Thank you for the quotation Plaguescarred. Was this ruling a 2014 or 2024 thing? I imagine the rule are intended to work the same way but just curious because 2024 wording is very subtly different.
Also if the weapon properties are game features, does using an object in a certain way not remove weapon properties from it? There is no explicit rule saying it does beyond damage and range being d4 and 20/60
Yeah there's no explicit rules preventing some Weapon Mastery Property to still be used so if for example you make a melee attack with a Dart it's still has Finesse & Vex, same when throwing a Rapier.
That would actually also mean you can't attack with a Two-Handed using only one hand if the Property remains, perhaps due to bulky unwieldyness.
Yeah there's no explicit rules preventing some Weapon Mastery Property to still be used so if for example you make a melee attack with a Dart it's still has Finesse & Vex, same when throwing a Rapier.
That would actually also mean you can't attack with a Two-Handed using only one hand if the Property remains, perhaps due to bulky unwieldyness.
The rules are too vague for a definitive answer, but I would argue that, when using a weapon as an improvised weapon, it is no longer the original weapon.
An improvised weapon is an object wielded as a makeshift weapon, such as broken glass, a table leg, or a frying pan. A Simple or Martial weapon also counts as an improvised weapon if it’s wielded in a way contrary to its design; if you use a Ranged weapon to make a melee attack or throw a Melee weapon that lacks the Thrown property, the weapon counts as an improvised weapon. An improvised weapon follows the rules below.
Proficiency. Don’t add your Proficiency Bonus to attack rolls with an improvised weapon.
Damage. On a hit, the weapon deals 1d4 damage of a type the DM thinks is appropriate for the object.
Range. If you throw the weapon, it has a normal range of 20 feet and a long range of 60 feet.
Weapon Equivalents. If an improvised weapon resembles a Simple or Martial weapon, the DM may say it functions as that weapon and uses that weapon’s rules. For example, the DM could treat a table leg as a Club.
It seems to me that these rules are overwriting the normal rules for the weapon, but you could interpret them either way, I guess.
It seems to me that these rules are overwriting the normal rules for the weapon, but you could interpret them either way, I guess.
As DM that's how i rule it as post earlier in lack of definitive guidelines.
The only other description for Improvised Weapons in the rules is this one not saying :
Improvised Weapons: If you use an object—such as a table leg, frying pan, or bottle—as a makeshift weapon, see “Improvised Weapons” in the rules glossary. Also see those rules if you wield a weapon in an unusual way, such as using a Ranged weapon to make a melee attack.
Yes, either way - no properties on improvised use of a weapon or keeping properties some odd things come out of it re lack of reach on long weapons for the former and impossibility of improvising two handed weapons in one hand for the latter.
Thank you for the quotation Plaguescarred. Was this ruling a 2014 or 2024 thing? I imagine the rule are intended to work the same way but just curious because 2024 wording is very subtly different.
Also if the weapon properties are game features, does using an object in a certain way not remove weapon properties from it? There is no explicit rule saying it does beyond damage and range being d4 and 20/60
It was before 2024 revision, but Improvised Weapons haven't much change.
Objects don't have weapon properties so unless the DM say an object functions as a weapon and uses that weapon’s rules, it shouldn't have any.
Well, by objects I guess I meant weapons specifically which do have weapon properties
Yeah there's no explicit rules preventing some Weapon Mastery Property to still be used so if for example you make a melee attack with a Dart it's still has Finesse & Vex, same when throwing a Rapier.
That would actually also mean you can't attack with a Two-Handed using only one hand if the Property remains, perhaps due to bulky unwieldyness.
The rules are too vague for a definitive answer, but I would argue that, when using a weapon as an improvised weapon, it is no longer the original weapon.
It seems to me that these rules are overwriting the normal rules for the weapon, but you could interpret them either way, I guess.
As DM that's how i rule it as post earlier in lack of definitive guidelines.
The only other description for Improvised Weapons in the rules is this one not saying :
Yes, either way - no properties on improvised use of a weapon or keeping properties some odd things come out of it re lack of reach on long weapons for the former and impossibility of improvising two handed weapons in one hand for the latter.
If a weapon is wielded in a way that correspond to its design, then its Mastery Property may apply.
If a weapon is wielded in a way contrary to its design, then its Mastery Property may not apply.