How do some of you DMs handle a situation where a new or surprise character joins the fray? I have a party currently getting a bit beaten up by some ghouls in the sub levels of a church. I wanted to have the priest to show up and help administer some healing. How should I fit them into the initiative line up mid fight?
I don't think the rules concerning surprise are vague. Surprise can only happen at the start of combat and ends at the end of a characters first turn.
The DM determines who might be surprised. If neither side tries to be stealthy, they automatically notice each other. Otherwise, the DM compares the Dexterity (Stealth) checks of anyone hiding with the passive Wisdom (Perception) score of each creature on the opposing side. Any character or monster that doesn't notice a threat is surprised at the start of the encounter.
If you're surprised, you can't move or take an action on your first turn of the combat, and you can't take a reaction until that turn ends. A member of a group can be surprised even if the other members aren't.
If combat has started then the combatents are hardly being stealthy the priest would here the battle and not be surprised. The ghouls are in the middle of combat are are not going to just not be able to carry out any actions or reactions because they didn't notice the priest appear.
The priest could either sneak in quietly so see what the disturbance is or run straight in. If he sneaks in, (at half movement speed) depending where you place him when you put him into the combat order he might arrive a turn later but if the ghouls don't notice him he would have advantage on his attack.
I would also point out the phrase " If neither side tries to be stealthy, they automatically notice each other" while individual combatents may try to be stealthy between their attacks I can not imagine a combat where everyone is "trying to be stealthy".
I do take you point that being unconcious might make you unable to notice the combat and depending on hoew light a sleeper you are you could potentially argue that a sleeping character could remain unconcious until he is hit, but I would tend to rule that it is also quite possible that the characters in combat are concentrating on each other and don't immediately notice a body on top of one of the beds and therefore neither party is surprised.
How do some of you DMs handle a situation where a new or surprise character joins the fray? I have a party currently getting a bit beaten up by some ghouls in the sub levels of a church. I wanted to have the priest to show up and help administer some healing. How should I fit them into the initiative line up mid fight?
Thanks in advance!
When the priest arrives in range of combat, you roll initiative. Next time that number's turn comes up, he goes.
So for example, let's say the initiative order is PC-21, PC-15, Ghouls-12, PC-10, PC-7. Priest comes in, you roll a 14 for his initiative. The next round would be PC-21, PC-15, Priest-14, and so on.
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Usually, I just roll for all the potential participants at the start of the combat. If some of them take a few rounds to get there then they enter the area of combat on their initiative roll. Depending on the size of the area being portrayed, this can mean that they would be several rounds away from actually participating in the combat. However, if the battlefield is that big then this would make sense. On the other hand, if they are behind a closed door then they would open the door on their initiative on the turn they enter combat.
In terms of "surprise" ... it doesn't happen. Creatures in combat can't be surprised since they are already aware of opponents and are alert and paying attention. If another opponent enters the combat they are assumed to see them coming unless the new opponent is hidden (in which case the creature isn't surprised but they are attacked with advantage since they do not see the creature prior to the attack being made.
P.S. In my opinion, any additional creatures entering combat should enter on their initiative - they move on their initiative - they should not be placed on the map and then roll their initiative since they are then possibly standing around doing nothing for several rounds until their initiative arrives - which makes no sense to me since they should have been using their movement on their initiative to enter the combat area in the first place.
Thanks for everyone's reply. It's funny that you said the priest rolled a 14 INT because that is exactly what they rolled and I fit them into the fray at that point. It worked well.
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Hello all
How do some of you DMs handle a situation where a new or surprise character joins the fray? I have a party currently getting a bit beaten up by some ghouls in the sub levels of a church. I wanted to have the priest to show up and help administer some healing. How should I fit them into the initiative line up mid fight?
Thanks in advance!
I don't think the rules concerning surprise are vague. Surprise can only happen at the start of combat and ends at the end of a characters first turn.
If combat has started then the combatents are hardly being stealthy the priest would here the battle and not be surprised. The ghouls are in the middle of combat are are not going to just not be able to carry out any actions or reactions because they didn't notice the priest appear.
The priest could either sneak in quietly so see what the disturbance is or run straight in. If he sneaks in, (at half movement speed) depending where you place him when you put him into the combat order he might arrive a turn later but if the ghouls don't notice him he would have advantage on his attack.
I would also point out the phrase " If neither side tries to be stealthy, they automatically notice each other" while individual combatents may try to be stealthy between their attacks I can not imagine a combat where everyone is "trying to be stealthy".
I do take you point that being unconcious might make you unable to notice the combat and depending on hoew light a sleeper you are you could potentially argue that a sleeping character could remain unconcious until he is hit, but I would tend to rule that it is also quite possible that the characters in combat are concentrating on each other and don't immediately notice a body on top of one of the beds and therefore neither party is surprised.
When the priest arrives in range of combat, you roll initiative. Next time that number's turn comes up, he goes.
So for example, let's say the initiative order is PC-21, PC-15, Ghouls-12, PC-10, PC-7. Priest comes in, you roll a 14 for his initiative. The next round would be PC-21, PC-15, Priest-14, and so on.
WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
Usually, I just roll for all the potential participants at the start of the combat. If some of them take a few rounds to get there then they enter the area of combat on their initiative roll. Depending on the size of the area being portrayed, this can mean that they would be several rounds away from actually participating in the combat. However, if the battlefield is that big then this would make sense. On the other hand, if they are behind a closed door then they would open the door on their initiative on the turn they enter combat.
In terms of "surprise" ... it doesn't happen. Creatures in combat can't be surprised since they are already aware of opponents and are alert and paying attention. If another opponent enters the combat they are assumed to see them coming unless the new opponent is hidden (in which case the creature isn't surprised but they are attacked with advantage since they do not see the creature prior to the attack being made.
P.S. In my opinion, any additional creatures entering combat should enter on their initiative - they move on their initiative - they should not be placed on the map and then roll their initiative since they are then possibly standing around doing nothing for several rounds until their initiative arrives - which makes no sense to me since they should have been using their movement on their initiative to enter the combat area in the first place.
Thanks for everyone's reply. It's funny that you said the priest rolled a 14 INT because that is exactly what they rolled and I fit them into the fray at that point. It worked well.