb too. The ranged fighters can then enter into a counter ranged fight.
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"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
Make sure that some monsters are attacking from multiple directions--if all the combat is the bad guys charging from one direction, they're not competent bad guys :) If the baddies are coming at the players from two sides, the barbarian can only charge in one direction. The other charging baddies will close with the archers very quickly, and poof, it's melee all around.
Make sure that some monsters are attacking from multiple directions--if all the combat is the bad guys charging from one direction, they're not competent bad guys :)
True and False =)
Goblins, Orcs, Gnolls angry mob.
Hobgoblins in a shieldwall phallanx.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
Make sure that some monsters are attacking from multiple directions--if all the combat is the bad guys charging from one direction, they're not competent bad guys :)
True and False =)
Goblins, Orcs, Gnolls angry mob.
Hobgoblins in a shieldwall phallanx.
Point taken, but my point was that if all the combat in the whole campaign is only bad guys charging from one direction, the world is full of incompetent bad guys :)
Gnolls use longbows, they may be cunning enough to attack from multiple directions or have some engage the Barbarian while others charge the archers. They are only Intelligence 6 though, so they may be easily tricked for a round or two, but remember that is within the range of Player Character intelligence.
Goblins are tactically astute enough to build their lairs with bolt holes and tunnels too small for humans they use these to circle around and surprise their enemies. They also have Nimble Escape allowing them to Disengage or Hide as a bonus action. Couple this with their short bows and goblins sound like natural hit and run fighters to me. They are not going to stupidly charge the Barbarian in one angry mb while the archers cut them to pieces. Goblins are Intelligence 10, which is average, they are not stupid.
Hobgoblins are well organized and tactically sophisticated. their one weakness is that they will attack any elves first.
Orcs are not likely to show much tactical sophistication, they are Int 7, and their most common missile weapon is a javelin. They are still smart enough to seek cover from archers, spread out and attack from more than one direction at once, or close the distance with the archers.
Most creatures of animal intelligence will likely run when the arrows start to fly.
Anything f above animal intelligence, unless it is suicidal or crazed with bloodlust, will seek cover to avoid arrow storms, likely try to attack from more than one direction, and certainly split up with some charging past the lone barbarian to get at the archers.
Very few monsters are stupid enough t just stand in an open field and let archers shoot them to pieces until they are all dead. Monsters should retreat if they are cannot fight back against the archers. Remember too the dangers of shooting into melee. Friendly fire isn't. As the barbarian should discover if his friends get too close with their fire support
Think about the tactics your monsters could use, and when they are likely to pull back, regroup and try a different plan.
Gnolls are not likely to pull back. The height of their tactical sophistication would be having some of their archers shoot their longbows while others charged into melee. Everyone else will know when they are outmatched, and likely only seek to attack when they think they have the advantage.
Play your monsters smarter. Also if the rest of the party wants to hang back and let the Barbarian take all the damage, let them. Eventually the Barbarian will realize that every fight his character is the only one at any risk. Especially if he falls to zero hit points while surrounded by monsters... Hard to stabilize a friend if you can't get to him in time.
Gnolls use longbows, they may be cunning enough to attack from multiple directions or have some engage the Barbarian while others charge the archers. They are only Intelligence 6 though, so they may be easily tricked for a round or two, but remember that is within the range of Player Character intelligence.
[snip]
Play your monsters smarter. Also if the rest of the party wants to hang back and let the Barbarian take all the damage, let them. Eventually the Barbarian will realize that every fight his character is the only one at any risk. Especially if he falls to zero hit points while surrounded by monsters... Hard to stabilize a friend if you can't get to him in time.
Really good suggestions here. I'm envisioning the various 'dumb' but 'cunning' sorts--orcs and goblins and etc--still having tactics they've learned over the years. Even if they don't have the training to use bows to their maximum potential like a more intelligent army would (firing in ranks, etc), they could easily have tactics to attack those bow users. A goblin tossing a wasp/bee hive into the middle of the archers gives the melee goblins the round they need to close :) Dropping from trees in an ambush, or hiding in a river breathing from a reed until the party is past them. Goblins being able to get through cracks in the cave walls that the PCs can't get through and circling around behind them. Homemade bombs filled with fire ashes or chalk dust or something to provide cover to close to melee.
But you can also just give the goblins some ranged weapons. Don't be bound by what it says in the books. A bow and arrow is not a terribly advanced concept, anything of above animal intelligence should be able to have them, or atlatls, or similar.
Thanks everyone, I definitely appreciate the advice. My main goal is that I just want all the players to feel important or atleast have their own moments to shine. Only thing is I dont wont them to feel as if I'm forcing it to come upon them.
Most of our encounters so far have been initiated by the PCs, but I do have some ideas for future encounters and situations for them to get themselves into.
you are not required to change tactics but I am certain your players would love to be challenged. and I am sure you will have fun with the above suggestions too.
here are some of my own:
1. barbarian charges, DC 15 perception check to notice he is running over tar, pitch, gasoline w/e. regardless of success the trap springs, the field is set aflame and the barbarian is cut off or injured, and the opponents are obscured by the fire and smoke... feel free to add a flanking attack or something completely different to then challenge this party in its dire circumstance.
2. an encounter where an adversary challenges an individual to personal combat.... "you killed me father...prepare to die".
3. an individual gets charmed by a fairy, possessed by a ghost or in some way is compelled to do something the forces the party to change its strategy/tactics. the vampire shows up only to be approached openly as an ally by one of the ranged players(fails a check)
A lot of responses in here. May duplicate some of what’s been said because I unfortunately Havnt Taken the time to read everything. Two things though immediately come to mind.
1) groups of enemies
2) terrain
say the party is fighting nine kobolds. Have there be three groups of 3. One in front. One to the left. One to the right. Barbarian chargers to the ones straight ahead while the ones to the left and right enclose on the archers.
As for terrain. It is a ranged characters best friend. They get High ground at a strategic point and they are set. On the opposite hand terrain can be a nightmare for ranged PCs. Say they are in a dense Forrest. It is difficult terrain and the coverage creates cover for the enemies.
Also, consider magic, there are a number of spells that can obscure an area, or make ranged combat practically impossible (wind wall)
I wouldn't use these all the time, but every now and then tossing a magic user into your enemies with some spells that minimize some of their groups weaknesses is just good planning.
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So I'm still fairly new to DMing. I've created a homebrew campaign and so far the players in my group are loving it. My only concern is that whenever conflict arises, all but one resort to using their bows.
Normally this wouldn't bother me but our party consist of a bard, a druid, a fighter and a barbarian. Whenever combat takes place, the barbarian is the only one to charge in for melee while the others sit back and launch arrows at the enemies. Often times this leaves the barbarian to take a large amount of damage being that's hes the only one that charges in.
I'm all for letting the players play how they want to, this is their campaign, but I'm wondering if I should try to encourage them away from relying solely on bows. Any advice from any veteran DMs out there.
Is the druid an elf? Otherwise they wouldn't have proficiency with any bow.
As the DM, don't have your monsters just let arrows rain down on them while they mindlessly attack the toughest target. Smart monsters will avoid the barbarian and move for the archers. Sneaky monsters might ambush the group mid battle. And once a few monsters are close to the archers, they will have disadvantage on all range attacks.
Thrown in some monsters with higher AC. If the archers are missing the target they need to change tactics. As DxJxC suggested use multiple monsters as well.
There is nothing wrong with what the players are doing. Bards don't always want to get in the down and dirty and Fighters have bow subclass - maybe that's what the player is aiming for.
On the flip side, you can always have some melee monsters for the Barb and throw in some ranged attacks to shoot the Barb too. The ranged fighters can then enter into a counter ranged fight.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Make sure that some monsters are attacking from multiple directions--if all the combat is the bad guys charging from one direction, they're not competent bad guys :) If the baddies are coming at the players from two sides, the barbarian can only charge in one direction. The other charging baddies will close with the archers very quickly, and poof, it's melee all around.
Looking for new subclasses, spells, magic items, feats, and races? Opinions welcome :)
True and False =)
Goblins, Orcs, Gnolls angry mob.
Hobgoblins in a shieldwall phallanx.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Point taken, but my point was that if all the combat in the whole campaign is only bad guys charging from one direction, the world is full of incompetent bad guys :)
Looking for new subclasses, spells, magic items, feats, and races? Opinions welcome :)
Adding in locations featuring alot of cover could help. half cover gives them +2 AC and three-quarters cover gives them +5 AC.
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Arrows are a resource.. make them harder to find/make/buy/recover for a bit. Eventually they should run out, lol.
Gnolls use longbows, they may be cunning enough to attack from multiple directions or have some engage the Barbarian while others charge the archers. They are only Intelligence 6 though, so they may be easily tricked for a round or two, but remember that is within the range of Player Character intelligence.
Goblins are tactically astute enough to build their lairs with bolt holes and tunnels too small for humans they use these to circle around and surprise their enemies. They also have Nimble Escape allowing them to Disengage or Hide as a bonus action. Couple this with their short bows and goblins sound like natural hit and run fighters to me. They are not going to stupidly charge the Barbarian in one angry mb while the archers cut them to pieces. Goblins are Intelligence 10, which is average, they are not stupid.
Hobgoblins are well organized and tactically sophisticated. their one weakness is that they will attack any elves first.
Orcs are not likely to show much tactical sophistication, they are Int 7, and their most common missile weapon is a javelin. They are still smart enough to seek cover from archers, spread out and attack from more than one direction at once, or close the distance with the archers.
Most creatures of animal intelligence will likely run when the arrows start to fly.
Anything f above animal intelligence, unless it is suicidal or crazed with bloodlust, will seek cover to avoid arrow storms, likely try to attack from more than one direction, and certainly split up with some charging past the lone barbarian to get at the archers.
Very few monsters are stupid enough t just stand in an open field and let archers shoot them to pieces until they are all dead. Monsters should retreat if they are cannot fight back against the archers. Remember too the dangers of shooting into melee. Friendly fire isn't. As the barbarian should discover if his friends get too close with their fire support
Think about the tactics your monsters could use, and when they are likely to pull back, regroup and try a different plan.
Gnolls are not likely to pull back. The height of their tactical sophistication would be having some of their archers shoot their longbows while others charged into melee. Everyone else will know when they are outmatched, and likely only seek to attack when they think they have the advantage.
Play your monsters smarter. Also if the rest of the party wants to hang back and let the Barbarian take all the damage, let them. Eventually the Barbarian will realize that every fight his character is the only one at any risk. Especially if he falls to zero hit points while surrounded by monsters... Hard to stabilize a friend if you can't get to him in time.
Really good suggestions here. I'm envisioning the various 'dumb' but 'cunning' sorts--orcs and goblins and etc--still having tactics they've learned over the years. Even if they don't have the training to use bows to their maximum potential like a more intelligent army would (firing in ranks, etc), they could easily have tactics to attack those bow users. A goblin tossing a wasp/bee hive into the middle of the archers gives the melee goblins the round they need to close :) Dropping from trees in an ambush, or hiding in a river breathing from a reed until the party is past them. Goblins being able to get through cracks in the cave walls that the PCs can't get through and circling around behind them. Homemade bombs filled with fire ashes or chalk dust or something to provide cover to close to melee.
But you can also just give the goblins some ranged weapons. Don't be bound by what it says in the books. A bow and arrow is not a terribly advanced concept, anything of above animal intelligence should be able to have them, or atlatls, or similar.
Looking for new subclasses, spells, magic items, feats, and races? Opinions welcome :)
Have some enemies end their turns by going prone.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
Thanks everyone, I definitely appreciate the advice. My main goal is that I just want all the players to feel important or atleast have their own moments to shine. Only thing is I dont wont them to feel as if I'm forcing it to come upon them.
Most of our encounters so far have been initiated by the PCs, but I do have some ideas for future encounters and situations for them to get themselves into.
to respond to OP.
you are not required to change tactics but I am certain your players would love to be challenged. and I am sure you will have fun with the above suggestions too.
here are some of my own:
1. barbarian charges, DC 15 perception check to notice he is running over tar, pitch, gasoline w/e. regardless of success the trap springs, the field is set aflame and the barbarian is cut off or injured, and the opponents are obscured by the fire and smoke... feel free to add a flanking attack or something completely different to then challenge this party in its dire circumstance.
2. an encounter where an adversary challenges an individual to personal combat.... "you killed me father...prepare to die".
3. an individual gets charmed by a fairy, possessed by a ghost or in some way is compelled to do something the forces the party to change its strategy/tactics. the vampire shows up only to be approached openly as an ally by one of the ranged players(fails a check)
good luck
Jesus Saves!... Everyone else takes damage.
A lot of responses in here. May duplicate some of what’s been said because I unfortunately Havnt Taken the time to read everything. Two things though immediately come to mind.
1) groups of enemies
2) terrain
say the party is fighting nine kobolds. Have there be three groups of 3. One in front. One to the left. One to the right. Barbarian chargers to the ones straight ahead while the ones to the left and right enclose on the archers.
As for terrain. It is a ranged characters best friend. They get High ground at a strategic point and they are set. On the opposite hand terrain can be a nightmare for ranged PCs. Say they are in a dense Forrest. It is difficult terrain and the coverage creates cover for the enemies.
Also, consider magic, there are a number of spells that can obscure an area, or make ranged combat practically impossible (wind wall)
I wouldn't use these all the time, but every now and then tossing a magic user into your enemies with some spells that minimize some of their groups weaknesses is just good planning.