My intention is clear: Know if a creature is from another plane for Banishment to be effective. If not, it's better to use other concentration spells, like hold Monster. So my question is: Is there an effective way to known if a creature is from another plane? I'm not talking about house rules, or assumptions. But some way, with the core books in hand, to know it. I don't know, with an Arcana roll (which I already know isn't), or something like that.
The long answer: it depends on setting, DM, character knowledge and a bunch of other stuff. If it looks like a fiend, fey, celestial or elemental in some way it probably is from another plane in most settings. Everything else is guesswork.
Banishment is still pretty good. Take one enemy out of the fight, then it comes back after all its friends are dead, and your allies have time to ready actions for its return.
Commune with Nature can tell you about 'influence from other planes of existence,' but that's about it. The planar ranger and paladin subclasses don't get any sort of identification type features, the paladin version just gets features that targets the various creature types traditionally from other planes, and the ranger just lets you find portals. If these subclasses specifically don't have it, I don't think you're going to find anything official.
Banishment is still pretty good. Take one enemy out of the fight, then it comes back after all its friends are dead, and your allies have time to ready actions for its return.
Agreed, being able to sideline a significant threat until the others have been dealt with is nothing to sneeze at. Both spells have their advantages:
* Hold Monster is 5th level while Banishment is only 4th
* Hold Monster lets you seriously wail on the target while they're caught in it, Banishment just puts them in time out, but...
* If that creature isn't native to the plane you're on, that time out is permanent(well, permanent enough in most cases)
* Hold Monster is a Wisdom save, Banishment is Charisma. Many targets will be weaker against one than the other, even if just a little bit
* Both require Concentration, but Hold Monster lets them re-roll the save each turn to try and escape, Banishment doesn't
In terms of how you'd know whether you're dealing with extraplanar entities, I believe Arcana is usually used for Aberrations/Elementals/etc, Religion for Fiends/Undead/Celestials, maybe Nature for Fey? In addition to your actual bonuses with those skills, maybe talk to your DM about your character doing research on extraplanar creatures specifically so he can recognize them and know when they can be banished. Most good DMs I've played with would be happy to work with their players on such things, within reason.
I'm not saying Banishment doesn't work if the creature is from the same plane you're on. But it's infinitely more useful if the creature is from another plane. If not, the wizard has better options in his arsenal to knock one or more creatures out of combat. Everything has its pros and cons, of course. And Banishment is still preferable in some situations. But his power is especially noticeable with creatures from other planes, where he puts himself ahead of any other option. It is, in fact, one of the best lvl 4 spells in the game.
It would be nice if there was a feat (expert in creatures or something similar), or some subclass of wizard (or another class), or some spell, that would allow you to know the origin, weaknesses, type of creature, etc... of a creature. But that would go in another subforum.
The Monster Slayer Ranger can magically determine damage immunities, resistances, or vulnerabilities of a creature. It's the main reason I want to play one lol.
Banishment is a much better 5th level spell than Hold Monster imo. You get to banish two creatures! Crazy.
The Detect Good and Evil can tell you if it is any of "aberration, celestial, elemental, fey, fiend, or undead", a lot of which are from other planes.
But it isn't a guarantee.
It would be more useful it would tell you which type. Celestials, Elementals, and Fiends are pretty consistently extraplanar, Fey are inconsistently handled, Aberrations usually aren't (only Slaad), Undead almost never.
The Monster Slayer Ranger can magically determine damage immunities, resistances, or vulnerabilities of a creature. It's the main reason I want to play one lol.
It's a great subclass. Useful for being able to tell if someone is in disguise as another race. But not a guarantee of being able to tell if someone is from another plane.
At the moment, the best option that has come out is Detect Evil and Good. It's not a consistent solution, but it's the closest thing. Unfortunately, although I didn't say it, I was thinking of a Wizard. But it is good that options of other classes come out, in case it helps someone.
Actually, on a lot of occasions, you can do metarolplay. But to me that kills the immersion. That's why I would like a consistent option so that the character can know that. As a home rule you can make Arcana, Religion or even Nature rolls. But that, unless I'm wrong, is not something that the rules contemplate
My intention is clear: Know if a creature is from another plane for Banishment to be effective. If not, it's better to use other concentration spells, like hold Monster.
So my question is: Is there an effective way to known if a creature is from another plane? I'm not talking about house rules, or assumptions. But some way, with the core books in hand, to know it. I don't know, with an Arcana roll (which I already know isn't), or something like that.
The short answer: No.
The long answer: it depends on setting, DM, character knowledge and a bunch of other stuff. If it looks like a fiend, fey, celestial or elemental in some way it probably is from another plane in most settings. Everything else is guesswork.
The Detect Good and Evil can tell you if it is any of "aberration, celestial, elemental, fey, fiend, or undead", a lot of which are from other planes.
But it isn't a guarantee.
Banishment is still pretty good. Take one enemy out of the fight, then it comes back after all its friends are dead, and your allies have time to ready actions for its return.
Commune with Nature can tell you about 'influence from other planes of existence,' but that's about it. The planar ranger and paladin subclasses don't get any sort of identification type features, the paladin version just gets features that targets the various creature types traditionally from other planes, and the ranger just lets you find portals. If these subclasses specifically don't have it, I don't think you're going to find anything official.
Birgit | Shifter | Sorcerer | Dragonlords
Shayone | Hobgoblin | Sorcerer | Netherdeep
Agreed, being able to sideline a significant threat until the others have been dealt with is nothing to sneeze at. Both spells have their advantages:
* Hold Monster is 5th level while Banishment is only 4th
* Hold Monster lets you seriously wail on the target while they're caught in it, Banishment just puts them in time out, but...
* If that creature isn't native to the plane you're on, that time out is permanent(well, permanent enough in most cases)
* Hold Monster is a Wisdom save, Banishment is Charisma. Many targets will be weaker against one than the other, even if just a little bit
* Both require Concentration, but Hold Monster lets them re-roll the save each turn to try and escape, Banishment doesn't
In terms of how you'd know whether you're dealing with extraplanar entities, I believe Arcana is usually used for Aberrations/Elementals/etc, Religion for Fiends/Undead/Celestials, maybe Nature for Fey? In addition to your actual bonuses with those skills, maybe talk to your DM about your character doing research on extraplanar creatures specifically so he can recognize them and know when they can be banished. Most good DMs I've played with would be happy to work with their players on such things, within reason.
Thanks.
I'm not saying Banishment doesn't work if the creature is from the same plane you're on. But it's infinitely more useful if the creature is from another plane. If not, the wizard has better options in his arsenal to knock one or more creatures out of combat. Everything has its pros and cons, of course. And Banishment is still preferable in some situations. But his power is especially noticeable with creatures from other planes, where he puts himself ahead of any other option. It is, in fact, one of the best lvl 4 spells in the game.
It would be nice if there was a feat (expert in creatures or something similar), or some subclass of wizard (or another class), or some spell, that would allow you to know the origin, weaknesses, type of creature, etc... of a creature. But that would go in another subforum.
The Monster Slayer Ranger can magically determine damage immunities, resistances, or vulnerabilities of a creature. It's the main reason I want to play one lol.
Banishment is a much better 5th level spell than Hold Monster imo. You get to banish two creatures! Crazy.
It would be more useful it would tell you which type. Celestials, Elementals, and Fiends are pretty consistently extraplanar, Fey are inconsistently handled, Aberrations usually aren't (only Slaad), Undead almost never.
It's a great subclass. Useful for being able to tell if someone is in disguise as another race. But not a guarantee of being able to tell if someone is from another plane.
Birgit | Shifter | Sorcerer | Dragonlords
Shayone | Hobgoblin | Sorcerer | Netherdeep
At the moment, the best option that has come out is Detect Evil and Good. It's not a consistent solution, but it's the closest thing.
Unfortunately, although I didn't say it, I was thinking of a Wizard. But it is good that options of other classes come out, in case it helps someone.
Actually, on a lot of occasions, you can do metarolplay. But to me that kills the immersion. That's why I would like a consistent option so that the character can know that. As a home rule you can make Arcana, Religion or even Nature rolls. But that, unless I'm wrong, is not something that the rules contemplate
The best way is "cast banishment on it and wait for a minute. If it doesn't return, it's from another plane".