Final boss fight coming up,. My party is a level 20 twilight cleric, lvl 20 soulknife rogue, and lvl 20 bard (dont remember subclass) with plenty of magic equipment.
What I have in store- round 1- About 6 level 11 guards (Rune Knight, Wizard, Barbarian, Warlock, Rogue, Monk/Paladin hybrid).
Round 2- Modified Tarrasque (breath weapon, immune to 4th level spells and below, 30hp Regen each turn)
Round 3- This is where I am thinking its too much possibly- using the 4 elder elementals all at once (Elder Tempest, Phoenix, Leviathan, and Zaratan).
Round 4- Souped up lvl 20 Druid with lots of legendary actions/lair actions by himself.
What do you think? Is this too much for the party, even high level?
The party ALL has an AC of at least 24, the twilight cleric gives a minimum 21 temp HP every single round, and the rogue dodges pretty much any dex save tossed at him, with the druid being able to debuff to an insane degree.
Honestly, you know your players best, and high level characters are incredibly variable. I assume those aren't literal rounds, with the possible exception of the first encounter I don't think any of them can end in one round.
Final boss fight coming up,. My party is a level 20 twilight cleric, lvl 20 soulknife rogue, and lvl 20 bard (dont remember subclass) with plenty of magic equipment.
What I have in store- round 1- About 6 level 11 guards (Rune Knight, Wizard, Barbarian, Warlock, Rogue, Monk/Paladin hybrid).
Round 2- Modified Tarrasque (breath weapon, immune to 4th level spells and below, 30hp Regen each turn)
Round 3- This is where I am thinking its too much possibly- using the 4 elder elementals all at once (Elder Tempest, Phoenix, Leviathan, and Zaratan).
Round 4- Souped up lvl 20 Druid with lots of legendary actions/lair actions by himself.
What do you think? Is this too much for the party, even high level?
The party ALL has an AC of at least 24, the twilight cleric gives a minimum 21 temp HP every single round, and the rogue dodges pretty much any dex save tossed at him, with the druid being able to debuff to an insane degree.
Thoughts?
This is three characters only, right? If these waves give no time to recoup, then it could certainly be too much if rolls end up being bad. I like your first wave, it should be interesting, not hard, but definitely gives you that initial impression of how well they'll do with the other waves. I'd see how that goes, then proceed depending on what sort of vibe you are getting. As a player, I think Round 3 would be the one I'd dread / be annoyed with the most. Usually, those creatures are fought by themselves, with maybe a small handful of underlings / environmental hazards.
So in my view, Round 3 is the one that'd concern me.
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Enjoy your slop. I'll be enjoying good products elsewhere.
Youre correct, i should have said waves or phases.
The Rogue can teleport and does excellent single target damage, the cleric, along with his temp HP every round, is able to do amazing DoT with summoned creatures, bonus actions, and actions (dude can somehow do like 5 attacks a turn with different spells) and the bard does either lots of debuffing or lots of AoE attacks.
Some of these are incredibly variable depending on situation. Most notably, the Tarrasque is really dangerous if you have to fight it in a box where you can't keep out of its reach, but in a more open environment it's likely to die without inflicting any damage because it just doesn't have the tools to force an engagement.
The battlefield is a field of open war (hence the first wave), so there is no dungeon crawl preceding it.
The Breath weapon I gave it is to help deal with any flying enemies/enemies who stay at a distance. The PCs are good at spreading out enough to make it difficult to hit multiple of them, but stay close enough to benefit from the clerics healing ability.
I would note that "can somehow do X" may actually mean "is playing fast and loose with the rules" -- if you don't know how someone is doing something, you have no way to know whether it's actually using the rules correctly. I can't think of a rules-legal way to get five attacks per round on a twilight cleric, unless most of them are being done by a summon.
If wave three is your main concern, you can always alter it depending on how the party is doing. If they're kicking major butt, use all four. If it's looking shaky, use fewer.
In fairness, im at work right now and not exactly looking at his stat sheet lol
But yes, he has 2 summons, his channel divinity, spiritual weapon, and his action. There might be one other thing he is capable of doing, cant remember off the top of my head.
I would note that "can somehow do X" may actually mean "is playing fast and loose with the rules" -- if you don't know how someone is doing something, you have no way to know whether it's actually using the rules correctly. I can't think of a rules-legal way to get five attacks per round on a twilight cleric, unless most of them are being done by a summon.
A 6th level summon celestial is 3 attacks, 8th level would be four. The cleric has one attack of their own and could cast Spiritual Weapon for a second attack. The celestial could be summoned before the fight. The only problem with summon celestial is that it requires concentration which prevents the cleric from using some of their other spells - especially Banishment since that one can very effectively and single handedly rebalance an entire encounter, particularly when upcast. I don't know where the cleric would get a second summons from though since most require concentration.
However, I agree with you, the DM needs to know what rules the character is using to attain their abilities.
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Final boss fight coming up,. My party is a level 20 twilight cleric, lvl 20 soulknife rogue, and lvl 20 bard (dont remember subclass) with plenty of magic equipment.
What I have in store- round 1- About 6 level 11 guards (Rune Knight, Wizard, Barbarian, Warlock, Rogue, Monk/Paladin hybrid).
Round 2- Modified Tarrasque (breath weapon, immune to 4th level spells and below, 30hp Regen each turn)
Round 3- This is where I am thinking its too much possibly- using the 4 elder elementals all at once (Elder Tempest, Phoenix, Leviathan, and Zaratan).
Round 4- Souped up lvl 20 Druid with lots of legendary actions/lair actions by himself.
What do you think? Is this too much for the party, even high level?
The party ALL has an AC of at least 24, the twilight cleric gives a minimum 21 temp HP every single round, and the rogue dodges pretty much any dex save tossed at him, with the druid being able to debuff to an insane degree.
Thoughts?
Honestly, you know your players best, and high level characters are incredibly variable. I assume those aren't literal rounds, with the possible exception of the first encounter I don't think any of them can end in one round.
This is three characters only, right? If these waves give no time to recoup, then it could certainly be too much if rolls end up being bad. I like your first wave, it should be interesting, not hard, but definitely gives you that initial impression of how well they'll do with the other waves. I'd see how that goes, then proceed depending on what sort of vibe you are getting. As a player, I think Round 3 would be the one I'd dread / be annoyed with the most. Usually, those creatures are fought by themselves, with maybe a small handful of underlings / environmental hazards.
So in my view, Round 3 is the one that'd concern me.
Enjoy your slop. I'll be enjoying good products elsewhere.
Youre correct, i should have said waves or phases.
The Rogue can teleport and does excellent single target damage, the cleric, along with his temp HP every round, is able to do amazing DoT with summoned creatures, bonus actions, and actions (dude can somehow do like 5 attacks a turn with different spells) and the bard does either lots of debuffing or lots of AoE attacks.
Yeah, wave 3 is the one that concerns me too. Thats a good idea, to gauge it in the moment and go from there.
Some of these are incredibly variable depending on situation. Most notably, the Tarrasque is really dangerous if you have to fight it in a box where you can't keep out of its reach, but in a more open environment it's likely to die without inflicting any damage because it just doesn't have the tools to force an engagement.
The battlefield is a field of open war (hence the first wave), so there is no dungeon crawl preceding it.
The Breath weapon I gave it is to help deal with any flying enemies/enemies who stay at a distance. The PCs are good at spreading out enough to make it difficult to hit multiple of them, but stay close enough to benefit from the clerics healing ability.
I would note that "can somehow do X" may actually mean "is playing fast and loose with the rules" -- if you don't know how someone is doing something, you have no way to know whether it's actually using the rules correctly. I can't think of a rules-legal way to get five attacks per round on a twilight cleric, unless most of them are being done by a summon.
If wave three is your main concern, you can always alter it depending on how the party is doing. If they're kicking major butt, use all four. If it's looking shaky, use fewer.
In fairness, im at work right now and not exactly looking at his stat sheet lol
But yes, he has 2 summons, his channel divinity, spiritual weapon, and his action. There might be one other thing he is capable of doing, cant remember off the top of my head.
A 6th level summon celestial is 3 attacks, 8th level would be four. The cleric has one attack of their own and could cast Spiritual Weapon for a second attack. The celestial could be summoned before the fight. The only problem with summon celestial is that it requires concentration which prevents the cleric from using some of their other spells - especially Banishment since that one can very effectively and single handedly rebalance an entire encounter, particularly when upcast. I don't know where the cleric would get a second summons from though since most require concentration.
However, I agree with you, the DM needs to know what rules the character is using to attain their abilities.