Wondering if recovering spell slots or changing spell lists is comsidered a benefit of a long rest. Specifically as a cleric running CoS and having a curse that doesn't allow the pc to benefit from long rest at night. Spell changes and slot recovery say they happen after rest and the curse implies that you still complete the rest but gain no benefit (hp, hit dice, etc.)
A long rest is a period of extended downtime, at least 8 hours long, during which a character sleeps for at least 6 hours and performs no more than 2 hours of light activity, such as reading, talking, eating, or standing watch. If the rest is interrupted by a period of strenuous activity - at least 1 hour of walking, fighting, casting spells, or similar adventuring activity - the characters must begin the rest again to gain any benefit from it.
At the end of a long rest, a character regains all lost hit points. The character also regains spent Hit Dice, up to a number of dice equal to half of the character's total number of them (minimum of one die). For example, if a character has eight Hit Dice, he or she can regain four spent Hit Dice upon finishing a long rest.
A character can't benefit from more than one long rest in a 24-hour period, and a character must have at least 1 hit point at the start of the rest to gain its benefits.
By default a Long Rest does not restore Spell Slots, because by default a character does not have Spell Slots. However, a Cleric's Spell Casting Feature adds additional benefits of a Long Rest:
Preparing and Casting Spells
The Cleric table shows how many spell slots you have to cast your cleric spells of 1st level and higher. To cast one of these spells, you must expend a slot of the spell’s level or higher. You regain all expended spell slots when you finish a long rest.
You prepare the list of cleric spells that are available for you to cast, choosing from the cleric spell list. When you do so, choose a number of cleric spells equal to your Wisdom modifier + your cleric level (minimum of one spell). The spells must be of a level for which you have spell slots.
For example, if you are a 3rd-level cleric, you have four 1st-level and two 2nd-level spell slots. With a Wisdom of 16, your list of prepared spells can include six spells of 1st or 2nd level, in any combination. If you prepare the 1st-level spell cure wounds, you can cast it using a 1st-level or 2nd-level slot. Casting the spell doesn’t remove it from your list of prepared spells.
You can change your list of prepared spells when you finish a long rest. Preparing a new list of cleric spells requires time spent in prayer and meditation: at least 1 minute per spell level for each spell on your list.
These two effects (regaining Spell Slots, changing your list of prepared spells) are certainly effects or features of a Long Rest for a Cleric. Regaining charges of a Magic Item are also additional effects of a Long Rest that a character might have. Are effects/features/whatehaveyou the same thing as Benefits for the purpose of your curse? I dunno, I don't have the rule text for the curse before me, but it's probably splitting hairs to say anything other "yes" I would think.
Thank you for that clear response, it's exactly the minor detail that I'm trying to clear up. Agreed its splitting hairs and can probably deal with it easy enough either way so at this point it's mostly academic. Didn't want to drop spoilers but here's the curse txt without revealing too much:
"A creature cursed in this way gains no benefit from finishing a short or long rest at night (resting during the day works normally, since the curse is dormant from dawn to dusk). A greater restoration or a remove curse spell cast on the creature ends the curse on it. The curse on the creature also ends if it leaves Barovia."
Odd, and tough to arbitrate. I'd probably rule it as interfering with player resources (HP, Hit Dice, Spell Slots) but not prepared spells (since it's just something you spend time doing over a certain period of time of prayer, not a physical or mental healing) and not magic item charges (since those are external to the player and more about the passage of time than how restful it is). ... but that's just my take, not really cut or dry what the definition of "benefit" is.
In the spirit of the game a curse should be debilitating and of great concern so it makes sense that you wouldn't get spell slots/health/hit dice/channel divinity etc. back so my pitch to the dm was to allow a change in spell list and nothing else as that is more a few minutes of concentration after rest and even with nightmares isn't too crazy. Will admit even that is a bit shaky as an argument. But as elves don't actually sleep it might hold some water.
Yes, recovering spell slots is a benefit of a long rest. The rules are written in such a way that they don't need to formally define what "benefit" means. We all know what benefit means. You're in a better position with your spell slots than without them, so having them is a benefit. You get them back when you take a long rest, so that satisfies the "from finishing... a long rest" part.
The game assumes a certain level of common sense when it comes to its language, and trying to argue something like "it's not really beneficial because when I have my spell slots, everyone expects me to USE them" is incredibly stupid.
Regarding swapping out spells, that too is a benefit of a long rest. You may think of it as "a few minutes of concentration after rest," but nothing in the rules says that's the case. All the rules say is that you can only do it when you finish a long rest.
I had to go searching for the full context of this curse, and I'll say that if I were DMing it, I would say the curse just straight-up doesn't work on elves. The fact that they do not sleep and cannot be put to sleep by magic is a far stronger argument than trying to say that preparing spells isn't a benefit of a long rest (it unambiguously is).
Thank you for that clear response, it's exactly the minor detail that I'm trying to clear up. Agreed its splitting hairs and can probably deal with it easy enough either way so at this point it's mostly academic. Didn't want to drop spoilers but here's the curse txt without revealing too much:
"A creature cursed in this way gains no benefit from finishing a short or long rest at night (resting during the day works normally, since the curse is dormant from dawn to dusk). A greater restoration or a remove curse spell cast on the creature ends the curse on it. The curse on the creature also ends if it leaves Barovia."
ah this is such a great challenge to the party I remember it well. As others have pointed out swapping spells and recovering of spell slots are a function of taking a long rest. The entire point of a curse is to be a pain to the players. This is where they need to come up with unique and creative solutions don't let them weasel out itll ruin all the fun.
Some great ways for them to overcome this effect that are level appropriate:
the spell leomund's tiny hut its a force effect so the creature can't enter to touch the party
the party can create disguised life size dolls dressed as the PCS while the PCS attempt their rest while hidden in some manner
cheesy not fun method is to purposefully not take a long rest until the creature shows up then once it leaves they take a long rest
When I played CoS I used the 2nd method then we murder hobod the monsters
Thank you for that clear response, it's exactly the minor detail that I'm trying to clear up. Agreed its splitting hairs and can probably deal with it easy enough either way so at this point it's mostly academic. Didn't want to drop spoilers but here's the curse txt without revealing too much:
"A creature cursed in this way gains no benefit from finishing a short or long rest at night (resting during the day works normally, since the curse is dormant from dawn to dusk). A greater restoration or a remove curse spell cast on the creature ends the curse on it. The curse on the creature also ends if it leaves Barovia."
Just sleep during the day then.
Yep, long rest during the daylight hours for full benefits. This curse forces you to become nocturnal, and worse you can't take a Short Rest until dawn - so a Warlock may have a long night with very few spell slots to rely on.
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Wondering if recovering spell slots or changing spell lists is comsidered a benefit of a long rest. Specifically as a cleric running CoS and having a curse that doesn't allow the pc to benefit from long rest at night. Spell changes and slot recovery say they happen after rest and the curse implies that you still complete the rest but gain no benefit (hp, hit dice, etc.)
Chapter 8: Adventuring - Resting describes the effects of short and long rests.
By default a Long Rest does not restore Spell Slots, because by default a character does not have Spell Slots. However, a Cleric's Spell Casting Feature adds additional benefits of a Long Rest:
These two effects (regaining Spell Slots, changing your list of prepared spells) are certainly effects or features of a Long Rest for a Cleric. Regaining charges of a Magic Item are also additional effects of a Long Rest that a character might have. Are effects/features/whatehaveyou the same thing as Benefits for the purpose of your curse? I dunno, I don't have the rule text for the curse before me, but it's probably splitting hairs to say anything other "yes" I would think.
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
Thank you for that clear response, it's exactly the minor detail that I'm trying to clear up. Agreed its splitting hairs and can probably deal with it easy enough either way so at this point it's mostly academic. Didn't want to drop spoilers but here's the curse txt without revealing too much:
"A creature cursed in this way gains no benefit from finishing a short or long rest at night (resting during the day works normally, since the curse is dormant from dawn to dusk). A greater restoration or a remove curse spell cast on the creature ends the curse on it. The curse on the creature also ends if it leaves Barovia."
Odd, and tough to arbitrate. I'd probably rule it as interfering with player resources (HP, Hit Dice, Spell Slots) but not prepared spells (since it's just something you spend time doing over a certain period of time of prayer, not a physical or mental healing) and not magic item charges (since those are external to the player and more about the passage of time than how restful it is). ... but that's just my take, not really cut or dry what the definition of "benefit" is.
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
In the spirit of the game a curse should be debilitating and of great concern so it makes sense that you wouldn't get spell slots/health/hit dice/channel divinity etc. back so my pitch to the dm was to allow a change in spell list and nothing else as that is more a few minutes of concentration after rest and even with nightmares isn't too crazy. Will admit even that is a bit shaky as an argument. But as elves don't actually sleep it might hold some water.
Yes, recovering spell slots is a benefit of a long rest. The rules are written in such a way that they don't need to formally define what "benefit" means. We all know what benefit means. You're in a better position with your spell slots than without them, so having them is a benefit. You get them back when you take a long rest, so that satisfies the "from finishing... a long rest" part.
The game assumes a certain level of common sense when it comes to its language, and trying to argue something like "it's not really beneficial because when I have my spell slots, everyone expects me to USE them" is incredibly stupid.
Regarding swapping out spells, that too is a benefit of a long rest. You may think of it as "a few minutes of concentration after rest," but nothing in the rules says that's the case. All the rules say is that you can only do it when you finish a long rest.
I had to go searching for the full context of this curse, and I'll say that if I were DMing it, I would say the curse just straight-up doesn't work on elves. The fact that they do not sleep and cannot be put to sleep by magic is a far stronger argument than trying to say that preparing spells isn't a benefit of a long rest (it unambiguously is).
Just sleep during the day then.
ah this is such a great challenge to the party I remember it well. As others have pointed out swapping spells and recovering of spell slots are a function of taking a long rest. The entire point of a curse is to be a pain to the players. This is where they need to come up with unique and creative solutions don't let them weasel out itll ruin all the fun.
Some great ways for them to overcome this effect that are level appropriate:
the spell leomund's tiny hut its a force effect so the creature can't enter to touch the party
the party can create disguised life size dolls dressed as the PCS while the PCS attempt their rest while hidden in some manner
cheesy not fun method is to purposefully not take a long rest until the creature shows up then once it leaves they take a long rest
When I played CoS I used the 2nd method then we murder hobod the monsters
Yep, long rest during the daylight hours for full benefits. This curse forces you to become nocturnal, and worse you can't take a Short Rest until dawn - so a Warlock may have a long night with very few spell slots to rely on.