I'm designing a train heist encounter and I want to know how I should calculate fall damage from a moving train if my players do something silly or accidentally destroy the train controls...
I'm designing a train heist encounter and I want to know how I should calculate fall damage from a moving train if my players do something silly or accidentally destroy the train controls...
Any Ideas?
What is the trains velocity?
distance to the ground?
type of ground?
weight carried? Weight of individual?
If you simply jump from a train moving at 10 meters per second (m/s), you’ll hit the ground. During impact, you’ll have a vertical velocity, because the train is higher than the ground. As you move down, the gravitational force will increase your vertical speed, as if you jumped off a stationary train. If the train is 1 meter high, you’ll travel down at 4 m/s.
But you’re also moving horizontally along with the train. So jumping would mean that upon impact, you’d move 4 m/s down and 10 m/s across. And it’s not the speed that causes injury—it’s the acceleration, or the change in velocity divided by the change in time.
Just as speed tells you how fast your position changes, acceleration describes how your speed changes in meters per second per second (m/s). There isn’t just one “safe” level of acceleration, but an acceleration of 10 m/s is safer than 40 m/s.
To decrease your acceleration on impact, decrease your starting velocity. If the train is traveling at 10 m/s north, you need to run 4 m/s south inside the train before jumping. Velocity is relative, so this puts your speed with respect to the ground at only 6 m/s north.
Personally, I’d try not to work too hard at it, and I classify doing physics homework as working too hard.
Go with the table djc suggested. Or just find the sort of damage an appropriate level monster does with a single melee attack. Or just say 3d6, cause it sounds reasonable to me. Or pick another number that’s reasonable to you. And if they jump on purpose, aDC 15 acrobatics/athletics check to halve the damage. If their thrown against their will or fall of not on purpose, a DC 15 dex save for half.
If there are no obstacles to hit as they jump off, I'd use fall damage and an acrobatics check at disadvantage (due to the trains movement) to determine if you land prone. If you jumped, and there were obstacles (like trees) you could hit, I'd say somewhere around 2d10 damage if you failed the check and hit one, plus the fall damage (and automatic fall prone).
Remember, 2d10 doesn't seem like a lot, but average damage would autokill a "commoner".
I'm designing a train heist encounter and I want to know how I should calculate fall damage from a moving train if my players do something silly or accidentally destroy the train controls...
Any Ideas?
What is the trains velocity?
distance to the ground?
type of ground?
weight carried? Weight of individual?
If you simply jump from a train moving at 10 meters per second (m/s), you’ll hit the ground. During impact, you’ll have a vertical velocity, because the train is higher than the ground. As you move down, the gravitational force will increase your vertical speed, as if you jumped off a stationary train. If the train is 1 meter high, you’ll travel down at 4 m/s.
But you’re also moving horizontally along with the train. So jumping would mean that upon impact, you’d move 4 m/s down and 10 m/s across. And it’s not the speed that causes injury—it’s the acceleration, or the change in velocity divided by the change in time.
Just as speed tells you how fast your position changes, acceleration describes how your speed changes in meters per second per second (m/s). There isn’t just one “safe” level of acceleration, but an acceleration of 10 m/s is safer than 40 m/s.
To decrease your acceleration on impact, decrease your starting velocity. If the train is traveling at 10 m/s north, you need to run 4 m/s south inside the train before jumping. Velocity is relative, so this puts your speed with respect to the ground at only 6 m/s north.
This is way too complicated for any sort of adjudication. Just use the table, and factor in the rules for fall damage; otherwise your table is going to be sitting awkwardly for 15 minutes while you do the math.
Damage dice for distance to the ground (1d6 per 10 ft) + damage dice for speed of the train (say 1d6 per 5 mph or 10 mph).
I agree. 1d6 per 10mph plus the distance fallen. Might allow Acrobatics to help ablate the damage (Epic Rolling)
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Remember there are Rules as Written (RAW), Rules as Intended (RAI), and Rules as Fun (RAF). There's some great RAW, RAI, and RAF here... please check in with your DM to determine how they want to adjudicate the RAW/RAI/RAF for your game.
10d10 Bludgeoning Damage. DC15 DEX Save to take half-damage on a success. Adjust if the player puts in effort to mitigate damage (looks for a safe place to land first, makes an acrobatics check, or uses feather fall to land safely).
We could also convert mph into feet per round and use fall damage based on that. 10 mph is 88 feet per 6 seconds exactly. But since you are moving horizontally to the ground it would really be much less damage than hitting it head on, I'd guess about 1/4th. So add 10 feet of vertical fall gives us 30 feet of fall damage for 3d6 bludgeoning.
We could also convert mph into feet per round and use fall damage based on that. 10 mph is 88 feet per 6 seconds exactly. But since you are moving horizontally to the ground it would really be much less damage than hitting it head on, I'd guess about 1/4th. So add 10 feet of vertical fall gives us 30 feet of fall damage for 3d6 bludgeoning.
Exactly what I said based purely on gut feelings. Take that math!
We could also convert mph into feet per round and use fall damage based on that. 10 mph is 88 feet per 6 seconds exactly. But since you are moving horizontally to the ground it would really be much less damage than hitting it head on, I'd guess about 1/4th. So add 10 feet of vertical fall gives us 30 feet of fall damage for 3d6 bludgeoning.
Exactly what I said based purely on gut feelings. Take that math!
That’s still math, that just falls under a different math than algebra. Probabilities and statistics.
10d10 Bludgeoning Damage. DC15 DEX Save to take half-damage on a success. Adjust if the player puts in effort to mitigate damage (looks for a safe place to land first, makes an acrobatics check, or uses feather fall to land safely).
That's more appropriate for someone getting hit by a train.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Personally, I’d try not to work too hard at it, and I classify doing physics homework as working too hard.
Go with the table djc suggested. Or just find the sort of damage an appropriate level monster does with a single melee attack. Or just say 3d6, cause it sounds reasonable to me. Or pick another number that’s reasonable to you. And if they jump on purpose, aDC 15 acrobatics/athletics check to halve the damage. If their thrown against their will or fall of not on purpose, a DC 15 dex save for half.
This sounds the most reasonable to me.
Train not moving -0
Train going slow - 1d6
Train going medium speed - 2d6
Tran going top speed - 3d6
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
10d10 Bludgeoning Damage. DC15 DEX Save to take half-damage on a success. Adjust if the player puts in effort to mitigate damage (looks for a safe place to land first, makes an acrobatics check, or uses feather fall to land safely).
That's more appropriate for someone getting hit by a train.
Might even be too high, they would only take 8d6 damage from hitting the ground at the same speed.
Does anyone have any mechanics for travelling on a train, I.e taking into account fuel resources and requirements like how often to stop for water and how to monitor usage of it etc?
Does anyone have any mechanics for travelling on a train, I.e taking into account fuel resources and requirements like how often to stop for water and how to monitor usage of it etc?
The rules don't have such mechanics so it would be up to DM to determine.
Does anyone have any mechanics for travelling on a train, I.e taking into account fuel resources and requirements like how often to stop for water and how to monitor usage of it etc?
First of all, trains aren't a part of D&D in the first place so the game doesn't need rules for how they operate. Second of all, such details aren't necessary even if it did because they're not relevant to adventurers: assign how much time it takes the train to get from Point A to Point B based on an average travel speed for the train, and figure that water and fuel stops are simply part of that travel time.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
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I'm designing a train heist encounter and I want to know how I should calculate fall damage from a moving train if my players do something silly or accidentally destroy the train controls...
Any Ideas?
Probably just consult the improvised damage table.
What is the trains velocity?
distance to the ground?
type of ground?
weight carried? Weight of individual?
If you simply jump from a train moving at 10 meters per second (m/s), you’ll hit the ground. During impact, you’ll have a vertical velocity, because the train is higher than the ground. As you move down, the gravitational force will increase your vertical speed, as if you jumped off a stationary train. If the train is 1 meter high, you’ll travel down at 4 m/s.
But you’re also moving horizontally along with the train. So jumping would mean that upon impact, you’d move 4 m/s down and 10 m/s across. And it’s not the speed that causes injury—it’s the acceleration, or the change in velocity divided by the change in time.
Just as speed tells you how fast your position changes, acceleration describes how your speed changes in meters per second per second (m/s). There isn’t just one “safe” level of acceleration, but an acceleration of 10 m/s is safer than 40 m/s.
To decrease your acceleration on impact, decrease your starting velocity. If the train is traveling at 10 m/s north, you need to run 4 m/s south inside the train before jumping. Velocity is relative, so this puts your speed with respect to the ground at only 6 m/s north.
Watch me on twitch
Personally, I’d try not to work too hard at it, and I classify doing physics homework as working too hard.
Go with the table djc suggested. Or just find the sort of damage an appropriate level monster does with a single melee attack. Or just say 3d6, cause it sounds reasonable to me. Or pick another number that’s reasonable to you.
And if they jump on purpose, aDC 15 acrobatics/athletics check to halve the damage. If their thrown against their will or fall of not on purpose, a DC 15 dex save for half.
If there are no obstacles to hit as they jump off, I'd use fall damage and an acrobatics check at disadvantage (due to the trains movement) to determine if you land prone. If you jumped, and there were obstacles (like trees) you could hit, I'd say somewhere around 2d10 damage if you failed the check and hit one, plus the fall damage (and automatic fall prone).
Remember, 2d10 doesn't seem like a lot, but average damage would autokill a "commoner".
This is way too complicated for any sort of adjudication. Just use the table, and factor in the rules for fall damage; otherwise your table is going to be sitting awkwardly for 15 minutes while you do the math.
Damage dice for distance to the ground (1d6 per 10 ft) + damage dice for speed of the train (say 1d6 per 5 mph or 10 mph).
I agree. 1d6 per 10mph plus the distance fallen. Might allow Acrobatics to help ablate the damage (Epic Rolling)
Remember there are Rules as Written (RAW), Rules as Intended (RAI), and Rules as Fun (RAF). There's some great RAW, RAI, and RAF here... please check in with your DM to determine how they want to adjudicate the RAW/RAI/RAF for your game.
10d10 Bludgeoning Damage. DC15 DEX Save to take half-damage on a success. Adjust if the player puts in effort to mitigate damage (looks for a safe place to land first, makes an acrobatics check, or uses feather fall to land safely).
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I agree. 1d6 per 10mph plus the distance fallen. Might allow Acrobatics to help ablate the damage
We could also convert mph into feet per round and use fall damage based on that. 10 mph is 88 feet per 6 seconds exactly. But since you are moving horizontally to the ground it would really be much less damage than hitting it head on, I'd guess about 1/4th. So add 10 feet of vertical fall gives us 30 feet of fall damage for 3d6 bludgeoning.
Exactly what I said based purely on gut feelings. Take that math!
That’s still math, that just falls under a different math than algebra. Probabilities and statistics.
math for the win!
Watch me on twitch
That's more appropriate for someone getting hit by a train.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
This sounds the most reasonable to me.
Train not moving -0
Train going slow - 1d6
Train going medium speed - 2d6
Tran going top speed - 3d6
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Might even be too high, they would only take 8d6 damage from hitting the ground at the same speed.
Maybe if they actually got run over...
Does anyone have any mechanics for travelling on a train, I.e taking into account fuel resources and requirements like how often to stop for water and how to monitor usage of it etc?
The rules don't have such mechanics so it would be up to DM to determine.
I wondered if anyone had managed to think of any as I’m struggling to determine how to run it myself.
First of all, trains aren't a part of D&D in the first place so the game doesn't need rules for how they operate. Second of all, such details aren't necessary even if it did because they're not relevant to adventurers: assign how much time it takes the train to get from Point A to Point B based on an average travel speed for the train, and figure that water and fuel stops are simply part of that travel time.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.