The door with high DC's are for a side either. You can get a key from Yusdrayl, the kobold priestess, as a reward for returning the White Wyrm. Or in other ways if your players decide to. I assume groups that enjoy exploration will return there at some point. Or they do it on their way out after doing all the rest. Which means the party is lvl 3 and its time to bump up the difficulty of the Dragon Priest encounter. My group went there, because they went outside for some fresh air, and introducing a new player. On the way in they decided to go to the side area. At this point they were lvl 2. It is a bit of an odd one. However the entire module is full of weird things.
As for how long to run it... well that depends. You can run through it in 6-8 hours. In my group it took close to 25-30 hours. Then again I modified the adventure a bit. Especially fleshed out Oakhurst and the quest hook that is under utilized. The one relating to maimed lifestock that can lead to an investigation and introduces the Twig Blights. So it really depends how much effort, you as a DM, put into creating content and how your players engage with it. If they just go from fight to fight its a short module and pretty linear.
Black hatchling as in being a kidnapped child of the Black Dragon at the bottom of Forge of Fury? I stuck with a white wyrm since there aren't many white dragons represented alongside the many other chrome dragons throughout the campaign.
I wouldn't leave it unlocked. Part of the fun is figuring out how to open it. Also how you describe it becomes important. You can lower the DC without trouble to a point your players can succeed.
I described it as the wall coming to live. An energy rippling across the surface and gathering towards the center of the door. From that point it turned into a dragon mouth that protrude outwards. In its mouth is the hole for a key. Or they have to mechanically use thieves tools for the lock and an arcane check for the magical part of the lock. So people need to work together. It is a little puzzle at the same time. On success the dragons face pulls back into the wall. The arcane energies moving outwards tracing the outerlines of a door. A loud thud is heard as dust starts to cascade down the ceiling. Portion of the thick wall slides across the dusty floor revealing a passage way into a dark room filled with stale musty air.
The adventure describes Kerowyn Hucrele as the matron of the Hucrele family, but never actually says what her relationship is with Sharwyn and Talgen, so I'm curious what other DMs have chosen to have her be (mother, aunt, grandmother, cousin, sister, etc...). I chose to have her be their aunt.
As far as the white dragon is concerned... I'm actually going to have it be a black dragon hatchling instead. :3 To tie in with a later part of the Yawning Portal series.
And what would that be?
They redid 'Forge of Fury' for the book, a Black Dragon appears in that, and there were clues seeded in 'Sunless' that would lead players there, 4 of 3rd editions orginal modules were loosly connected, the others being 'Nightfang Spire' and 'The Bastion of Broken Souls'.
All 4 were part of the dragon Ashardalon's story, he proved popular enough to get his own 4th edition Adventure System Board Game........
As far as the white dragon is concerned... I'm actually going to have it be a black dragon hatchling instead. :3 To tie in with a later part of the Yawning Portal series.
And what would that be?
They redid 'Forge of Fury' for the book, a Black Dragon appears in that, and there were clues seeded in 'Sunless' that would lead players there, 4 of 3rd editions orginal modules were loosly connected, the others being 'Nightfang Spire' and 'The Bastion of Broken Souls'.
All 4 were part of the dragon Ashardalon's story, he proved popular enough to get his own 4th edition Adventure System Board Game........
There were actually 8 modules that were meant to be played in order: Sunless Citadel, Forge of Fury, Speaker in Dreams, Standing Stone, Heart of Nightfang Spire, Deep Horizon, Lord of the Iron Fortress, and Bastion of Broken Souls. I had wanted to run them but never got a chance. I'm hoping that more of them will be converted to 5E.
There were actually 8 modules that were meant to be played in order: Sunless Citadel, Forge of Fury, Speaker in Dreams, Standing Stone, Heart of Nightfang Spire, Deep Horizon, Lord of the Iron Fortress, and Bastion of Broken Souls. I had wanted to run them but never got a chance. I'm hoping that more of them will be converted to 5E.
I know, I have all 8, but only 4 actually directly have referances or links in them.
They are a very, very loose series since they didnt get published in module level order at the time and were retroactively considered a series long after the event.
Mind you, with a bit of work, you could design an entire campaign (and smal scale setting) around the 8 modules if you add some additional material from some of the Player and DM Splatbooks of the time.
That's something I'm considering writing a blog about at some point.....
Depends entirely on the narrative I suppose. did they just free or also try to make a deal with it?
How aggressive is the original stance of the dragon? Then I would use the system to gradually allow the demeanor to change from very aggressive to a little aggressive. Then too neutral. Just like a social encounter where you gradually get in good graces with someone. Look at the dragon being Chaotic Evil. White dragons are more bestial in nature then the others. Then go from there when you understand the wyrms motives/goals and how to achieve them. Does it even include attacking the players at some point? Or perhaps cause trouble elsewhere to which the players can respond.
In my group the cleric wanted to make it his pet. But after the conversation there was at least a mutual understanding. He would help to set the beast free if it would leave the area and not harm the party. After the social encounter the wyrm flew to the far cold north. After snatching a cow for a bite to eat at an outlying farm of Oakhurst. Which gave a nice little mention once the players returned to Oakhurst themselves.
Hi! I'm going to start Tyranny of Dragons, starting with Sunless Citadel. I placed the citadel to the south of Greenest as an ancient and secret stronghold of the Cult of the Dragon. Any advice?
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He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And if you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss also gazes into you.
My son sobbed inconsolably when Meepo was killed by the wyrmling's breath weapon. Everyone else in the group asked if there was anything that could be done to bring Meepo back. They insisted on giving Meepo a dignified burial with honors. There's something endearing about him...
Hi! I'm going to start Tyranny of Dragons, starting with Sunless Citadel. I placed the citadel to the south of Greenest as an ancient and secret stronghold of the Cult of the Dragon. Any advice?
It has kobolds, a dragon, dragon statues, and a tomb to a dragon knight. Sounds like enough =)
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"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
My biggest challenge in HoDQ was to hook the characters to the plot. if you Link them to greenest in any way during the adventure that can help your cause. Also, if the kobolds are Hording treasure for the cult and there is some written evidence of it. that could be cool to I think.
Going through the Citadel soon with another group of players. Will tweak it even further from previous runs. Last time I noticed the describing the marble walls and ceiling etc became very repetitive. Also some elements weren't played up well in my opinion. During this run this specific kobold tribe will be more like crocodile lizards instead of snakes or dragons. This means they want hot humid areas. Since its placed in my campaign, in the Elsir Vale, which has a tropical climate it makes sense. This tribe of kobolds arrived only a few months ago and still is making adjustments to make the ecology fit them. Dank humid filthy environments. Some of the rooms, instead of random encounters, got big wooden "barrels" with filthy water and kobold eggs in it. They are makeshift pools of water for the kobolds until they take over goblin territory and can set up proper pools and such.
The second level already mentions underdark flora that some creatures try to cultivate and use for food. You also find that diseased rat on a table used for experimentation. Idea is to increase this scenario more. Turning Belak basically in a druid of the Land: Underdark. Basically more underdark flora and fungus. And the creatures in the second half of the grove level will become a mixed creature. The bugbear patrolling the aboretum will have myconid fungal spores growing all over their body and so do the skeletons. Using those spores to "telepathically" communicate among each other. So even if players stealthily try to sneak around and kill one...the other creatures are still alerted that way.
I still have issues figuring out why the skeletons are even there. In some rooms I can understand their presence. Locked into rooms/chambers makes sense. Having the skeletons on the grove level roaming around and seemingly assisting the denizens doesn't make sense. It's the only discrepancy I can't figure out. Anyone got an idea? For now I try to "solve" it partially through the myconid spores.
Belak's fight will get a huge boost in deadlyness as well. As he's written in Yawning Portal he's meaningless and not much of a threat. Since that book was published relatively early on in the 5e cycle it makes sense they didn't use some mechanics. Belak is already a lvl 4 druid, but will have Wildshape, which is entirely neglected in his statblock. He'll be able to shape into either a big wolf and/or a giant frog. Perhaps even a Giant Spider if he needs to get away. Wildshapes will also give him more HP so that he won't die in 2-3 well rolled hits.
The tree itself will have a 60ft range Charm it can cast on a recharge of 5-6. Simply because the tree grew out of the Gulthias vampire blood. Makes sense the tree having some of the vampiric capabilities. Also aids in providing lore for mind controlling others around it...including Belak to some degree. I'll also add some Lair Actions this time around: --Vine Whip; from the ground in a 5ft square roots/vines whip from the ground hitting the enemy creatures --Spawn Twig Blights; more Twig Blights crawl from the ground and join in the fight <-- might turn a group of Twig Blights into spawning 1 or 2 Vine Blights which can grapple/create difficult terrain. but would give them less hp as to not overwhelm the players too much. This also depends if you got AoE spellcasters or a more melee oriented group I believe. --Gas Spore; From the ceiling spores randomly fall down. Each creature within 20 feet radius of impact point must succeed on a DC 15 Constitution saving throw or take 10 (3d6) poison damage and become infected with a disease on a failed save. Creatures immune to the poisoned condition are immune to this disease. Spores invade an infected creature’s system, killing the creature in a number of hours equal to 1d12+the creature’s Constitution score, unless the disease is removed. In half that time, the creature becomes poisoned for the rest of the duration. After the creature dies, it sprouts 2d4 Tiny gas spores that grow to full size in 7 days.
Will need to tweak the numbers of damage for the lair actions. Don't want to instant kill the party. Just make it properly dangerous, scary ... but fair. Something which 5e fails at if you don't modify things yourself.
It is odd to me that. 15 years ago, Belak passed through Oakhurst and shortly after arrived at the Citadel. I assume it didn't take him too long to find the Gulthias Seed and grow it into a tree and put everything into action. With the Gulthias experience, and influence, its only natural to assume that the tree would try to find ways to create defensive measures against "heroes". Belak doing the experiments would've assumed that eventually people would start asking questions and come looking as well. He had at least a few years, or more, to create the situations for possible Lair Actions.
For Belak, I'm going to be making him a corrupted/brainwashed Druid of the Raven, so he's going to have spells and abilities pertaining to a warden of the druid barrows/burial grounds he originally maintained in my campaign. Might even give him the Circle of Spore perk. As for the Gulthias Tree itself... well, I was thinking that Gulthias has had a long, long time to consider the possibility of adventurers coming to try and destroy him for good. He has control of plantlife and corpses already with the Blights... my campaign, he's gonna make himself a battle-shell around his tree. :3 A Blightbark Drake, to fit in with the Citadel's background as a cult shrine/temple to Ashardalon. x3
Working on a supplement for the adventure-minded. A project including (and crediting) homebrew subclasses from the community, a world of my own design, premade characters, magic items, and even a prologue adventure to start things off!
Past and Current Characters: Morgann 'Duskspear' Solbeard, Hill Dwarf Paladin/Fighter/Warlock; Ephemeral 'Skye' Solbeard, Hill Dwarf Artificer; Zaldrick Lawscrip of Orzhov, Hobgoblin Wizard; Eremys Spydrun, Shadar'kai Monk; Cuchulainn, Wood Elf Blood Hunter.
Running sunless citadel through tales of yawning portal tied to death curse and Asorack. My group never asks questions of NPCs and blindly follow any quest without motivation of why. This will lead them to trouble as they will not understand that Acerack sp? Is sucking all souls from the afterlife.
So they are headed to second floor and do not know why...just going to rescue hucrele fam. Which are dead or thralls.
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The door with high DC's are for a side either. You can get a key from Yusdrayl, the kobold priestess, as a reward for returning the White Wyrm. Or in other ways if your players decide to. I assume groups that enjoy exploration will return there at some point. Or they do it on their way out after doing all the rest. Which means the party is lvl 3 and its time to bump up the difficulty of the Dragon Priest encounter. My group went there, because they went outside for some fresh air, and introducing a new player. On the way in they decided to go to the side area. At this point they were lvl 2. It is a bit of an odd one. However the entire module is full of weird things.
As for how long to run it... well that depends. You can run through it in 6-8 hours. In my group it took close to 25-30 hours. Then again I modified the adventure a bit. Especially fleshed out Oakhurst and the quest hook that is under utilized. The one relating to maimed lifestock that can lead to an investigation and introduces the Twig Blights. So it really depends how much effort, you as a DM, put into creating content and how your players engage with it. If they just go from fight to fight its a short module and pretty linear.
Black hatchling as in being a kidnapped child of the Black Dragon at the bottom of Forge of Fury? I stuck with a white wyrm since there aren't many white dragons represented alongside the many other chrome dragons throughout the campaign.
If the side door is a side bit, would it hurt the adventure to lower the difficulty or just leave it unlocked?
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
I wouldn't leave it unlocked. Part of the fun is figuring out how to open it. Also how you describe it becomes important. You can lower the DC without trouble to a point your players can succeed.
I described it as the wall coming to live. An energy rippling across the surface and gathering towards the center of the door. From that point it turned into a dragon mouth that protrude outwards. In its mouth is the hole for a key. Or they have to mechanically use thieves tools for the lock and an arcane check for the magical part of the lock. So people need to work together. It is a little puzzle at the same time. On success the dragons face pulls back into the wall. The arcane energies moving outwards tracing the outerlines of a door. A loud thud is heard as dust starts to cascade down the ceiling. Portion of the thick wall slides across the dusty floor revealing a passage way into a dark room filled with stale musty air.
The adventure describes Kerowyn Hucrele as the matron of the Hucrele family, but never actually says what her relationship is with Sharwyn and Talgen, so I'm curious what other DMs have chosen to have her be (mother, aunt, grandmother, cousin, sister, etc...). I chose to have her be their aunt.
I went with mother.
They redid 'Forge of Fury' for the book, a Black Dragon appears in that, and there were clues seeded in 'Sunless' that would lead players there, 4 of 3rd editions orginal modules were loosly connected, the others being 'Nightfang Spire' and 'The Bastion of Broken Souls'.
All 4 were part of the dragon Ashardalon's story, he proved popular enough to get his own 4th edition Adventure System Board Game........
"I am The Ancient, I am The Land"
There were actually 8 modules that were meant to be played in order: Sunless Citadel, Forge of Fury, Speaker in Dreams, Standing Stone, Heart of Nightfang Spire, Deep Horizon, Lord of the Iron Fortress, and Bastion of Broken Souls. I had wanted to run them but never got a chance. I'm hoping that more of them will be converted to 5E.
I know, I have all 8, but only 4 actually directly have referances or links in them.
They are a very, very loose series since they didnt get published in module level order at the time and were retroactively considered a series long after the event.
Mind you, with a bit of work, you could design an entire campaign (and smal scale setting) around the 8 modules if you add some additional material from some of the Player and DM Splatbooks of the time.
That's something I'm considering writing a blog about at some point.....
"I am The Ancient, I am The Land"
If your party freed the dragon, how long before you had them encounter it again?
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Depends entirely on the narrative I suppose. did they just free or also try to make a deal with it?
How aggressive is the original stance of the dragon? Then I would use the system to gradually allow the demeanor to change from very aggressive to a little aggressive. Then too neutral. Just like a social encounter where you gradually get in good graces with someone. Look at the dragon being Chaotic Evil. White dragons are more bestial in nature then the others. Then go from there when you understand the wyrms motives/goals and how to achieve them. Does it even include attacking the players at some point? Or perhaps cause trouble elsewhere to which the players can respond.
In my group the cleric wanted to make it his pet. But after the conversation there was at least a mutual understanding. He would help to set the beast free if it would leave the area and not harm the party. After the social encounter the wyrm flew to the far cold north. After snatching a cow for a bite to eat at an outlying farm of Oakhurst. Which gave a nice little mention once the players returned to Oakhurst themselves.
Hi! I'm going to start Tyranny of Dragons, starting with Sunless Citadel. I placed the citadel to the south of Greenest as an ancient and secret stronghold of the Cult of the Dragon. Any advice?
He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And if you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss also gazes into you.
My son sobbed inconsolably when Meepo was killed by the wyrmling's breath weapon. Everyone else in the group asked if there was anything that could be done to bring Meepo back. They insisted on giving Meepo a dignified burial with honors. There's something endearing about him...
It has kobolds, a dragon, dragon statues, and a tomb to a dragon knight. Sounds like enough =)
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Good evening man,
My biggest challenge in HoDQ was to hook the characters to the plot. if you Link them to greenest in any way during the adventure that can help your cause. Also, if the kobolds are Hording treasure for the cult and there is some written evidence of it. that could be cool to I think.
There's nothing wrong with having players stumble on it accidentally on purpose.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Whats the dragons name?
Calcryx. Says so in the manual
Also Meepo doesn't have to die from the breath weapon. Just apply three death saves like a regular PC if you want too.
Going through the Citadel soon with another group of players. Will tweak it even further from previous runs. Last time I noticed the describing the marble walls and ceiling etc became very repetitive. Also some elements weren't played up well in my opinion. During this run this specific kobold tribe will be more like crocodile lizards instead of snakes or dragons. This means they want hot humid areas. Since its placed in my campaign, in the Elsir Vale, which has a tropical climate it makes sense. This tribe of kobolds arrived only a few months ago and still is making adjustments to make the ecology fit them. Dank humid filthy environments. Some of the rooms, instead of random encounters, got big wooden "barrels" with filthy water and kobold eggs in it. They are makeshift pools of water for the kobolds until they take over goblin territory and can set up proper pools and such.
The second level already mentions underdark flora that some creatures try to cultivate and use for food. You also find that diseased rat on a table used for experimentation. Idea is to increase this scenario more. Turning Belak basically in a druid of the Land: Underdark. Basically more underdark flora and fungus. And the creatures in the second half of the grove level will become a mixed creature. The bugbear patrolling the aboretum will have myconid fungal spores growing all over their body and so do the skeletons. Using those spores to "telepathically" communicate among each other. So even if players stealthily try to sneak around and kill one...the other creatures are still alerted that way.
I still have issues figuring out why the skeletons are even there. In some rooms I can understand their presence. Locked into rooms/chambers makes sense. Having the skeletons on the grove level roaming around and seemingly assisting the denizens doesn't make sense. It's the only discrepancy I can't figure out. Anyone got an idea? For now I try to "solve" it partially through the myconid spores.
Belak's fight will get a huge boost in deadlyness as well. As he's written in Yawning Portal he's meaningless and not much of a threat. Since that book was published relatively early on in the 5e cycle it makes sense they didn't use some mechanics. Belak is already a lvl 4 druid, but will have Wildshape, which is entirely neglected in his statblock. He'll be able to shape into either a big wolf and/or a giant frog. Perhaps even a Giant Spider if he needs to get away. Wildshapes will also give him more HP so that he won't die in 2-3 well rolled hits.
The tree itself will have a 60ft range Charm it can cast on a recharge of 5-6. Simply because the tree grew out of the Gulthias vampire blood. Makes sense the tree having some of the vampiric capabilities. Also aids in providing lore for mind controlling others around it...including Belak to some degree. I'll also add some Lair Actions this time around:
--Vine Whip; from the ground in a 5ft square roots/vines whip from the ground hitting the enemy creatures
--Spawn Twig Blights; more Twig Blights crawl from the ground and join in the fight <-- might turn a group of Twig Blights into spawning 1 or 2 Vine Blights which can grapple/create difficult terrain. but would give them less hp as to not overwhelm the players too much. This also depends if you got AoE spellcasters or a more melee oriented group I believe.
--Gas Spore; From the ceiling spores randomly fall down. Each creature within 20 feet radius of impact point must succeed on a DC 15 Constitution saving throw or take 10 (3d6) poison damage and become infected with a disease on a failed save. Creatures immune to the poisoned condition are immune to this disease. Spores invade an infected creature’s system, killing the creature in a number of hours equal to 1d12+the creature’s Constitution score, unless the disease is removed. In half that time, the creature becomes poisoned for the rest of the duration. After the creature dies, it sprouts 2d4 Tiny gas spores that grow to full size in 7 days.
Will need to tweak the numbers of damage for the lair actions. Don't want to instant kill the party. Just make it properly dangerous, scary ... but fair. Something which 5e fails at if you don't modify things yourself.
It is odd to me that. 15 years ago, Belak passed through Oakhurst and shortly after arrived at the Citadel. I assume it didn't take him too long to find the Gulthias Seed and grow it into a tree and put everything into action. With the Gulthias experience, and influence, its only natural to assume that the tree would try to find ways to create defensive measures against "heroes". Belak doing the experiments would've assumed that eventually people would start asking questions and come looking as well. He had at least a few years, or more, to create the situations for possible Lair Actions.
For Belak, I'm going to be making him a corrupted/brainwashed Druid of the Raven, so he's going to have spells and abilities pertaining to a warden of the druid barrows/burial grounds he originally maintained in my campaign. Might even give him the Circle of Spore perk. As for the Gulthias Tree itself... well, I was thinking that Gulthias has had a long, long time to consider the possibility of adventurers coming to try and destroy him for good. He has control of plantlife and corpses already with the Blights... my campaign, he's gonna make himself a battle-shell around his tree. :3 A Blightbark Drake, to fit in with the Citadel's background as a cult shrine/temple to Ashardalon. x3
Working on a supplement for the adventure-minded. A project including (and crediting) homebrew subclasses from the community, a world of my own design, premade characters, magic items, and even a prologue adventure to start things off!
Past and Current Characters: Morgann 'Duskspear' Solbeard, Hill Dwarf Paladin/Fighter/Warlock; Ephemeral 'Skye' Solbeard, Hill Dwarf Artificer; Zaldrick Lawscrip of Orzhov, Hobgoblin Wizard; Eremys Spydrun, Shadar'kai Monk; Cuchulainn, Wood Elf Blood Hunter.
Running sunless citadel through tales of yawning portal tied to death curse and Asorack. My group never asks questions of NPCs and blindly follow any quest without motivation of why. This will lead them to trouble as they will not understand that Acerack sp? Is sucking all souls from the afterlife.
So they are headed to second floor and do not know why...just going to rescue hucrele fam. Which are dead or thralls.