Honestly, as much as I was joking earlier, I wouldn't be surprised if they did try to introduce something like a pack of tokens that could be redeemed for advantage but are meant to be destroyed after use.
Here's the thing. In any TTRPG, you need to only buy once. You only need one PHB. You need only one set of dice (at least technically. You can roll a d12 10 times if you have some 10d12 attack after all). You only need one set of rules for an expansion. You technically don't even need a figurine as you can just use a coin or something from another game that just looks vaguely like what your character looks like. You don't even need enemy tokens as you can use skittles and let the players eat any foes they kill. And so much of that is technically optional. With the rise of digital dice, forums, online token makers, and other things you can technically play D&D without spending a dime. A group of five friends can have one person buy the books then they can play online in PBP or something. That's all a one-time purchase and a serious loss of revenue. If a PHB cost 50 bucks but a group only NEEDS one, that's basically 10 bucks per person which is not a lot.
If they find a way to make it so that each and every individual player needs to provide a constant, if small, stream of revenue to them then that would drastically increase the amount of coin they'd earn per player. Something like what I suggested could be baked into the rules (so it's legal in so far as the rules are concerned) and result in customers constantly providing a small stream of steady revenue.
Would this be a dumb idea? Sure. But at the same time I'm sure we can all point to the multitude of dumb ideas companies have tried before.
Now, what I would LIKE to see them do instead is offer more and better online tools for playing the game. Online map makers, token makers, support for online play, and such would all be smart ideas. Hell, they could even look at the older editions, digitize them, and then sell them online. Would be relatively cheap and you just know some people out there would be interested in playing 2e or something if only for the novelty of it. Not to mention they could actually provide legit new content for said older editions with ease as a result.
Honestly, as much as I was joking earlier, I wouldn't be surprised if they did try to introduce something like a pack of tokens that could be redeemed for advantage but are meant to be destroyed after use.
I am 100% confident that nothing like this is even remotely being considered.
VTT, chests you find while running official adventures, those chests are locked but you can open them for some cool cosmetics if you just buy some keys. They may even have rare cosmetics in them.....it's coming.
I'm pretty certain what they are taking about includes things like the following:
Nice themed dice sets, both real and virtual
Character sheet portfolios
Licensed merchandise
Customizable miniatures, both real and virtual
New spell card decks
Fully realized VTT adventures
Films
Cartoons
Cute stuffed beholders
DnD can be played without spending any money at all. In most groups, only the DM spends much. That's what they are aware of. Players really only need a set of dice and maybe a miniature if they are playing in person. Not even those if online. They want to at least be the ones selling the players their dice and minis. And maybe a T shirt and a movie ticket. We are a long way from loot boxes. And heck, even if they did do that, all we have to do is just not buy them. They'll come up with something else to replace it fast.
I would really like to see a cartoon. There's plenty of good fantasy animation such as Castlevania. So as long as they didn't stupid themselves into the dirt and do stuff like Rings of Power it should be easy money. Just produce a series that shows how cool and awesome D&D is and the fun stories you can have while playing it. Heck, just turning their modules into cartoons would likely work beautifully.
I'm pretty certain what they are taking about includes things like the following:
Nice themed dice sets, both real and virtual
Character sheet portfolios
Licensed merchandise
Customizable miniatures, both real and virtual
New spell card decks
Fully realized VTT adventures
Films
Cartoons
Cute stuffed beholders
DnD can be played without spending any money at all. In most groups, only the DM spends much. That's what they are aware of. Players really only need a set of dice and maybe a miniature if they are playing in person. Not even those if online. They want to at least be the ones selling the players their dice and minis. And maybe a T shirt and a movie ticket. We are a long way from loot boxes. And heck, even if they did do that, all we have to do is just not buy them. They'll come up with something else to replace it fast.
This.
The discussion wasn’t about monetizing the game. It was and monetizing the brand. Movies, AAA video games, merch with the D&D logo on it. They specifically referenced Harry Potter and Marvel as models. Things where if you’re a fan and player, they have lots of different things to sell you beyond the PHB. And if you’re not a player, they still have things to sell you. Lots more people go to see avengers movies than ever buy the comics they’re based on. They may find more things to sell you in the game, too. But at its core, all you really need is the PHB and some dice to play (really, just the dice since the srd is free, and there’s plenty of free dice rollers around, too). So while they can try to sell more things, but they’ll be easy to ignore.
I'm pretty certain what they are taking about includes things like the following:
Nice themed dice sets, both real and virtual
Character sheet portfolios
Licensed merchandise
Customizable miniatures, both real and virtual
New spell card decks
Fully realized VTT adventures
Films
Cartoons
Cute stuffed beholders
DnD can be played without spending any money at all. In most groups, only the DM spends much. That's what they are aware of. Players really only need a set of dice and maybe a miniature if they are playing in person. Not even those if online. They want to at least be the ones selling the players their dice and minis. And maybe a T shirt and a movie ticket. We are a long way from loot boxes. And heck, even if they did do that, all we have to do is just not buy them. They'll come up with something else to replace it fast.
This.
The discussion wasn’t about monetizing the game. It was and monetizing the brand. Movies, AAA video games, merch with the D&D logo on it. They specifically referenced Harry Potter and Marvel as models. Things where if you’re a fan and player, they have lots of different things to sell you beyond the PHB. And if you’re not a player, they still have things to sell you. Lots more people go to see avengers movies than ever buy the comics they’re based on. They may find more things to sell you in the game, too. But at its core, all you really need is the PHB and some dice to play (really, just the dice since the srd is free, and there’s plenty of free dice rollers around, too). So while they can try to sell more things, but they’ll be easy to ignore.
In the grand scheme of things D&D is an incredibly cheap hobby. My current group has been playing for over 5 years and between all of us we have bought less than a dozen books.
If the new D&D movie is relatively successful, it will make more money than every D&D book ever published. Hell, if it is a hit, the TOY sales alone might bring in more than the game ever did.
Bottom line is Hasbro doesn't care if they make any money by you playing d&d. They just want you playing so you will buy movie tickets, videogames, toys, etc.
Honestly, as much as I was joking earlier, I wouldn't be surprised if they did try to introduce something like a pack of tokens that could be redeemed for advantage but are meant to be destroyed after use.
Yeah, and five seconds after they announce this, every DM ever immediately house rules "No advantage tokens allowed."
Crap like that works in video games. Not in TTRPG's.
Honestly, as much as I was joking earlier, I wouldn't be surprised if they did try to introduce something like a pack of tokens that could be redeemed for advantage but are meant to be destroyed after use.
Yeah, and five seconds after they announce this, every DM ever immediately house rules "No advantage tokens allowed."
Crap like that works in video games. Not in TTRPG's.
Unless they start running official adventure's league games online using their VTT and official scenarios, combine that with some ladder system or public leaderboard showing which characters have been on the most successful adventures and hold the most wealth or something and you have the pieces for an incentive to buy tokens/whatever may make that public leaderboard character look cool or perform better.
Honestly, as much as I was joking earlier, I wouldn't be surprised if they did try to introduce something like a pack of tokens that could be redeemed for advantage but are meant to be destroyed after use.
Yeah, and five seconds after they announce this, every DM ever immediately house rules "No advantage tokens allowed."
Crap like that works in video games. Not in TTRPG's.
You know that there's also a bunch of people who would insist that, since it's in the rules (presumably core rules to boot), it's legal.
You know that there's also a bunch of people who would insist that, since it's in the rules (presumably core rules to boot), it's legal.
Yes, but those are the same kind of people who, back in 3.5e insisted that they should be able to play their weird overpowered Multi-Class/species combo from six separate setting supplements, because they were from 'official material'. And we told those people 'no' too.
Honestly, as much as I was joking earlier, I wouldn't be surprised if they did try to introduce something like a pack of tokens that could be redeemed for advantage but are meant to be destroyed after use.
Yeah, and five seconds after they announce this, every DM ever immediately house rules "No advantage tokens allowed."
Crap like that works in video games. Not in TTRPG's.
You know that there's also a bunch of people who would insist that, since it's in the rules (presumably core rules to boot), it's legal.
Yes, and there are also a LOT more players who would say "No." Like, even if the DM wanted to implement them, most players are going to say no, because they don't want to have to spend their whole paycheck on Advantage tokens just to keep up with no life Bob who is the only person at the table to doesn't have a family or other expenses and can afford to spend his whole paycheck on this crap. It works in video games because if you want to play a video game, you have no choice but to play by the publisher's rules. With DnD, any table can change the rules as they see fit. Besides, pay to win games don't tend to last very long.
You know that there's also a bunch of people who would insist that, since it's in the rules (presumably core rules to boot), it's legal.
Yes, but those are the same kind of people who, back in 3.5e insisted that they should be able to play their weird overpowered Multi-Class/species combo from six separate setting supplements, because they were from 'official material'. And we told those people 'no' too.
Hey. I'm not gonna argue that it would be stupid, wrong, a terrible idea, and so-forth. I'm saying that there are people out there who would buy these tokens en-mass if WotC made them official and would try to force it with the backing of 'it's legal'.
Honestly, as much as I was joking earlier, I wouldn't be surprised if they did try to introduce something like a pack of tokens that could be redeemed for advantage but are meant to be destroyed after use.
Yeah, and five seconds after they announce this, every DM ever immediately house rules "No advantage tokens allowed."
Crap like that works in video games. Not in TTRPG's.
You know that there's also a bunch of people who would insist that, since it's in the rules (presumably core rules to boot), it's legal.
Yes, and there are also a LOT more players who would say "No." Like, even if the DM wanted to implement them, most players are going to say no, because they don't want to have to spend their whole paycheck on Advantage tokens just to keep up with no life Bob who is the only person at the table to doesn't have a family or other expenses and can afford to spend his whole paycheck on this crap. It works in video games because if you want to play a video game, you have no choice but to play by the publisher's rules. With DnD, any table can change the rules as they see fit. Besides, pay to win games don't tend to last very long.
Certainly agree there. Players and GM's would refuse to play with these people and they'd be confined to their own tables accepting these tokens. Would be a universally bad idea. I still think a company would do so if they thought they would get away with it. It's not like we haven't seen companies torpedo entire franchises on ideas that showed they had no understanding of the IP or fanbase before just to make a quick buck or two. 'Do you guys not have phones?'
Technically, I've already been in some AL games where you could buy rerolls. They were for charity, but you still were able to buy rerolls.
There were also some certs for AL, again for charity, that could have been bought.
Never really thought much of them then, due to the whole charity part, but in a way microtransaction happened. It was accepted due to rhe charity part though; take that away and people would most certainly lash back.
Really, the main form of monetization I can see for One D&D, in the form of a trpg, is the VTT. Making it a subscription service can draw in a huge amount of income if they make the VTT well enough.
Integrate it with D&D Beyond to more easily build characters as one of the huge flaws with VTT's is setting up all of the mechanics if each ability. People always had a lot of issues with making macros for Elven Accuracy for example.
If it's for charity I wouldn't be surprised if both the GM's and players at the table were totally fine with you donating $100 to start at level 20 with a vorpal sword or something.
I feel that the 'best' monitization would be creating a series. Like I said earlier, turn the modules into an animated series. Think about how awesome that would be. Watching your favorite heroes battle through something then being able to do it yourself in a module with your friends. It's basically the exact same thing Pokemon and Yugioh do with their anime. When you get down to it they're glorified ads to try and get you to play the games with your friends.
If it's for charity I wouldn't be surprised if both the GM's and players at the table were totally fine with you donating $100 to start at level 20 with a vorpal sword or something.
I feel that the 'best' monitization would be creating a series. Like I said earlier, turn the modules into an animated series. Think about how awesome that would be. Watching your favorite heroes battle through something then being able to do it yourself in a module with your friends. It's basically the exact same thing Pokemon and Yugioh do with their anime. When you get down to it they're glorified ads to try and get you to play the games with your friends.
I agree that something along these lines would probably be a good direction to pursue. However, I think there are a lot of issues that could be problematic for this combination. I don't know much about Pokemon or Yugioh, or even DnD modules, but it seems the latter are far more dependent upon some sort of mystery or surprise. Something like Curse of Strahd seems like it would lose a lot if everyone (or just one or two players) has seen the adventure ahead of time and knows the secrets and tricks of the adventure. I'm sure there would be ways to get around this, but it seems like it would be a challenge, at least to the extent that I have properly understood what you are suggesting.
If it's for charity I wouldn't be surprised if both the GM's and players at the table were totally fine with you donating $100 to start at level 20 with a vorpal sword or something.
I feel that the 'best' monitization would be creating a series. Like I said earlier, turn the modules into an animated series. Think about how awesome that would be. Watching your favorite heroes battle through something then being able to do it yourself in a module with your friends. It's basically the exact same thing Pokemon and Yugioh do with their anime. When you get down to it they're glorified ads to try and get you to play the games with your friends.
I agree that something along these lines would probably be a good direction to pursue. However, I think there are a lot of issues that could be problematic for this combination. I don't know much about Pokemon or Yugioh, or even DnD modules, but it seems the latter are far more dependent upon some sort of mystery or surprise. Something like Curse of Strahd seems like it would lose a lot if everyone (or just one or two players) has seen the adventure ahead of time and knows the secrets and tricks of the adventure. I'm sure there would be ways to get around this, but it seems like it would be a challenge, at least to the extent that I have properly understood what you are suggesting.
While that may be true for Yu Gi Oh it's not true for Pokemon as the main 'product' is not the cards but the video games. I also don't feel it would be that much of an issue as people do tend to replay modules with different groups and the like and not every module is linear or would have the same outcome. Not to mention that it doesn't have to be a 1:1 conversion and GM's and your party will result in different outcomes. Heck, a botched persuade roll could result in an entirely different adventure. Plus, even if all of that wasn't true, there's only so much adventure you can HAVE in one series. You're not going to have a series focused on Princes of the Apocolypse running at the exact same time as Storm Kings Thunder. My bigger concern is that people might avoid one of the show or the book because the series was being played due to the stigma of spoilers.
If it's for charity I wouldn't be surprised if both the GM's and players at the table were totally fine with you donating $100 to start at level 20 with a vorpal sword or something.
I feel that the 'best' monitization would be creating a series. Like I said earlier, turn the modules into an animated series. Think about how awesome that would be. Watching your favorite heroes battle through something then being able to do it yourself in a module with your friends. It's basically the exact same thing Pokemon and Yugioh do with their anime. When you get down to it they're glorified ads to try and get you to play the games with your friends.
I agree that something along these lines would probably be a good direction to pursue. However, I think there are a lot of issues that could be problematic for this combination. I don't know much about Pokemon or Yugioh, or even DnD modules, but it seems the latter are far more dependent upon some sort of mystery or surprise. Something like Curse of Strahd seems like it would lose a lot if everyone (or just one or two players) has seen the adventure ahead of time and knows the secrets and tricks of the adventure. I'm sure there would be ways to get around this, but it seems like it would be a challenge, at least to the extent that I have properly understood what you are suggesting.
While that may be true for Yu Gi Oh it's not true for Pokemon as the main 'product' is not the cards but the video games. I also don't feel it would be that much of an issue as people do tend to replay modules with different groups and the like and not every module is linear or would have the same outcome. Not to mention that it doesn't have to be a 1:1 conversion and GM's and your party will result in different outcomes. Heck, a botched persuade roll could result in an entirely different adventure. Plus, even if all of that wasn't true, there's only so much adventure you can HAVE in one series. You're not going to have a series focused on Princes of the Apocolypse running at the exact same time as Storm Kings Thunder. My bigger concern is that people might avoid one of the show or the book because the series was being played due to the stigma of spoilers.
This is why I am inclined to think that a series or movie might introduce a world or a location and present an adventure, but modules would be an offshoot, adopting the setting, lore, and history and building upon it or exploring an offshoot from it. I don't really play video games, but have watched my son and stepson play games related to the Lord of the Rings that seemed to explore adventures tangential to the storyline in the books. Something like this might be the best approach.
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Honestly, as much as I was joking earlier, I wouldn't be surprised if they did try to introduce something like a pack of tokens that could be redeemed for advantage but are meant to be destroyed after use.
Here's the thing. In any TTRPG, you need to only buy once. You only need one PHB. You need only one set of dice (at least technically. You can roll a d12 10 times if you have some 10d12 attack after all). You only need one set of rules for an expansion. You technically don't even need a figurine as you can just use a coin or something from another game that just looks vaguely like what your character looks like. You don't even need enemy tokens as you can use skittles and let the players eat any foes they kill. And so much of that is technically optional. With the rise of digital dice, forums, online token makers, and other things you can technically play D&D without spending a dime. A group of five friends can have one person buy the books then they can play online in PBP or something. That's all a one-time purchase and a serious loss of revenue. If a PHB cost 50 bucks but a group only NEEDS one, that's basically 10 bucks per person which is not a lot.
If they find a way to make it so that each and every individual player needs to provide a constant, if small, stream of revenue to them then that would drastically increase the amount of coin they'd earn per player. Something like what I suggested could be baked into the rules (so it's legal in so far as the rules are concerned) and result in customers constantly providing a small stream of steady revenue.
Would this be a dumb idea? Sure. But at the same time I'm sure we can all point to the multitude of dumb ideas companies have tried before.
Now, what I would LIKE to see them do instead is offer more and better online tools for playing the game. Online map makers, token makers, support for online play, and such would all be smart ideas. Hell, they could even look at the older editions, digitize them, and then sell them online. Would be relatively cheap and you just know some people out there would be interested in playing 2e or something if only for the novelty of it. Not to mention they could actually provide legit new content for said older editions with ease as a result.
I am 100% confident that nothing like this is even remotely being considered.
I wish I could be that confident; but I thought the same about things like lootboxes back in the day.
VTT, chests you find while running official adventures, those chests are locked but you can open them for some cool cosmetics if you just buy some keys. They may even have rare cosmetics in them.....it's coming.
I'm pretty certain what they are taking about includes things like the following:
DnD can be played without spending any money at all. In most groups, only the DM spends much. That's what they are aware of. Players really only need a set of dice and maybe a miniature if they are playing in person. Not even those if online. They want to at least be the ones selling the players their dice and minis. And maybe a T shirt and a movie ticket. We are a long way from loot boxes. And heck, even if they did do that, all we have to do is just not buy them. They'll come up with something else to replace it fast.
I would really like to see a cartoon. There's plenty of good fantasy animation such as Castlevania. So as long as they didn't stupid themselves into the dirt and do stuff like Rings of Power it should be easy money. Just produce a series that shows how cool and awesome D&D is and the fun stories you can have while playing it. Heck, just turning their modules into cartoons would likely work beautifully.
Damn it. Take my money.
This.
The discussion wasn’t about monetizing the game. It was and monetizing the brand. Movies, AAA video games, merch with the D&D logo on it. They specifically referenced Harry Potter and Marvel as models. Things where if you’re a fan and player, they have lots of different things to sell you beyond the PHB. And if you’re not a player, they still have things to sell you. Lots more people go to see avengers movies than ever buy the comics they’re based on.
They may find more things to sell you in the game, too. But at its core, all you really need is the PHB and some dice to play (really, just the dice since the srd is free, and there’s plenty of free dice rollers around, too). So while they can try to sell more things, but they’ll be easy to ignore.
In the grand scheme of things D&D is an incredibly cheap hobby. My current group has been playing for over 5 years and between all of us we have bought less than a dozen books.
If the new D&D movie is relatively successful, it will make more money than every D&D book ever published. Hell, if it is a hit, the TOY sales alone might bring in more than the game ever did.
Bottom line is Hasbro doesn't care if they make any money by you playing d&d. They just want you playing so you will buy movie tickets, videogames, toys, etc.
Yeah, and five seconds after they announce this, every DM ever immediately house rules "No advantage tokens allowed."
Crap like that works in video games. Not in TTRPG's.
Unless they start running official adventure's league games online using their VTT and official scenarios, combine that with some ladder system or public leaderboard showing which characters have been on the most successful adventures and hold the most wealth or something and you have the pieces for an incentive to buy tokens/whatever may make that public leaderboard character look cool or perform better.
You know that there's also a bunch of people who would insist that, since it's in the rules (presumably core rules to boot), it's legal.
Yes, but those are the same kind of people who, back in 3.5e insisted that they should be able to play their weird overpowered Multi-Class/species combo from six separate setting supplements, because they were from 'official material'. And we told those people 'no' too.
Yes, and there are also a LOT more players who would say "No." Like, even if the DM wanted to implement them, most players are going to say no, because they don't want to have to spend their whole paycheck on Advantage tokens just to keep up with no life Bob who is the only person at the table to doesn't have a family or other expenses and can afford to spend his whole paycheck on this crap. It works in video games because if you want to play a video game, you have no choice but to play by the publisher's rules. With DnD, any table can change the rules as they see fit. Besides, pay to win games don't tend to last very long.
Hey. I'm not gonna argue that it would be stupid, wrong, a terrible idea, and so-forth. I'm saying that there are people out there who would buy these tokens en-mass if WotC made them official and would try to force it with the backing of 'it's legal'.
Certainly agree there. Players and GM's would refuse to play with these people and they'd be confined to their own tables accepting these tokens. Would be a universally bad idea. I still think a company would do so if they thought they would get away with it. It's not like we haven't seen companies torpedo entire franchises on ideas that showed they had no understanding of the IP or fanbase before just to make a quick buck or two. 'Do you guys not have phones?'
Technically, I've already been in some AL games where you could buy rerolls. They were for charity, but you still were able to buy rerolls.
There were also some certs for AL, again for charity, that could have been bought.
Never really thought much of them then, due to the whole charity part, but in a way microtransaction happened. It was accepted due to rhe charity part though; take that away and people would most certainly lash back.
Really, the main form of monetization I can see for One D&D, in the form of a trpg, is the VTT. Making it a subscription service can draw in a huge amount of income if they make the VTT well enough.
Integrate it with D&D Beyond to more easily build characters as one of the huge flaws with VTT's is setting up all of the mechanics if each ability. People always had a lot of issues with making macros for Elven Accuracy for example.
If it's for charity I wouldn't be surprised if both the GM's and players at the table were totally fine with you donating $100 to start at level 20 with a vorpal sword or something.
I feel that the 'best' monitization would be creating a series. Like I said earlier, turn the modules into an animated series. Think about how awesome that would be. Watching your favorite heroes battle through something then being able to do it yourself in a module with your friends. It's basically the exact same thing Pokemon and Yugioh do with their anime. When you get down to it they're glorified ads to try and get you to play the games with your friends.
I agree that something along these lines would probably be a good direction to pursue. However, I think there are a lot of issues that could be problematic for this combination. I don't know much about Pokemon or Yugioh, or even DnD modules, but it seems the latter are far more dependent upon some sort of mystery or surprise. Something like Curse of Strahd seems like it would lose a lot if everyone (or just one or two players) has seen the adventure ahead of time and knows the secrets and tricks of the adventure. I'm sure there would be ways to get around this, but it seems like it would be a challenge, at least to the extent that I have properly understood what you are suggesting.
While that may be true for Yu Gi Oh it's not true for Pokemon as the main 'product' is not the cards but the video games. I also don't feel it would be that much of an issue as people do tend to replay modules with different groups and the like and not every module is linear or would have the same outcome. Not to mention that it doesn't have to be a 1:1 conversion and GM's and your party will result in different outcomes. Heck, a botched persuade roll could result in an entirely different adventure. Plus, even if all of that wasn't true, there's only so much adventure you can HAVE in one series. You're not going to have a series focused on Princes of the Apocolypse running at the exact same time as Storm Kings Thunder. My bigger concern is that people might avoid one of the show or the book because the series was being played due to the stigma of spoilers.
This is why I am inclined to think that a series or movie might introduce a world or a location and present an adventure, but modules would be an offshoot, adopting the setting, lore, and history and building upon it or exploring an offshoot from it. I don't really play video games, but have watched my son and stepson play games related to the Lord of the Rings that seemed to explore adventures tangential to the storyline in the books. Something like this might be the best approach.