Excuses in advance for the wrong use of the forum and my language skills, this is my first threat, so here I go.
Recently started my first campaign as a DM. So far so good, but now something has happened. My party rescued a child, hanging from a windmill. Long story that isn't important now. After rescuing him, he started talking and talking. It's a proud and maybe somewhat prideful little kid, but does not mean any harm. The goliath of the party on the other hand grew annoyed with the child very quickly and seriously attempted to murder him with his club...
He threw an attack roll. An 18, I believe. And a damage roll of 5. Other party members tried to stop him, but didn't throw higher than a 17, so we decided that they had no way of stopping the goliath. Luckily the Goliath changed his mind halfway to just knock the kid out, thank god, but that still leaves my question:
Could I have used a saving roll in an attempt to make the child avoid the attack? Or how do saving throws work exactly, because I can't make too much sense of my DM's Guide and hoped someone could help me out. The gnome of the party - who has some DM experience - told me the armor class wasn't high enough, because it was just a child with no armor on. But wearing armor does not say anything about the child being agile enough to jump out of the way, I'd say.
A saving throw is usually called for by an attack or spell, or the DM might say "make a save" if they feel it's appropriate. I haven't experienced any DM who made an attack, hit, then asked for a save to avoid damage.
That goliath would be watching his back in that town if he was in my world.
Alright. If I understand you correctly, I (or the child, in this case) should have done a saving throw right after the goliath did an attack roll? And if they threw higher they should've been able to avoid it?
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Meanwhile the goliath is a terrible character, honestly. He doesn't play along with the other party members or just blatantly ignores them. He can also only say his own name, so communicating is hard (and probably results in him finding different means to get attention, but that's just an assumption). Yet have to decide what to do with that. But that's a different story.
No, I'd say if you're allowing an ordinary attack roll from the goliath you should let it play out. Or, if the goliath said "I smack the child with my club" then give the child a save instead of asking for an attack roll.
I think you have some misconceptions of how the basic mechanics work.
The Goliath attacked the child with a melee weapon attack.
Assuming they were close enough together for him to swing at the child, he simply rolls a d20 to see how well he scored. The d20 roll needs to be compared to the effective armor class of the child, which in this case is 10+ the child's dexterity bonus. So the child does get the benefit of being able to possibly dodge the blow.
However, an 18 attack roll will overcome any 10+dex so the goliath "hit" the child with his attack. Then the goliath rolled a 5 on damage. So the child takes 5 bludgeoning damage. This could be enough to cause the child to drop unconscious and have to be revived or he will die. Usually NPCs are just "left to die" but if you want to raise the importance of this child in the overall narrative you may begin trying to have him roll death saves to see if he truly dies or if he recovers consciousness and lives.
The goliath will now be a notorious child killer at least in this settlement. The townsfolk should act like they know he is a child killer. They may be too intimidated to assault the goliath, but there are many other things they can do. The party is in quite a dilemma. They are probably considered accomplices of the child killer unless they actively work to subdue him and bring him to justice.
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Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt
No, I'd say if you're allowing an ordinary attack roll from the goliath you should let it play out. Or, if the goliath said "I smack the child with my club" then give the child a save instead of asking for an attack roll.
I wouldn't use both.
The goliath announced that was what he was going to do. Hitting the child over the head with his club. So I should've let the child at least TRY to dodge it, correct? Unless - as MusicScout pointed out - the child would never be able to successfully dodge it to begin with. A saving throw would still be allowed later on, I suppose.
I think you have some misconceptions of how the basic mechanics work.
The Goliath attacked the child with a melee weapon attack.
Assuming they were close enough together for him to swing at the child, he simply rolls a d20 to see how well he scored. The d20 roll needs to be compared to the effective armor class of the child, which in this case is 10+ the child's dexterity bonus. So the child does get the benefit of being able to possibly dodge the blow.
However, an 18 attack roll will overcome any 10+dex so the goliath "hit" the child with his attack. Then the goliath rolled a 5 on damage. So the child takes 5 bludgeoning damage. This could be enough to cause the child to drop unconscious and have to be revived or he will die. Usually NPCs are just "left to die" but if you want to raise the importance of this child in the overall narrative you may begin trying to have him roll death saves to see if he truly dies or if he recovers consciousness and lives.
The goliath will now be a notorious child killer at least in this settlement. The townsfolk should act like they know he is a child killer. They may be too intimidated to assault the goliath, but there are many other things they can do. The party is in quite a dilemma. They are probably considered accomplices of the child killer unless they actively work to subdue him and bring him to justice.
They were basically looking for this child (and a dozen other kidnapped children, this one just happens to be the first they come across). The child was hit unconscious and the gnome wizard had to force the goliath to pick the child up and take it with them to the nearest town, because at first the goliath didn't want to. The nearby town doesn't know what happened because the party lied to them, making up a story wherein the child simply fell off the windmill, and I yet have to come up with what'll happen if he recovers... I really want to penalize the goliath for his bullcrêpe (like having the child be able to recover safely and then say the goliath attacked him) because right now I'm just pissed out of my mind that he doesn't seem to take the campaign seriously.
Unless you are wearing heavy armour your AC does take accont of your ability to dodge out the way. In a normal battle the goliaths opponent wouldn't have a save to avoid the club but a creature with higher dex would have a higher AC than a lower dex character.
I would argue that children are smaller and probably more agile than typical non-combat adults (commoners) and therefore more difficult to hiy. Giving them a Dex of 14 would increase the AC to 12 (compared to 10 for a commoner) but would still get hit by an 18 attack roll.
The number one rule is that everybody must have fun, and your group could benefit from an ooc session on theirthoughtsd on this.
A similar sort of event occurred in a game I was involved in recently. One PC was a greedy pirate who wanted nothing more than to get his own ship. The party (who had chartered a ship) were attacked by a vessel bearing the flag of Asmodeus. After the crew were defeated in a dream the PC a devil (we are not sure if it was Asmodeus himself) offered the ship and a "really cool gun" (a hell fire weapon) if he agreed to serve this devil.
Out of Character the player informed us he was happy for the party to do whatever we though appropriate. After a lot of attempts to try and get the pirate to see the seriousness of the position he was in he was unwilling to have any attempts to invalidate his contract. The party decided to try to restrain the pirate (hold person / Hypnotic pattern) while we sunk the ship in the hope that with no chance of a ship he would see sense but he kept making saves and started shooting us with a hellfire weapon so the party turned on an killed the pirate.
It was an interesting situation but we knew the player was OK with rollling a new character, and we all had fun. I would not like the same thing to happen in a couple of weeks with his new character but it was great as a one off.
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Excuses in advance for the wrong use of the forum and my language skills, this is my first threat, so here I go.
Recently started my first campaign as a DM. So far so good, but now something has happened.
My party rescued a child, hanging from a windmill. Long story that isn't important now. After rescuing him, he started talking and talking. It's a proud and maybe somewhat prideful little kid, but does not mean any harm. The goliath of the party on the other hand grew annoyed with the child very quickly and seriously attempted to murder him with his club...
He threw an attack roll. An 18, I believe. And a damage roll of 5. Other party members tried to stop him, but didn't throw higher than a 17, so we decided that they had no way of stopping the goliath. Luckily the Goliath changed his mind halfway to just knock the kid out, thank god, but that still leaves my question:
Could I have used a saving roll in an attempt to make the child avoid the attack? Or how do saving throws work exactly, because I can't make too much sense of my DM's Guide and hoped someone could help me out.
The gnome of the party - who has some DM experience - told me the armor class wasn't high enough, because it was just a child with no armor on. But wearing armor does not say anything about the child being agile enough to jump out of the way, I'd say.
Thanks in advance.
A saving throw is usually called for by an attack or spell, or the DM might say "make a save" if they feel it's appropriate. I haven't experienced any DM who made an attack, hit, then asked for a save to avoid damage.
That goliath would be watching his back in that town if he was in my world.
Alright. If I understand you correctly, I (or the child, in this case) should have done a saving throw right after the goliath did an attack roll?
And if they threw higher they should've been able to avoid it?
-
Meanwhile the goliath is a terrible character, honestly. He doesn't play along with the other party members or just blatantly ignores them.
He can also only say his own name, so communicating is hard (and probably results in him finding different means to get attention, but that's just an assumption).
Yet have to decide what to do with that. But that's a different story.
No, I'd say if you're allowing an ordinary attack roll from the goliath you should let it play out. Or, if the goliath said "I smack the child with my club" then give the child a save instead of asking for an attack roll.
I wouldn't use both.
I think you have some misconceptions of how the basic mechanics work.
The Goliath attacked the child with a melee weapon attack.
Assuming they were close enough together for him to swing at the child, he simply rolls a d20 to see how well he scored. The d20 roll needs to be compared to the effective armor class of the child, which in this case is 10+ the child's dexterity bonus. So the child does get the benefit of being able to possibly dodge the blow.
However, an 18 attack roll will overcome any 10+dex so the goliath "hit" the child with his attack. Then the goliath rolled a 5 on damage. So the child takes 5 bludgeoning damage. This could be enough to cause the child to drop unconscious and have to be revived or he will die. Usually NPCs are just "left to die" but if you want to raise the importance of this child in the overall narrative you may begin trying to have him roll death saves to see if he truly dies or if he recovers consciousness and lives.
The goliath will now be a notorious child killer at least in this settlement. The townsfolk should act like they know he is a child killer. They may be too intimidated to assault the goliath, but there are many other things they can do. The party is in quite a dilemma. They are probably considered accomplices of the child killer unless they actively work to subdue him and bring him to justice.
Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt
The goliath announced that was what he was going to do. Hitting the child over the head with his club. So I should've let the child at least TRY to dodge it, correct? Unless - as MusicScout pointed out - the child would never be able to successfully dodge it to begin with. A saving throw would still be allowed later on, I suppose.
They were basically looking for this child (and a dozen other kidnapped children, this one just happens to be the first they come across). The child was hit unconscious and the gnome wizard had to force the goliath to pick the child up and take it with them to the nearest town, because at first the goliath didn't want to.
The nearby town doesn't know what happened because the party lied to them, making up a story wherein the child simply fell off the windmill, and I yet have to come up with what'll happen if he recovers... I really want to penalize the goliath for his bullcrêpe (like having the child be able to recover safely and then say the goliath attacked him) because right now I'm just pissed out of my mind that he doesn't seem to take the campaign seriously.
Unless you are wearing heavy armour your AC does take accont of your ability to dodge out the way. In a normal battle the goliaths opponent wouldn't have a save to avoid the club but a creature with higher dex would have a higher AC than a lower dex character.
I would argue that children are smaller and probably more agile than typical non-combat adults (commoners) and therefore more difficult to hiy. Giving them a Dex of 14 would increase the AC to 12 (compared to 10 for a commoner) but would still get hit by an 18 attack roll.
The number one rule is that everybody must have fun, and your group could benefit from an ooc session on theirthoughtsd on this.
A similar sort of event occurred in a game I was involved in recently. One PC was a greedy pirate who wanted nothing more than to get his own ship. The party (who had chartered a ship) were attacked by a vessel bearing the flag of Asmodeus. After the crew were defeated in a dream the PC a devil (we are not sure if it was Asmodeus himself) offered the ship and a "really cool gun" (a hell fire weapon) if he agreed to serve this devil.
Out of Character the player informed us he was happy for the party to do whatever we though appropriate. After a lot of attempts to try and get the pirate to see the seriousness of the position he was in he was unwilling to have any attempts to invalidate his contract. The party decided to try to restrain the pirate (hold person / Hypnotic pattern) while we sunk the ship in the hope that with no chance of a ship he would see sense but he kept making saves and started shooting us with a hellfire weapon so the party turned on an killed the pirate.
It was an interesting situation but we knew the player was OK with rollling a new character, and we all had fun. I would not like the same thing to happen in a couple of weeks with his new character but it was great as a one off.