I think it’s a little letdown that the warlock gets subclasses at level 3, but I love the new subclass changes. Great old one was a favorite of mine, and I like the changes. I do dislike how they changed archfey. I liked the flavor of fey presence, and I feel like now the entire subclass is just misty step.
Do the subclasses matter when the base class was completely wrecked and is basically nothing but a boring, undertuned retread of the 2014 release with no meaningful changes, fixes, or updates?
I hate it. I hate the fey changes, I hate the pacts being mediocre except for blade. I like the extra spells just being given, but I hate hey take out the best invocations to make them spells, and I hate that it doesn't address issues.
Of course it does, Yurei! There's always value in seeing the best in what you have. :)
As for Archfey, I really like how the features now synergise with one another like that. It really gives the subclass a lot of identity as a mobile dreamweaver. Very neat! And if you really miss the days of yore with Fae Presence, it sounds like an easy cludge to give Steps of the Fey a third option to charm everyone you land next to for a round, right? Call it "Welcoming Step", if you will! (Hey, WotC? Take note here, okay?)
Our Cthulhu devotees got themselves a proper horrorshow set-up with their weaponised telepathy. Just in time for all of us who have been playing Baldur's Gate 3, to boot! (Yes... Give me those tentacle-adjacent mind-powers...)
Archfey is a good subclass. At least on paper. I like that the entire subclass is themed around misty step, and I'm surprised that they haven't done the same with the others (not with misty step, of course. But with another concept). I really like what they have done with the Archfey, but I would have to try it to have a definitive opinion.
While I did think Fey Presence was neat, in practice I didn't get to do much with it except the occasional RP moment during a social encounter. It was definitely weak compared to the other Patrons.
Agreed, Irrelevant_guy! It would be nice to see a bit more of thematic ability interaction within more subclasses. Like, Fiend might let you discharge those ill-gotten temp-HP in a form of mini-Hellish Rebuke? Or Celestial could receive alternate uses of their Healing Light dice as they grow stronger. I very much enjoy classes and subclasses that introduce a base mechanic and then expands upon it throughout.
Do the subclasses matter when the base class was completely wrecked and is basically nothing but a boring, undertuned retread of the 2014 release with no meaningful changes, fixes, or updates?
I’ve come to the realization over the last few UA’s that this was never going to be a new edition that we could have substantial changes or even a 5.5 with some broad yet less substantial changes than a new edition, but more a rules update with mostly some “quality of life” changes in the classes. A 5.1, if you will.
Edit: And on topic, I haven’t read through the warlock carefully, only skimmed, but I kind of like the changes to the subclasses. GOO needed some help as I always liked the theme but it wasn’t very good in the 2014 PHB
Archfey is a good subclass. At least on paper. I like that the entire subclass is themed around misty step, and I'm surprised that they haven't done the same with the others (not with misty step, of course. But with another concept). I really like what they have done with the Archfey, but I would have to try it to have a definitive opinion.
Ok. Honestly, the class can be interesting but it could be it's own new interplanar subclass rather than destroying the entirety of the class.
I feel fiend got unnecessarily nerfed. It was good but never super great. I heavily prefer this new misty step at level 3 feature and am ok with misty escape alteration. There are a lot of tricks that this can do. Provide support for allies trickster taunt and run, later bamf and invisible. Fey presence I have tried to build and make useful at best it has been useful 2 or 3 times a campaign. This is going to be useful 2 or 3 times a day. The 14 level feature is what I am disappointed with. It doubles down too much on misty step. Plunging someone into an illusory dreamlike world once per short rest felt like I was getting an extra spell and a solid one at that. It was low scoring because it was once per short rather than based on long, required concentration and because fear and charm are common immunities at higher levels. A change to a couple of these things on the ability would have improved it, but I like it more than the misty step as part of other casts.
It’s alright. Still think that the 3rd pact slot should be at 7th level and the 4th at 13th level. And warlock should have been a intelligence class.
I think some good minor improvement’s for each subclass is to give an extra language based on the subclass: Fiend gets Infernal or Abyssal, Archfey gets Sylivin?, Great-Old One gets Deep Speech, Celestial gets Celestial. And also change the damage type of your warlock spells like the GOO can: Fiend gets fire or poison, Celestial gets radiant, Archfey gets whatever damage type reflects the Fey.
Pact of Chain could use more options like a Gazer or a Death’s Head. And an invocation that increases the survivability and combat potential of the familiar. Like get temp hp equal to the warlocks level+charisma modifier and a bonus to the attack and damage rolls.
I wish it was int too, maybe just have int or charisma as options but ditch wisdom? Other than that it feels ok, I was interested in the last version I think with a few small changes it could have been great.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Where words fail, swords prevail. Where blood is spilled, my cup is filled" -Cartaphilus
"I have found the answer to the meaning of life. You ask me what the answer is? You already know what the answer to life is. You fear it more than the strike of a viper, the ravages of disease, the ire of a lover. The answer is always death. But death is a gentle mistress with a sweet embrace, and you owe her a debt of restitution. Life is not a gift, it is a loan."
They are great. Tho I'd give Celestial Patron a pseudo smite where you can use your bonus action to spend some healing dice to deal extra radiant damage to a target you just hit with an attack roll.
Archfey is a good subclass. At least on paper. I like that the entire subclass is themed around misty step, and I'm surprised that they haven't done the same with the others (not with misty step, of course. But with another concept). I really like what they have done with the Archfey, but I would have to try it to have a definitive opinion.
Ok. Honestly, the class can be interesting but it could be it's own new interplanar subclass rather than destroying the entirety of the class.
I just don't want to discuss the warlock chassis here. The warlock in playtest 7 seems disappointing to me. But that doesn't mean that subclasses are fine. Especially the Archfey.
I think the subclasses were genuinely improved over the 2014 version. Having your patron spells always prepared is a huge boon in versatility for Warlocks, leaving you free to learn some utility rituals, taking advantage of the fact that now all classes can cast the ritual version of their prepared spells.
Hurl Through Hell was slightly nerfed in damage, but that is mitigated by giving the incapacitated condition to the target.
My dear Great Old One was rightfully buffed, and I especially like the flavor of your weaponized telepathy.
Celestial is solid.
Can't really speak about Archfey, I really can't stand the flavor of that one lol.
To sum it all, I'm really satisfied with the Warlock in this UA.
Archfey is a good subclass. At least on paper. I like that the entire subclass is themed around misty step, and I'm surprised that they haven't done the same with the others (not with misty step, of course. But with another concept). I really like what they have done with the Archfey, but I would have to try it to have a definitive opinion.
Ok. Honestly, the class can be interesting but it could be it's own new interplanar subclass rather than destroying the entirety of the class.
I just don't want to discuss the warlock chassis here. The warlock in playtest 7 seems disappointing to me. But that doesn't mean that subclasses are fine. Especially the Archfey.
I mean subclass. I like old archfey. New archfey could have been a different archetype like the new barbarian, which is seems to be a copy of as the new barbarian basically misty steps with bonuses as well. They could have made it a world tree warlock, with The Guardian of The World Tree as it's patron or something.
I don't think, as someone put it, nightcrawler, when I think fey
There's nothing that bothers me, really. It's more that it's not my cup of tea: a pact with an Archfey doesn't spark my imagination like a pact with a Devil or a Lovecraftian entity.
I'm sorry if I seemed harsh or dismissive; English is not my native language so sometimes I cannot express very well the nuances of my thoughts.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Vegan. Punk. Metal. Queer. Comics. Videogames.
Warlock enthusiast.
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
I think it’s a little letdown that the warlock gets subclasses at level 3, but I love the new subclass changes. Great old one was a favorite of mine, and I like the changes. I do dislike how they changed archfey. I liked the flavor of fey presence, and I feel like now the entire subclass is just misty step.
But.. but.. now I can play nightcrawler in a more exciting manner, and I match the fey summon's misty powers!
Do the subclasses matter when the base class was completely wrecked and is basically nothing but a boring, undertuned retread of the 2014 release with no meaningful changes, fixes, or updates?
Please do not contact or message me.
I hate it. I hate the fey changes, I hate the pacts being mediocre except for blade. I like the extra spells just being given, but I hate hey take out the best invocations to make them spells, and I hate that it doesn't address issues.
Of course it does, Yurei! There's always value in seeing the best in what you have. :)
As for Archfey, I really like how the features now synergise with one another like that. It really gives the subclass a lot of identity as a mobile dreamweaver. Very neat! And if you really miss the days of yore with Fae Presence, it sounds like an easy cludge to give Steps of the Fey a third option to charm everyone you land next to for a round, right? Call it "Welcoming Step", if you will! (Hey, WotC? Take note here, okay?)
Our Cthulhu devotees got themselves a proper horrorshow set-up with their weaponised telepathy. Just in time for all of us who have been playing Baldur's Gate 3, to boot! (Yes... Give me those tentacle-adjacent mind-powers...)
Archfey is a good subclass. At least on paper.
I like that the entire subclass is themed around misty step, and I'm surprised that they haven't done the same with the others (not with misty step, of course. But with another concept).
I really like what they have done with the Archfey, but I would have to try it to have a definitive opinion.
While I did think Fey Presence was neat, in practice I didn't get to do much with it except the occasional RP moment during a social encounter. It was definitely weak compared to the other Patrons.
Agreed, Irrelevant_guy! It would be nice to see a bit more of thematic ability interaction within more subclasses. Like, Fiend might let you discharge those ill-gotten temp-HP in a form of mini-Hellish Rebuke? Or Celestial could receive alternate uses of their Healing Light dice as they grow stronger. I very much enjoy classes and subclasses that introduce a base mechanic and then expands upon it throughout.
I’ve come to the realization over the last few UA’s that this was never going to be a new edition that we could have substantial changes or even a 5.5 with some broad yet less substantial changes than a new edition, but more a rules update with mostly some “quality of life” changes in the classes. A 5.1, if you will.
Edit: And on topic, I haven’t read through the warlock carefully, only skimmed, but I kind of like the changes to the subclasses. GOO needed some help as I always liked the theme but it wasn’t very good in the 2014 PHB
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
Ok. Honestly, the class can be interesting but it could be it's own new interplanar subclass rather than destroying the entirety of the class.
I feel fiend got unnecessarily nerfed. It was good but never super great. I heavily prefer this new misty step at level 3 feature and am ok with misty escape alteration. There are a lot of tricks that this can do. Provide support for allies trickster taunt and run, later bamf and invisible. Fey presence I have tried to build and make useful at best it has been useful 2 or 3 times a campaign. This is going to be useful 2 or 3 times a day. The 14 level feature is what I am disappointed with. It doubles down too much on misty step. Plunging someone into an illusory dreamlike world once per short rest felt like I was getting an extra spell and a solid one at that. It was low scoring because it was once per short rather than based on long, required concentration and because fear and charm are common immunities at higher levels. A change to a couple of these things on the ability would have improved it, but I like it more than the misty step as part of other casts.
The subclasses are nice (except why did they have to gut Hurl Through Hell?), but the base class has been maimed back to its 2014 disfunctional state.
It’s alright. Still think that the 3rd pact slot should be at 7th level and the 4th at 13th level. And warlock should have been a intelligence class.
I think some good minor improvement’s for each subclass is to give an extra language based on the subclass: Fiend gets Infernal or Abyssal, Archfey gets Sylivin?, Great-Old One gets Deep Speech, Celestial gets Celestial. And also change the damage type of your warlock spells like the GOO can: Fiend gets fire or poison, Celestial gets radiant, Archfey gets whatever damage type reflects the Fey.
Pact of Chain could use more options like a Gazer or a Death’s Head. And an invocation that increases the survivability and combat potential of the familiar. Like get temp hp equal to the warlocks level+charisma modifier and a bonus to the attack and damage rolls.
I wish it was int too, maybe just have int or charisma as options but ditch wisdom? Other than that it feels ok, I was interested in the last version I think with a few small changes it could have been great.
"Where words fail, swords prevail. Where blood is spilled, my cup is filled" -Cartaphilus
"I have found the answer to the meaning of life. You ask me what the answer is? You already know what the answer to life is. You fear it more than the strike of a viper, the ravages of disease, the ire of a lover. The answer is always death. But death is a gentle mistress with a sweet embrace, and you owe her a debt of restitution. Life is not a gift, it is a loan."
They are great. Tho I'd give Celestial Patron a pseudo smite where you can use your bonus action to spend some healing dice to deal extra radiant damage to a target you just hit with an attack roll.
I just don't want to discuss the warlock chassis here. The warlock in playtest 7 seems disappointing to me. But that doesn't mean that subclasses are fine. Especially the Archfey.
I think the subclasses were genuinely improved over the 2014 version. Having your patron spells always prepared is a huge boon in versatility for Warlocks, leaving you free to learn some utility rituals, taking advantage of the fact that now all classes can cast the ritual version of their prepared spells.
Hurl Through Hell was slightly nerfed in damage, but that is mitigated by giving the incapacitated condition to the target.
My dear Great Old One was rightfully buffed, and I especially like the flavor of your weaponized telepathy.
Celestial is solid.
Can't really speak about Archfey, I really can't stand the flavor of that one lol.
To sum it all, I'm really satisfied with the Warlock in this UA.
Vegan. Punk. Metal. Queer. Comics. Videogames.
Warlock enthusiast.
I mean subclass. I like old archfey. New archfey could have been a different archetype like the new barbarian, which is seems to be a copy of as the new barbarian basically misty steps with bonuses as well. They could have made it a world tree warlock, with The Guardian of The World Tree as it's patron or something.
I don't think, as someone put it, nightcrawler, when I think fey
It's one dimensional and only focuses on teleportation, which is arguably one of the traits least associated with the fey traditionally.
Its overreliance on misty step also forces some builds over others. I.e. blaster and blade.
There's nothing that bothers me, really. It's more that it's not my cup of tea: a pact with an Archfey doesn't spark my imagination like a pact with a Devil or a Lovecraftian entity.
I'm sorry if I seemed harsh or dismissive; English is not my native language so sometimes I cannot express very well the nuances of my thoughts.
Vegan. Punk. Metal. Queer. Comics. Videogames.
Warlock enthusiast.