Hey I am a relatively new DM, unfamiliar with many things available to me, and I have run into a problem:
My players (party of 3 level 1 players) went into the Alchemist's House in the Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh and immediately found their way into the cellar--but made a lot of noise doing it with the Magic Mouth trap door--and so I let the game play out as it did, and the two bandits and scout (that the adventure "says" should be in the room if they've been alerted to their presence) defeated them. The healer of the group "spared the dying" while the healer was himself at 1 HP, and I played it such that the enemies allowed him to "Spare the Dying" on the other party member that was just defeated could be spared, but then the surviving bandit and scout (they had killed one of them) "knocks him out."
That is where my adventure currently stands.
I've read on here how players universally hate losing battles, and universally hate "being captured." I don't like anything that truly takes away their agency either. BUT--I also believe that this happened because they were careless. What I did like was the role playing at the end, and we do have a completely new player who is a magic user and didn't realize how unwise it was to use all his spell slots early in the game day--so that left him in a tight spot when the battle got intense.
Within the context of the story: They have discovered that the local haunted house is not actually haunted, but is being used by bandits "for some reason." It stands to reason to me that the leader (Sanbalet), once alerted to his new prisoners, would not want the players killed necessarily because he knows that the town council of Saltmarsh (who assigned them to go investigate the house) may send more if they do not return. One of the major merchants of Saltwater (Gellan Primewater) is actually behind this (in my version--and they do not know this yet, but have met him and view him as a friend).
I think a reasonable thing to do is return some of their belongings to Gellan and have him make up a story and a resolution for the townspeople--but have them "dispose" of the characters by dropping them off in some sort of dangerous situation that they have to address, far away from Saltmarsh where they can't inform Eliander FIrebrand of what is going on at the house--because he might send some of his towns guard to investigate.
What I am looking for is a level one-appropriate "dungeon" that they could possibly awaken in, or awaken "on their way to" for the enemies to say "we'll drop you off here and check back in 2 days. If you're alive, we'll take the spoils you found. If you're not...tough luck!"
If you have read this much--thank you. If you have suggestions or ideas or stories of what you have done in similar situations, please share. If you know of resources (other than "The Sunless Citadel", which two of the party has experienced before) that are appropriate for 3 level-1 players, please let me know. My next stop is the DM Lair, I know he has lots of good free stuff. But I just thought I'd engage with anyone who was interested in sharing their thoughts...thank you all so much!
I would probably give the players level 2. First, it will make them a lot less squishy and make your life easier not having to worry as much about accidentally killing them with a good roll; and Second, it will greatly soften the blow of getting captured their first time out.
I see no issue with capturing the players. Instead of dropping them off somewhere far from saltmarsh, I would instead have them wake up being held by the bandits in a cage, or one of the rooms in the house, where they are being kept while the bandits try to decide what to do with them. Maybe the bandits are planning on shanghaiing the players into service on a pirate ship and they are just waiting on the ship to show up. Have the players figure out how to escape. Give them a chance to come up with their own plan, they probably have a few spells, tricks, etc.
Some ideas:
They could lure a bandit over and get the keys somehow. Maybe the bandit is drunk and trying to antagonize them for killing his buddy.
If there is a bard in the party they could sing the bandits all to sleep, or can cause enough discord that the bandits start infighting (really could be any player with high/good performance/persuasion/deception rolls).
If there is a rogue or a character proficient with thieves tools they find a bit of twisted metal or a needle and can use it as a pick.
Maybe the town council gets worried the party hasn't returned and sends another adventuring group along that finishes the bandits and sets them free (My least favorite).
Have them being shipped off to be used for entertainment by a wealthy merchant. Give them opportunities to escape but if they fail, they get shipped off. Then they might have chances to seize the ship - but if they fail, they arrive at the colosseum to fight as gladiators. Then give them opportunities to escape or win their freedom - another contestant perhaps has an escape plan but needs their help. Keep it moving forward - having them wake up outside with the bandits gone or be rescued is just a story way of saying "and you succeeded anyway, but nearly died" and is a bit lame. Be sure to keep their belongings nearby (in an unlocked chest close to their cells, but not reachable without escaping) and make it easy for them to get them back. Don't tell them where exactly their belongings are - that way you can drop them in their path no matter what they do. "you climb out of the window and zipline down a rope of bunting to the stables, where you find two stableboys dressed in what looks suspiciously like the paladins armour, swinging at each other with sticks. There is an open chest on the wagon behind them, with all of your stuff in it." Easy chase scene if the kids run (they can't run fast in armour) and there's their stuff. IF they went out of the door, they also find their stuff, same if they tunnel out!
There are a LOT of encounters in Ghosts of Saltmarsh that hit well above the paygrade of what level the characters are supposed to be at for their particular sections. This will especially be the case for you since you have just 3 PC's.
The issue with being captured is more being forced into it. When the DM contrives a no-win situation and there’s nothing the players can do. In your case, this happened organically, and you used it as an alternative to killing them. I’d say you made a good call — they have learned there are consequences and you didn’t tpk them.
I‘d agree with letting them level up. There’s a lot of experience to be gained from what they did, it will give them a nice bump in power, and will take the sting out of the capture. I can’t help much with published adventures, but I like thoruck’s idea for a gladiatorial combat, those can be fun. And depending on party composition, they might just try to sneak out themselves, or go full Spartacus and lead a rebellion, or bribe a guard, or win so much they are granted their freedom — leave it to them how they get out.
Thank you guys so much! I have leveled them up, and I have a plan--they are now in cages in the storage room underneath the house. They don't know this yet, but the plan is that they will be sold to go compete in an illegal gladiatorial combat arena on the (relatively nearby) island of Caerbannog (where they are told there is a chance that they will face a "legendary black beast"). If they escape, they can carry on with the mission. If they don't--they will get delivered to the arena and we're totally off script from there. They are being guarded by a scout and two bandits who have been drinking the wine in the room and aren't very bright--so they should be able to devise some scheme to escape if they really want to.
We're all older (30's and 40's), so they're not kids--but we are all relative newbies (or very dusty) at this game and I want to make it fun, but still reasonably challenging and not just brush off consequences. And I still am definitely trying to figure out how to have appropriate challenges and stories for them. But it's great fun, and I appreciate all of your input.
For those of you who understood the Caerbannog reference, one of the players had decided to name his character "Guy De Loimbard," so I'm trying to riff off of that just a little where I can without delving into complete silliness. I hope someone gets those references.
When I ran Saltmarsh I captured half of the group and had Sanbalet use them as laborers to load and unload the goods that he’s smuggling. He stored them in the room with the skeletons and they managed to defeat the skeletons without their weapons. Since only half of them were captured it turned into a rescue instead of a straight escape and everyone had a great time!
I had to scramble to figure out what to do when they got knocked unconscious too. I wasn’t expecting them to lose, but the dice weren’t their friends that night.
When I ran Saltmarsh I captured half of the group and had Sanbalet use them as laborers to load and unload the goods that he’s smuggling. He stored them in the room with the skeletons and they managed to defeat the skeletons without their weapons. Since only half of them were captured it turned into a rescue instead of a straight escape and everyone had a great time!
I had to scramble to figure out what to do when they got knocked unconscious too. I wasn’t expecting them to lose, but the dice weren’t their friends that night.
Same here! Thank you. I thought about using the skeleton room--and that may still happen--but for now, at least I have a story in my head that seems reasonable!
Thank you guys so much! I have leveled them up, and I have a plan--they are now in cages in the storage room underneath the house. They don't know this yet, but the plan is that they will be sold to go compete in an illegal gladiatorial combat arena on the (relatively nearby) island of Caerbannog (where they are told there is a chance that they will face a "legendary black beast"). If they escape, they can carry on with the mission. If they don't--they will get delivered to the arena and we're totally off script from there. They are being guarded by a scout and two bandits who have been drinking the wine in the room and aren't very bright--so they should be able to devise some scheme to escape if they really want to.
We're all older (30's and 40's), so they're not kids--but we are all relative newbies (or very dusty) at this game and I want to make it fun, but still reasonably challenging and not just brush off consequences. And I still am definitely trying to figure out how to have appropriate challenges and stories for them. But it's great fun, and I appreciate all of your input.
For those of you who understood the Caerbannog reference, one of the players had decided to name his character "Guy De Loimbard," so I'm trying to riff off of that just a little where I can without delving into complete silliness. I hope someone gets those references.
I get the references :)
For the Legendary Black Beast, what are you thinking of using? I'm wondering if there are any suitable creatures which have illusion powers to help make the initial appearance suit properly!
Will you also be adding an NPC conjurer who some call... Tim?
There are a few options, some of which are suggested above, but there are a couple of things to keep in mind from a DM perspective.
1) Level 1 is very squishy.
2) Small parties are MUCH squishier than larger ones.
3) If you run every fight as listed in GoS for a party of three characters - the odds are good that this will happen again.
My suggestions would be the following -
- level them level 2
- add an NPC that is also a prisoner (choose a class that doesn't hog the limelight but provides useful support) - ideally with access to the healing word spell - but which doesn't over shadow any of the PCs. Once everyone has gotten used to the game more you can have the NPC move along if you want. (you could even use the existing sea elf prisoner on the smuggling ship if you like but perhaps make him a useful class/NPC).
As far as continuing the storyline ...
Sanbalet might keep them as prisoners - however, the second half of the adventure involves the characters having to capture the smuggling ship. So a natural continuation would be for Sanbalet to transfer the prisoners to the smuggling ship for "disposal" ... either dumped at sea or sold into slavery at a distant port of call. If the prisoners can figure out a way to escape then they might be able to continue the module with minimal disruption of the plot line. If they need an assist on the ship, then the sea elf could break free or you could modify the storyline slightly and have the lizard folk help them out a bit. (The lizardfolk are trading with the smugglers for weapons as part of the greater story arc so they tend to stay out of fights entirely but they might agree to help the characters if the characters agree to letting them take the weapons). However, some of the opponents on the ship can be fairly tough so the goal has to be stealthy elimination of opponents as much as possible.
I'm a new DM and have run into similar situations with my PC's, I was thinking along the same lines as the suggestions so it helps to see that I'm not completely off the mark. Thanks everyone.
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Hey I am a relatively new DM, unfamiliar with many things available to me, and I have run into a problem:
My players (party of 3 level 1 players) went into the Alchemist's House in the Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh and immediately found their way into the cellar--but made a lot of noise doing it with the Magic Mouth trap door--and so I let the game play out as it did, and the two bandits and scout (that the adventure "says" should be in the room if they've been alerted to their presence) defeated them. The healer of the group "spared the dying" while the healer was himself at 1 HP, and I played it such that the enemies allowed him to "Spare the Dying" on the other party member that was just defeated could be spared, but then the surviving bandit and scout (they had killed one of them) "knocks him out."
That is where my adventure currently stands.
I've read on here how players universally hate losing battles, and universally hate "being captured." I don't like anything that truly takes away their agency either. BUT--I also believe that this happened because they were careless. What I did like was the role playing at the end, and we do have a completely new player who is a magic user and didn't realize how unwise it was to use all his spell slots early in the game day--so that left him in a tight spot when the battle got intense.
Within the context of the story: They have discovered that the local haunted house is not actually haunted, but is being used by bandits "for some reason." It stands to reason to me that the leader (Sanbalet), once alerted to his new prisoners, would not want the players killed necessarily because he knows that the town council of Saltmarsh (who assigned them to go investigate the house) may send more if they do not return. One of the major merchants of Saltwater (Gellan Primewater) is actually behind this (in my version--and they do not know this yet, but have met him and view him as a friend).
I think a reasonable thing to do is return some of their belongings to Gellan and have him make up a story and a resolution for the townspeople--but have them "dispose" of the characters by dropping them off in some sort of dangerous situation that they have to address, far away from Saltmarsh where they can't inform Eliander FIrebrand of what is going on at the house--because he might send some of his towns guard to investigate.
What I am looking for is a level one-appropriate "dungeon" that they could possibly awaken in, or awaken "on their way to" for the enemies to say "we'll drop you off here and check back in 2 days. If you're alive, we'll take the spoils you found. If you're not...tough luck!"
If you have read this much--thank you. If you have suggestions or ideas or stories of what you have done in similar situations, please share. If you know of resources (other than "The Sunless Citadel", which two of the party has experienced before) that are appropriate for 3 level-1 players, please let me know. My next stop is the DM Lair, I know he has lots of good free stuff. But I just thought I'd engage with anyone who was interested in sharing their thoughts...thank you all so much!
I would probably give the players level 2. First, it will make them a lot less squishy and make your life easier not having to worry as much about accidentally killing them with a good roll; and Second, it will greatly soften the blow of getting captured their first time out.
I see no issue with capturing the players. Instead of dropping them off somewhere far from saltmarsh, I would instead have them wake up being held by the bandits in a cage, or one of the rooms in the house, where they are being kept while the bandits try to decide what to do with them. Maybe the bandits are planning on shanghaiing the players into service on a pirate ship and they are just waiting on the ship to show up. Have the players figure out how to escape. Give them a chance to come up with their own plan, they probably have a few spells, tricks, etc.
Some ideas:
+1 on progress the story!
Have them being shipped off to be used for entertainment by a wealthy merchant. Give them opportunities to escape but if they fail, they get shipped off. Then they might have chances to seize the ship - but if they fail, they arrive at the colosseum to fight as gladiators. Then give them opportunities to escape or win their freedom - another contestant perhaps has an escape plan but needs their help. Keep it moving forward - having them wake up outside with the bandits gone or be rescued is just a story way of saying "and you succeeded anyway, but nearly died" and is a bit lame. Be sure to keep their belongings nearby (in an unlocked chest close to their cells, but not reachable without escaping) and make it easy for them to get them back. Don't tell them where exactly their belongings are - that way you can drop them in their path no matter what they do. "you climb out of the window and zipline down a rope of bunting to the stables, where you find two stableboys dressed in what looks suspiciously like the paladins armour, swinging at each other with sticks. There is an open chest on the wagon behind them, with all of your stuff in it." Easy chase scene if the kids run (they can't run fast in armour) and there's their stuff. IF they went out of the door, they also find their stuff, same if they tunnel out!
Make your Artificer work with any other class with 174 Multiclassing Feats for your Artificer Multiclass Character!
DM's Guild Releases on This Thread Or check them all out on DMs Guild!
DrivethruRPG Releases on This Thread - latest release: My Character is a Werewolf: balanced rules for Lycanthropy!
I have started discussing/reviewing 3rd party D&D content on Substack - stay tuned for semi-regular posts!
There are a LOT of encounters in Ghosts of Saltmarsh that hit well above the paygrade of what level the characters are supposed to be at for their particular sections. This will especially be the case for you since you have just 3 PC's.
The issue with being captured is more being forced into it. When the DM contrives a no-win situation and there’s nothing the players can do. In your case, this happened organically, and you used it as an alternative to killing them. I’d say you made a good call — they have learned there are consequences and you didn’t tpk them.
I‘d agree with letting them level up. There’s a lot of experience to be gained from what they did, it will give them a nice bump in power, and will take the sting out of the capture.
I can’t help much with published adventures, but I like thoruck’s idea for a gladiatorial combat, those can be fun. And depending on party composition, they might just try to sneak out themselves, or go full Spartacus and lead a rebellion, or bribe a guard, or win so much they are granted their freedom — leave it to them how they get out.
Thank you guys so much! I have leveled them up, and I have a plan--they are now in cages in the storage room underneath the house. They don't know this yet, but the plan is that they will be sold to go compete in an illegal gladiatorial combat arena on the (relatively nearby) island of Caerbannog (where they are told there is a chance that they will face a "legendary black beast"). If they escape, they can carry on with the mission. If they don't--they will get delivered to the arena and we're totally off script from there. They are being guarded by a scout and two bandits who have been drinking the wine in the room and aren't very bright--so they should be able to devise some scheme to escape if they really want to.
We're all older (30's and 40's), so they're not kids--but we are all relative newbies (or very dusty) at this game and I want to make it fun, but still reasonably challenging and not just brush off consequences. And I still am definitely trying to figure out how to have appropriate challenges and stories for them. But it's great fun, and I appreciate all of your input.
For those of you who understood the Caerbannog reference, one of the players had decided to name his character "Guy De Loimbard," so I'm trying to riff off of that just a little where I can without delving into complete silliness. I hope someone gets those references.
When I ran Saltmarsh I captured half of the group and had Sanbalet use them as laborers to load and unload the goods that he’s smuggling. He stored them in the room with the skeletons and they managed to defeat the skeletons without their weapons. Since only half of them were captured it turned into a rescue instead of a straight escape and everyone had a great time!
I had to scramble to figure out what to do when they got knocked unconscious too. I wasn’t expecting them to lose, but the dice weren’t their friends that night.
Professional computer geek
Same here! Thank you. I thought about using the skeleton room--and that may still happen--but for now, at least I have a story in my head that seems reasonable!
I get the references :)
For the Legendary Black Beast, what are you thinking of using? I'm wondering if there are any suitable creatures which have illusion powers to help make the initial appearance suit properly!
Will you also be adding an NPC conjurer who some call... Tim?
Make your Artificer work with any other class with 174 Multiclassing Feats for your Artificer Multiclass Character!
DM's Guild Releases on This Thread Or check them all out on DMs Guild!
DrivethruRPG Releases on This Thread - latest release: My Character is a Werewolf: balanced rules for Lycanthropy!
I have started discussing/reviewing 3rd party D&D content on Substack - stay tuned for semi-regular posts!
There are a few options, some of which are suggested above, but there are a couple of things to keep in mind from a DM perspective.
1) Level 1 is very squishy.
2) Small parties are MUCH squishier than larger ones.
3) If you run every fight as listed in GoS for a party of three characters - the odds are good that this will happen again.
My suggestions would be the following -
- level them level 2
- add an NPC that is also a prisoner (choose a class that doesn't hog the limelight but provides useful support) - ideally with access to the healing word spell - but which doesn't over shadow any of the PCs. Once everyone has gotten used to the game more you can have the NPC move along if you want. (you could even use the existing sea elf prisoner on the smuggling ship if you like but perhaps make him a useful class/NPC).
As far as continuing the storyline ...
Sanbalet might keep them as prisoners - however, the second half of the adventure involves the characters having to capture the smuggling ship. So a natural continuation would be for Sanbalet to transfer the prisoners to the smuggling ship for "disposal" ... either dumped at sea or sold into slavery at a distant port of call. If the prisoners can figure out a way to escape then they might be able to continue the module with minimal disruption of the plot line. If they need an assist on the ship, then the sea elf could break free or you could modify the storyline slightly and have the lizard folk help them out a bit. (The lizardfolk are trading with the smugglers for weapons as part of the greater story arc so they tend to stay out of fights entirely but they might agree to help the characters if the characters agree to letting them take the weapons). However, some of the opponents on the ship can be fairly tough so the goal has to be stealthy elimination of opponents as much as possible.
I'm a new DM and have run into similar situations with my PC's, I was thinking along the same lines as the suggestions so it helps to see that I'm not completely off the mark. Thanks everyone.