I disagree about a high movement character not being a team player. The three big rolls are:
Tank
DPR
Utility
While it's certainly possible to have an RPG with those roles, it isn't really D&D. While you want more attacks to be directed at your more durable characters, you don't want focus fire either; even very tough characters don't last long if all the attacks are aimed at them (a phrase from a prior campaign: 'thank you for contributing your valuable hit points to the encounter').
Out of context misinterpreation. I did not not say we wanted 100% focused fire, not even 50% You used a far more strict interpretation of what a tank is than I was, and it was not relevant to the discussion. By your interpretation, only tanks would ever be hit. If anyone else takes 1 point of damage, the tank failed. That idea only works in some particularly strange video games.
The Tank/DPR/Utility extends to pretty much any form of multi-person combat. Whether you are discussing police, war, or D&D, everyone combatant can be categorized as tank, dpr, utility. Medics are not snipers are not door breachers. Air Craft Carriers (DPR) are not fuel ships (utility) are not battleships (tanks). The reason is simple - all combatants need some form of defense, some form of offense, and some form of utility. You wouldn't go into battle with any AC, any weapon, and at least one thing that is not armor or weapons.
Back to my original point. No one will complain about a PC hanging back. It happens all the time with characters that are not playing the role of a tank. It is normal behavior and not worth mentioning, let alone complaining about.
Out of context misinterpreation. I did not not say we wanted 100% focused fire, not even 50%
You said it was okay for a character to not be targeted.
D&D combat, because of the nature of hit points, produces some anomalies that don't correspond to anything in the real world. Most notably, characters fight at full strength until hit points are reduced to zero. This means spreading your fire is a very poor tactic, because you haven't really gained anything until a target is dead, and defensively, you want to encourage your opponents to spread their fire. The character who is hanging back is inadvertently encouraging the enemy to use good tactics.
Considering there are a bunch of items he cannot use, I'd say it's balanced. He can't use boots of striding and springing, boots of the winterlands, slippers of spider climbing, etc. It's about the only item available for the "feet" slot. The mobility is nice, but not every fight is in a space that lets you take advantage of it. I've played the monk with mobility, and it was cool but not game-breaking. Monks basically specialize in being elusive and hard to affect or pin down (all saves proficient, missile parry, mobility, dodge) and are only moderate hitters unless using a limited resource (stun, quivering palm if that's your schtick). This makes them more so, but doesn't break the model. Now a centaur barbarian with these is basically a runaway locomotive. Lance, shield, and a couple of totem powers and you're leaping/flying all over knocking opponents down like ninepins.
If a monster "readied an attack" then the fast monk could be hit as he runs in and out, right?
Yes but unless he has immunity to opportunity attacks from say the Disengage action or Ashardalon's Stride spell then there is no point becuase an ordinary opportunity attack will get them
You could also give an enemy or two a feat like sentinel or alternatively a weapon like a net.
Horseshoes of speed don’t require attunement because they were written for mounts which have no official attunement slots. But I would totally allow it, back in 2e I had a Tiefling with cloven hooves that used a pair of horseshoes of speed. Your player’s centaur can’t wear regular boots of speed, or boots of elvenkind, or any of the magic boots for that matter, nor slippers of spider climbing for that matter. And they have a dickens of a time climbing too. And it’s not like you can’t address things as a DM, if there are groups of monsters then at least some of them will get OAs in as the centaur races past, and enemies with ranged attacks will always be a threat.
There are some potentially significant downsides to being a centaur, as a trade off I’d allow horseshoes of speed. At high enough levels I would even be okay with horseshoes of a zephyr depending on whatever other magic items were in the campaign. But I wouldn’t let them be purchased at a shop, I’d make it a quest to get them so they can at least feel like they’ve earned their “racing stripes.”
How did that work with all 4 horseshoes needing to be worn to get the affect?
If a monster "readied an attack" then the fast monk could be hit as he runs in and out, right?
Yes but unless he has immunity to opportunity attacks from say the Disengage action or Ashardalon's Stride spell then there is no point becuase an ordinary opportunity attack will get them
You could also give an enemy or two a feat like sentinel or alternatively a weapon like a net.
I was thinking that a readied spell like Web could pose a problem for the Centaur.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt
If a monster "readied an attack" then the fast monk could be hit as he runs in and out, right?
Yes but unless he has immunity to opportunity attacks from say the Disengage action or Ashardalon's Stride spell then there is no point becuase an ordinary opportunity attack will get them
You could also give an enemy or two a feat like sentinel or alternatively a weapon like a net.
I was thinking that a readied spell like Web could pose a problem for the Centaur.
Oh, you probably wouldn't have to, web has decent range and it creates a continuous effect in the area that would effect them if they move through it . Grease, transmute rock, spike growth and hunger of Hadar are similar
You might have to ready a spell like hold person but I don't know how often he will be able to get more than 60 ft away or more realistically 90ft as enemies can move 30 ft a round. 90ft rooms aren't super common. That is only if you don't have war caster though.
It's also worth keeping in mind that as an opportunity attack you can
There really is no lack of ways to challenge it, its just about finding that balance between not challenging them at all and completely nullifying them with counters.
It's hard to worry about high ground speed when missile weapons exist. An awful lot of monsters have no effective way of engaging an archer, other than by holing up in dungeons with extremely short sight lines.
I'm currently in a campaign running my lvl 12 Centaur Druid (Circle of Dreams). This Really lets me get around the map. I charge up to 70', do damage and bounce to out (Hidden Paths: teleport 60')
Charge up to 70' > Primal Savagery > Attack (Weapon, Hooves, Charge & Primal Savagery) > Hidden Paths to safety
Was a lot of fun to watch the first time it triggered.
About Me: Godless monster in human form bent on extending their natural life to unnatural extremes /general of the goose horde /Moderator of Vinstreb School for the Gifted /holder of the evil storyteller badge of no honor /king of madness /The FBI/ The Archmage of I CAST...!
Alignment: Lawful Evil
Fun Fact: i gain more power the more you post on my forum threads. MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Out of context misinterpreation. I did not not say we wanted 100% focused fire, not even 50% You used a far more strict interpretation of what a tank is than I was, and it was not relevant to the discussion. By your interpretation, only tanks would ever be hit. If anyone else takes 1 point of damage, the tank failed. That idea only works in some particularly strange video games.
The Tank/DPR/Utility extends to pretty much any form of multi-person combat. Whether you are discussing police, war, or D&D, everyone combatant can be categorized as tank, dpr, utility. Medics are not snipers are not door breachers. Air Craft Carriers (DPR) are not fuel ships (utility) are not battleships (tanks). The reason is simple - all combatants need some form of defense, some form of offense, and some form of utility. You wouldn't go into battle with any AC, any weapon, and at least one thing that is not armor or weapons.
Back to my original point. No one will complain about a PC hanging back. It happens all the time with characters that are not playing the role of a tank. It is normal behavior and not worth mentioning, let alone complaining about.
You said it was okay for a character to not be targeted.
D&D combat, because of the nature of hit points, produces some anomalies that don't correspond to anything in the real world. Most notably, characters fight at full strength until hit points are reduced to zero. This means spreading your fire is a very poor tactic, because you haven't really gained anything until a target is dead, and defensively, you want to encourage your opponents to spread their fire. The character who is hanging back is inadvertently encouraging the enemy to use good tactics.
Considering there are a bunch of items he cannot use, I'd say it's balanced. He can't use boots of striding and springing, boots of the winterlands, slippers of spider climbing, etc. It's about the only item available for the "feet" slot. The mobility is nice, but not every fight is in a space that lets you take advantage of it. I've played the monk with mobility, and it was cool but not game-breaking. Monks basically specialize in being elusive and hard to affect or pin down (all saves proficient, missile parry, mobility, dodge) and are only moderate hitters unless using a limited resource (stun, quivering palm if that's your schtick). This makes them more so, but doesn't break the model. Now a centaur barbarian with these is basically a runaway locomotive. Lance, shield, and a couple of totem powers and you're leaping/flying all over knocking opponents down like ninepins.
If a monster "readied an attack" then the fast monk could be hit as he runs in and out, right?
Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt
Yes but unless he has immunity to opportunity attacks from say the Disengage action or Ashardalon's Stride spell then there is no point becuase an ordinary opportunity attack will get them
You could also give an enemy or two a feat like sentinel or alternatively a weapon like a net.
You know what counters a high ground speed really well?
Caltrops, bear traps, tripwires, and other nasty things you can step on/run into. Or go with spells like Spike Growth, Blade Barrier, or Wall of Fire.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
How did that work with all 4 horseshoes needing to be worn to get the affect?
I was thinking that a readied spell like Web could pose a problem for the Centaur.
Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt
Oh, you probably wouldn't have to, web has decent range and it creates a continuous effect in the area that would effect them if they move through it . Grease, transmute rock, spike growth and hunger of Hadar are similar
You might have to ready a spell like hold person but I don't know how often he will be able to get more than 60 ft away or more realistically 90ft as enemies can move 30 ft a round. 90ft rooms aren't super common. That is only if you don't have war caster though.
It's also worth keeping in mind that as an opportunity attack you can
With ready you can grapple, shove or [Tooltip Not Found].
There really is no lack of ways to challenge it, its just about finding that balance between not challenging them at all and completely nullifying them with counters.
It's hard to worry about high ground speed when missile weapons exist. An awful lot of monsters have no effective way of engaging an archer, other than by holing up in dungeons with extremely short sight lines.
I'm currently in a campaign running my lvl 12 Centaur Druid (Circle of Dreams). This Really lets me get around the map. I charge up to 70', do damage and bounce to out (Hidden Paths: teleport 60')
Charge up to 70' > Primal Savagery > Attack (Weapon, Hooves, Charge & Primal Savagery) > Hidden Paths to safety
Was a lot of fun to watch the first time it triggered.
yes
Pronouns: Any/All
About Me: Godless monster in human form bent on extending their natural life to unnatural extremes /general of the goose horde /Moderator of Vinstreb School for the Gifted /holder of the evil storyteller badge of no honor /king of madness /The FBI/ The Archmage of I CAST...!
Alignment: Lawful Evil
Fun Fact: i gain more power the more you post on my forum threads. MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!