How do you handle players and gold?

I have read that gold coins were typically 1/40th of a pound (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aureus) although I have also heard of a ratio as low as 1:10.  

In any case, what do you if your characters amass a fortune?  40K GP would be a staggering 1000 pounds.  I had characters as a kid that had multi million GP.  I feel certain (if someone could) walk into a small town with that amount of money it would destabilize the economy.  

Do you let them carry it all around?  Use magic to lighten the weight?  Make them buy something less liquid (and less portable) like land and herds?  Give them lots of things to spend it on so the total is never too high?  Something else?

The D&D standard is 50 coins/lb, though realistically coin comes in varying sizes (dimes are 200/lb, pennies are 180, nickels are 90, quarters are 80, half dollars are 40, modern dollar coins are 55, old fashioned dollar coins are 20) and no-one used more than two coin metals. Anyway, D&D economics is pretty complete nonsense so I'd generally just ignore the problem unless it's a plot device (for example, dealing with the sheer mass of the coin hoard in Waterdeep Dragon Heist was a significant plot point in our campaign).

so, i forget how many gold coins the basic rules say exist per pound, but I did several things to address this, lol. Someone will come in with the game standard.

First off, 35 coins of any weight equal a pound. I also reduced my primary coin to the Silver piece, and created a coin called a Bit beneath a copper piece. "Two bits, four bits, six bits, a pence!"So all me default prices are in pence, and when they gain wealth during character creation it is all silver pieces as well.

So that resets (from the Player POV) everything to silver as a base. I won't go into the economic stuff like I have in the past, but a single bit will buy you a half loaf of bread, or a place to crash in the barn at night. It is the most common coin seen by common folks.

Next, for "storing it": I have banks. One is run by an actual "kingdom" The others are run by private enterprise. They are moneychangers, essentially, and they have their own stuff going on. Taking a cue from fictional  banking (as described by Edmond Dantes), I have letters of credit and shipments (secret, of course) and so they can deposit in one realm and then withdraw in a different one -- but never the whole thing, of course, strictly limited to what they have on hand, and you do recall there is a fee for that, correct (both for accepting the letter of credit and for permitting the withdrawal of funds).

Of course, those are only found in the cities and some of the larger towns, and are heavily involved in shipping and related stuff.

That matters because bandits and brigands are out there (two different things on this world). So robbery is common. And if they flash money, there are always pickpockets about.

But also...

Taxes. Fees. Weapons break on fumbles. Armor occasionally breaks for seemingly no reason at all (literally a 1% chance every day, not cumulative.) Extortion. Guilds charge a membership fee. Not a guild member? Good luck finding jobs.  The prices in the "starting equipment list" are not the regular prices -- those are all higher, and even worse they vary according to what you want and where you are.

Eating at an Inn? well, remember how everything is paid in silver? Adventurers are a special group, and they are known to be rich so they pay in gold.

The single most common thing players say when they get near a town after a hard effort in an adventure, is "oh, shit, downtime is going to be expensive."

Now you might wonder about the rest -- they stumble upon some hoard in a Warren or hideout. There, they find a large chest. Not a small chest, not a medium chest or a sea chest, but a large chest. The big score.

Here's where the percentages comes into play; 3% platinum, 9% gold, 14% silver, 23% copper (that's half the hoard), the rest is Bits. That represents what they have taken from travelers and such in coin. There will likely also be a spell scroll, maybe a couple potions, possibly a "daily life useful wand" or similar item. They will, of course, think "oh man, that's only a 100 coins" or whatever (average haul is around 250 coins). Then they look around. There are bolts of fabric, weapons, piles of furs, jugs of oil, books, clothes, and so forth. In one of the coats (if they bother to search) they will find a bloody, broken off arrowhead next to a small pouch that has a dozen small gemstones.

The value of all that other stuff? about 1100 when they get it all back to town. After filling the portable holes we all hope they have, they still have to get stuff to town, and that's why they usually get a cart or a wagon. And vehicles cost 100's of Silver pieces. or a Mount (who cost a pretty pence themselves).

Sounds kinda boring? Where's the treasure? Well, this is where that point about what a Bit can buy you comes into play. A Gold Piece is worth 800 bits. A silver piece is worth 80. A platinum piece is worth 8000.  Shift all of that up one level, so that a Silver piece translates into a gold piece. And if you don't laugh, check your math, lol.Because what I did was essentially raise all the prices, but "devalue" the currency. So it all seems less exciting, but the overall spending is pretty much the same, just more expensive.

It is a dirty trick, but also, they have all that other stuff. That's more role playing, more money, more possible story hooks, and a way of seeing the world that is a little mercenary. Those clothes on that dead noble might be worth a few hundred coins if you can get the blood out of them, or get rid of the bloody parts, lol.

None of which iis to say that I don't have actual cast hoards. Those are usually saved for BBEG or their Lieutenants -- and those can indeed be large, thousand plus coin haords -- but the real value there is the more prized magical items.

You may note I mention books and scrolls and "everyday use magic items." A wand that lights candles. A wand that purifies water. A ring that keeps campfire or lamp smoke away from you. little stuff like that. Those can be traded -- not sold at a shop, but fenced, essentially. There is no place to buy magical items.

The real treasures will be those scrolls and books. The scrolls because if you want a spell, you have to find it. A first level Wizard has the most spells -- 6 Cantrips, 2 1st level spells, 1 2nd level spell. They can't cast the higher level spells yet, they are still figuring them out. They might find a 9th level spell when they are only 1st level, or they may never find a 4th level spell, even when they are 20th level. Grimoires have multiple spells, of course -- and can be any of several different forms. I don' t usually pick and choose, I roll on a table. This is a big callback to 1e, where that was the original plan (even says so in both the PHB and DMG).

Bigger hoards increase the size of the treasure as well as the percentage of each of the higher value coins -- and bigger hoards are found as they go up in levels (and their expenses increase).

They can create stuff (a light crafting system and spell creating set up). Costs money, requires effort and time, a workshop, that kind of thing. I get about half what they take during each downtime session if it lasts more than a week, lol. 

But they can buy almost anything except magic items. THey can buy spells if they can find a wizard willing to sell (and when researching a spell costs a fortune and has a high DC, there is usually a need for coin).

In short, I revisited the basic premise, and then added a lot of "mundane" stuff to it. Which we roleplay. Most of them don't aventure for the money. They do it for other reasons. But the money never hurts.

Quote from Velstitzen >>

Do you let them carry it all around?  Use magic to lighten the weight?  Make them buy something less liquid (and less portable) like land and herds?  Give them lots of things to spend it on so the total is never too high?  Something else?

 I just have there be a bank in the main city.  No interest or anything like that, just a safe spot to stash large amount of money and not have to worry about carrying it or losing it.

The players either buy a bag of holding or they get encumbered. 

On a related note, walking around the city with an overflowing gold pouch is just asking to be pick pocketed. 

There are some campaigns that ignore the encumbrance of currency - it is a character creation option.

I tend to ignore it until it gets ridiculous. But by then the party has bags of holding or portable holes.

Unless they're actively transporting a hoard, it should be assumed that PCs will convert large amounts of money into small, relatively-convertible items that hold their value, probably gems, or, in civilized societies with at least semi-functional financial systems, letters of credit or the like. IMO, the logistics of cash are rarely interesting enough to be worth dealing with. (Similarly, I don't worry about currency exchange issues. The gp is an abstraction, not the actual currency of everyone.)

In my particular game, one of the major kingdoms has invented paper money. (And also the PCs have a flying ship, so they have basically infinite storage.)

Quote from AEDorsay >>

So, I forget how many gold coins the basic rules say exist per pound, but I did several things to address this, lol. Someone will come in with the game standard.....

 

Not to get too far afield, but I run my spells a lot like you do.  Magic is somewhat scarce in my world and finding a spell scroll is a large boon for a mage. They never get all the "best" spells for a level and sometimes don't have any spells at all for a certain level, at least for a period of time.  

I also have some expensive items they can purchase, particularly consumable magic items.  These are hardly widely available but a party in one of my cities befriended an herbalist and he will therefore sell them potions.  

I may also implement some of the ideas the others mentioned about banks or money lenders.  Something like the Fugger or Medici banks in the late medieval period.  

Thanks everyone.  Other ideas still welcome.

My party got a good haul from a dragon horde early on, they needed to get wagons to carry it out of there. They took it all to the bank, which I set up so that they could still access their money relatively easily when they needed it!

When they recover the rest of the horde from the Giants who swooped in after them, they will definitely need a bank!

Quote from Velstitzen >>

Quote from AEDorsay >>

So, I forget how many gold coins the basic rules say exist per pound, but I did several things to address this, lol. Someone will come in with the game standard.....

 

 

Not to get too far afield, but I run my spells a lot like you do.  Magic is somewhat scarce in my world and finding a spell scroll is a large boon for a mage. They never get all the "best" spells for a level and sometimes don't have any spells at all for a certain level, at least for a period of time.  

I also have some expensive items they can purchase, particularly consumable magic items.  These are hardly widely available but a party in one of my cities befriended an herbalist and he will therefore sell them potions.  

I may also implement some of the ideas the others mentioned about banks or money lenders.  Something like the Fugger or Medici banks in the late medieval period.  

Thanks everyone.  Other ideas still welcome.

Banks are a big thing. Huge thing. And have been around since about 2500 BCE (though I'd have to look that up to be more precise, they were doing grain loans in Assyria, and there is some limited evidence to suggest they were around even earlier than that).

So, yes, include banks. And expand your basis! lol. The renaissance Italianate bankers were murderous and crafty and all that, but so were French Bankers. German Bakers werre considered to be the most miserly of all.

And the Medici fortune, in particular, was late stage. 

Every ancient place had banks -- prior to the advent of coinage and continuing to the modern day (in the form of commodities), merchants would loan seed to farmers. And it wasn't until very modern times that Banks stopped being simple merchants (the medici's were just shippers, at their core -- maritime trade).

Some peculiar historic points: Christians were forbidden by the Church from charging interest from the 6th to 13th centuries. In other religions, the Church was a Bank as well as other things. Money changers made their money by converting foreign coins into the local coin -- and some would make loans.

Pawnbrokers have been around forever.

Excepting the Church, there was no real formal oversight of banking until after 1000 AD (and it was China that did it first, followed a couple hundred years later by Germans). And Interest rates had no cap. However, in most cases (and this is where the Italianate folks come in) if a Banker had more out in loans than they had in care, they would be ruined if a ship sank or a major loan fell through.

My reference to Edmond Dantes was playing on the Count of Monte Cristo, where that ruining of a French Banker was key.  And a ruined Banker would either be put in slavery or Prison (as would anyone who failed to pay a debt).

Definitely have banks.

Any good books to read on the history of banking?  I read a nice web article on it but I would be interested to know more.  I read a book on the Medici family a few years back which was fascinating but mostly focused on their political and religious efforts.

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/07/banking.asp

Quote from Velstitzen >>

Any good books to read on the history of banking?  I read a nice web article on it but I would be interested to know more.  I read a book on the Medici family a few years back which was fascinating but mostly focused on their political and religious efforts.

 

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/07/banking.asp

 

 

 
Rollinger’s Commerce of the Ancient World is probably the most useful, but can be hard to find and isn’t a “book”, strictly speaking.

Cameron’s Economic History is good, and recent.

The Davies’ History of Money is useful as well.

oh, of course, the Britannica is like the most readily grabbed stuff, lol. 

For our campaign we just simplified things and said that banks and letters of credit exist and are used regularly and widely. As long as they are in or near major cities or trade hubs regularly we assume they are stopping at banks or their HQ as needed to deposit and get letters of credit.

The basic rules are:

- For their party gold balance we just assume all of it goes in the bank and is represented by letters of credit they carry around with them

- For players individual gold, we assume they only carry 25% up to a max of 3,000 of their total on them as "cash", anything above that is letters of credit, unless a player specifically says otherwise. This way they have "walking around" money to pay for things like rooms and food and such while traveling, and if they are ever captured and stripped of their gear, or robbed etc, there is still a consequence in gold loss.

- All vendors in established settlements, and most even in other places like on the road or whatever, on the sword coast accept the letters of credit.

We will probably need to revisit and tweak these if they wind up on a mission or adventure that takes them away from the major cities and trade routes of the sword coast or they wind up on another plane, for any significant amount of time, but it hasn't come up just yet.

Quote from Velstitzen >>

How do you handle players and gold?

I have read that gold coins were typically 1/40th of a pound (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aureus) although I have also heard of a ratio as low as 1:10.  

In any case, what do you if your characters amass a fortune?  40K GP would be a staggering 1000 pounds.  I had characters as a kid that had multi million GP.  I feel certain (if someone could) walk into a small town with that amount of money it would destabilize the economy.  

Do you let them carry it all around?  Use magic to lighten the weight?  Make them buy something less liquid (and less portable) like land and herds?  Give them lots of things to spend it on so the total is never too high?  Something else?

-Someplace to store the money and maybe a way to fast travel between them, like a magical portal key. 

-An endless coin pouch (much like Bag of Holding but only for money, basically just for practicality)

-Paper money. 1000gp bills. 

-More valuable coins for the big bucks. Like 1 platinum coin is 100gp and one Awesomenum Coin is 100 platinum coins. 

Which of these works best depends on the setting.