I'm making a Rogue and trying to find everything I can to make one viable in combat. I'm firm believer that damage potential is not the only thing a class should be judged by. But most of the other things a Rogue has going for it can be duplicated by other classes. And there has been some concern expressed over the new restrictions to Sneak Attack. So I thought I should try it myself, and see if I could at least maximize the opportunities for it each turn.
And I realized that the easiest way I could make a better Rogue was to start with a level in Ranger...
By multiclassing I delay the increase to Sneak Attack damage and other features by one level. But that's normal. It won't hurt much as you power through the first few levels.
What do you gain for going Ranger 1 first?
More HP
All martial weapons
Medium armor and Shield training
2 cantrips and 2 first level spells including good ones for Sneak Attack like Entangle
Hunter's Mark - delay the Sneak Attack d6 bonus by one level to get an extra d6 on almost all attacks.
Rogues get one more skill proficiency than Rangers, but multiclassing into Rogue gives you that proficiency back, thieves tools, AND 2 more expertise at second level.
We knew that Hunter's Mark was too tempting at level 1, but multiclassing within the same Expert Group compliments each other so well in every way, it really feels like the best way to make a super expert. It's like getting 3 feats, extra expertise, and Hunter's Mark almost for free. I'm expecting a lot of these situations to pop up in future groups too. Let me know if you see any obvious flaws in this reading of the classes.
Ranger 5/Rogue 15 from UA is the best I am seeing so far. With 5 levels of Ranger using 2 short swords you get:
Hunter's mark 1d6 per hit (for 3 attacks at level 5)
Taking hunter subclass you get 1d8 on a single attack
Extra Attack
2nd level primal spells (including pass without trace and locate object)
A fighting style (two weapon fighting most likely)
then you take 15 levels of rogue to get that 8d6 sneak attack, advantage on attacks against a target within 5 foot of an ally and so many other rogue features which make you a lot more resilient to damage.
The rogue has very little margin of choice to make, ruse and thats pretty much all about it. Kinda lame boring, and weak. (ruse is very great tho, but it doesnt fill the gap on its own)
Every class should have a no ressource mechanic, a ressource one, topped by a signature ability "defining" or framing gameplay.
At least for one level.
I'm making a Rogue and trying to find everything I can to make one viable in combat. I'm firm believer that damage potential is not the only thing a class should be judged by. But most of the other things a Rogue has going for it can be duplicated by other classes. And there has been some concern expressed over the new restrictions to Sneak Attack. So I thought I should try it myself, and see if I could at least maximize the opportunities for it each turn.
And I realized that the easiest way I could make a better Rogue was to start with a level in Ranger...
By multiclassing I delay the increase to Sneak Attack damage and other features by one level. But that's normal. It won't hurt much as you power through the first few levels.
What do you gain for going Ranger 1 first?
More HP
All martial weapons
Medium armor and Shield training
2 cantrips and 2 first level spells including good ones for Sneak Attack like Entangle
Hunter's Mark - delay the Sneak Attack d6 bonus by one level to get an extra d6 on almost all attacks.
Rogues get one more skill proficiency than Rangers, but multiclassing into Rogue gives you that proficiency back, thieves tools, AND 2 more expertise at second level.
We knew that Hunter's Mark was too tempting at level 1, but multiclassing within the same Expert Group compliments each other so well in every way, it really feels like the best way to make a super expert. It's like getting 3 feats, extra expertise, and Hunter's Mark almost for free. I'm expecting a lot of these situations to pop up in future groups too. Let me know if you see any obvious flaws in this reading of the classes.
Ranger 5/Rogue 15 from UA is the best I am seeing so far. With 5 levels of Ranger using 2 short swords you get:
Hunter's mark 1d6 per hit (for 3 attacks at level 5)
Taking hunter subclass you get 1d8 on a single attack
Extra Attack
2nd level primal spells (including pass without trace and locate object)
A fighting style (two weapon fighting most likely)
then you take 15 levels of rogue to get that 8d6 sneak attack, advantage on attacks against a target within 5 foot of an ally and so many other rogue features which make you a lot more resilient to damage.
The rogue has very little margin of choice to make, ruse and thats pretty much all about it.
Kinda lame boring, and weak. (ruse is very great tho, but it doesnt fill the gap on its own)
Every class should have a no ressource mechanic, a ressource one, topped by a signature ability "defining" or framing gameplay.