I have a massive problem with cohesion within the group
I run a curse of Strahd group with a party of 5, we are all good friends and have known eachother for ages. The party has just exited Vallaki after 6-7 sessions (including a full day 12 hour session) and over this time some very clear issues have come up in the group that I don't know how to deal with
- party Cleric/Rogue has an urge to antagonize any NPC that's slightly disagreeable and attacks without any warning to the group, in or out of character. - Party wizard has a "I can do no wrong" complex where he doesn't actively cause scenarios that are a determent to the groups interest, however he often makes major decisions that affect the narrative without consulting the party and gets mad when people then take actions that don't support this. - Party Barbarian is the quietest person, I try and encourage her to weigh in more on whats going on at the table but she constantly keeps "I'm just going to go with whatever the group decides". She is new to DnD however and the rest of the table has more experience.
Needless to say, the wizard and cleric are butting heads constantly. Wizard is always trying to take a carefully thought through and diplomatic approach while the cleric wants to blow up first ask questions second. Last Session right as the group left Vallaki I had a encounter with 3 barbarians from the mountain tribe that weren't hostile with the group, just as some level of communication was being established the cleric when to grapple one of them and the party just left him to get attacked by 3 berserkers and quickly taken down. this resulted in A LOT of loud out of character arguments with the cleric visibly angry that no one in the group would back him up.
Any advice from anyone else that's had similar issues or insights on how to manage this?
First of all - I think we've all been there at some moment.
We've had campaigns (mostly in other systems since that's what I've played most), were players could end up using most of the time to sabotage each other. Sure, it was some REALLY funny roleplaying there, but what suffered was the progress of the story.
I'll try to explain what I guess the problem is. This is based on my experience as a player and GM. You have to decide if this might apply to your game, or if I'm completely off.
Don't be concerned about the barbarian. It sounds to me she just isn't the type who wants to spend a lot of time quarreling with her fellow players. That's OK. Just ask her in private if she really is fine with "doing just as the group wants". If she says so and you believe her. Let hr do that for now. This group doesn't sounds like the group you 1. want another loud voice to question everything or 2. for a new player to test out quarreling with other players. If you should do anything for her, throw in a cool subplot or something for her. Something you can more or less give her between sessions. Just make sure she knows you SEE her, but acknowledge that she doesn't want to be part of the groups internal issues. (That actually sounds like a cool barbarian - I don't care about those self-righteous peoples quarreling. I only want to get things done).
It may sound to me that you have at least two players that have a very clear idea of their characters. They might even play them really well as intended (OK, the cleric/rogue doing things in AND out of character is kind of difficult to place). The problem is that they should never have been traveling together. They have no common goal. My experience with RPG is that finding the balance between creating interesting individual characters and a reason those characters travel together can be difficult. If the characters are dull, it can be easy to give them common goals, but it's not that awarding. If the characters get to individualistic, you can end up where you are.
You should address this with your players - at least if you think it will help. I would NOT have attacked any of their characters. The characters might be fine, the problem is that they don't sound like they work together. The question is: Can they manage to find a way to do that. This discussion HAS to be taken completely off game. The answer might be no, and if so, you'll have to make the decision if it's worth to continue the campaign. If you think "no" don't take it as a defeat. Just make sure you try to work out a plan with your players on how to avoid this in future campaigns. I'm quite sure no-one is ENJOYING this situation.
I've had campaigns where I finally had to turn to - find an enemy that all the players hate more than each other, and the given enemy is so potent that they HAVE to keep together. That campaign didn't last long.
If nothing works, check out Blades in the Dark. That game has a brilliant way of addressing this problem.
Write it into the story. If you've noticed this, Strahd has noticed this and will exploit it. He'll set some kind of trap designed around this exact weakness and the party will only survive because one of the mentor characters (van Richten, Esmerelda, maybe Dmitri Martikov) shows up in the nick of time and saves them. They smack the characters on the head and tell them that if they can't learn to work together, they'll never be able to challenge Strahd. He's been doing this for centuries and he understands how to find the weak link in a group.
QFT. The PCs are Strah's toys. They are there for his entertainment. What entertains him is breaking people. Once he has broken a character, they are no fun anymore so he'll discard them.
If I were the GM, I would do exactly that. Exploit the flaws, break the characters, then kill them*. Then tell the players that if they want to defeat Strahd and escape the valley then their next characters need to learn from the actions if their dead characters.
* Personally, I feel that this module is one where a TPK is acceptable, even desirable. The characters are going up against a master predator (a sexual predator, depending on which gothic horror tropes you are using). Killing the entire party will make the players sit up and realise this is serious.
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I have a massive problem with cohesion within the group
I run a curse of Strahd group with a party of 5, we are all good friends and have known eachother for ages.
The party has just exited Vallaki after 6-7 sessions (including a full day 12 hour session) and over this time some very clear issues have come up in the group that I don't know how to deal with
- party Cleric/Rogue has an urge to antagonize any NPC that's slightly disagreeable and attacks without any warning to the group, in or out of character.
- Party wizard has a "I can do no wrong" complex where he doesn't actively cause scenarios that are a determent to the groups interest, however he often makes major decisions that affect the narrative without consulting the party and gets mad when people then take actions that don't support this.
- Party Barbarian is the quietest person, I try and encourage her to weigh in more on whats going on at the table but she constantly keeps "I'm just going to go with whatever the group decides". She is new to DnD however and the rest of the table has more experience.
Needless to say, the wizard and cleric are butting heads constantly. Wizard is always trying to take a carefully thought through and diplomatic approach while the cleric wants to blow up first ask questions second. Last Session right as the group left Vallaki I had a encounter with 3 barbarians from the mountain tribe that weren't hostile with the group, just as some level of communication was being established the cleric when to grapple one of them and the party just left him to get attacked by 3 berserkers and quickly taken down. this resulted in A LOT of loud out of character arguments with the cleric visibly angry that no one in the group would back him up.
Any advice from anyone else that's had similar issues or insights on how to manage this?
First of all - I think we've all been there at some moment.
We've had campaigns (mostly in other systems since that's what I've played most), were players could end up using most of the time to sabotage each other. Sure, it was some REALLY funny roleplaying there, but what suffered was the progress of the story.
I'll try to explain what I guess the problem is. This is based on my experience as a player and GM. You have to decide if this might apply to your game, or if I'm completely off.
Don't be concerned about the barbarian. It sounds to me she just isn't the type who wants to spend a lot of time quarreling with her fellow players. That's OK. Just ask her in private if she really is fine with "doing just as the group wants". If she says so and you believe her. Let hr do that for now. This group doesn't sounds like the group you 1. want another loud voice to question everything or 2. for a new player to test out quarreling with other players. If you should do anything for her, throw in a cool subplot or something for her. Something you can more or less give her between sessions. Just make sure she knows you SEE her, but acknowledge that she doesn't want to be part of the groups internal issues. (That actually sounds like a cool barbarian - I don't care about those self-righteous peoples quarreling. I only want to get things done).
It may sound to me that you have at least two players that have a very clear idea of their characters. They might even play them really well as intended (OK, the cleric/rogue doing things in AND out of character is kind of difficult to place). The problem is that they should never have been traveling together. They have no common goal. My experience with RPG is that finding the balance between creating interesting individual characters and a reason those characters travel together can be difficult. If the characters are dull, it can be easy to give them common goals, but it's not that awarding. If the characters get to individualistic, you can end up where you are.
You should address this with your players - at least if you think it will help. I would NOT have attacked any of their characters. The characters might be fine, the problem is that they don't sound like they work together. The question is: Can they manage to find a way to do that. This discussion HAS to be taken completely off game. The answer might be no, and if so, you'll have to make the decision if it's worth to continue the campaign. If you think "no" don't take it as a defeat. Just make sure you try to work out a plan with your players on how to avoid this in future campaigns. I'm quite sure no-one is ENJOYING this situation.
I've had campaigns where I finally had to turn to - find an enemy that all the players hate more than each other, and the given enemy is so potent that they HAVE to keep together. That campaign didn't last long.
If nothing works, check out Blades in the Dark. That game has a brilliant way of addressing this problem.
Ludo ergo sum!
Write it into the story. If you've noticed this, Strahd has noticed this and will exploit it. He'll set some kind of trap designed around this exact weakness and the party will only survive because one of the mentor characters (van Richten, Esmerelda, maybe Dmitri Martikov) shows up in the nick of time and saves them. They smack the characters on the head and tell them that if they can't learn to work together, they'll never be able to challenge Strahd. He's been doing this for centuries and he understands how to find the weak link in a group.
QFT. The PCs are Strah's toys. They are there for his entertainment. What entertains him is breaking people. Once he has broken a character, they are no fun anymore so he'll discard them.
If I were the GM, I would do exactly that. Exploit the flaws, break the characters, then kill them*. Then tell the players that if they want to defeat Strahd and escape the valley then their next characters need to learn from the actions if their dead characters.
* Personally, I feel that this module is one where a TPK is acceptable, even desirable. The characters are going up against a master predator (a sexual predator, depending on which gothic horror tropes you are using). Killing the entire party will make the players sit up and realise this is serious.