I am using one spell that has jumped out at me. I know this is hardly an isolated case.
This is from the 1st level Protection from Evil and Good
Components: V, S, M (holy water or powdered silver and iron, which the spell consumes).
For new DM's (I am not one), how about making it easy for said DM's, and actually going through the EXISTING spells in the game, and quantifying how much these components cost? As opposed to creating new stuff. In the example above, btw, powdered Silver and Holy Water would be vastly more expensive, by volume, than powered Iron. And that begets another question: Does this mean an entire vial of Holy Water, or a portion of a vial. And if the latter, how much of a vial?
I know what I do in my game. But new DM's should not have to go through that mental process.
Holy Water is 25gp, so it stands to reason the alternates: powdered silver or iron, would be the same value although I know that is highly debated among players. FYI, 25gp of powdered iron would weigh more than some players could carry, so it was silly to ever include it as a material component. And if one argues that it doesn't have to be valued at 25gp, just some amount, then it's even dumber because who would ever buy the holy water when you could just scrape an iron bar. 2024 version is clearer: flask of Holy Water worth 25gp.
A flask of holy water is 25gp. It was previously not at all clear how much holy water was required, and the spell was pretty much nonsensically useless if it required 25gp in materials.
I'm not sure I understand your question. Every spell that uses material components lists what those components are and what price/value (if any) is associated with each. Are you looking for a listing of all spell components by price? I suppose you could make a spreadsheet of that, if you've got some time on your hands. As far as how much holy water is enough, while the 2024 spell description says "a flask", even the 2014 spell description can reasonably be assumed to be one flask or vial or whatever. Holy water isn't generally available in an assortment of different sizes.
They did. That is the old version. Here is the new version.
Great. I wonder how many other spells were not fixed.
It was fixed. Did you not look at the tooltip?
Yes, I saw that one particular spell was fixed in this new edition. But how many others were not? Was every spell like the example I gave, was it also fixed?
They did. That is the old version. Here is the new version.
Great. I wonder how many other spells were not fixed.
It was fixed. Did you not look at the tooltip?
Yes, I saw that one particular spell was fixed in this new edition. But how many others were not? Was every spell like the example I gave, was it also fixed?
I think to be honest spell components must have fallen way out of favour with their test player base. I do know groups that run very crunchy, very resource heavy games where GMs have banned spellcasting foci and component pouches in favour of the players getting the resources needed to cast their spells. That's a player and group choice though, certainly not for everyone. I think from 3e onwards, the designers either decided it was too much work or just not popular to really invest much in the way of components. It actively makes the game slightly more accessible and certainly is a little less on the game's overall workload. Certainly part of their process has been more geared toward the video game style design of character options and player choices.
All of which leads me to think that the designers just assume that new DMs are largely going to ignore component costs, and just get the player to buy a component pouch or go with their gut on what feels like the right amount.
I'd personally love to run a game where component pouches don't exist and where casting a spell consumes the material components. I fear though that it's a level of detail that many players wouldn't find too engaging.
Yes, I saw that one particular spell was fixed in this new edition. But how many others were not? Was every spell like the example I gave, was it also fixed?
??? You can buy all the spell components you need as a component pouch
"... except for those components that have a specific cost."
That's the issue, I think. The spell in question, Protection from Evil and Good, says " * - (a flask of Holy Water worth 25+ GP, which the spell consumes)".
I am using one spell that has jumped out at me. I know this is hardly an isolated case.
This is from the 1st level Protection from Evil and Good
Components: V, S, M (holy water or powdered silver and iron, which the spell consumes).
For new DM's (I am not one), how about making it easy for said DM's, and actually going through the EXISTING spells in the game, and quantifying how much these components cost? As opposed to creating new stuff. In the example above, btw, powdered Silver and Holy Water would be vastly more expensive, by volume, than powered Iron. And that begets another question: Does this mean an entire vial of Holy Water, or a portion of a vial. And if the latter, how much of a vial?
I know what I do in my game. But new DM's should not have to go through that mental process.
They did. That is the old version. Here is the new version.
Haha. They chose the option that makes the spell basically unusable at the level you learn it.
Holy Water is 25gp, so it stands to reason the alternates: powdered silver or iron, would be the same value although I know that is highly debated among players. FYI, 25gp of powdered iron would weigh more than some players could carry, so it was silly to ever include it as a material component. And if one argues that it doesn't have to be valued at 25gp, just some amount, then it's even dumber because who would ever buy the holy water when you could just scrape an iron bar. 2024 version is clearer: flask of Holy Water worth 25gp.
A flask of holy water is 25gp. It was previously not at all clear how much holy water was required, and the spell was pretty much nonsensically useless if it required 25gp in materials.
Great. I wonder how many other spells were not fixed.
It was fixed. Did you not look at the tooltip?
I'm not sure I understand your question. Every spell that uses material components lists what those components are and what price/value (if any) is associated with each. Are you looking for a listing of all spell components by price? I suppose you could make a spreadsheet of that, if you've got some time on your hands. As far as how much holy water is enough, while the 2024 spell description says "a flask", even the 2014 spell description can reasonably be assumed to be one flask or vial or whatever. Holy water isn't generally available in an assortment of different sizes.
Anzio Faro. Protector Aasimar light cleric. Lvl 18.
Viktor Gavriil. White dragonborn grave cleric. Lvl 20.
Ikram Sahir ibn-Malik al-Sayyid Ra'ad. Brass dragonborn draconic sorcerer Lvl 9. Fire elemental devil.
Wrangler of cats.
Yes, I saw that one particular spell was fixed in this new edition. But how many others were not? Was every spell like the example I gave, was it also fixed?
Do you have an example of a not-fixed spell?
I think to be honest spell components must have fallen way out of favour with their test player base. I do know groups that run very crunchy, very resource heavy games where GMs have banned spellcasting foci and component pouches in favour of the players getting the resources needed to cast their spells. That's a player and group choice though, certainly not for everyone. I think from 3e onwards, the designers either decided it was too much work or just not popular to really invest much in the way of components. It actively makes the game slightly more accessible and certainly is a little less on the game's overall workload. Certainly part of their process has been more geared toward the video game style design of character options and player choices.
All of which leads me to think that the designers just assume that new DMs are largely going to ignore component costs, and just get the player to buy a component pouch or go with their gut on what feels like the right amount.
I'd personally love to run a game where component pouches don't exist and where casting a spell consumes the material components. I fear though that it's a level of detail that many players wouldn't find too engaging.
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??? You can buy all the spell components you need as a component pouch
"... except for those components that have a specific cost."
That's the issue, I think. The spell in question, Protection from Evil and Good, says " * - (a flask of Holy Water worth 25+ GP, which the spell consumes)".
Anzio Faro. Protector Aasimar light cleric. Lvl 18.
Viktor Gavriil. White dragonborn grave cleric. Lvl 20.
Ikram Sahir ibn-Malik al-Sayyid Ra'ad. Brass dragonborn draconic sorcerer Lvl 9. Fire elemental devil.
Wrangler of cats.
One not fixed example is snare. But I guess that's not in the PHB, so no reason it would be fixed in 2024.
just cross reference what the items listed cost in the equipment list. i have a 1 page listing of all spells which have a material cost listed.
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