Hey everyone, there is some debate amongst me and my players as to what exactly is flanking when using hexes as the rules as written are not clear
looking at chapter 8 of the dungeon masters guide it states Flanking on Hexes. When a creature and at least one of its allies are adjacent to an enemy and on opposite sides of the enemy’s space, they flank that enemy, and each of them has advantage on attack rolls against that enemy. On hexes, count around the enemy from one creature to its ally. Against a Medium or smaller creature, the allies flank if there are 2 hexes between them. Against a Large creature, the allies flank if there are 4 hexes between them. Against a Huge creature, they must have 5 hexes between them. Against a Gargantuan creature, they must have at least 6 hexes between them.
then shows this example
to me it looks like the intent from the author is to count 4 empty spaces around the creature to get to flanking position. however there are only 3 empty spaces below the enemy in this example and therefor it could be considered that an ally has to be in the 4th hex. the dungeon masters guide does not give examples on small, medium, huge, or gargantuan enemies in regards to flanking.
this would mean that an ally would only have to be in the second hex on medium characters making the below layout with green being allies and red being the enemy a proper flanking positions. and this below image is proper flanking
this would also mean an ally in the left green position, grants flanking advantage on 3 different hexes like this
this would also mean that this would be a proper flanking position on large creatures in addition to the diagram in the dungeon master's guide.
was this the intent of the rules as written?
OR
would it be intended that each position only grants 1 other positing flanking?
for example in the below image, the enemy is red dotted. but only matching pairs of allies grant flanking to the other matching color. so green can ONLY grant advantage to an ally if they are in the other green position? and same for yellow and purple, even if all green, yellow and purple are all allies?
this would mean that in the case of a large enemy, matching pairs of green, yellow and purple would only grant advantage to matching colors, but the 3 black dots would not be able to get flanking bonus no matter what position is any of their other allies are in. this still does not allow for 4 spaces between allies as one side will always be 4 and the other 3.but if the rule was truly intended to be 4 empty spaces between allies on both sides, there would not be a way to get flanking on a large enemy.
You need to have exactly the listed number of hexes to be considered flanking. Your ally's hex is not counted towards that number -only the hexes in between the two of you.
then shows this example
to me it looks like the intent from the author is to count 4 empty spaces around the creature to get to flanking position. however there are only 3 empty spaces below the enemy in this example and therefor it could be considered that an ally has to be in the 4th hex. the dungeon masters guide does not give examples on small, medium, huge, or gargantuan enemies in regards to flanking.
In the example listed, flanking is gained by counting the 4 empty hexes that circle around the top of the monster. The three empty spaces below the creature are irrelevant.
this would mean that an ally would only have to be in the second hex on medium characters making the below layout with green being allies and red being the enemy a proper flanking positions. and this below image is proper flanking
This is not flanking. The two allies have either 1 or 3 hexes between them, not 2.
this would also mean an ally in the left green position, grants flanking advantage on 3 different hexes like this
Only the middle right is granted flanking, for the same reasons as above.
This would also mean that this would be a proper flanking position on large creatures in addition to the diagram in the dungeon master's guide.
This would be a valid flanking setup for a large creature.
for example in the below image, the enemy is red dotted. but only matching pairs of allies grant flanking to the other matching color. so green can ONLY grant advantage to an ally if they are in the other green position? and same for yellow and purple, even if all green, yellow and purple are all allies?
this would mean that in the case of a large enemy, matching pairs of green, yellow and purple would only grant advantage to matching colors, but the 3 black dots would not be able to get flanking bonus no matter what position is any of their other allies are in. this still does not allow for 4 spaces between allies as one side will always be 4 and the other 3.but if the rule was truly intended to be 4 empty spaces between allies on both sides, there would not be a way to get flanking on a large enemy.
.
Against a medium or smaller creature, there is only one valid flanking position per hex.
In the larger example, the black allies can gain flanking. You just have to be able to count exactly 4 hexes in between you and your ally, clockwise or counter-clockwise. For example, the bottom most black dot can flank with both the topmost yellow by counting 4 hexes counter-clockwise, and it can flank with the topmost green by counting 4 hexes clockwise.
Hey everyone, there is some debate amongst me and my players as to what exactly is flanking when using hexes as the rules as written are not clear
looking at chapter 8 of the dungeon masters guide it states
Flanking on Hexes. When a creature and at least one of its allies are adjacent to an enemy and on opposite sides of the enemy’s space, they flank that enemy, and each of them has advantage on attack rolls against that enemy. On hexes, count around the enemy from one creature to its ally. Against a Medium or smaller creature, the allies flank if there are 2 hexes between them. Against a Large creature, the allies flank if there are 4 hexes between them. Against a Huge creature, they must have 5 hexes between them. Against a Gargantuan creature, they must have at least 6 hexes between them.
then shows this example
to me it looks like the intent from the author is to count 4 empty spaces around the creature to get to flanking position. however there are only 3 empty spaces below the enemy in this example and therefor it could be considered that an ally has to be in the 4th hex. the dungeon masters guide does not give examples on small, medium, huge, or gargantuan enemies in regards to flanking.
this would mean that an ally would only have to be in the second hex on medium characters making the below layout with green being allies and red being the enemy a proper flanking positions. and this below image is proper flanking
this would also mean an ally in the left green position, grants flanking advantage on 3 different hexes like this
this would also mean that this would be a proper flanking position on large creatures in addition to the diagram in the dungeon master's guide.
was this the intent of the rules as written?
OR
would it be intended that each position only grants 1 other positing flanking?
for example in the below image, the enemy is red dotted. but only matching pairs of allies grant flanking to the other matching color. so green can ONLY grant advantage to an ally if they are in the other green position? and same for yellow and purple, even if all green, yellow and purple are all allies?
this would mean that in the case of a large enemy, matching pairs of green, yellow and purple would only grant advantage to matching colors, but the 3 black dots would not be able to get flanking bonus no matter what position is any of their other allies are in. this still does not allow for 4 spaces between allies as one side will always be 4 and the other 3.but if the rule was truly intended to be 4 empty spaces between allies on both sides, there would not be a way to get flanking on a large enemy.
.
what is everyone's thoughts on this?
You need to have exactly the listed number of hexes to be considered flanking. Your ally's hex is not counted towards that number -only the hexes in between the two of you.
In the example listed, flanking is gained by counting the 4 empty hexes that circle around the top of the monster. The three empty spaces below the creature are irrelevant.
This is not flanking. The two allies have either 1 or 3 hexes between them, not 2.
Only the middle right is granted flanking, for the same reasons as above.
This would be a valid flanking setup for a large creature.
Against a medium or smaller creature, there is only one valid flanking position per hex.
In the larger example, the black allies can gain flanking. You just have to be able to count exactly 4 hexes in between you and your ally, clockwise or counter-clockwise. For example, the bottom most black dot can flank with both the topmost yellow by counting 4 hexes counter-clockwise, and it can flank with the topmost green by counting 4 hexes clockwise.
Since it's an optional rule anyway, I just say that if they are mostly across from each other, they are adequately flanking.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
The "exactly X spaces" explanation makes the rules make sense.