What are some times that the players in your campaign completely derailed the story? I hope that you find the story at least somewhat hilarious. The- the stories you have, in case you didn’t get that.
Honestly, the players will always disrupt a plot if you try to impose one so the best way to avoid it is to not have a "plot".
You create a world with NPCs with their own goals and purposes, there could be a dozen "plots" or more that the characters could get involved in. Even unexpected actions by NPCs or PCs or unexpected die results can lead to a "plot". There may be times when the characters accept a job or agree to do a task. This isn't a "plot" ... the characters may or may not complete that task, there may or may not be penalties or consequences if they do, they may find some more pressing task to take care of while they are trying to complete the first one. The DM creates the world, the characters interact with it and decide what to do and the plot is the RESULT, not the starting point :)
One time in a Traveller game (sci-fi RPG) ... the characters had recovered a space ship and in the process of other business found a nuclear device on which they accidentally triggered a countdown. At the time, their spaceship was at the shipyard for repairs and upgrades and the device was in the hold. One of the characters had been inspecting/playing with the unusual container to figure out what it was. The ensuing panic as the characters tried to find a safe way to dispose of the device was hilarious. However, none of that was planned. It wasn't a plot, it didn't derail the plot or the other activities of the characters ... it simply became the top priority on their to do list for the play session. Especially since they thought there was a good chance that if they didn't figure out what to do with it there might not be any characters left.
Honestly, the players will always disrupt a plot if you try to impose one so the best way to avoid it is to not have a "plot".
...
The DM creates the world, the characters interact with it and decide what to do and the plot is the RESULT, not the starting point :)
I agree with this 10,000% - but this is only true for those of us which adopt a more improvisational style.
I define my adventure "plans" by detailing out the Agencies ( who they are, what are their: motives, goals, tactics, resources, beliefs ), the Conflict ( where are the various agencies colliding in their goals and plans ), and the Winning Conditions for each of the Agencies ( including the Everyone Left so No One Wins end-state ). Then I just role-play out the next act of each Agency in "real time". That means there's never any pre-defined Plot to derail. I have had the Players do things I didn't expect, for sure - but this approach can just absorb any Player wackiness and keep on rolling.
But not everyone is as comfortable flying by the seat of their pants, and like sketching out a flowchart of possible actions and story branches - and of course, Players find new branches that we never consider :p
This is especially true of newer DMs, and those who prefer running published modules ( which definitely have a plot structure ).
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It's not that my players ever really derail anything. It's that I set up half a dozen possible storylines they could pursue and on a regular basis go off in a direction I never imagined! Which is fun, just means I gotta scramble a bit more!
My players have not completely detailed the plot yet... I am not sure there is a solid enough plan for them to be able to derail it. But the 3 most noticeable instances of players going off in unexpected entirely unexpected directions are;
First was a goblin lair that was intended as a simple low level dungeon. But they chose to run off and come back with a translator, then set up negotiations of a trade deal between the goblins and the townsfolk, those goblins will now be useful in establishing what I expect will be the big bad for the rest of the campaign. The second was a ghost wanting to reclaim a sentimental ring from the now eliminated low level big bad, by the time they got to the showdown they had forgot about this poor guy so looted and departed. One is now having dreams of the ghosts travels to reclaim the ring, and get revenge (I rolled to see who pocketed the ring, next dream, the ghost striking a deal with a hag). And last session a couple of the party were stunt doubles for the sword fight at the end of a comedy play, this was intended to be a puzzle based on the Monkey Island insult sword fighting, but the character playing the villain got a little carried away and the character playing the hero fluffed rolls to get him under control, so the druid ended up charging a giant elk at the villain of the play from off stage. This bizarre climax to the piece left a sizable chunk of the audience confused, and the performers annoyed.
In my case, personally, I tend to give to vague descriptions deliberately and my players find that suspicious. Last time they began investigating an abandoned windmill, for which I had planned some events in the future. Nevertheless, they have forced their way through (I did not have the heart to stop them, since they wanted enter it so badly) and were forced to do some quite rough encounter. Ultimately, I was able to put the story back on track I imagined it to be, but it was fun doing so. A challenge for DM, for sure :)
Don’t try to lock the players to YOUR story. Players are as predictable as the dice, not very. There are always things a DM can do to influence the game, just don’t try to force the players to do it YOUR way. Tell the story thru them, not about them.
Some people have said it’s best to not have a plot. I agree, but it can be fun, if not as fun as improvising most of the time. The best example I have of people derailing the plot, for example, is in Waterdeep: Dragon Heist. I knew it would go wrong as soon as they named their characters “Adult Hateler” and “Josephine Stalling.” The guy who played Hateler ended up starting a dragonborn only thieves’ guild that tried to kill thousands of halflings, and Josephine ended up trying to kill everything that wasn’t him, regardless of race. He accepted all races into his guild, and the rogue’s guild and Stalling’s guild ended up going to war.
It can help to understand fully how much creative freedom you have as a DM. If they derail then you gently give them ways to get back on track. If they persist you need to consider if this is the game you want to play.
What are some times that the players in your campaign completely derailed the story? I hope that you find the story at least somewhat hilarious. The- the stories you have, in case you didn’t get that.
Never? :)
Honestly, the players will always disrupt a plot if you try to impose one so the best way to avoid it is to not have a "plot".
You create a world with NPCs with their own goals and purposes, there could be a dozen "plots" or more that the characters could get involved in. Even unexpected actions by NPCs or PCs or unexpected die results can lead to a "plot". There may be times when the characters accept a job or agree to do a task. This isn't a "plot" ... the characters may or may not complete that task, there may or may not be penalties or consequences if they do, they may find some more pressing task to take care of while they are trying to complete the first one. The DM creates the world, the characters interact with it and decide what to do and the plot is the RESULT, not the starting point :)
One time in a Traveller game (sci-fi RPG) ... the characters had recovered a space ship and in the process of other business found a nuclear device on which they accidentally triggered a countdown. At the time, their spaceship was at the shipyard for repairs and upgrades and the device was in the hold. One of the characters had been inspecting/playing with the unusual container to figure out what it was. The ensuing panic as the characters tried to find a safe way to dispose of the device was hilarious. However, none of that was planned. It wasn't a plot, it didn't derail the plot or the other activities of the characters ... it simply became the top priority on their to do list for the play session. Especially since they thought there was a good chance that if they didn't figure out what to do with it there might not be any characters left.
I agree with this 10,000% - but this is only true for those of us which adopt a more improvisational style.
I define my adventure "plans" by detailing out the Agencies ( who they are, what are their: motives, goals, tactics, resources, beliefs ), the Conflict ( where are the various agencies colliding in their goals and plans ), and the Winning Conditions for each of the Agencies ( including the Everyone Left so No One Wins end-state ). Then I just role-play out the next act of each Agency in "real time". That means there's never any pre-defined Plot to derail. I have had the Players do things I didn't expect, for sure - but this approach can just absorb any Player wackiness and keep on rolling.
But not everyone is as comfortable flying by the seat of their pants, and like sketching out a flowchart of possible actions and story branches - and of course, Players find new branches that we never consider :p
This is especially true of newer DMs, and those who prefer running published modules ( which definitely have a plot structure ).
My DM Philosophy, as summed up by other people: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rN5w4-azTq3Kbn0Yvk9nfqQhwQ1R5by1/view
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InsiderIt's not that my players ever really derail anything. It's that I set up half a dozen possible storylines they could pursue and on a regular basis go off in a direction I never imagined! Which is fun, just means I gotta scramble a bit more!
Find me on Twitter: @OboeLauren
My players have not completely detailed the plot yet... I am not sure there is a solid enough plan for them to be able to derail it. But the 3 most noticeable instances of players going off in unexpected entirely unexpected directions are;
First was a goblin lair that was intended as a simple low level dungeon. But they chose to run off and come back with a translator, then set up negotiations of a trade deal between the goblins and the townsfolk, those goblins will now be useful in establishing what I expect will be the big bad for the rest of the campaign.
The second was a ghost wanting to reclaim a sentimental ring from the now eliminated low level big bad, by the time they got to the showdown they had forgot about this poor guy so looted and departed. One is now having dreams of the ghosts travels to reclaim the ring, and get revenge (I rolled to see who pocketed the ring, next dream, the ghost striking a deal with a hag).
And last session a couple of the party were stunt doubles for the sword fight at the end of a comedy play, this was intended to be a puzzle based on the Monkey Island insult sword fighting, but the character playing the villain got a little carried away and the character playing the hero fluffed rolls to get him under control, so the druid ended up charging a giant elk at the villain of the play from off stage. This bizarre climax to the piece left a sizable chunk of the audience confused, and the performers annoyed.
In my case, personally, I tend to give to vague descriptions deliberately and my players find that suspicious. Last time they began investigating an abandoned windmill, for which I had planned some events in the future. Nevertheless, they have forced their way through (I did not have the heart to stop them, since they wanted enter it so badly) and were forced to do some quite rough encounter. Ultimately, I was able to put the story back on track I imagined it to be, but it was fun doing so. A challenge for DM, for sure :)
Don’t try to lock the players to YOUR story. Players are as predictable as the dice, not very. There are always things a DM can do to influence the game, just don’t try to force the players to do it YOUR way. Tell the story thru them, not about them.
Some people have said it’s best to not have a plot. I agree, but it can be fun, if not as fun as improvising most of the time. The best example I have of people derailing the plot, for example, is in Waterdeep: Dragon Heist. I knew it would go wrong as soon as they named their characters “Adult Hateler” and “Josephine Stalling.” The guy who played Hateler ended up starting a dragonborn only thieves’ guild that tried to kill thousands of halflings, and Josephine ended up trying to kill everything that wasn’t him, regardless of race. He accepted all races into his guild, and the rogue’s guild and Stalling’s guild ended up going to war.
Sometimes the DM needs to roll the DM dice....hey heart attacks happen....or worse a parasitic infection.
not that I would ever do that....maybe
It can help to understand fully how much creative freedom you have as a DM. If they derail then you gently give them ways to get back on track. If they persist you need to consider if this is the game you want to play.
Remember, it has to be fun for you and the players.