lf my wizard gets to lv 17+ and choses wish as their level up spell,could they then find,copy,prepare,and use,say "power word kill" (or any other 9th lv spell),or would wish be the only 9th lv spell they can use?
in other words, can l only have access to one lv 9 spell,or can l have 2+ lv 9 spells,just with only one lv9 spell slot?
ps l am asking per RAW, obviously if this is not allowed RAW,l would just need the dm's ok to do it.
The basic use of this spell is to duplicate any other spell of 8th level or lower
You cannot duplicate another 9th level spell.
However, they can add other 9th level spells to their spellbook, but you only get 1 slot a day with which to cast a 9th level spell slot.
l was not asking if l could add a 9th lv spell with wish,l was useing that spell as a example of a spell the pc had first. but you did answer the question l had,so thank you!
Yeah I realized after my post that I misunderstood your question and went back to fix it. You were just quick on the draw and caught me before I could correct myself :)
lf my wizard gets to lv 17+ and choses wish as their level up spell,could they then find,copy,prepare,and use,say "power word kill" (or any other 9th lv spell),or would wish be the only 9th lv spell they can use?
in other words, can l only have access to one lv 9 spell,or can l have 2+ lv 9 spells,just with only one lv9 spell slot?
ps l am asking per RAW, obviously if this is not allowed RAW,l would just need the dm's ok to do it.
That's the fun part about Wizards, there is no hard limit on how many spells they can have in their spellbook. They get to add spell for free when leveling up, but can add any Wizard spells they find in spellbooks or scrolls, provided they're of a level you're currently able to prepare. So once you become a 17th-level Wizard, you can copy as many 9th-level Wizard spells as you can find. From a more practical standpoint, your DM is likely going to make them EXTREMELY rare. Plus, if you do find one, it's going to take 18 hours to transcribe into your book, and will cost 450gp worth of materials(2 hours and 50gp per level of the spell being transcribed).
So there is a common confusion with new players that "spell slots" are how many spells you can know and you cast each one once per day. That is not the case.
Each class learns/knows a different amount of spells based on their class and class level. Artificers, clerics, druids, paladins, and wizards need to prepare a number of their known spells based on class level and spellcasting ability to be able to cast them. Arcane tricksters, bards, eldritch knights, rangers, sorcerers, and warlocks can cast spells they know without having to prepare them. And none of these processes put a limit on number of each spell level can be known/prepared.
Spell slots only come into play during casting. To cast a spell, you need to expend 1 spell slot equal or higher than the spell's level, the spell is then cast at that level. You can cast the same spell as many times as you have slots it can use.
So there is a common confusion with new players that "spell slots" are how many spells you can know and you cast each one once per day. That is not the case.
Each class learns/knows a different amount of spells based on their class and class level. Artificers, clerics, druids, paladins, and wizards need to prepare a number of their known spells based on class level and spellcasting ability to be able to cast them. Arcane tricksters, bards, eldritch knights, rangers, sorcerers, and warlocks can cast spells they know without having to prepare them. And none of these processes put a limit on number of each spell level can be known/prepared.
Spell slots only come into play during casting. To cast a spell, you need to expend 1 spell slot equal or higher than the spell's level, the spell is then cast at that level. You can cast the same spell as many times as you have slots it can use.
I didn't want it to get too confusing in my last post, but arcane tricksters, bards, eldritch knights, rangers, sorcerers, warlocks, and wizards do have a sort of natural limit to how many spells of each level is possible for them to know because they learn a limited number of new spells each level (and except wizard can trade 1 already known spell for a new spell) and can only learn higher level spells after they get slots for them (not counting spell slots gotten from multiclassing, it is a whole other thing I don't want to get into) so at level 17 the max number of level 9 spells you can know is 2, but considering you will only ever be able to cast 1 per day...
The only limit on the amount of spells a wizard can learn (aka have in their spellbook) is the amount of spells in the published materials + any homebrew your DM lets you use.
There are three types of classes when it comes to spellcasting, but one of them is just Wizard.
Type 1, "Spells Prepared": Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Paladin. These classes prepare a list of spells every day from a list of spells known. Their spells "known" are all the spells on their spell list, but they can't do anything with spells they don't have prepared, not even ritual casting. The limit on the spells they can prepare is their class level (or half their class level, for the half casters Artificer and Paladin) + their relevant ability modifier (Int for Artificer, Wis for Cleric and Druid, and Cha for Paladin).
Type 2, "Spells Known": Arcane Trickster (Rogue), Bard, Eldritch Knight (Fighter), Ranger, Sorcerer, Warlock. These classes only know a certain number of spells, all of which they can cast. They can only change these spells slowly, one spell per level up (one spell per Long Rest in the Class Feature Variants UA, but many DMs don't allow UA in their games).
Type 3, "Wizard": Wizard. The Wizard is probably closest, mechanically, to Type 1 casters, as a Wizard prepares their spells (Wizard level + Int mod spells) every day from the list of spells known, but their spells known is all the spells in their spellbook, and can therefore be reduced to 0 if their spellbook is lost, stolen, or destroyed. The difference between a Wizard and Type 1 casters is that a Wizard can ritually cast spells they don't have prepared, so long as the spell is in their spellbook and they have their spellbook on them.
The only limit on the amount of spells a wizard can learn (aka have in their spellbook) is the amount of spells in the published materials + any homebrew your DM lets you use.
There are three types of classes when it comes to spellcasting, but one of them is just Wizard.
Type 1, "Spells Prepared": Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Paladin. These classes prepare a list of spells every day from a list of spells known.Their spells "known" are all the spells on their spell list, but they can't do anything with spells they don't have prepared, not even ritual casting. The limit on the spells they can prepare is their class level (or half their class level, for the half casters Artificer and Paladin) + their relevant ability modifier (Int for Artificer, Wis for Cleric and Druid, and Cha for Paladin).
Type 2, "Spells Known": Arcane Trickster (Rogue), Bard, Eldritch Knight (Fighter), Ranger, Sorcerer, Warlock. These classes only know a certain number of spells, all of which they can cast. They can only change these spells slowly, one spell per level up (one spell per Long Rest in the Class Feature Variants UA, but many DMs don't allow UA in their games).
Type 3, "Wizard": Wizard. The Wizard is probably closest, mechanically, to Type 1 casters, as a Wizard prepares their spells (Wizard level + Int mod spells) every day from the list of spells known, but their spells known is all the spells in their spellbook, and can therefore be reduced to 0 if their spellbook is lost, stolen, or destroyed. The difference between a Wizard and Type 1 casters is that a Wizard can ritually cast spells they don't have prepared, so long as the spell is in their spellbook and they have their spellbook on them.
It is very helpful to break out the different types of casters, but when doing so we should use precise language. I know this isn't the main thrust of this thread, but "Spells Prepared" casters prepare off of their class spell list, they do not "know" spells at all. Subclass features that expand their class spell list do so by adding that spell to their class spell list, not by letting them "know" it. "Knowing" spells is synonymous with being a "Spells Known" caster. I don't believe there are any feats or racial features which would run afoul of this, because to my knowledge they all let you "know" a cantrip (see below), but "cast" a leveled spell x times/day without "knowing" it.
Wizard is a subset of "Spells Prepared" casters, with an additional limitation. They can only prepare spells that are written in their wizard spellbook, and they can only write spells in their spellbook which are on the wizard spell list. They have a section in their description called "Learning spells of 1st level and higher" which is not to be conflated with the "Known Casters" "Spells Known of 1st level and higher;" real bummer they used such similar terms, "Written spells" or "Spellbook spells" would have been much clearer and cut down on the confusion.
And in case you were thinking that was all easy and that you've gotten your terms straight, keep in mind that Cantrips are "known" no matter what sort of caster you are, and work the same for every sort of caster. You know cantrips based on your level, and don't prepare them, you can just always cast known cantrips. Calling Cantrips "0-level Spells" really isn't useful, because depending on what class you are they either work practically the same as your other spells only without a spell slot, or entirely different than your other spells!
lf my wizard gets to lv 17+ and choses wish as their level up spell,could they then find,copy,prepare,and use,say "power word kill" (or any other 9th lv spell),or would wish be the only 9th lv spell they can use?
in other words, can l only have access to one lv 9 spell,or can l have 2+ lv 9 spells,just with only one lv9 spell slot?
ps l am asking per RAW, obviously if this is not allowed RAW,l would just need the dm's ok to do it.
They can add other 9th level spells to their spellbook, but you only get 1 slot a day with which to cast a 9th level spell slot.
(misunderstood question initially, lol)
l was not asking if l could add a 9th lv spell with wish,l was useing that spell as a example of a spell the pc had first. but you did answer the question l had,so thank you!
Yeah I realized after my post that I misunderstood your question and went back to fix it. You were just quick on the draw and caught me before I could correct myself :)
That's the fun part about Wizards, there is no hard limit on how many spells they can have in their spellbook. They get to add spell for free when leveling up, but can add any Wizard spells they find in spellbooks or scrolls, provided they're of a level you're currently able to prepare. So once you become a 17th-level Wizard, you can copy as many 9th-level Wizard spells as you can find. From a more practical standpoint, your DM is likely going to make them EXTREMELY rare. Plus, if you do find one, it's going to take 18 hours to transcribe into your book, and will cost 450gp worth of materials(2 hours and 50gp per level of the spell being transcribed).
So there is a common confusion with new players that "spell slots" are how many spells you can know and you cast each one once per day. That is not the case.
Each class learns/knows a different amount of spells based on their class and class level. Artificers, clerics, druids, paladins, and wizards need to prepare a number of their known spells based on class level and spellcasting ability to be able to cast them. Arcane tricksters, bards, eldritch knights, rangers, sorcerers, and warlocks can cast spells they know without having to prepare them. And none of these processes put a limit on number of each spell level can be known/prepared.
Spell slots only come into play during casting. To cast a spell, you need to expend 1 spell slot equal or higher than the spell's level, the spell is then cast at that level. You can cast the same spell as many times as you have slots it can use.
I think that explains everything.
It does! Thank you!
I didn't want it to get too confusing in my last post, but arcane tricksters, bards, eldritch knights, rangers, sorcerers, warlocks, and wizards do have a sort of natural limit to how many spells of each level is possible for them to know because they learn a limited number of new spells each level (and except wizard can trade 1 already known spell for a new spell) and can only learn higher level spells after they get slots for them (not counting spell slots gotten from multiclassing, it is a whole other thing I don't want to get into) so at level 17 the max number of level 9 spells you can know is 2, but considering you will only ever be able to cast 1 per day...
The only limit on the amount of spells a wizard can learn (aka have in their spellbook) is the amount of spells in the published materials + any homebrew your DM lets you use.
There are three types of classes when it comes to spellcasting, but one of them is just Wizard.
Type 1, "Spells Prepared": Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Paladin. These classes prepare a list of spells every day from a list of spells known. Their spells "known" are all the spells on their spell list, but they can't do anything with spells they don't have prepared, not even ritual casting. The limit on the spells they can prepare is their class level (or half their class level, for the half casters Artificer and Paladin) + their relevant ability modifier (Int for Artificer, Wis for Cleric and Druid, and Cha for Paladin).
Type 2, "Spells Known": Arcane Trickster (Rogue), Bard, Eldritch Knight (Fighter), Ranger, Sorcerer, Warlock. These classes only know a certain number of spells, all of which they can cast. They can only change these spells slowly, one spell per level up (one spell per Long Rest in the Class Feature Variants UA, but many DMs don't allow UA in their games).
Type 3, "Wizard": Wizard. The Wizard is probably closest, mechanically, to Type 1 casters, as a Wizard prepares their spells (Wizard level + Int mod spells) every day from the list of spells known, but their spells known is all the spells in their spellbook, and can therefore be reduced to 0 if their spellbook is lost, stolen, or destroyed. The difference between a Wizard and Type 1 casters is that a Wizard can ritually cast spells they don't have prepared, so long as the spell is in their spellbook and they have their spellbook on them.
Yes, you can prepare any number of level 9 spells you like.
Personally I normally have Wish, True Poly, Invulnerability, and Foresight prepared as my level 9 spells.
It is very helpful to break out the different types of casters, but when doing so we should use precise language. I know this isn't the main thrust of this thread, but "Spells Prepared" casters prepare off of their class spell list, they do not "know" spells at all. Subclass features that expand their class spell list do so by adding that spell to their class spell list, not by letting them "know" it. "Knowing" spells is synonymous with being a "Spells Known" caster. I don't believe there are any feats or racial features which would run afoul of this, because to my knowledge they all let you "know" a cantrip (see below), but "cast" a leveled spell x times/day without "knowing" it.
Wizard is a subset of "Spells Prepared" casters, with an additional limitation. They can only prepare spells that are written in their wizard spellbook, and they can only write spells in their spellbook which are on the wizard spell list. They have a section in their description called "Learning spells of 1st level and higher" which is not to be conflated with the "Known Casters" "Spells Known of 1st level and higher;" real bummer they used such similar terms, "Written spells" or "Spellbook spells" would have been much clearer and cut down on the confusion.
And in case you were thinking that was all easy and that you've gotten your terms straight, keep in mind that Cantrips are "known" no matter what sort of caster you are, and work the same for every sort of caster. You know cantrips based on your level, and don't prepare them, you can just always cast known cantrips. Calling Cantrips "0-level Spells" really isn't useful, because depending on what class you are they either work practically the same as your other spells only without a spell slot, or entirely different than your other spells!
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.