Looks like it's time to homebrew a warlock fix. I'm thinking of just tacking on 1/3 caster spell slots (like Eldritch Knight and Arcane Trickster), and keeping the flexible casting stat.
I briefly tried to do just that. I was going to simply disable pact magic and enable spell casting with 1/3 progression to see how it looked, but the DDB tools do not appear to support that. I can create subclasses, but I don't see a way to do a base class.
Why not just add the 1/3 casting via the subclass, like AT/EK do?
I may go back and try that and see how it works. I'm not sure if I can actually /do/ that; I haven't played with the tools that much. I'm generally a bit adverse to homebrew as it feels like cheating, but it's something I would like to explore. I do feel like pact magic should be disabled or somehow ignored because both pact magic AND 1/3 casting I think would likely be pretty overpowered.
Except 1/3 casting on its own only reinforces the issue of Warlock having to spam EB or Blade in combat by locking them into few and weak spells and slots. At that point you might as well just main Arcane Trickster or Eldritch Knight and either just frame it as being the product of a pact or dip a level or two.
I still don't see a problem with Pact Magic + 1/3 casting, especially if they lose Magical Cunning. Like at worst, they could slow down Pact Slot progression so that it maxes out at 3 pact slots instead of 4 per Short Rest, and maybe knock off an invocation or two; I would gladly take 1/3 casting from the Warlock list in place of those minor tweaks, and it would solve so many problems related to utility/exploration and pact slot conservation.
I still don't see a problem with Pact Magic + 1/3 casting, especially if they lose Magical Cunning. Like at worst, they could slow down Pact Slot progression so that it maxes out at 3 pact slots instead of 4 per Short Rest, and maybe knock off an invocation or two; I would gladly take 1/3 casting from the Warlock list in place of those minor tweaks, and it would solve so many problems related to utility/exploration and pact slot conservation.
It’s a lot of casting especially if they are taking invocations to cast spells at will. I think the trick is figuring out the correct balance of Spellcasting levels per invocation taken to give those that want the additional spell casting spell slot a way to use invocations to gain it by giv g up those utility at wills. Remember they moved those at wills down to more appropriate levels, making them more useful. It should be choice. But none of this matters because we won’t know what we are getting until right before the book release. They might actually find a balance for Pact magic that is good, or scrap it for something else we have already seen. I doubt they do anything all new, but they could release a half caster with Mystic Arcanum as not part of invocations but it gets less invocations. I wouldn’t be happy, but some would rejoice. We really don’t know what will happen since they still have internal playtest as well.
I still don't see a problem with Pact Magic + 1/3 casting, especially if they lose Magical Cunning. Like at worst, they could slow down Pact Slot progression so that it maxes out at 3 pact slots instead of 4 per Short Rest, and maybe knock off an invocation or two; I would gladly take 1/3 casting from the Warlock list in place of those minor tweaks, and it would solve so many problems related to utility/exploration and pact slot conservation.
It’s a lot of casting especially if they are taking invocations to cast spells at will. I think the trick is figuring out the correct balance of Spellcasting levels per invocation taken to give those that want the additional spell casting spell slot a way to use invocations to gain it by giv g up those utility at wills. Remember they moved those at wills down to more appropriate levels, making them more useful. It should be choice. But none of this matters because we won’t know what we are getting until right before the book release. They might actually find a balance for Pact magic that is good, or scrap it for something else we have already seen. I doubt they do anything all new, but they could release a half caster with Mystic Arcanum as not part of invocations but it gets less invocations. I wouldn’t be happy, but some would rejoice. We really don’t know what will happen since they still have internal playtest as well.
See, I went in a different direction. At-will invocations that “level up”. Otherworldly Leap gives Jump at-will, levels up to Dimension Door once per day. Ascendant Step gives Levitate? Upgrades to Fly. Keeps the at-will and gives a new option or two. Warlocks are supposed to be weird so let’s get WEIRD.
Looks like it's time to homebrew a warlock fix. I'm thinking of just tacking on 1/3 caster spell slots (like Eldritch Knight and Arcane Trickster), and keeping the flexible casting stat.
I briefly tried to do just that. I was going to simply disable pact magic and enable spell casting with 1/3 progression to see how it looked, but the DDB tools do not appear to support that. I can create subclasses, but I don't see a way to do a base class.
Why not just add the 1/3 casting via the subclass, like AT/EK do?
I may go back and try that and see how it works. I'm not sure if I can actually /do/ that; I haven't played with the tools that much. I'm generally a bit adverse to homebrew as it feels like cheating, but it's something I would like to explore. I do feel like pact magic should be disabled or somehow ignored because both pact magic AND 1/3 casting I think would likely be pretty overpowered.
Except 1/3 casting on its own only reinforces the issue of Warlock having to spam EB or Blade in combat by locking them into few and weak spells and slots. At that point you might as well just main Arcane Trickster or Eldritch Knight and either just frame it as being the product of a pact or dip a level or two.
Pact magic does even worse if you don't get those short rests in.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Looks like it's time to homebrew a warlock fix. I'm thinking of just tacking on 1/3 caster spell slots (like Eldritch Knight and Arcane Trickster), and keeping the flexible casting stat.
I briefly tried to do just that. I was going to simply disable pact magic and enable spell casting with 1/3 progression to see how it looked, but the DDB tools do not appear to support that. I can create subclasses, but I don't see a way to do a base class.
Why not just add the 1/3 casting via the subclass, like AT/EK do?
I may go back and try that and see how it works. I'm not sure if I can actually /do/ that; I haven't played with the tools that much. I'm generally a bit adverse to homebrew as it feels like cheating, but it's something I would like to explore. I do feel like pact magic should be disabled or somehow ignored because both pact magic AND 1/3 casting I think would likely be pretty overpowered.
Except 1/3 casting on its own only reinforces the issue of Warlock having to spam EB or Blade in combat by locking them into few and weak spells and slots. At that point you might as well just main Arcane Trickster or Eldritch Knight and either just frame it as being the product of a pact or dip a level or two.
Pact magic does even worse if you don't get those short rests in.
Pact magic can impact quantity, but not quality. Your model means they don't get access to 3rd level spells before level 13, which is a bit late to the party if the class is supposed to be a dedicated caster, as opposed to someone who minored in magic.
Looks like it's time to homebrew a warlock fix. I'm thinking of just tacking on 1/3 caster spell slots (like Eldritch Knight and Arcane Trickster), and keeping the flexible casting stat.
I briefly tried to do just that. I was going to simply disable pact magic and enable spell casting with 1/3 progression to see how it looked, but the DDB tools do not appear to support that. I can create subclasses, but I don't see a way to do a base class.
Why not just add the 1/3 casting via the subclass, like AT/EK do?
I may go back and try that and see how it works. I'm not sure if I can actually /do/ that; I haven't played with the tools that much. I'm generally a bit adverse to homebrew as it feels like cheating, but it's something I would like to explore. I do feel like pact magic should be disabled or somehow ignored because both pact magic AND 1/3 casting I think would likely be pretty overpowered.
Except 1/3 casting on its own only reinforces the issue of Warlock having to spam EB or Blade in combat by locking them into few and weak spells and slots. At that point you might as well just main Arcane Trickster or Eldritch Knight and either just frame it as being the product of a pact or dip a level or two.
Pact magic does even worse if you don't get those short rests in.
Pact magic can impact quantity, but not quality. Your model means they don't get access to 3rd level spells before level 13, which is a bit late to the party if the class is supposed to be a dedicated caster, as opposed to someone who minored in magic.
The spell progression would have to be moved up to level 1 for it to work at all. No spell slots at all until level 3 would be a no-go. I'd probably have to reinstate the PT5 invocations for mystic arcanum as well. Like I said, I want to see what it all looks like when put together.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Confirmed today, the next packet will be out before year end and will contain Barb, Monk, and Druid. Looks like they're happy enough with Warlock and Sorcerer to not need to test them publicly.
Thanks for the info. That’s scary because the last Warlock was Blade focused and a far better two level dip than the 5e version. I’m fine Sorcerer isn’t coming back, but that doesn’t mean what we saw last is what we will get. Honestly I’m not going to assume anything I did or didn’t like will make the game. I remember UA samurai being the coolest fighter ever to me. I also remember UA Dragon Monk being an epic monk. When they released Samurai was okay and Dragon Monk was not good.
Meh, I suspect that was a large part of the feedback so i am not that worried. I suspect the answer they got was we like pact boons as invocations but they need some tuning.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
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Except 1/3 casting on its own only reinforces the issue of Warlock having to spam EB or Blade in combat by locking them into few and weak spells and slots. At that point you might as well just main Arcane Trickster or Eldritch Knight and either just frame it as being the product of a pact or dip a level or two.
I still don't see a problem with Pact Magic + 1/3 casting, especially if they lose Magical Cunning. Like at worst, they could slow down Pact Slot progression so that it maxes out at 3 pact slots instead of 4 per Short Rest, and maybe knock off an invocation or two; I would gladly take 1/3 casting from the Warlock list in place of those minor tweaks, and it would solve so many problems related to utility/exploration and pact slot conservation.
It’s a lot of casting especially if they are taking invocations to cast spells at will. I think the trick is figuring out the correct balance of Spellcasting levels per invocation taken to give those that want the additional spell casting spell slot a way to use invocations to gain it by giv g up those utility at wills. Remember they moved those at wills down to more appropriate levels, making them more useful. It should be choice. But none of this matters because we won’t know what we are getting until right before the book release. They might actually find a balance for Pact magic that is good, or scrap it for something else we have already seen. I doubt they do anything all new, but they could release a half caster with Mystic Arcanum as not part of invocations but it gets less invocations. I wouldn’t be happy, but some would rejoice. We really don’t know what will happen since they still have internal playtest as well.
See, I went in a different direction. At-will invocations that “level up”. Otherworldly Leap gives Jump at-will, levels up to Dimension Door once per day. Ascendant Step gives Levitate? Upgrades to Fly. Keeps the at-will and gives a new option or two. Warlocks are supposed to be weird so let’s get WEIRD.
Pact magic does even worse if you don't get those short rests in.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
Pact magic can impact quantity, but not quality. Your model means they don't get access to 3rd level spells before level 13, which is a bit late to the party if the class is supposed to be a dedicated caster, as opposed to someone who minored in magic.
The spell progression would have to be moved up to level 1 for it to work at all. No spell slots at all until level 3 would be a no-go. I'd probably have to reinstate the PT5 invocations for mystic arcanum as well. Like I said, I want to see what it all looks like when put together.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
Meh, I suspect that was a large part of the feedback so i am not that worried. I suspect the answer they got was we like pact boons as invocations but they need some tuning.