I’m horrible at hinting and foreshadowing. My players have been putzing around in my homebrew world of Ynd for about 1/2 months of real time, and about two weeks of in-game time; they are level three. I started with a sandbox format, allowing them to do whatever they wanted, dropping quests, jobs, and other story hooks in front of them. This was partly to give my new players time to learn the basics of the game, and partly to give myself time to actually come up with a plot.
Now I’m ready to start nudging the story towards the main plot, which is a loose, semi-linear story. A pair of elves is trying to make the Material Plane into a chaotic paradise similar to the Feywild. Thus far, they’ve been empowering beings of chaos (good and bad), opening portals, and sowing unrest and fear of the Law gone bad. Their most recent tactic involved summoning and unleashing a succubus, with the agreement that it corrupts as many people as possible, without killing them directly afterward; thus the succubus has been starting cults dedicated to Mammon and Graz’zt left and right. The chaos wrought by these actions has made it easier to open portals, and keep them open, allowing more influence from the plane of Faerie.
On the other hand, we have the Order of Law, a circle of Lawful Neutral Order clerics who are trying to counterbalance the rising chaotic influences, possibly achieving the opposite of the end desired by the Chaos Elves. The Order is not yet aware that these incidents are the work of the same force, although they have some suspicions. Their tactics so far have been the formation of a royally-approved posse to track down and destroy the succubus and the people whom she has corrupted, which is rapidly turning into an inquisition.
The players are not aware of either group yet, although they have investigated the Cult of Mammon somewhat, and know there’s a succubus on the lose. They don’t know about the blossoming inquisition yet.
So: what kind of hints can I use, and how do I use them? As I said, I’m awful at subtlety. I have a couple of powerful NPCs who can give them information, but I really don’t want to do that if I can avoid it; it just feels too contrived.
My ideas so far include: Dream sequences, Divine Visions for the paladin, Cryptic Prophecy from the Archfey patroness of the warlock, Cryptic Prophecy from the Diviner tutor of the wizard, and Cult Rituals designed to draw the Feywild (or another plane) closer to the Material Plane
As you can see, my ideas are few and stereotypical, and rather boring. Any help is appreciated!
Edited to add: I meant 1 and 1/2 months of real time.
Maybe they save/befriend someone who fell afoul of the succubus. As they go about their business in the area, they see that person being questioned by the Order of Law. Maybe they interfere, not knowing who the Order is, or maybe they get there just after the questioning and ask what is was about. this could be the hint, or just the first hint of many.
Maybe they try to learn more about who the inquisitor was, then learn about the Order, then decide if they want to join it.
You know the mechanics of your world the forces at play in the background it's a matter of how they affect the foreground of your world...
The forces of Chaos - more portals more rumors of diabolical beast rampaging, more chaotic cult activity and the subsequent rumors at the bar of what those may be The Forces of Law - tightening of laws inspections taxes guard recruitment drives and ultimately the big public show trials inquisitions
It sounds like you have a excellent grasp of what wheels are turning in your world and how it is changing it this I think is your best hint how is your world changing around the players
sounds like a super campaign by the way :D have fun wishing you all the best
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
“It cannot be seen, cannot be felt, Cannot be heard, cannot be smelt, It lies behind stars and under hills, And empty holes it fills, It comes first and follows after, Ends life, kills laughter.” J.R.R. Tolkien, The Hobbit, or There and Back Again
Don't worry about the foreshadowing so much: it should come quite naturally once you design the world.
Design the areas and locations for the players to explore, and ensure that you have a web of current events that both (a) demand player action, and (b) are caused by the anatagonist's actions. Sprinkle in documents that link to other areas, or explain what the specific NPC at that location has been doing, or just have them offer the information. But the NPCs don't know the whole plan. The PCs have to put it together from different elements.
Here's how my campaign has flowed:
Level 1: Players' ship was sunk. Players locate a dead body on the beach that shows signs of corruption, and has a tattoo reading 'WORKFORCE 3'. Fight some hobgobs in a lighthouse, learn who the local ruler is from them. Level 2: Players meet an NPC who can give them limited info on local area. Meet a dryad, also corrupted by a magical crystal in the stream. Go to the mine, explore dungeon, learn from the end boss that the old great evil returns (they don't know what it is, nor that it's an old great evil). Players want to find out what caused the issue at the mine, and so need to go to a nearby town that governs it. Level 3: Travelling to the town, do some sub-quests, meet some other survivors from the shipwreck who know more than they do (but not much). Help a small village where a mad bull has been corrupted as well, discovering an obelisk that seems to be the cause (and is constructed from stuff from the mine from level 2). On getting to the town, meet various NPCs, find that everyone has a WORKFORCE 2 tattoo, so that guy at level 1 came from somewhere else. The hobgobs bosses rule here. Meet a new NPC who has no memory, who joins them. Level 4: Sort out a series of dungeons and encounters around the town, which involve a major obelisk similar to the one at level 3, and which was built with the corrupted stone there. Learn that the stone has shipped to other places. The NPC with no memory learns her name, nothing else. Learn that the workers who made the obelisk were murdered on-site. Newly named NPC is told she smells like a magic stone found in the possession of Duergar in a mountain. Find out who ordered the workers to be killed, go into his ruined old mansion, find documents showing that he serves the dark old power, and that he has a prophecy. They basically know what they're up against. Level 5: The BBEG shows up after they burned down his house. They actually managed to fight and kill him (unintended! Which rocked) in his first form through clever play. They then decide to attack the hobgobs fort. I'm barely directing anything by this point. Level 6: PCs head off on a pirate ship (utterly unintended) to go to the biggest city to seek help from the ruler to stop corruption. On the way, they get attacked, crash the ship, and end up going to a mountain instead, as the nameless NPC wants to go there.
...and on it goes.
So essentially you have documents, NPCs, and events each giving the PCs a new location or bit of info that leads them to the next place. It's a chain of breadcrumbs, and naturally the PCs discover more significant information as the challenges get tougher.
Maybe they save/befriend someone who fell afoul of the succubus. As they go about their business in the area, they see that person being questioned by the Order of Law. Maybe they interfere, not knowing who the Order is, or maybe they get there just after the questioning and ask what is was about. this could be the hint, or just the first hint of many.
Maybe they try to learn more about who the inquisitor was, then learn about the Order, then decide if they want to join it.
Another option, if the PCs need to be directly shoehorned into the plot, is to have the PC group be questioned directly by the Inquisition. They're genuinely suspects of interest, given that they have an agent of an Archfey in the party - if the Inquisition used divine magic to determine who they should speak to in the city about the aims of the fey, the party warlock's description, location, or whatever the magic provides should show up in the list. It's very narratively appropriate for the party to be looked into.
They can find written orders in treasure hoards. These help because you write them in downtime, so you can have time to get it just right.
For more fun with those, the enemy throws it in a fire just before the fight starts, so parts of the note are burned off, not giving them all the information.
And it will be signed with a single letter instead of a name, and then you put in a number of NPCs who have a name that starts that way. Or signed with a code name or something like “the twins”
Maybe they save/befriend someone who fell afoul of the succubus. As they go about their business in the area, they see that person being questioned by the Order of Law. Maybe they interfere, not knowing who the Order is, or maybe they get there just after the questioning and ask what is was about. this could be the hint, or just the first hint of many.
Maybe they try to learn more about who the inquisitor was, then learn about the Order, then decide if they want to join it.
I really like the idea of one of their friends becoming an object of suspicion. The difficulty is in either finding someone for them to befriend, or turning one of their previous friends into a suspect. Thus far, they have not met anyone involved with the succubus whom they haven’t decided to turn over to the High Priestess of Helm, who’s a friend of theirs, and who has worked with the family of one character (a monster hunter fighter) in the past. However, I have thought about having her ask them to join the Order, as she is one of the principal founders/leaders of the group. The official Order is only a week old at this point; not a lot of in-game time has passed. But the PCs might be interested in joining a brand-new
I’m not sure I’m comfortable letting them join, when I know that the movement is already becoming very bloody very fast. My players, and all their characters, are good, kind-hearted people, half of whom (3 out of 5) have suffered severe trauma from religious abuse in the past. I don’t think it would be a good idea to let them think that the Order is (insert positive descriptor here), let them trust it, and then pull the “You’ve actually been enabling the abusive tactics of the people you thought were the good guys” card.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
You know the mechanics of your world the forces at play in the background it's a matter of how they affect the foreground of your world...
The forces of Chaos - more portals more rumors of diabolical beast rampaging, more chaotic cult activity and the subsequent rumors at the bar of what those may be The Forces of Law - tightening of laws inspections taxes guard recruitment drives and ultimately the big public show trials inquisitions
It sounds like you have a excellent grasp of what wheels are turning in your world and how it is changing it this I think is your best hint how is your world changing around the players
sounds like a super campaign by the way :D have fun wishing you all the best
Thank you. It has been fun! A big part of why I made a sandbox initially was to get a strong idea of how everything was working before I put the main plot into action.
I am working on the portal idea already. The Archfey warlock is a Kitsune, a homebrew faerie race, with the Hermit background; her “discovery” feature is that she has learned the basics of opening portals to the Feywild, which will definitely factor in if she decides she wants to pursue that story thread.
The Order’s inquisition is raising taxes (to pay its members), investigating unusually attractive men and women (in case the succubus is trying to hide in plain sight), investigating merchant families (since the most obvious example of corruption so far has been a merchant who succumbed to greed and became a bandit), and so on.
As for cults, there are two at the moment, with a third on the horizon; whether it gets established depends on how fast the succubus is caught. There’s the cult of Mammon, which is laying low at the moment from the excess attention, and the cult of Graz’zt, which is mostly an excuse for hedonistic partying, although the leaders have been opening portals to the Abyss to receive boons from their lord and master. They have ‘t been noticed by anyone in a position to interfere with them yet, largely because of the hysteria surrounding the cult of Mammon.
The PCs have just discovered that the forest they own property in is becoming infested with strange creatures; they don’t know exactly what yet, but I’m planning on Ettercaps and giant spiders, and evil fey. I might try looking for demons as well, but most of them are so disgusting of disturbing that I’d rather not have to play one!
One other idea that I just had was that maybe the Order of Law might hire modrons from Mechanus to enforce their laws. I want to present the picture that Ultimate Law isn’t a better choice than Ultimate Chaos; hence the inquisition. I’m having a hard time finding ways to do so, however; most of the lawful creatures I can find are (relatively) benevolent. There’s always the Duergar, of course, but none of my story takes place in the Underdark, because that setting makes me feel claustrophobic.
If anybody has ideas for dangerous/disastrous lawful enemies, I’d love to hear them!
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
Don't worry about the foreshadowing so much: it should come quite naturally once you design the world.
Design the areas and locations for the players to explore, and ensure that you have a web of current events that both (a) demand player action, and (b) are caused by the anatagonist's actions. Sprinkle in documents that link to other areas, or explain what the specific NPC at that location has been doing, or just have them offer the information. But the NPCs don't know the whole plan. The PCs have to put it together from different elements.
Here's how my campaign has flowed:
Level 1: Players' ship was sunk. Players locate a dead body on the beach that shows signs of corruption, and has a tattoo reading 'WORKFORCE 3'. Fight some hobgobs in a lighthouse, learn who the local ruler is from them. Level 2: Players meet an NPC who can give them limited info on local area. Meet a dryad, also corrupted by a magical crystal in the stream. Go to the mine, explore dungeon, learn from the end boss that the old great evil returns (they don't know what it is, nor that it's an old great evil). Players want to find out what caused the issue at the mine, and so need to go to a nearby town that governs it. Level 3: Travelling to the town, do some sub-quests, meet some other survivors from the shipwreck who know more than they do (but not much). Help a small village where a mad bull has been corrupted as well, discovering an obelisk that seems to be the cause (and is constructed from stuff from the mine from level 2). On getting to the town, meet various NPCs, find that everyone has a WORKFORCE 2 tattoo, so that guy at level 1 came from somewhere else. The hobgobs bosses rule here. Meet a new NPC who has no memory, who joins them. Level 4: Sort out a series of dungeons and encounters around the town, which involve a major obelisk similar to the one at level 3, and which was built with the corrupted stone there. Learn that the stone has shipped to other places. The NPC with no memory learns her name, nothing else. Learn that the workers who made the obelisk were murdered on-site. Newly named NPC is told she smells like a magic stone found in the possession of Duergar in a mountain. Find out who ordered the workers to be killed, go into his ruined old mansion, find documents showing that he serves the dark old power, and that he has a prophecy. They basically know what they're up against. Level 5: The BBEG shows up after they burned down his house. They actually managed to fight and kill him (unintended! Which rocked) in his first form through clever play. They then decide to attack the hobgobs fort. I'm barely directing anything by this point. Level 6: PCs head off on a pirate ship (utterly unintended) to go to the biggest city to seek help from the ruler to stop corruption. On the way, they get attacked, crash the ship, and end up going to a mountain instead, as the nameless NPC wants to go there.
...and on it goes.
So essentially you have documents, NPCs, and events each giving the PCs a new location or bit of info that leads them to the next place. It's a chain of breadcrumbs, and naturally the PCs discover more significant information as the challenges get tougher.
This is very similar to what I’ve been trying to do, but failing. I’ve been adding objects, magic items, and puzzles related to Law and Chaos, but to no effect; either it’s too subtle, my players have dismissed them, or both, or neither. I honestly have no idea.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
Maybe they save/befriend someone who fell afoul of the succubus. As they go about their business in the area, they see that person being questioned by the Order of Law. Maybe they interfere, not knowing who the Order is, or maybe they get there just after the questioning and ask what is was about. this could be the hint, or just the first hint of many.
Maybe they try to learn more about who the inquisitor was, then learn about the Order, then decide if they want to join it.
Another option, if the PCs need to be directly shoehorned into the plot, is to have the PC group be questioned directly by the Inquisition. They're genuinely suspects of interest, given that they have an agent of an Archfey in the party - if the Inquisition used divine magic to determine who they should speak to in the city about the aims of the fey, the party warlock's description, location, or whatever the magic provides should show up in the list. It's very narratively appropriate for the party to be looked into.
I’m definitely planning to use the Archfey connection; it’s just too serendipitous to ignore! The warlock is actually a faerie creature herself: a homebrew Kitsune. I’ll have to ask her if she minds being persecuted by two different forces, though; she’s already on the run from hunters chasing her for her pelt and flesh. She also appears as a beautiful elf woman most of the time, and since the Order of Law has made beautiful people automatically suspect, that’s likely going to become a problem for her.
I think I’m going to ask my players just how attractive they want their characters to be, and use that as a guide to whether anyone becomes a major suspect.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
They can find written orders in treasure hoards. These help because you write them in downtime, so you can have time to get it just right.
For more fun with those, the enemy throws it in a fire just before the fight starts, so parts of the note are burned off, not giving them all the information.
And it will be signed with a single letter instead of a name, and then you put in a number of NPCs who have a name that starts that way. Or signed with a code name or something like “the twins”
I like this idea. I’ll have to come up with something cool to call them, other than the Chaos Elves, which is what I call them in my personal notes.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
Mmm... dangerous/disastrous lawful enemy none more so then the self-righteous Mob take pogroms, Rwanda, khmer rouge or the cultural revolution our history is littered with them... I could quite easily see that kind of nightmare unfolding in your world if the target groups becomes "attractive people" or "wealthy merchants" and quite perversely I think Succubi would be masters at manipulating them.... but that might be a bit to dark and close to home
Was thinking about those Chaotic incursions originating from a forest the players own... this could quickly have repercussions for the players farmers villagers complaining that the beasts from the players property are killing their livestock and loved ones, rumors about what are the players doing in thier own wood? might be reason enough for the Law to start asking questions of the players suspect their involvement even... nothing like the incentive to clear ones good name
Super interesting campaign wishing you loads of fun
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
“It cannot be seen, cannot be felt, Cannot be heard, cannot be smelt, It lies behind stars and under hills, And empty holes it fills, It comes first and follows after, Ends life, kills laughter.” J.R.R. Tolkien, The Hobbit, or There and Back Again
Like others have said anything you use to artificially foreshadow will come across as a bit clunky, sometimes the best thing is to build your encounters and allow then the threads to come together. let me give you the example of my current campaign, similar to you sandbox/openworld, players are level 3.
the players met in an inn, one of them was getting conned by a small gang who where cheating at cards and taking his money from him. This was spotted, dealt with the gang sent on their way and the party formed. The party met the head of the towns guard who talked about how a gang had moved into the area and was causing lots of trouble, the party then realised this was being watched and listened to by a shady looking individual. They followed him out of the inn, saw him meet with the same gang they had run out of the inn, and then saw the group break into a merchants house.
The merchant house burglary was foiled, he was away but his housekeeper and her husband where there, they where saved. Party found out that the gang had been hired by an individual, name unknown (they had killed the gang member who had that info), who had given them a list of merchant houses to hit. They found out that the town was struggling as the mine it relied on for trade was slowing down and getting close to shutting down. The merchants on the list where all close to leaving the town which would have made the situation worse. They also found out the first hints of a cult that might be growing in town, one of the town priests had found a pamphlet proclaiming the return of the eldest.
They where then hired by the head of the merchant guild to track down his brother who had been returning having negotiated a new trade deal with the elves in a nearby forest. This led to the party tracking into the woods, finding a cave system full of goblins, killing the bugbears inside (3 of them) and saving the merchant, his 2 surviving guards and an elf women. It also led to them finding a note from the Red Tiger, instructing the gang leader to kidnap the merchant and hold him until instructed to kill him (yes this was lifted from mines of Phandelver). They linked that this might be the same individual who hired the gang to break into the merchant houses.
On returning they got several rumours and stories from various sources, they had a sense that the Red Tiger was, for some reason, trying to undermine the town, there next encounter came in the grave yard where reports of strange noises led them to a crypt where a dead priest (different one to earlier) was impaled with one of the pamphlets stuck to them with a dagger. What made it more confusing was that the body was 2 weeks old, but the priest had been seen coming in and out of the town gates only a few days previously informing people he was heading out of town for a while. 2 of the zombies are freshly dead (few days) one has the pamphlet in its pocket, the other an empty glass vial. There is more to the crypt but that is where the adventure ended
So the party know that there are at least 2 factions in town, they have a sense that someone or something is trying to sow discord and create tensions and have suggested amongst themselves that the 2 might be linked. This red tiger and the cult.
The reality, the Red Tiger is a wizard (they have met) who owns a magic shop and advises the council. He is also behind the cult, the Eldest being spoken of is an Aboleth that the wizard is aiding (he is immune to its enslave ability), who is trapped in the bottom of the mine in a large underwater lake. The wizard is trying to gain knowledge from the aboleth.
The members of the cult are all enslaved. Wizard has concocted a potion that helps enforce the enslave abilities making them far harder to break and extending the range they are effective. (disadvantage on wisdom saving throw if potion has been ingested in the past week, and the DC is increased by 5). Wizard has a simulacrum, but he did not directly make it, his previous clone did (I am bending the rules of the clone spell and simulacrum to state that if a magic user has created a simulacrum and then dies and is cloned, then the new wizard is a different magic user for the purposes of the spell, but, the simulacrum is still loyal to him because in its mind it is the same person).
Wizard creates a simulacrum, replaces the person he wants enslaved, teleports that person to the aboleth, leaves them there to get enslaved, then returns them and removes the simulacrum.
Now there are lots of ways the players can find out about this, there are clues all around the town, and the various encounters I have planned will also leave hints and information. The wizards end goal is to control the town council, and, when the aboleth gives him what he needs, then leave and hand the town to the aboleth as a thankyou but also to ensure anyone chasing him has to stop and deal with this huge threat to the nation. I am not going to force the information down their throats but I also will listen to my players. For instance the dead cleric wasn't going to have a pamphlet pinned to his chest but 2 of the players (not characters) where convinced the cult was linked to this so, to get them excited and reward them for thinking about the information I have give them so far, I decided to confirm that fact in game. In reality the wizard as red tiger has hired a shape changer to kill the priest and parade as him for the past week, although the most recent sighting was the wizard himself disguised as the priest.
So I would let the game take shape, put the encounters in front of your players and let them guide you with their decisions. But the best "foreshadowing" happens by accident as you take story elements the players latch onto and then make them part of the main overarching plot rewarding them for "discovering" the secrets.
A real easy way to get them involved is to have them hired by one of the special interest groups, and then design and adventure where the players learn about what is going by acting as proxies for the group that hired them. Perhaps they find out they don't agree/align with the interests of the group that hired them, and then they are well on their way to being wrapped up in the larger plot points.
Sounds like I’ve got some strategies to try out. Thank you guys so much!
Another trick I use is to listen to the players (not characters) out of game, for instance one player talked about an NPC I introduced and how she was convinced there was something off about them because of how I was answering questions as them There really wasn't but, I have now given that NPC a secret and worked them into the story so, when the reveal happens, the player can say, see I told you.
I don't always do this, sometimes it is good to make players think there is someting there when there isn't, but sometimes my players will be convinced of something. The great thing about my players is they are great at not then using that to define character actions. So in the case of this NPC the characters have no concerns (rolled a really low insight).
But I don't detail out my story up front, I have a sense of the beginning but the middle and end are defined by the players, I will have bullet points of whats going on but I leave it all very flexible because if my story isn't exciting the players I can segway it to something different.
A real easy way to get them involved is to have them hired by one of the special interest groups, and then design and adventure where the players learn about what is going by acting as proxies for the group that hired them. Perhaps they find out they don't agree/align with the interests of the group that hired them, and then they are well on their way to being wrapped up in the larger plot points.
That’s a good idea. They’re already friends of one of the leaders/founders of the Order of Law, whom they have been working with in a non-official capacity to find the succubus and its corrupted cultists. Several players have expressed a strong interest in making cult destruction their first priority (they have multiple story threads that they could follow at this point, and the party can’t agree on which one to follow first). I can also use the Archfey patron of our warlock for a similar purpose; she (the Summer Queen) has agreed not to encourage/help the Chaos Elves directly, but that doesn’t mean she doesn’t like the idea of Faerie gaining control of the Material Plane. I’m thinking of giving the warlock quests from her that indirectly aid the cause of Chaos.
Sounds like I’ve got some strategies to try out. Thank you guys so much!
Another trick I use is to listen to the players (not characters) out of game, for instance one player talked about an NPC I introduced and how she was convinced there was something off about them because of how I was answering questions as them There really wasn't but, I have now given that NPC a secret and worked them into the story so, when the reveal happens, the player can say, see I told you.
I don't always do this, sometimes it is good to make players think there is someting there when there isn't, but sometimes my players will be convinced of something. The great thing about my players is they are great at not then using that to define character actions. So in the case of this NPC the characters have no concerns (rolled a really low insight).
But I don't detail out my story up front, I have a sense of the beginning but the middle and end are defined by the players, I will have bullet points of whats going on but I leave it all very flexible because if my story isn't exciting the players I can segway it to something different.
Sounds like I’ve got some strategies to try out. Thank you guys so much!
Another trick I use is to listen to the players (not characters) out of game, for instance one player talked about an NPC I introduced and how she was convinced there was something off about them because of how I was answering questions as them There really wasn't but, I have now given that NPC a secret and worked them into the story so, when the reveal happens, the player can say, see I told you.
I don't always do this, sometimes it is good to make players think there is someting there when there isn't, but sometimes my players will be convinced of something. The great thing about my players is they are great at not then using that to define character actions. So in the case of this NPC the characters have no concerns (rolled a really low insight).
But I don't detail out my story up front, I have a sense of the beginning but the middle and end are defined by the players, I will have bullet points of whats going on but I leave it all very flexible because if my story isn't exciting the players I can segway it to something different.
This is also a very useful idea! The PCs were given a piece of land with a Wizard’s tower on it, which turned out to be inhabited by a pride of 16 sentient, talking cats. They’ve taken a particular liking to the matriarch and caretaker, Mnemosyne, and are convinced that she holds the secrets of the multiverse in her paws. She’s already wise, intelligent, and slightly smug (as befits a good-hearted yet ornery cat!), so it would be very easy to put a few more secrets in her possession. The players are already wondering why she just “allowed” them to settle there, when she’s clearly in charge of the place, so that could be a really easy tie-in.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
I have found that listening to the players, in or out of character, can be a great way to move something along. Sometimes it is for the characters' good, sometimes... it is not. My campaign was in a town that was overrun by skulks, who smashed a lot of mirrors. The party was convinced they were going up against vampires... I had a hard time keeping a straight face, but will admit I shifted some of the sounds and sights they heard/saw a little, to make them more convinced it was vampires...
I’m horrible at hinting and foreshadowing. My players have been putzing around in my homebrew world of Ynd for about 1/2 months of real time, and about two weeks of in-game time; they are level three. I started with a sandbox format, allowing them to do whatever they wanted, dropping quests, jobs, and other story hooks in front of them. This was partly to give my new players time to learn the basics of the game, and partly to give myself time to actually come up with a plot.
Now I’m ready to start nudging the story towards the main plot, which is a loose, semi-linear story. A pair of elves is trying to make the Material Plane into a chaotic paradise similar to the Feywild. Thus far, they’ve been empowering beings of chaos (good and bad), opening portals, and sowing unrest and fear of the Law gone bad. Their most recent tactic involved summoning and unleashing a succubus, with the agreement that it corrupts as many people as possible, without killing them directly afterward; thus the succubus has been starting cults dedicated to Mammon and Graz’zt left and right. The chaos wrought by these actions has made it easier to open portals, and keep them open, allowing more influence from the plane of Faerie.
On the other hand, we have the Order of Law, a circle of Lawful Neutral Order clerics who are trying to counterbalance the rising chaotic influences, possibly achieving the opposite of the end desired by the Chaos Elves. The Order is not yet aware that these incidents are the work of the same force, although they have some suspicions. Their tactics so far have been the formation of a royally-approved posse to track down and destroy the succubus and the people whom she has corrupted, which is rapidly turning into an inquisition.
The players are not aware of either group yet, although they have investigated the Cult of Mammon somewhat, and know there’s a succubus on the lose. They don’t know about the blossoming inquisition yet.
So: what kind of hints can I use, and how do I use them? As I said, I’m awful at subtlety. I have a couple of powerful NPCs who can give them information, but I really don’t want to do that if I can avoid it; it just feels too contrived.
My ideas so far include: Dream sequences, Divine Visions for the paladin, Cryptic Prophecy from the Archfey patroness of the warlock, Cryptic Prophecy from the Diviner tutor of the wizard, and Cult Rituals designed to draw the Feywild (or another plane) closer to the Material Plane
As you can see, my ideas are few and stereotypical, and rather boring. Any help is appreciated!
Edited to add: I meant 1 and 1/2 months of real time.
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
Maybe they save/befriend someone who fell afoul of the succubus. As they go about their business in the area, they see that person being questioned by the Order of Law. Maybe they interfere, not knowing who the Order is, or maybe they get there just after the questioning and ask what is was about. this could be the hint, or just the first hint of many.
Maybe they try to learn more about who the inquisitor was, then learn about the Order, then decide if they want to join it.
You know the mechanics of your world the forces at play in the background it's a matter of how they affect the foreground of your world...
The forces of Chaos - more portals more rumors of diabolical beast rampaging, more chaotic cult activity and the subsequent rumors at the bar of what those may be
The Forces of Law - tightening of laws inspections taxes guard recruitment drives and ultimately the big public show trials inquisitions
It sounds like you have a excellent grasp of what wheels are turning in your world and how it is changing it this I think is your best hint how is your world changing around the players
sounds like a super campaign by the way :D have fun wishing you all the best
“It cannot be seen, cannot be felt, Cannot be heard, cannot be smelt, It lies behind stars and under hills, And empty holes it fills, It comes first and follows after, Ends life, kills laughter.” J.R.R. Tolkien, The Hobbit, or There and Back Again
Don't worry about the foreshadowing so much: it should come quite naturally once you design the world.
Design the areas and locations for the players to explore, and ensure that you have a web of current events that both (a) demand player action, and (b) are caused by the anatagonist's actions. Sprinkle in documents that link to other areas, or explain what the specific NPC at that location has been doing, or just have them offer the information. But the NPCs don't know the whole plan. The PCs have to put it together from different elements.
Here's how my campaign has flowed:
Level 1: Players' ship was sunk. Players locate a dead body on the beach that shows signs of corruption, and has a tattoo reading 'WORKFORCE 3'. Fight some hobgobs in a lighthouse, learn who the local ruler is from them.
Level 2: Players meet an NPC who can give them limited info on local area. Meet a dryad, also corrupted by a magical crystal in the stream. Go to the mine, explore dungeon, learn from the end boss that the old great evil returns (they don't know what it is, nor that it's an old great evil). Players want to find out what caused the issue at the mine, and so need to go to a nearby town that governs it.
Level 3: Travelling to the town, do some sub-quests, meet some other survivors from the shipwreck who know more than they do (but not much). Help a small village where a mad bull has been corrupted as well, discovering an obelisk that seems to be the cause (and is constructed from stuff from the mine from level 2). On getting to the town, meet various NPCs, find that everyone has a WORKFORCE 2 tattoo, so that guy at level 1 came from somewhere else. The hobgobs bosses rule here. Meet a new NPC who has no memory, who joins them.
Level 4: Sort out a series of dungeons and encounters around the town, which involve a major obelisk similar to the one at level 3, and which was built with the corrupted stone there. Learn that the stone has shipped to other places. The NPC with no memory learns her name, nothing else. Learn that the workers who made the obelisk were murdered on-site. Newly named NPC is told she smells like a magic stone found in the possession of Duergar in a mountain. Find out who ordered the workers to be killed, go into his ruined old mansion, find documents showing that he serves the dark old power, and that he has a prophecy. They basically know what they're up against.
Level 5: The BBEG shows up after they burned down his house. They actually managed to fight and kill him (unintended! Which rocked) in his first form through clever play. They then decide to attack the hobgobs fort. I'm barely directing anything by this point.
Level 6: PCs head off on a pirate ship (utterly unintended) to go to the biggest city to seek help from the ruler to stop corruption. On the way, they get attacked, crash the ship, and end up going to a mountain instead, as the nameless NPC wants to go there.
...and on it goes.
So essentially you have documents, NPCs, and events each giving the PCs a new location or bit of info that leads them to the next place. It's a chain of breadcrumbs, and naturally the PCs discover more significant information as the challenges get tougher.
Another option, if the PCs need to be directly shoehorned into the plot, is to have the PC group be questioned directly by the Inquisition. They're genuinely suspects of interest, given that they have an agent of an Archfey in the party - if the Inquisition used divine magic to determine who they should speak to in the city about the aims of the fey, the party warlock's description, location, or whatever the magic provides should show up in the list. It's very narratively appropriate for the party to be looked into.
They can find written orders in treasure hoards. These help because you write them in downtime, so you can have time to get it just right.
For more fun with those, the enemy throws it in a fire just before the fight starts, so parts of the note are burned off, not giving them all the information.
And it will be signed with a single letter instead of a name, and then you put in a number of NPCs who have a name that starts that way. Or signed with a code name or something like “the twins”
Lots of good ideas and interesting thoughts here.
I really like the idea of one of their friends becoming an object of suspicion. The difficulty is in either finding someone for them to befriend, or turning one of their previous friends into a suspect. Thus far, they have not met anyone involved with the succubus whom they haven’t decided to turn over to the High Priestess of Helm, who’s a friend of theirs, and who has worked with the family of one character (a monster hunter fighter) in the past. However, I have thought about having her ask them to join the Order, as she is one of the principal founders/leaders of the group. The official Order is only a week old at this point; not a lot of in-game time has passed. But the PCs might be interested in joining a brand-new
I’m not sure I’m comfortable letting them join, when I know that the movement is already becoming very bloody very fast. My players, and all their characters, are good, kind-hearted people, half of whom (3 out of 5) have suffered severe trauma from religious abuse in the past. I don’t think it would be a good idea to let them think that the Order is (insert positive descriptor here), let them trust it, and then pull the “You’ve actually been enabling the abusive tactics of the people you thought were the good guys” card.
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
Thank you. It has been fun! A big part of why I made a sandbox initially was to get a strong idea of how everything was working before I put the main plot into action.
I am working on the portal idea already. The Archfey warlock is a Kitsune, a homebrew faerie race, with the Hermit background; her “discovery” feature is that she has learned the basics of opening portals to the Feywild, which will definitely factor in if she decides she wants to pursue that story thread.
The Order’s inquisition is raising taxes (to pay its members), investigating unusually attractive men and women (in case the succubus is trying to hide in plain sight), investigating merchant families (since the most obvious example of corruption so far has been a merchant who succumbed to greed and became a bandit), and so on.
As for cults, there are two at the moment, with a third on the horizon; whether it gets established depends on how fast the succubus is caught. There’s the cult of Mammon, which is laying low at the moment from the excess attention, and the cult of Graz’zt, which is mostly an excuse for hedonistic partying, although the leaders have been opening portals to the Abyss to receive boons from their lord and master. They have ‘t been noticed by anyone in a position to interfere with them yet, largely because of the hysteria surrounding the cult of Mammon.
The PCs have just discovered that the forest they own property in is becoming infested with strange creatures; they don’t know exactly what yet, but I’m planning on Ettercaps and giant spiders, and evil fey. I might try looking for demons as well, but most of them are so disgusting of disturbing that I’d rather not have to play one!
One other idea that I just had was that maybe the Order of Law might hire modrons from Mechanus to enforce their laws. I want to present the picture that Ultimate Law isn’t a better choice than Ultimate Chaos; hence the inquisition. I’m having a hard time finding ways to do so, however; most of the lawful creatures I can find are (relatively) benevolent. There’s always the Duergar, of course, but none of my story takes place in the Underdark, because that setting makes me feel claustrophobic.
If anybody has ideas for dangerous/disastrous lawful enemies, I’d love to hear them!
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
This is very similar to what I’ve been trying to do, but failing. I’ve been adding objects, magic items, and puzzles related to Law and Chaos, but to no effect; either it’s too subtle, my players have dismissed them, or both, or neither. I honestly have no idea.
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
I’m definitely planning to use the Archfey connection; it’s just too serendipitous to ignore! The warlock is actually a faerie creature herself: a homebrew Kitsune. I’ll have to ask her if she minds being persecuted by two different forces, though; she’s already on the run from hunters chasing her for her pelt and flesh. She also appears as a beautiful elf woman most of the time, and since the Order of Law has made beautiful people automatically suspect, that’s likely going to become a problem for her.
I think I’m going to ask my players just how attractive they want their characters to be, and use that as a guide to whether anyone becomes a major suspect.
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
I like this idea. I’ll have to come up with something cool to call them, other than the Chaos Elves, which is what I call them in my personal notes.
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
Mmm... dangerous/disastrous lawful enemy none more so then the self-righteous Mob take pogroms, Rwanda, khmer rouge or the cultural revolution our history is littered with them... I could quite easily see that kind of nightmare unfolding in your world if the target groups becomes "attractive people" or "wealthy merchants" and quite perversely I think Succubi would be masters at manipulating them.... but that might be a bit to dark and close to home
Was thinking about those Chaotic incursions originating from a forest the players own... this could quickly have repercussions for the players farmers villagers complaining that the beasts from the players property are killing their livestock and loved ones, rumors about what are the players doing in thier own wood? might be reason enough for the Law to start asking questions of the players suspect their involvement even... nothing like the incentive to clear ones good name
Super interesting campaign wishing you loads of fun
“It cannot be seen, cannot be felt, Cannot be heard, cannot be smelt, It lies behind stars and under hills, And empty holes it fills, It comes first and follows after, Ends life, kills laughter.” J.R.R. Tolkien, The Hobbit, or There and Back Again
Like others have said anything you use to artificially foreshadow will come across as a bit clunky, sometimes the best thing is to build your encounters and allow then the threads to come together. let me give you the example of my current campaign, similar to you sandbox/openworld, players are level 3.
the players met in an inn, one of them was getting conned by a small gang who where cheating at cards and taking his money from him. This was spotted, dealt with the gang sent on their way and the party formed. The party met the head of the towns guard who talked about how a gang had moved into the area and was causing lots of trouble, the party then realised this was being watched and listened to by a shady looking individual. They followed him out of the inn, saw him meet with the same gang they had run out of the inn, and then saw the group break into a merchants house.
The merchant house burglary was foiled, he was away but his housekeeper and her husband where there, they where saved. Party found out that the gang had been hired by an individual, name unknown (they had killed the gang member who had that info), who had given them a list of merchant houses to hit. They found out that the town was struggling as the mine it relied on for trade was slowing down and getting close to shutting down. The merchants on the list where all close to leaving the town which would have made the situation worse. They also found out the first hints of a cult that might be growing in town, one of the town priests had found a pamphlet proclaiming the return of the eldest.
They where then hired by the head of the merchant guild to track down his brother who had been returning having negotiated a new trade deal with the elves in a nearby forest. This led to the party tracking into the woods, finding a cave system full of goblins, killing the bugbears inside (3 of them) and saving the merchant, his 2 surviving guards and an elf women. It also led to them finding a note from the Red Tiger, instructing the gang leader to kidnap the merchant and hold him until instructed to kill him (yes this was lifted from mines of Phandelver). They linked that this might be the same individual who hired the gang to break into the merchant houses.
On returning they got several rumours and stories from various sources, they had a sense that the Red Tiger was, for some reason, trying to undermine the town, there next encounter came in the grave yard where reports of strange noises led them to a crypt where a dead priest (different one to earlier) was impaled with one of the pamphlets stuck to them with a dagger. What made it more confusing was that the body was 2 weeks old, but the priest had been seen coming in and out of the town gates only a few days previously informing people he was heading out of town for a while. 2 of the zombies are freshly dead (few days) one has the pamphlet in its pocket, the other an empty glass vial. There is more to the crypt but that is where the adventure ended
So the party know that there are at least 2 factions in town, they have a sense that someone or something is trying to sow discord and create tensions and have suggested amongst themselves that the 2 might be linked. This red tiger and the cult.
The reality, the Red Tiger is a wizard (they have met) who owns a magic shop and advises the council. He is also behind the cult, the Eldest being spoken of is an Aboleth that the wizard is aiding (he is immune to its enslave ability), who is trapped in the bottom of the mine in a large underwater lake. The wizard is trying to gain knowledge from the aboleth.
The members of the cult are all enslaved. Wizard has concocted a potion that helps enforce the enslave abilities making them far harder to break and extending the range they are effective. (disadvantage on wisdom saving throw if potion has been ingested in the past week, and the DC is increased by 5). Wizard has a simulacrum, but he did not directly make it, his previous clone did (I am bending the rules of the clone spell and simulacrum to state that if a magic user has created a simulacrum and then dies and is cloned, then the new wizard is a different magic user for the purposes of the spell, but, the simulacrum is still loyal to him because in its mind it is the same person).
Wizard creates a simulacrum, replaces the person he wants enslaved, teleports that person to the aboleth, leaves them there to get enslaved, then returns them and removes the simulacrum.
Now there are lots of ways the players can find out about this, there are clues all around the town, and the various encounters I have planned will also leave hints and information. The wizards end goal is to control the town council, and, when the aboleth gives him what he needs, then leave and hand the town to the aboleth as a thankyou but also to ensure anyone chasing him has to stop and deal with this huge threat to the nation. I am not going to force the information down their throats but I also will listen to my players. For instance the dead cleric wasn't going to have a pamphlet pinned to his chest but 2 of the players (not characters) where convinced the cult was linked to this so, to get them excited and reward them for thinking about the information I have give them so far, I decided to confirm that fact in game. In reality the wizard as red tiger has hired a shape changer to kill the priest and parade as him for the past week, although the most recent sighting was the wizard himself disguised as the priest.
So I would let the game take shape, put the encounters in front of your players and let them guide you with their decisions. But the best "foreshadowing" happens by accident as you take story elements the players latch onto and then make them part of the main overarching plot rewarding them for "discovering" the secrets.
Sounds like I’ve got some strategies to try out. Thank you guys so much!
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
A real easy way to get them involved is to have them hired by one of the special interest groups, and then design and adventure where the players learn about what is going by acting as proxies for the group that hired them. Perhaps they find out they don't agree/align with the interests of the group that hired them, and then they are well on their way to being wrapped up in the larger plot points.
Another trick I use is to listen to the players (not characters) out of game, for instance one player talked about an NPC I introduced and how she was convinced there was something off about them because of how I was answering questions as them There really wasn't but, I have now given that NPC a secret and worked them into the story so, when the reveal happens, the player can say, see I told you.
I don't always do this, sometimes it is good to make players think there is someting there when there isn't, but sometimes my players will be convinced of something. The great thing about my players is they are great at not then using that to define character actions. So in the case of this NPC the characters have no concerns (rolled a really low insight).
But I don't detail out my story up front, I have a sense of the beginning but the middle and end are defined by the players, I will have bullet points of whats going on but I leave it all very flexible because if my story isn't exciting the players I can segway it to something different.
That’s a good idea. They’re already friends of one of the leaders/founders of the Order of Law, whom they have been working with in a non-official capacity to find the succubus and its corrupted cultists. Several players have expressed a strong interest in making cult destruction their first priority (they have multiple story threads that they could follow at this point, and the party can’t agree on which one to follow first). I can also use the Archfey patron of our warlock for a similar purpose; she (the Summer Queen) has agreed not to encourage/help the Chaos Elves directly, but that doesn’t mean she doesn’t like the idea of Faerie gaining control of the Material Plane. I’m thinking of giving the warlock quests from her that indirectly aid the cause of Chaos.
This is also a very useful idea! The PCs were given a piece of land with a Wizard’s tower on it, which turned out to be inhabited by a pride of 16 sentient, talking cats. They’ve taken a particular liking to the matriarch and caretaker, Mnemosyne, and are convinced that she holds the secrets of the multiverse in her paws. She’s already wise, intelligent, and slightly smug (as befits a good-hearted yet ornery cat!), so it would be very easy to put a few more secrets in her possession. The players are already wondering why she just “allowed” them to settle there, when she’s clearly in charge of the place, so that could be a really easy tie-in.
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.
I have found that listening to the players, in or out of character, can be a great way to move something along. Sometimes it is for the characters' good, sometimes... it is not. My campaign was in a town that was overrun by skulks, who smashed a lot of mirrors. The party was convinced they were going up against vampires... I had a hard time keeping a straight face, but will admit I shifted some of the sounds and sights they heard/saw a little, to make them more convinced it was vampires...
Lol
I live with several severe autoimmune conditions. If I don’t get back to you right away, it’s probably because I’m not feeling well.