Lycanthrope questions! I have some PC’s that fought a werewolf last night. They don’t know that 2 of them contracted lycanthropy. (19 DC! Ouch!) In 3 weeks when the moon is full again, I need to know a few things: 1. Do they have any premonition, dreams, mood changes, etc. leading up to the full moon? 2. What time of day does the moon affect them? Sundown? After sundown when it’s fully dark? Midnight? 3. First transformation, do they have any chance of retaining mental control, even if they can’t stop the transformation? Are there rules for attempting? Would they transform before their first full moon?
I know a lot of this isn’t written & up to the DM, but I’m interested in how you’d run this.
Disclaimer: I have no idea if there are any hard and fast rules on this. I'm just talking off the top of my head.
1. Sure. Anxiety. Night sweats. Dreams of running through the forest. Etc.
2. As soon as the full moon becomes visible in the sky. Think of the cliche movie scene where the clouds part and the full moon shines in the night sky.
3. Nope. Werewolves are Chaotic Evil. The disease changes you.
Hey there! I'm actually rolling some Lyncathrope into my game soon:
1. Yes, I've created a random table of odd effects; including random agitation, spontaneous anxiety in open areas, sweats, flashes of vision; that happen mostly towards dusk or night.
2. As previous posters noted: When the moon hits the sky like a big piece of pie... that's lycanthrope!
3. if they fight the curse they retain mental control all except through the transformation period, consider this DM controlled - now that is only if you aren't including a world setting that has blood hunters or blood hunter orders of some kind: https://www.dndbeyond.com/classes/blood-hunter - How you wrap *that* into your game will obviously be up to you.
First off, the I would only allow the damage immunity to apply in beast/hybrid form. This is a curse, not a blessing that occasionally acts as a curse. As for the mental effects of the curse, it's as strong or manageable as you feel it should be. In 3.5, you had to make a save every time you shifted, with a permanent change in alignment coming about the first time you failed. That might be a bit harsh for you. At a minimum, take control of characters while they are shifted unless they embrace the curse. If they embrace the curse, award inspiration for them behaving like a semiferal monster.
Since we only meet 3 hours/month, we still haven’t arrived at the full moon yet.
Here’s the rules I’m going with: Once bitten (werewolf in this case), the infected starts having dreams about being pursued by wolves. Over time as the full moon approaches, those dreams recur, but eventually, they dream they’re running with the pack, but it’s a dream, so they’re also pursuing themselves, because dreams don’t make sense. Once the full moon hits — and I’m making the ruling because it works for dramatic effect — they’ll be at an inn in town, and suddenly, a wolf starts attacking the inn patrons at darkness, as in when the sun hasn’t just set, but it’s no longer casting light on the horizon, which is usually ~90 minutes later. As the party awakens and starts defending the inn against the werewolf, they discover one way or another that one of their party is missing.
I’m ruling that, first transformation, they have to make a DC 20 (Wisdom?) save to gain control. Not sure about future transformations, since I plan to have them cured after the 1st one.
I’m ruling that, first transformation, they have to make a DC 20 (Wisdom?) save to gain control. Not sure about future transformations, since I plan to have them cured after the 1st one.
What do you mean by this out of curiosity? Given the base RAW lyncanthrope rule 'However, when the full moon rises, the curse becomes too strong to resist, transforming the individual into its beast form — or into a horrible hybrid form that combines animal and humanoid traits. When the moon wanes, the beast within can be controlled once again.' . I was just curious if this was you giving them a possible way to extraordinarily control the conversion -- which isn't a bad idea.
Also, what do you mean when you say you plan to have them cured? Are you just going to make remove curse available - what if they don't accept it? What if they embrace the change? I'm actually using this to introduce my characters to the Blood Hunter Order; giving the remove curse option as well as the option to take a hybrid multi-class (I'm house-ruling a bit of this myself).
3. I would give them a Difficult chance to retain control with a bonus for high Wisdom. Not sure exactly what I’d set the DC at (not that good with numbers lol). Also, if the PC has a loved one I would give them a chance to regain control if they see their loved one endangered.
I'm currently going through this. My PC has been bit, and there's about 2 weeks until the full moon. In the lead up I'm doing a few things.
1. I gave the PC the sunlight sensitivity trait and made the player aware of it. Out of game I informed the player of this and allowed them to roleplay it as they see fit, telling them that sunlight is particularly bright/blinding for them. I take care to describe the weather every day, throwing in rain and cloudy days along with sun, allowing the PC some freedom to react however they want. If other PCs notice and ask to investigate, the most they can really tell is that he seems bothered by sunlight, as the curse isn't showing any other effects right now.
2. I take care to describe the moon at night, so the players have a sense of it getting to fullness. Nobody thinks anything of it right now, but when it happens everything should click into place for them.
3. Whenever the PC kills an enemy, I have him make a WIS save. On a failure, he makes his next attack on the nearest creature, including allies if that's the nearest creature. This kind of represents giving in to the bloodlust of the curse.
When the actual transformation hits, I'm actually planning on cutting straight to the next morning. Party wakes up and the PC is gone. PC wakes up in the wilderness covered in dirt and grime and maybe some blood. Then the party will encounter the aftermath of the werewolf's pillaging the night before. Maybe some dead livestock, possibly a dead villager. They should all clue in by then.
As for alignment, I don't view the switch to Chaotic Evil as immediate, more of a gradual change. So offline at that point I'll tell the player that his alignment has changed from it's current Chaotic Good to Chaotic Neutral, and trust him to play it as such. At this point the party will probably have an idea of what's going on and when they find their missing PC they'll probably fix it relatively quickly. I don't intend for this to be a major arc, more of a bump in the road.
My idea is that you start forcing that player to make saves as the full moon rises, the DC increases for each hour under the full moon, until finally the player either transforms when the save gets too hard or manages to power through. You could also make it so that when close to other people, they have to save or have an urge to attack them.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Give a man a fish, and he will eat for a day. Teach a man to fish, and he will eat for a lifetime. Oh, and it would be nice if you gave him a fishing rod.
I'm currently going through this. My PC has been bit, and there's about 2 weeks until the full moon. In the lead up I'm doing a few things.
1. I gave the PC the sunlight sensitivity trait and made the player aware of it. Out of game I informed the player of this and allowed them to roleplay it as they see fit, telling them that sunlight is particularly bright/blinding for them. I take care to describe the weather every day, throwing in rain and cloudy days along with sun, allowing the PC some freedom to react however they want. If other PCs notice and ask to investigate, the most they can really tell is that he seems bothered by sunlight, as the curse isn't showing any other effects right now.
2. I take care to describe the moon at night, so the players have a sense of it getting to fullness. Nobody thinks anything of it right now, but when it happens everything should click into place for them.
3. Whenever the PC kills an enemy, I have him make a WIS save. On a failure, he makes his next attack on the nearest creature, including allies if that's the nearest creature. This kind of represents giving in to the bloodlust of the curse.
When the actual transformation hits, I'm actually planning on cutting straight to the next morning. Party wakes up and the PC is gone. PC wakes up in the wilderness covered in dirt and grime and maybe some blood. Then the party will encounter the aftermath of the werewolf's pillaging the night before. Maybe some dead livestock, possibly a dead villager. They should all clue in by then.
As for alignment, I don't view the switch to Chaotic Evil as immediate, more of a gradual change. So offline at that point I'll tell the player that his alignment has changed from it's current Chaotic Good to Chaotic Neutral, and trust him to play it as such. At this point the party will probably have an idea of what's going on and when they find their missing PC they'll probably fix it relatively quickly. I don't intend for this to be a major arc, more of a bump in the road.
This is clever. I really like the mystery aspect of your approach, and admire the trust you put in this player working with you on it
My idea is that you start forcing that player to make saves as the full moon rises, the DC increases for each hour under the full moon, until finally the player either transforms when the save gets too hard or manages to power through. You could also make it so that when close to other people, they have to save or have an urge to attack them.
Escalating DC is a fun mechanic. Perhaps it reaches it’s maximum at the zenith of the moon through the sky.
I'm currently going through this. My PC has been bit, and there's about 2 weeks until the full moon. In the lead up I'm doing a few things.
1. I gave the PC the sunlight sensitivity trait and made the player aware of it. Out of game I informed the player of this and allowed them to roleplay it as they see fit, telling them that sunlight is particularly bright/blinding for them. I take care to describe the weather every day, throwing in rain and cloudy days along with sun, allowing the PC some freedom to react however they want. If other PCs notice and ask to investigate, the most they can really tell is that he seems bothered by sunlight, as the curse isn't showing any other effects right now.
2. I take care to describe the moon at night, so the players have a sense of it getting to fullness. Nobody thinks anything of it right now, but when it happens everything should click into place for them.
3. Whenever the PC kills an enemy, I have him make a WIS save. On a failure, he makes his next attack on the nearest creature, including allies if that's the nearest creature. This kind of represents giving in to the bloodlust of the curse.
When the actual transformation hits, I'm actually planning on cutting straight to the next morning. Party wakes up and the PC is gone. PC wakes up in the wilderness covered in dirt and grime and maybe some blood. Then the party will encounter the aftermath of the werewolf's pillaging the night before. Maybe some dead livestock, possibly a dead villager. They should all clue in by then.
As for alignment, I don't view the switch to Chaotic Evil as immediate, more of a gradual change. So offline at that point I'll tell the player that his alignment has changed from it's current Chaotic Good to Chaotic Neutral, and trust him to play it as such. At this point the party will probably have an idea of what's going on and when they find their missing PC they'll probably fix it relatively quickly. I don't intend for this to be a major arc, more of a bump in the road.
This is clever. I really like the mystery aspect of your approach, and admire the trust you put in this player working with you on it
Thanks! Last session I realized there's an added benefit of this approach. One of my players has noticed me describing the moon slowly becoming larger in the night sky as time passes. He reached out to me out of game and is terrified that HIS character contracted lycanthropy because he was bit during the encounter and he rolled low on the save. He made the saving throw but obviously he has no idea, and he's been panicking about what happens when the moon gets full. Very fun for me.
I'm currently going through this. My PC has been bit, and there's about 2 weeks until the full moon. In the lead up I'm doing a few things.
1. I gave the PC the sunlight sensitivity trait and made the player aware of it. Out of game I informed the player of this and allowed them to roleplay it as they see fit, telling them that sunlight is particularly bright/blinding for them. I take care to describe the weather every day, throwing in rain and cloudy days along with sun, allowing the PC some freedom to react however they want. If other PCs notice and ask to investigate, the most they can really tell is that he seems bothered by sunlight, as the curse isn't showing any other effects right now.
2. I take care to describe the moon at night, so the players have a sense of it getting to fullness. Nobody thinks anything of it right now, but when it happens everything should click into place for them.
3. Whenever the PC kills an enemy, I have him make a WIS save. On a failure, he makes his next attack on the nearest creature, including allies if that's the nearest creature. This kind of represents giving in to the bloodlust of the curse.
When the actual transformation hits, I'm actually planning on cutting straight to the next morning. Party wakes up and the PC is gone. PC wakes up in the wilderness covered in dirt and grime and maybe some blood. Then the party will encounter the aftermath of the werewolf's pillaging the night before. Maybe some dead livestock, possibly a dead villager. They should all clue in by then.
As for alignment, I don't view the switch to Chaotic Evil as immediate, more of a gradual change. So offline at that point I'll tell the player that his alignment has changed from it's current Chaotic Good to Chaotic Neutral, and trust him to play it as such. At this point the party will probably have an idea of what's going on and when they find their missing PC they'll probably fix it relatively quickly. I don't intend for this to be a major arc, more of a bump in the road.
This is clever. I really like the mystery aspect of your approach, and admire the trust you put in this player working with you on it
Thanks! Last session I realized there's an added benefit of this approach. One of my players has noticed me describing the moon slowly becoming larger in the night sky as time passes. He reached out to me out of game and is terrified that HIS character contracted lycanthropy because he was bit during the encounter and he rolled low on the save. He made the saving throw but obviously he has no idea, and he's been panicking about what happens when the moon gets full. Very fun for me.
That sounds like fun.
Imagine if this little misunderstanding leads the party to chain up their friend on the night of the full moon, only to realize that they got the wrong guy. That would be a neat twist, and entirely of their own making.
Thanks! Last session I realized there's an added benefit of this approach. One of my players has noticed me describing the moon slowly becoming larger in the night sky as time passes. He reached out to me out of game and is terrified that HIS character contracted lycanthropy because he was bit during the encounter and he rolled low on the save. He made the saving throw but obviously he has no idea, and he's been panicking about what happens when the moon gets full. Very fun for me.
This is why you should roll the all of the PCs saves for them, behind a screen... :) ("What's your Con save? No reason... <rolls dice>).
Maybe, if you don't want to go for a horror theme, they transform into a wolf automatically every full moon, and act like a normal wolf until dawn, with no recollection of what happened while they were transformed. Maybe it's like a 'beast within' thing, where they can change into their hybrid form in battle but have something similar to the Bloodlust that the Order of the Lycan Blood Hunter has (possibly with additional triggers) This could be very interesting for role-playing, like if you have a player who transforms to protect their friends from a terrible monster, but can't control their violent impulses and starts attacking their allies after defeating the monster. Maybe they have to make a Constitution or Wisdom saving throw to transform back, and can make this save any time they try to attack a friendly creature.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Teach a man to make fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life."
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Lycanthrope questions!
I have some PC’s that fought a werewolf last night. They don’t know that 2 of them contracted lycanthropy. (19 DC! Ouch!) In 3 weeks when the moon is full again, I need to know a few things:
1. Do they have any premonition, dreams, mood changes, etc. leading up to the full moon?
2. What time of day does the moon affect them? Sundown? After sundown when it’s fully dark? Midnight?
3. First transformation, do they have any chance of retaining mental control, even if they can’t stop the transformation? Are there rules for attempting? Would they transform before their first full moon?
I know a lot of this isn’t written & up to the DM, but I’m interested in how you’d run this.
Dale
Helping you make lives better through TTRPGs
Disclaimer: I have no idea if there are any hard and fast rules on this. I'm just talking off the top of my head.
1. Sure. Anxiety. Night sweats. Dreams of running through the forest. Etc.
2. As soon as the full moon becomes visible in the sky. Think of the cliche movie scene where the clouds part and the full moon shines in the night sky.
3. Nope. Werewolves are Chaotic Evil. The disease changes you.
DCI: 3319125026
The werewolf entry in the MM has rules for PC werewolves. Where did you get DC 19, though? It's generally DC 12.
DC 8 + the lycanthrope’s proficiency bonus (which is hit dice, right? So 9) + the lycanthrope’s Constitution modifier (2)
Am I misunderstanding monster proficiency bonus? That’s what I gathered from the PHB.
Dale
Helping you make lives better through TTRPGs
Monster proficiency bonus is the same as a PC with level = CR, or 1 + CR/4, rounded up (so 2 for a CR 3 werewolf).
I was misreading that. Rerolled. They both still failed. Thanks for the clarification.
Dale
Helping you make lives better through TTRPGs
Hey there! I'm actually rolling some Lyncathrope into my game soon:
1. Yes, I've created a random table of odd effects; including random agitation, spontaneous anxiety in open areas, sweats, flashes of vision; that happen mostly towards dusk or night.
2. As previous posters noted: When the moon hits the sky like a big piece of pie... that's lycanthrope!
3. if they fight the curse they retain mental control all except through the transformation period, consider this DM controlled - now that is only if you aren't including a world setting that has blood hunters or blood hunter orders of some kind: https://www.dndbeyond.com/classes/blood-hunter - How you wrap *that* into your game will obviously be up to you.
First off, the I would only allow the damage immunity to apply in beast/hybrid form. This is a curse, not a blessing that occasionally acts as a curse. As for the mental effects of the curse, it's as strong or manageable as you feel it should be. In 3.5, you had to make a save every time you shifted, with a permanent change in alignment coming about the first time you failed. That might be a bit harsh for you. At a minimum, take control of characters while they are shifted unless they embrace the curse. If they embrace the curse, award inspiration for them behaving like a semiferal monster.
Since we only meet 3 hours/month, we still haven’t arrived at the full moon yet.
Here’s the rules I’m going with: Once bitten (werewolf in this case), the infected starts having dreams about being pursued by wolves. Over time as the full moon approaches, those dreams recur, but eventually, they dream they’re running with the pack, but it’s a dream, so they’re also pursuing themselves, because dreams don’t make sense. Once the full moon hits — and I’m making the ruling because it works for dramatic effect — they’ll be at an inn in town, and suddenly, a wolf starts attacking the inn patrons at darkness, as in when the sun hasn’t just set, but it’s no longer casting light on the horizon, which is usually ~90 minutes later. As the party awakens and starts defending the inn against the werewolf, they discover one way or another that one of their party is missing.
I’m ruling that, first transformation, they have to make a DC 20 (Wisdom?) save to gain control. Not sure about future transformations, since I plan to have them cured after the 1st one.
Dale
Helping you make lives better through TTRPGs
What do you mean by this out of curiosity? Given the base RAW lyncanthrope rule 'However, when the full moon rises, the curse becomes too strong to resist, transforming the individual into its beast form — or into a horrible hybrid form that combines animal and humanoid traits. When the moon wanes, the beast within can be controlled once again.' . I was just curious if this was you giving them a possible way to extraordinarily control the conversion -- which isn't a bad idea.
Also, what do you mean when you say you plan to have them cured? Are you just going to make remove curse available - what if they don't accept it? What if they embrace the change? I'm actually using this to introduce my characters to the Blood Hunter Order; giving the remove curse option as well as the option to take a hybrid multi-class (I'm house-ruling a bit of this myself).
1. Yes
2. After dark when the full moon is visible
3. I would give them a Difficult chance to retain control with a bonus for high Wisdom. Not sure exactly what I’d set the DC at (not that good with numbers lol). Also, if the PC has a loved one I would give them a chance to regain control if they see their loved one endangered.
Hope this helps.
I'm currently going through this. My PC has been bit, and there's about 2 weeks until the full moon. In the lead up I'm doing a few things.
1. I gave the PC the sunlight sensitivity trait and made the player aware of it. Out of game I informed the player of this and allowed them to roleplay it as they see fit, telling them that sunlight is particularly bright/blinding for them. I take care to describe the weather every day, throwing in rain and cloudy days along with sun, allowing the PC some freedom to react however they want. If other PCs notice and ask to investigate, the most they can really tell is that he seems bothered by sunlight, as the curse isn't showing any other effects right now.
2. I take care to describe the moon at night, so the players have a sense of it getting to fullness. Nobody thinks anything of it right now, but when it happens everything should click into place for them.
3. Whenever the PC kills an enemy, I have him make a WIS save. On a failure, he makes his next attack on the nearest creature, including allies if that's the nearest creature. This kind of represents giving in to the bloodlust of the curse.
When the actual transformation hits, I'm actually planning on cutting straight to the next morning. Party wakes up and the PC is gone. PC wakes up in the wilderness covered in dirt and grime and maybe some blood. Then the party will encounter the aftermath of the werewolf's pillaging the night before. Maybe some dead livestock, possibly a dead villager. They should all clue in by then.
As for alignment, I don't view the switch to Chaotic Evil as immediate, more of a gradual change. So offline at that point I'll tell the player that his alignment has changed from it's current Chaotic Good to Chaotic Neutral, and trust him to play it as such. At this point the party will probably have an idea of what's going on and when they find their missing PC they'll probably fix it relatively quickly. I don't intend for this to be a major arc, more of a bump in the road.
"To die would be an awfully big adventure"
My idea is that you start forcing that player to make saves as the full moon rises, the DC increases for each hour under the full moon, until finally the player either transforms when the save gets too hard or manages to power through. You could also make it so that when close to other people, they have to save or have an urge to attack them.
Give a man a fish, and he will eat for a day. Teach a man to fish, and he will eat for a lifetime. Oh, and it would be nice if you gave him a fishing rod.
-Trevor Noah
Current character: Daceth dococeth, moon blessed.
This is clever. I really like the mystery aspect of your approach, and admire the trust you put in this player working with you on it
Escalating DC is a fun mechanic. Perhaps it reaches it’s maximum at the zenith of the moon through the sky.
Thanks! Last session I realized there's an added benefit of this approach. One of my players has noticed me describing the moon slowly becoming larger in the night sky as time passes. He reached out to me out of game and is terrified that HIS character contracted lycanthropy because he was bit during the encounter and he rolled low on the save. He made the saving throw but obviously he has no idea, and he's been panicking about what happens when the moon gets full. Very fun for me.
"To die would be an awfully big adventure"
That sounds like fun.
Imagine if this little misunderstanding leads the party to chain up their friend on the night of the full moon, only to realize that they got the wrong guy. That would be a neat twist, and entirely of their own making.
This is why you should roll the all of the PCs saves for them, behind a screen... :) ("What's your Con save? No reason... <rolls dice>).
Maybe, if you don't want to go for a horror theme, they transform into a wolf automatically every full moon, and act like a normal wolf until dawn, with no recollection of what happened while they were transformed. Maybe it's like a 'beast within' thing, where they can change into their hybrid form in battle but have something similar to the Bloodlust that the Order of the Lycan Blood Hunter has (possibly with additional triggers) This could be very interesting for role-playing, like if you have a player who transforms to protect their friends from a terrible monster, but can't control their violent impulses and starts attacking their allies after defeating the monster. Maybe they have to make a Constitution or Wisdom saving throw to transform back, and can make this save any time they try to attack a friendly creature.
"Teach a man to make fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life."