My party is facing an opponent with Magic Resistance.
A member of the party has Counterspell.
I am thinking that any attempt to Counterspell should be rolled at disadvantage. I know that's not precisely how Magic Resistance reads, but makes sense thematically in my mind.
Why would the enemies resistance matter? Counter spell is targeting their spell, not them. That’s like saying if someone has resistance to slashing damage sword attack would be at disadvantage.
Magic resistance is already powerful, no need to buff it further.
It was my understanding that Counterspell is cast upon the caster. The spell description starts with "You interrupt a creature in the process of casting a spell."
That's a negative on disadvantage, straight roll for sure. If that were the case, nobody would play anything other than Abjuration Wizards as they have resistance to all magic as well as get to add their proficiency modifier to their counterspells. That would be super OP.
Magic resistance gives advantage to the targeted creature on saving throws against spells, not disadvantage to the caster while casting them. Also, The roll required by Counterspell is not a saving throw on the part of the targeted creature, so either way, magic resistance has no effect on counterspell
I would agree with the other posters that imposing disadvantage on the Counterspell roll would be unfair to the player and certainly not covered by the rules. That said, if you want to give your villain an ability such that their spells are more difficult to counter or rather that they are so focused that another caster has more difficulty interrupting their spells then by all means home brew it but it isn't a feature could already be considered part of magic resistance.
"You attempt to interrupt a creature in the process of casting a spell. If the creature is casting a spell of 3rd level or lower, its spell fails and has no effect. If it is casting a spell of 4th level or higher, make an ability check using your spellcasting ability. The DC equals 10 - the spell's level. On a success, the creature's spell fails and has no effect."
Counterspell doesn't involve a saving throw, it is an ABILITY check. It is possible that whatever counterspell does isn't essentially magical in the first place. It allows the caster to reach out and interfere with another caster in the process of casting a spell, interrupting one or more of the V,S,M components of the spell as it is being cast so that it doesn't work. This could be reflected by the fact that it is the caster that makes an ability check for success and not the target that has to make a save. Higher level spells are more difficult to disrupt.
In any case, RAW, because the target isn't making a save, magic resistance doesn't apply. In terms of however, you want to interpret counterspell working, it is the caster of counterspell that has to make an ability check to disrupt the spell, the target isn't saving against any magic so disadvantage on the ability check due to magic resistance wouldn't necessarily make any sense at all.
On the other hand, if a particular caster was very difficult to interrupt in their work for whatever reason then a modifier to the counterspell ability check might be something you could consider home brewing.
If it's a player that is a caster and making that argument and won't see it RAW way, you could always say that since he is so resistant to magic that any spell he casts has a 50% chance to fail if he wants advantage on counterspells against him.
An ability that would affect counterspell would be the limited magic immunity of creatures like the Rakshasha, in which the creature is immune to the effects of spells of a certain level or lower. But that is a lot different from the magic resistance ability
I agree that this isn't covered by the RAW Magical Resistance ability. Nor can Magical Resistance be stretched to include it.
Thematically, however, it still makes sense to me that the creatures in question (a coven of night hags) who are resistant to magical effects would also possess spells difficult to magically disrupt.
I will add it as an additional ability, which I think will only be in effect when the coven members are within range of one another and gain access to their shared spells. I just need a good name for it. Harridan's Might, perhaps.
Here's hoping their Eyebite can make an appearance. :)
Oh, you're talking about a [monster[night hag[/monster]...
Counterspell would behave as normal according to the rules of counterspell even though hags have magic resistance. As an aside, if you want to really make your party feel the pain, forget about eyebite and cast [spell[lightning bolt[/spell] at 6th level. And 5th level. And 4th level. And 3rd level. Counterspell is limited to a 60 foot range. Lightning bolt is not.
Also, if you want a creature to have difficult-to-counterspell magic, make them a sorcerer with access to Subtle Spell metamagic. The trigger for counterspell is *seeing* the creature begin to cast a spell. With subtle spell, there are no verbal or somatic components, so there's nothing to see.
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My party is facing an opponent with Magic Resistance.
A member of the party has Counterspell.
I am thinking that any attempt to Counterspell should be rolled at disadvantage. I know that's not precisely how Magic Resistance reads, but makes sense thematically in my mind.
Your thoughts?
Why would the enemies resistance matter? Counter spell is targeting their spell, not them. That’s like saying if someone has resistance to slashing damage sword attack would be at disadvantage.
Magic resistance is already powerful, no need to buff it further.
My thought process:
It was my understanding that Counterspell is cast upon the caster. The spell description starts with "You interrupt a creature in the process of casting a spell."
I also saw a twitter post from Jeremy Crawford: https://mobile.twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/792412232432758784
That's a negative on disadvantage, straight roll for sure. If that were the case, nobody would play anything other than Abjuration Wizards as they have resistance to all magic as well as get to add their proficiency modifier to their counterspells. That would be super OP.
Magic resistance gives advantage to the targeted creature on saving throws against spells, not disadvantage to the caster while casting them. Also, The roll required by Counterspell is not a saving throw on the part of the targeted creature, so either way, magic resistance has no effect on counterspell
I would agree with the other posters that imposing disadvantage on the Counterspell roll would be unfair to the player and certainly not covered by the rules. That said, if you want to give your villain an ability such that their spells are more difficult to counter or rather that they are so focused that another caster has more difficulty interrupting their spells then by all means home brew it but it isn't a feature could already be considered part of magic resistance.
"You attempt to interrupt a creature in the process of casting a spell. If the creature is casting a spell of 3rd level or lower, its spell fails and has no effect. If it is casting a spell of 4th level or higher, make an ability check using your spellcasting ability. The DC equals 10 - the spell's level. On a success, the creature's spell fails and has no effect."
Counterspell doesn't involve a saving throw, it is an ABILITY check. It is possible that whatever counterspell does isn't essentially magical in the first place. It allows the caster to reach out and interfere with another caster in the process of casting a spell, interrupting one or more of the V,S,M components of the spell as it is being cast so that it doesn't work. This could be reflected by the fact that it is the caster that makes an ability check for success and not the target that has to make a save. Higher level spells are more difficult to disrupt.
In any case, RAW, because the target isn't making a save, magic resistance doesn't apply. In terms of however, you want to interpret counterspell working, it is the caster of counterspell that has to make an ability check to disrupt the spell, the target isn't saving against any magic so disadvantage on the ability check due to magic resistance wouldn't necessarily make any sense at all.
On the other hand, if a particular caster was very difficult to interrupt in their work for whatever reason then a modifier to the counterspell ability check might be something you could consider home brewing.
If it's a player that is a caster and making that argument and won't see it RAW way, you could always say that since he is so resistant to magic that any spell he casts has a 50% chance to fail if he wants advantage on counterspells against him.
An ability that would affect counterspell would be the limited magic immunity of creatures like the Rakshasha, in which the creature is immune to the effects of spells of a certain level or lower. But that is a lot different from the magic resistance ability
I appreciate all the thoughts and insights.
I agree that this isn't covered by the RAW Magical Resistance ability. Nor can Magical Resistance be stretched to include it.
Thematically, however, it still makes sense to me that the creatures in question (a coven of night hags) who are resistant to magical effects would also possess spells difficult to magically disrupt.
I will add it as an additional ability, which I think will only be in effect when the coven members are within range of one another and gain access to their shared spells. I just need a good name for it. Harridan's Might, perhaps.
Here's hoping their Eyebite can make an appearance. :)
Oh, you're talking about a [monster[night hag[/monster]...
Counterspell would behave as normal according to the rules of counterspell even though hags have magic resistance. As an aside, if you want to really make your party feel the pain, forget about eyebite and cast [spell[lightning bolt[/spell] at 6th level. And 5th level. And 4th level. And 3rd level. Counterspell is limited to a 60 foot range. Lightning bolt is not.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
Also, if you want a creature to have difficult-to-counterspell magic, make them a sorcerer with access to Subtle Spell metamagic. The trigger for counterspell is *seeing* the creature begin to cast a spell. With subtle spell, there are no verbal or somatic components, so there's nothing to see.