Spell Slots. The Warlock Features table shows how many spell slots you have to cast your Warlock spells of levels 1–5. The table also shows the level of those slots, all of which are the same level. You regain all expended Pact Magic spell slots when you finish a Short or Long Rest.
For example, when you’re a level 5 Warlock, you have two level 3 spell slots. To cast the level 1 spell Witch Bolt, you must spend one of those slots, and you cast it as a level 3 spell.
As fiendish Vigor is not powered by Spell Slots, there is nothing that permits upcasting.
You can cast False Life on yourself without expending a spell slot. When you cast the spell with this feature, you don’t roll the die for the Temporary Hit Points; you automatically get the highest number on the die.
So unless otherwise stated, spells are always cast at level for Eldritch Invocation. An exception maybe Pact of the Tome
As the 1st level spells prepared by Pact of the Tome still use Spell slots, they still can up cast. I would also note such a thing would also be true of rituals, as rituals are not expending spell slots, they also do not upcast, unless you cast said spell using a spell slot instead of casting it as a ritual.
Such a spell is cast at its lowest possible level, which is the level that appears near the top of its description. Unless you have a special ability that says otherwise, the only way to increase the level of a spell is to expend a higher-level spell slot when you cast it. [...]
The previous entry in the SAC is related to the following rules in the PHB (Chapter 7).
So, you can upcast by using a slot of a higher level than the spell. Therefore, if casting without slots, the spell is cast at its lowest possible level by default.
There are several ways to cast a spell without expending a spell slot:
Cantrips. A cantrip is cast without a spell slot.
Rituals. Certain spells have the Ritual tag in the Casting Time entry. Such a spell can be cast following the normal rules for spellcasting, or it can be cast as a Ritual. The Ritual version of a spell takes 10 minutes longer to cast than normal, but it doesn’t expend a spell slot. To cast a spell as a Ritual, a spellcaster must have it prepared.
Special Abilities. Some characters and monsters have special abilities that allow them to cast specific spells without a spell slot. This casting is usually limited in another way, such as being able to cast the spell a limited number of times per day.
Magic Items.Spell Scrolls and some other magic items contain spells that can be cast without a spell slot. The description of such an item specifies how many times a spell can be cast from it.
When a spellcaster casts a spell using a slot that is of a higher level than the spell, the spell takes on the higher level for that casting. For instance, if a Wizard casts Magic Missile using a level 2 slot, that Magic Missile is level 2. Effectively, the spell expands to fill the slot it is put into.
Some spells, such as Magic Missile and Cure Wounds, have more powerful effects when cast at a higher level, as detailed in a spell’s description.
Always 1st level, any spell cast without using a spell slot can't be cast using a higher level slot.
Thanks Plague - that is what I thought.
But, can you point me to the rule that states that? (so I can show my game table)
Sure the rules for Using a Higher-Level Spell Slot is when you casts a spell using a slot and the Invocation isn't expending a spell slot.
Fiendish Vigor: You can cast False Life on yourself without expending a spell slot.
Using a Higher-Level Spell Slot: When a spellcaster casts a spell using a slot that is of a higher level than the spell, the spell takes on the higher level for that casting.
Always 1st level, any spell cast without using a spell slot can't be cast using a higher level slot.
Thanks Plague - that is what I thought.
But, can you point me to the rule that states that? (so I can show my game table)
I don't think you will be able to find a rule that says what you want.
That's because the rules for how upcasting works are pretty specific and clear. You use a spell slot higher than the lowest spell slot that can be used to cast the spell (e.g. Fireball requires at least a 3rd level spell slot, so you use at least a 4th level spell lot to upcast it) and you receive benefits.
Asking for a rule that says that you can't upcast Fiendish Vigor is sort of like asking for a rule that says that a Wizard doesn't get their Proficiency Bonus and can't use Vex when using a shortsword. You won't find a rule that says they don't get to do that. Instead the rules state what is required to get those abilities (Proficiency in the weapon and Weapon Mastery). Since Wizards aren't granted those requirements, they don't get to do that.
You won't generally see a rule specifically forbidding something like that because to the rules would balloon incredibly if they specified everything characters weren't allowed to do.
A couple problems with this: First, in 2014 PHB the text specified that false life was cast as a 1st level spell. This wording is no longer present in the 2024 version, and that feels intentional. The Sage Advice article linked was written for the 2014 edition of the game and still links to the legacy versions of invocations, not the updated ones. The 2024 rules for casting spells without spell slots makes no mention of spell level.
Under Pact Magic for warlocks, it says: If another Warlock feature gives you spells that you always have prepared, those spells don’t count against the number of spells you can prepare with this feature, but those spells otherwise count as Warlock spells for you.
When casting Warlock spells you use the spell level listed in the table based on your level. Fiendish Vigor says you don't Expend a spell slot, but doesn't say you aren't casting it with your spell slots. Given all that, a case could be made that you cast false life like any other warlock spell, using the spell level of your spell slots, but that spell slot is then not expended.
[...] The Sage Advice article linked was written for the 2014 edition of the game and still links to the legacy versions of invocations, not the updated ones. The 2024 rules for casting spells without spell slots makes no mention of spell level.
That's true, but the answer is still valid in my opinion.
The rules for casting spells are clear for me and you could consider the Fiendish Vigor Eldritch Invocation a Special Ability, so it falls under the section "Casting without Slots". If you don't use a slot, you cannot upcast the spell.
Rituals, Magic Items, Spell Scrolls, or traits/features/feats that grant characters prepared spells they can cast without using spell slots follow the same rule.
Under Pact Magic for warlocks, it says: If another Warlock feature gives you spells that you always have prepared, those spells don’t count against the number of spells you can prepare with this feature, but those spells otherwise count as Warlock spells for you.
When casting Warlock spells you use the spell level listed in the table based on your level. Fiendish Vigor says you don't Expend a spell slot, but doesn't say you aren't casting it with your spell slots. Given all that, a case could be made that you cast false life like any other warlock spell, using the spell level of your spell slots, but that spell slot is then not expended.
To use your own slots, it's as @R3sistance explained.
You can also check all this using a character created in D&D Beyond.
There seems to be a lot of speculation on this topic. Given that false life is not even a warlock spell, the only way for a warlock to cast false life is by taking Fiendish Vigor Invocation, so this is limited. For arguments sake let’s use Warlock level 5 as an example, so warlock casting a spell uses a 3rd level spell. This is the specific example Jeremy Crawford referred to when he said “ unless you have a special ability that says otherwise” (I.e., the warlock). The warlock will never, ever, ever ever expend a higher level spell slot to cast a spell as they only have one spell slot level they can use. The warlock can only cast a spell at the level in their table. The spell descriptions don’t change, and those spells which say “using higher level spell slot” have always benefitted the warlock as a higher level spell. This is not about expending a slot, it’s about at what level the spell is cast. Then consider that there are 28 invocations. 12 of those invocations give the warlock a spell to cast. 9 of those spells cannot be cast at higher levels (for example Levitate). The 3 remaining spells which can be cast at higher level: invisibility, false life, and jump. The invocation text specifically limits the casting of jump and invisibility so those two (even cast at the higher level warlock’s spell slot per their table as the warlock increases) there’s no benefit to the upcast. In other words if a 5th level warlock has the “otherworldly leap” invocation which allows them to cast jump, they would cast jump at 3rd level because the warlock only casts at the spell slot level on their table. However, the invocation says they can only cast jump on themselves. Jump is a touch spell and cast at a higher level say by a Wizard, would allow the wizard to touch 3 people and give them jump. But not the warlock if he uses the invocation because the specific instructions in the invocation only allow the jump spell to be cast on themselves. ONLY false life has any benefit to casting at a higher level. So for warlocks, this is a buff compared to 2014. This is pretty niche and only applicable to one invocation for one class. The designers did a good job not allowing warlocks higher level casting to be abused. This is not broken. False life through Fiendish Vigor invocation now in 2024 version scales nicely and is a decent invocation to take. It amounts to a few extra temp hp for the warlock who invests in this invocation and maxes out after a warlock reaches 9th level at 2d4+4+20 using a 5th level spell, 32 temp HP for the warlock at 9th level.
There seems to be a lot of speculation on this topic. Given that false life is not even a warlock spell, the only way for a warlock to cast false life is by taking Fiendish Vigor Invocation, so this is limited. For arguments sake let’s use Warlock level 5 as an example, so warlock casting a spell uses a 3rd level spell. This is the specific example Jeremy Crawford referred to when he said “ unless you have a special ability that says otherwise” (I.e., the warlock). The warlock will never, ever, ever ever expend a higher level spell slot to cast a spell as they only have one spell slot level they can use. The warlock can only cast a spell at the level in their table. The spell descriptions don’t change, and those spells which say “using higher level spell slot” have always benefitted the warlock as a higher level spell. This is not about expending a slot, it’s about at what level the spell is cast. Then consider that there are 28 invocations. 12 of those invocations give the warlock a spell to cast. 9 of those spells cannot be cast at higher levels (for example Levitate). The 3 remaining spells which can be cast at higher level: invisibility, false life, and jump. The invocation text specifically limits the casting of jump and invisibility so those two (even cast at the higher level warlock’s spell slot per their table as the warlock increases) there’s no benefit to the upcast. In other words if a 5th level warlock has the “otherworldly leap” invocation which allows them to cast jump, they would cast jump at 3rd level because the warlock only casts at the spell slot level on their table. However, the invocation says they can only cast jump on themselves. Jump is a touch spell and cast at a higher level say by a Wizard, would allow the wizard to touch 3 people and give them jump. But not the warlock if he uses the invocation because the specific instructions in the invocation only allow the jump spell to be cast on themselves. ONLY false life has any benefit to casting at a higher level. So for warlocks, this is a buff compared to 2014. This is pretty niche and only applicable to one invocation for one class. The designers did a good job not allowing warlocks higher level casting to be abused. This is not broken. False life through Fiendish Vigor invocation now in 2024 version scales nicely and is a decent invocation to take. It amounts to a few extra temp hp for the warlock who invests in this invocation and maxes out after a warlock reaches 9th level at 2d4+4+20 using a 5th level spell, 32 temp HP for the warlock at 9th level.
100% wrong. From the PHB:
"When a spellcaster casts a spell using a slot that is of a higher level than the spell, the spell takes on the higher level for that casting."
Importantly, this rule ONLY applies when you cast with a higher-level spell slot. Anything that doesn't use a spell slot doesn't get the benefits of upcasting.
Also, any spell that doesn't gain additional benefits for upcasting can still be upcast. For the most part it makes no difference. However, for the purposes of effects such as Dispel Magic, the higher level still applies to the checks.
I think you basically proved my point. That rule from players handbook compliments the fact that Warlocks always cast at their assigned spell level, so they would cast the spell, as the invocation text says, according to the warlock casting level. if this rule “ONLY” applies when you cast a higher level, then the warlock follows that guideline. If, in fact, that rule does not apply if you don’t use a spell slot, then it would not apply to the invocation, which does not expend a spell slot.
I think we’re looking at this from two totally different angles. I get what you’re saying and in 5e that would make sense completely, but in 2024, there are a couple (not many) situations where a higher level casting kicks in. One is the warlock, another is Sorcerer’s new twinned spell metamagic, any others?
In all the videos put out during and just after the play test time over the past year and a half about the warlock, this was highlighted. If this comes down to “what your DM will allow”, then maybe the understanding that general rules vs specific rules kicks in. Whether or not a Warlock’s specific rule higher cast level by being a Pact Magic caster rather than Wizard, sorcerer, etc., trumps some other general rule will be up to that DM. But from years of playing it seems to be commonly accepted that when there’s a general rule it is followed, but a specific wording supersedes the general rule. That is all I’m saying. I agree wholeheartedly there are specific cases where the warlock level of higher than a spell on an item doesn’t get used. For example if a ring of spell storing had a first level spell in it, used by a higher level warlock, or a spell scroll with a first level spell written in it, probably even a new “enspelled item” with a certain level spell on it, when used by a warlock, would follow the specific text for that item, and spell would be cast at the level of that item. An invocation is not an item, and as the Warlock Pact Magic text says in 2024 a few posts above, “these spells count as warlock spells for you. Warlocks use the spell level from their table.” Before replying please do this: think this is not a question of whether a spell slot is expended, what what level the spell is cast. In this specific case, the Warlock’s special ability to cast using their level in the Warlock table applies.
Again, this is not breaking the game and there’s no reason to force a 2014 understanding on the 2024 buff. It’s a slight buff for warlocks that scales well.can you see where I’m coming from?
This is such a unique case, that it doesn’t radically change the game in anyway. It only affects one scenario.
I think people can certainly see where you're coming from, but where you're coming from is not something that's in the actual rules.
The column you're talking about in the Warlock table just says what level your spell slots are. It doesn't say anything about what happens when you cast a spell without using a spell slot, so the general rules on that apply.
The general rules on casting spells at higher levels, which can be found in the "Casting Spells" section of chapter 7 of the Player's Handbook, specifically say "when a spellcaster casts a spell using a slot that is of a higher level than the spell, the spell takes on the higher level for casting". If you are not casting the spell using a spell slot at all, then you're not casting the spell using a slot of a higher level, and this rule doesn't apply.
Under Pact Magic for warlocks, it says: If another Warlock feature gives you spells that you always have prepared, those spells don’t count against the number of spells you can prepare with this feature, but those spells otherwise count as Warlock spells for you.
This has come up in other threads, but there is some dispute as to whether spells granted through Invocations count as prepared spells, and thus count as warlock spells. Prepared spells are specifically ones you can cast using spell slots
Prepared Spells of Level 1+. You prepare the list of level 1+ spells that are available for you to cast with this feature.
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Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock) Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric) Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue) Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
I think the thing tripping wllm up is that the warlock casting rule is not "Warlocks always cast at their assigned spell level", but rather as the text says,
The table also shows the level of those slots, all of which are the same level.
So nothing says warlocks always cast their spells at the same level, it is that their slots are the same level, so spells cast with slots are cast at the level of those slots.
Right. Specifically, a Warlock's spell slots are all at the same level, but that only applies to spells cast with a spell slot. Funny enough, insisting that Invocations must also be cast at that level has a terrible implication as well: All of their Mystic Arcanum must also be cast at 5th level, since they don't use a spell slot and are Warlock spells.
Thank you very much for the reply. And thank you all of you for your patience and explanations. I don’t agree, but no need to be fussy. I am going to try and send this straight to WOTC for a ruling as it really is only one unique scenario. There is no impact to all the other rules in dnd if the free casting of false life through Fiendish Vigor is allowed to be cast at Warlock table level, and therefore scale over time, making this a useful invocation. Maybe we’ll get a straight answer. What I’m trying to avoid is what will happen if only the first level false life is the consensus. I think the reason for the 2024 Invocation text change was made intentionally so false life could scale along with the warlock spell levels. Otherwise why have the text in the 2014 version limiting the free casting to first level? Was it not because otherwise it would be cast at the higher level? They didn’t want to provide high temp hp. And I think they dropped that. The 2024 text also was added to not even roll for temp hp in the false life spell, just take the max….why? Because tables sat around rolling and rolling until the warlock at the table got the highest roll anyway. The text change in 2024 stops that from being necessary. In similar fashion, some spells last all day (like temp hp) and don’t go away on short rest but do go away on long rest. So parties wake up from 8 he long rest, then cast an all day spell, then take a short rest to get their spell slot back.
What will happen then is like a battle master with Rally maneuver: soon as long rest is over, roll superiority dice to give party members temp hp, then take a short rest to get superiority dice back. So 8 hr long rest becomes 9 hr rest instead. The warlock will wake up, cast false life using a spell slot at higher level, then take the short rest to get their spell slot back. I am saying this invocation text change keeps that from having to happen. Makes the game a little faster for the table. does that make sense?
Simple question:
Does the False Life spell cast by a Warlock using the Fiendish Vigor invocation level up as the Warlock levels up? Or is it always cast at 1st level?
E.g., a 5th-level Warlock gets 12 THP (1st-level spell max) or 22 THP (3rd-level spell max)?
Cheers!
My Author Page: www.peterjblake.com
Novels Published: Reynard's Fate, Kita's Honour, Okoth's War and Callindrill
Always 1st level, any spell cast without using a spell slot can't be cast using a higher level slot.
Thanks Plague - that is what I thought.
But, can you point me to the rule that states that? (so I can show my game table)
My Author Page: www.peterjblake.com
Novels Published: Reynard's Fate, Kita's Honour, Okoth's War and Callindrill
I do not know if there is a specific rules that explains it but upcasting warlock spells is specific to spell slots
https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/dnd/free-rules/character-classes#Level1PactMagic
As fiendish Vigor is not powered by Spell Slots, there is nothing that permits upcasting.
https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/dnd/free-rules/character-classes#FiendishVigor
So unless otherwise stated, spells are always cast at level for Eldritch Invocation. An exception maybe Pact of the Tome
https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/dnd/free-rules/character-classes#PactoftheTome
As the 1st level spells prepared by Pact of the Tome still use Spell slots, they still can up cast. I would also note such a thing would also be true of rituals, as rituals are not expending spell slots, they also do not upcast, unless you cast said spell using a spell slot instead of casting it as a ritual.
Okay, that works - thanks!
My Author Page: www.peterjblake.com
Novels Published: Reynard's Fate, Kita's Honour, Okoth's War and Callindrill
If it helps, we have this in the Sage Advice Compendium:
The previous entry in the SAC is related to the following rules in the PHB (Chapter 7).
So, you can upcast by using a slot of a higher level than the spell. Therefore, if casting without slots, the spell is cast at its lowest possible level by default.
Sure the rules for Using a Higher-Level Spell Slot is when you casts a spell using a slot and the Invocation isn't expending a spell slot.
I don't think you will be able to find a rule that says what you want.
That's because the rules for how upcasting works are pretty specific and clear. You use a spell slot higher than the lowest spell slot that can be used to cast the spell (e.g. Fireball requires at least a 3rd level spell slot, so you use at least a 4th level spell lot to upcast it) and you receive benefits.
Asking for a rule that says that you can't upcast Fiendish Vigor is sort of like asking for a rule that says that a Wizard doesn't get their Proficiency Bonus and can't use Vex when using a shortsword. You won't find a rule that says they don't get to do that. Instead the rules state what is required to get those abilities (Proficiency in the weapon and Weapon Mastery). Since Wizards aren't granted those requirements, they don't get to do that.
You won't generally see a rule specifically forbidding something like that because to the rules would balloon incredibly if they specified everything characters weren't allowed to do.
A couple problems with this:
First, in 2014 PHB the text specified that false life was cast as a 1st level spell. This wording is no longer present in the 2024 version, and that feels intentional.
The Sage Advice article linked was written for the 2014 edition of the game and still links to the legacy versions of invocations, not the updated ones.
The 2024 rules for casting spells without spell slots makes no mention of spell level.
Under Pact Magic for warlocks, it says:
If another Warlock feature gives you spells that you always have prepared, those spells don’t count against the number of spells you can prepare with this feature, but those spells otherwise count as Warlock spells for you.
When casting Warlock spells you use the spell level listed in the table based on your level. Fiendish Vigor says you don't Expend a spell slot, but doesn't say you aren't casting it with your spell slots. Given all that, a case could be made that you cast false life like any other warlock spell, using the spell level of your spell slots, but that spell slot is then not expended.
That's true, but the answer is still valid in my opinion.
The rules for casting spells are clear for me and you could consider the Fiendish Vigor Eldritch Invocation a Special Ability, so it falls under the section "Casting without Slots". If you don't use a slot, you cannot upcast the spell.
Rituals, Magic Items, Spell Scrolls, or traits/features/feats that grant characters prepared spells they can cast without using spell slots follow the same rule.
To use your own slots, it's as @R3sistance explained.
You can also check all this using a character created in D&D Beyond.
There seems to be a lot of speculation on this topic. Given that false life is not even a warlock spell, the only way for a warlock to cast false life is by taking Fiendish Vigor Invocation, so this is limited. For arguments sake let’s use Warlock level 5 as an example, so warlock casting a spell uses a 3rd level spell. This is the specific example Jeremy Crawford referred to when he said “ unless you have a special ability that says otherwise” (I.e., the warlock). The warlock will never, ever, ever ever expend a higher level spell slot to cast a spell as they only have one spell slot level they can use. The warlock can only cast a spell at the level in their table. The spell descriptions don’t change, and those spells which say “using higher level spell slot” have always benefitted the warlock as a higher level spell. This is not about expending a slot, it’s about at what level the spell is cast.
Then consider that there are 28 invocations. 12 of those invocations give the warlock a spell to cast. 9 of those spells cannot be cast at higher levels (for example Levitate).
The 3 remaining spells which can be cast at higher level: invisibility, false life, and jump. The invocation text specifically limits the casting of jump and invisibility so those two (even cast at the higher level warlock’s spell slot per their table as the warlock increases) there’s no benefit to the upcast. In other words if a 5th level warlock has the “otherworldly leap” invocation which allows them to cast jump, they would cast jump at 3rd level because the warlock only casts at the spell slot level on their table. However, the invocation says they can only cast jump on themselves. Jump is a touch spell and cast at a higher level say by a Wizard, would allow the wizard to touch 3 people and give them jump. But not the warlock if he uses the invocation because the specific instructions in the invocation only allow the jump spell to be cast on themselves.
ONLY false life has any benefit to casting at a higher level.
So for warlocks, this is a buff compared to 2014.
This is pretty niche and only applicable to one invocation for one class. The designers did a good job not allowing warlocks higher level casting to be abused.
This is not broken. False life through Fiendish Vigor invocation now in 2024 version scales nicely and is a decent invocation to take. It amounts to a few extra temp hp for the warlock who invests in this invocation and maxes out after
a warlock reaches 9th level at 2d4+4+20 using a 5th level spell, 32 temp HP for the warlock at 9th level.
100% wrong. From the PHB:
"When a spellcaster casts a spell using a slot that is of a higher level than the spell, the spell takes on the higher level for that casting."
Importantly, this rule ONLY applies when you cast with a higher-level spell slot. Anything that doesn't use a spell slot doesn't get the benefits of upcasting.
Also, any spell that doesn't gain additional benefits for upcasting can still be upcast. For the most part it makes no difference. However, for the purposes of effects such as Dispel Magic, the higher level still applies to the checks.
I think you basically proved my point. That rule from players handbook compliments the fact that Warlocks always cast at their assigned spell level, so they would cast the spell, as the invocation text says, according to the warlock casting level.
if this rule “ONLY” applies when you cast a higher level, then the warlock follows that guideline. If, in fact, that rule does not apply if you don’t use a spell slot, then it would not apply to the invocation, which does not expend a spell slot.
I think we’re looking at this from two totally different angles. I get what you’re saying and in 5e that would make sense completely, but in 2024, there are a couple (not many) situations where a higher level casting kicks in. One is the warlock, another is Sorcerer’s new twinned spell metamagic, any others?
In all the videos put out during and just after the play test time over the past year and a half about the warlock, this was highlighted. If this comes down to “what your DM will allow”, then maybe the understanding that general rules vs specific rules kicks in. Whether or not a Warlock’s specific rule higher cast level by being a Pact Magic caster rather than Wizard, sorcerer, etc., trumps some other general rule will be up to that DM. But from years of playing it seems to be commonly accepted that when there’s a general rule it is followed, but a specific wording supersedes the general rule. That is all I’m saying.
I agree wholeheartedly there are specific cases where the warlock level of higher than a spell on an item doesn’t get used. For example if a ring of spell storing had a first level spell in it, used by a higher level warlock, or a spell scroll with a first level spell written in it, probably even a new “enspelled item” with a certain level spell on it, when used by a warlock, would follow the specific text for that item, and spell would be cast at the level of that item. An invocation is not an item, and as the Warlock Pact Magic text says in 2024 a few posts above, “these spells count as warlock spells for you. Warlocks use the spell level from their table.”
Before replying please do this: think this is not a question of whether a spell slot is expended, what what level the spell is cast. In this specific case, the Warlock’s special ability to cast using their level in the Warlock table applies.
Again, this is not breaking the game and there’s no reason to force a 2014 understanding on the 2024 buff. It’s a slight buff for warlocks that scales well.can you see where I’m coming from?
This is such a unique case, that it doesn’t radically change the game in anyway. It only affects one scenario.
Good?
I think people can certainly see where you're coming from, but where you're coming from is not something that's in the actual rules.
The column you're talking about in the Warlock table just says what level your spell slots are. It doesn't say anything about what happens when you cast a spell without using a spell slot, so the general rules on that apply.
The general rules on casting spells at higher levels, which can be found in the "Casting Spells" section of chapter 7 of the Player's Handbook, specifically say "when a spellcaster casts a spell using a slot that is of a higher level than the spell, the spell takes on the higher level for casting". If you are not casting the spell using a spell slot at all, then you're not casting the spell using a slot of a higher level, and this rule doesn't apply.
pronouns: he/she/they
This has come up in other threads, but there is some dispute as to whether spells granted through Invocations count as prepared spells, and thus count as warlock spells. Prepared spells are specifically ones you can cast using spell slots
Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock)
Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric)
Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue)
Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
I think the thing tripping wllm up is that the warlock casting rule is not "Warlocks always cast at their assigned spell level", but rather as the text says,
So nothing says warlocks always cast their spells at the same level, it is that their slots are the same level, so spells cast with slots are cast at the level of those slots.
Right. Specifically, a Warlock's spell slots are all at the same level, but that only applies to spells cast with a spell slot. Funny enough, insisting that Invocations must also be cast at that level has a terrible implication as well: All of their Mystic Arcanum must also be cast at 5th level, since they don't use a spell slot and are Warlock spells.
Isn't the answer right there in the spell description for False Life?
No spell slot used means this line doesn't apply, right?
"Not all those who wander are lost"
Thank you very much for the reply. And thank you all of you for your patience and explanations.
I don’t agree, but no need to be fussy. I am going to try and send this straight to WOTC for a ruling as it really is only one unique scenario. There is no impact to all the other rules in dnd if the free casting of false life through Fiendish Vigor is allowed to be cast at Warlock table level, and therefore scale over time, making this a useful invocation. Maybe we’ll get a straight answer.
What I’m trying to avoid is what will happen if only the first level false life is the consensus.
I think the reason for the 2024 Invocation text change was made intentionally so false life could scale along with the warlock spell levels. Otherwise why have the text in the 2014 version limiting the free casting to first level? Was it not because otherwise it would be cast at the higher level? They didn’t want to provide high temp hp. And I think they dropped that.
The 2024 text also was added to not even roll for temp hp in the false life spell, just take the max….why? Because tables sat around rolling and rolling until the warlock at the table got the highest roll anyway. The text change in 2024 stops that from being necessary. In similar fashion, some spells last all day (like temp hp) and don’t go away on short rest but do go away on long rest. So parties wake up from 8 he long rest, then cast an all day spell, then take a short rest to get their spell slot back.
What will happen then is like a battle master with Rally maneuver: soon as long rest is over, roll superiority dice to give party members temp hp, then take a short rest to get superiority dice back. So 8 hr long rest becomes 9 hr rest instead.
The warlock will wake up, cast false life using a spell slot at higher level, then take the short rest to get their spell slot back. I am saying this invocation text change keeps that from having to happen. Makes the game a little faster for the table.
does that make sense?