It still feels like a bad subclass which is awful because it is my favorite class thematically and I developed my favorite character of all time as an alchemist.
Experimental Elixir not only got nerfed, but it is still mostly unusable. The Transformation elixir was the best option available on the table and now that is gone. The ability to choose what you make in the place of that is just okay. If the elixirs leveled up with the alchemist, then it would be better because +1 AC drops off before it is even useful but raising that to a +5 AC at level 10 or something would be.
The rest of the subclass is okay. Not great not terrible. Getting a level 6 spell at level 15 is okay but I would consider it the best capstone feature either.
Any other suggestions?
EDIT: Leaving the above for reference, but updating my idea for how to handle Experimental Elixirs.
Experimental Elixir
Whenever you finish a long rest, while holding Alchemist Supplies, you can use that tool to magically produce two elixirs. These elixirs are spells you know distilled into potions. The elixir appears in a vial, and the vial vanishes when the elixir is drunk or poured out. If any elixir remains when you finish a Long Rest, the elixir and its vial vanish.
Drinking an Elixir. As an Action, a creature can drink the elixir or administer it to another creature within 5 feet of itself.
Throwing an Elixir. As an Action, a creature can throw the potion at another creature as a ranged touch attack administering the effects upon a successful hit.
Creating Additional Elixirs. As a Magic action while holding Alchemist’s Supplies, you can expend one spell slot to create another elixir. When you do so, you choose its effect from the Experimental Elixir table rather than rolling. When you reach certain Artificer levels, you can make an additional elixir at the end of each Long Rest: a total of three at level 5, four at level 9, and 5 at level 15.
+5 AC at level 10? For the whole party? That sounds excessive. +1 AC doesn't drop off. Ever. This isn't 3rd edition, we have bounded accuracy in 5th edition.
I think the only change that is needed is the flight potion. 10 feet is just too slow. I think 30 feet for 1 minute would be better. I think even 20 feet for 10 minutes would feel a lot less bad. But personally all the other potions just seem generically good. The healing one may be the one that scales the worst but a bonus action to use keeps all of them relevant.
I was attempting to build out an Alchemist, because I'm currently playing one in a campaign that will be updating to the 2024 rules. I found out something interesting.
So in the YouTube video, Jeremy Crawford makes a point to explain that they dropped out the Blight spell for Alchemists and added in Vitriolic Sphere. Now here's where things break down a little.
The Level 5 Alchemical Savant ability still lists a bonus to casting a spell that restores hit points or deals Acid, Fire, Necrotic, or Poison damage. Blight was the only spell Alchemists had that could deal Necrotic damage. I looked over the entire Artificer spell list, and all the potential magic item Plans that an Artificer could make, and nowhere can I find anything that deals Necrotic damage. So either 1) they just copy/pasted that ability without actually reviewing it, or 2) it has that in the list for the very specific purpose of multi-classing. I'm inclined to believe the former.
So, I've had a few ideas on how to improve this subclass. The UA is better than the original Tasha's, to be sure. And so, i suppose it fulfills the design team's stated goal of bringing the Artificer more in line power-wise (aka a "glow-up") with the other 2024 classes. However, this UA fails to confront the obviously bad design decision to make the main subclass feature RANDOM. Nobody really likes it. Many people like the IDEA of the Alchemist, but dislike- or are disappointed by- the mechanics of it.
EXPERIMENTAL ELIXIR should let the player CHOOSE which elixirs they make. The rest of the feature only needs a few minor changes. The number of elixirs and how they increase is good. The effects are good, except for Flight. Make it 30 feet for 1 minute. 10 feet is just... meh. Otherwise, I'd recommend that the 6th option be changed to something else useful. Maybe 10 minutes Darkvision, or the original Alter Self, or something. Expending a spell slot to create more elixirs is fine. And you'd still get to choose.
ALCHEMICAL SAVANT. This is fine. However, I'd recommend they make it explicit that this bonus stacks with any other. For example: Cure Wounds and Healing Word, which both qualify for this feature, already add your spellcasting modifier to their healing totals. It should be made clear that this adds your modifier a second time.
RESTORATIVE REAGENTS should be renamed something like "Improved Elixirs." Temporary HP is cheap in 2024- so many spells & class features now dish them out. And, since they do not stack, any feature that gives Temp HP is less valuable than it otherwise could be. So, instead, this feature should be improving your elixirs in a way other than temp hp. I could see this going one of 2 ways. First, the level 3 options could be improved upon to scale better into higher tiers of play. 4d8 healing. 20 foot movement bonus. +2 AC. 1d6 bonus to attacks & Saves. 1 hour of flight (or double the flight speed), and 1 hour darkvision (if we assume my earlier proposed idea). OR...(and this would be my preference) expand the list of possible elixirs. Invisibility for 10 minutes. Enlarge/Reduce for 1 minute. Choose a damage type to resist for 10 minutes. Haste for 1 minute. Blur for 1 minute. Disguise self for 1 hr. Another idea would be to add debuffs into the mix of options, and they could be thrown at enemies. This would bring in things like Blindness, a Web or Entangle effect, a Slow, a Stun, etc. These options could vary from the original spells in duration or area of effect to bring them in line, power-wise, since they wouldn't have concentration. I think this would make the Alchemist feel very unique.
CHEMICAL MASTERY is actually decent. I think that the Acid/Poison resistance should come online much earlier, like at level 5. But the added damage and the Tasha's Cauldron spell are both good features. I'd Luke the damage boost to match the damage type used, rather than be force damage, so it'd be more on theme. But it's not a big deal.
If they proposed some ideas like the ones I've proposed- or if they at least tried something else- I'd be more excited. But, from the look of it, they are going to keep the subclass' basic design and just boost it a little. And that's really too bad. They proved that they can really improve things with the Monk.
EXPERIMENTAL ELIXIR should let the player CHOOSE which elixirs they make. The rest of the feature only needs a few minor changes. The number of elixirs and how they increase is good. The effects are good, except for Flight. Make it 30 feet for 1 minute. 10 feet is just... meh.
Agree on the elixirs. It makes no sense this is random. I could live with 1 being chosen the rest random, but the Alchemist needs some control. And Agree on the Flight, 30' would be great, I could live with 15-20' , 10 is just pointless.
If the elixirs leveled up with the alchemist, then it would be better because +1 AC drops off before it is even useful but raising that to a +5 AC at level 10 or something would be.
+5 AC at level 10 for a party is waaay too high. Not sure you realize how good a +5 AC bump is... especially stacking on their current AC.
I've got a character with just a +1 Shield. The shield is a 3 AC bump for my character (wasn't using a shield before), going from 16 to 19. My character rarely gets hit as is. So Lets say my character is in a party with a level 10 alchemist. Your idea for this would mean my AC would be TWENTY FOUR (24) with that. That is way too high for basically an up all the time bonus.
I tend to disagree with the choosing of the elixir that are made for free each day pretty heavily. In the early levels you are going to see healing potions made a lot and past level 5 the only potions that are going to be made are the ones that add to attack and saving throw and any other potions will only be made when the situation calls for them with a first level slot. This is significantly less fun as a feature. In addition, with the way it is and getting to choose on a 6 and rolling 2 dice to pick the odds of a player getting at least 1 potion that would have been their choice is around 50% because you get that potion if you roll that potion or a 6 so 1/3 on 2 different dice making the chance around 50% that at least 1 elixir will be the one you would have chosen anyway.
If the elixirs leveled up with the alchemist, then it would be better because +1 AC drops off before it is even useful but raising that to a +5 AC at level 10 or something would be.
+5 AC at level 10 for a party is waaay too high. Not sure you realize how good a +5 AC bump is... especially stacking on their current AC.
I've got a character with just a +1 Shield. The shield is a 3 AC bump for my character (wasn't using a shield before), going from 16 to 19. My character rarely gets hit as is. So Lets say my character is in a party with a level 10 alchemist. Your idea for this would mean my AC would be TWENTY FOUR (24) with that. That is way too high for basically an up all the time bonus.
Maybe +1 per tier would be better, or +1 per 6 levels (or fraction thereof). Something that still scales, but not so quickly as to become a problem for the DM.
+5 AC at level 10? For the whole party? That sounds excessive. +1 AC doesn't drop off. Ever. This isn't 3rd edition, we have bounded accuracy in 5th edition.
Yeah, I realized that, but I also have a better idea for the experimental elixir feature.
I think the only change that is needed is the flight potion. 10 feet is just too slow. I think 30 feet for 1 minute would be better. I think even 20 feet for 10 minutes would feel a lot less bad. But personally all the other potions just seem generically good. The healing one may be the one that scales the worst but a bonus action to use keeps all of them relevant.
So, I've had a few ideas on how to improve this subclass. The UA is better than the original Tasha's, to be sure. And so, i suppose it fulfills the design team's stated goal of bringing the Artificer more in line power-wise (aka a "glow-up") with the other 2024 classes. However, this UA fails to confront the obviously bad design decision to make the main subclass feature RANDOM. Nobody really likes it. Many people like the IDEA of the Alchemist, but dislike- or are disappointed by- the mechanics of it.
EXPERIMENTAL ELIXIR should let the player CHOOSE which elixirs they make. The rest of the feature only needs a few minor changes. The number of elixirs and how they increase is good. The effects are good, except for Flight. Make it 30 feet for 1 minute. 10 feet is just... meh. Otherwise, I'd recommend that the 6th option be changed to something else useful. Maybe 10 minutes Darkvision, or the original Alter Self, or something. Expending a spell slot to create more elixirs is fine. And you'd still get to choose.
ALCHEMICAL SAVANT. This is fine. However, I'd recommend they make it explicit that this bonus stacks with any other. For example: Cure Wounds and Healing Word, which both qualify for this feature, already add your spellcasting modifier to their healing totals. It should be made clear that this adds your modifier a second time.
RESTORATIVE REAGENTS should be renamed something like "Improved Elixirs." Temporary HP is cheap in 2024- so many spells & class features now dish them out. And, since they do not stack, any feature that gives Temp HP is less valuable than it otherwise could be. So, instead, this feature should be improving your elixirs in a way other than temp hp. I could see this going one of 2 ways. First, the level 3 options could be improved upon to scale better into higher tiers of play. 4d8 healing. 20 foot movement bonus. +2 AC. 1d6 bonus to attacks & Saves. 1 hour of flight (or double the flight speed), and 1 hour darkvision (if we assume my earlier proposed idea). OR...(and this would be my preference) expand the list of possible elixirs. Invisibility for 10 minutes. Enlarge/Reduce for 1 minute. Choose a damage type to resist for 10 minutes. Haste for 1 minute. Blur for 1 minute. Disguise self for 1 hr. Another idea would be to add debuffs into the mix of options, and they could be thrown at enemies. This would bring in things like Blindness, a Web or Entangle effect, a Slow, a Stun, etc. These options could vary from the original spells in duration or area of effect to bring them in line, power-wise, since they wouldn't have concentration. I think this would make the Alchemist feel very unique.
CHEMICAL MASTERY is actually decent. I think that the Acid/Poison resistance should come online much earlier, like at level 5. But the added damage and the Tasha's Cauldron spell are both good features. I'd Luke the damage boost to match the damage type used, rather than be force damage, so it'd be more on theme. But it's not a big deal.
If they proposed some ideas like the ones I've proposed- or if they at least tried something else- I'd be more excited. But, from the look of it, they are going to keep the subclass' basic design and just boost it a little. And that's really too bad. They proved that they can really improve things with the Monk.
I loved everything in here, but I think I may have a better idea for Experimental Elixir.
EXPERIMENTAL ELIXIR should let the player CHOOSE which elixirs they make. The rest of the feature only needs a few minor changes. The number of elixirs and how they increase is good. The effects are good, except for Flight. Make it 30 feet for 1 minute. 10 feet is just... meh.
Agree on the elixirs. It makes no sense this is random. I could live with 1 being chosen the rest random, but the Alchemist needs some control. And Agree on the Flight, 30' would be great, I could live with 15-20' , 10 is just pointless.
If the elixirs leveled up with the alchemist, then it would be better because +1 AC drops off before it is even useful but raising that to a +5 AC at level 10 or something would be.
+5 AC at level 10 for a party is waaay too high. Not sure you realize how good a +5 AC bump is... especially stacking on their current AC.
I've got a character with just a +1 Shield. The shield is a 3 AC bump for my character (wasn't using a shield before), going from 16 to 19. My character rarely gets hit as is. So Lets say my character is in a party with a level 10 alchemist. Your idea for this would mean my AC would be TWENTY FOUR (24) with that. That is way too high for basically an up all the time bonus.
See above, I beefed it with that but maybe I have a better solution?
TL;DR - My proposal below would be to allow the Alchemist to make spells they can give to other members of the party instead of a random table.
Experimental Elixir
Whenever you finish a long rest, while holding Alchemist Supplies, you can use that tool to magically produce two elixirs. These elixirs are spells you know distilled into potions. The elixir appears in a vial, and the vial vanishes when the elixir is drunk or poured out. If any elixir remains when you finish a Long Rest, the elixir and its vial vanish.
Drinking an Elixir. As an Action, a creature can drink the elixir or administer it to another creature within 5 feet of itself.
Throwing an Elixir. As an Action, a creature can throw the potion at another creature as a ranged touch attack administering the effects upon a successful hit. (For attack or Debuff spells.)
Creating Additional Elixirs. As a Magic action while holding Alchemist’s Supplies, you can expend one spell slot to create another elixir. When you do so, you choose its effect from the Experimental Elixir table rather than rolling. When you reach certain Artificer levels, you can make an additional elixir at the end of each Long Rest: a total of three at level 5, four at level 9, and 5 at level 15.
Personally, I like that part of the alchemist that has some randomness when waking up (None of it is harmful, nor is it secret until the end so that you can't distribute it according to what happens, so at most they are wasted if you have bad luck.), but I really appreciate that an option helps you get what you need most at the moment according to what you planned to do that day.
I don't know if "Tool Proficiency", apart from what is offered, should also add proficiency in Medicine (Arcane in gunner and an extra tool in the other two.) which is somewhat related to the direction of the subclass.
I would prefer that at level 9 those elixirs are improved as a group advances to your experiments, instead of a tasteless and generic improvement, yes, now that improvement is greater but it is not what we need, perhaps something like the following (It was done lightly but it gives an idea.):
1----> Healing: The drinker regains a number of Hit Points equal to 2dX plus your Intelligence modifier. ----> The drinker regains a number of Hit Points equal to 4dX plus your Intelligence modifier.
2----> Swiftness: The alls drinker’s Speeds increases by 10 feet for 1 hour. ----> The alls drinker’s Speeds increases by 10 feet for 8 hours.
3----> Resilience: The drinker gains a +1 bonus to AC for 10 minutes. ----> The drinker gains a +2 bonus to AC for 10 minutes.
4----> Boldness: The drinker can roll 1d4 and add the number rolled to every attack roll and saving throw they make for the next minute. ----> The drinker add +4 to every attack roll and saving throw they make for the next minute.
5----> Flight: The drinker gains a Fly Speed of 20 feet for 10 minutes. ----> The drinker gains a Fly Speed of 20 feet for 1 hour.
6----> You determine the elixir’s effect by choosing one of the other rows in this table. ---->You can choose the effects of two of the other options on this table, they must be different. (Only available when rolling the dice.)
I suppose they could excuse themselves with the lack of spells that cause necrotic damage by justifying themselves with one provided by the species, feats or items. But even so, that would be an excuse; the alchemist at least needs one spell that causes necrotic damage, and if it is only one, preferably one of a higher level than what they could get from species or feats.
With Chemical Mastery, I am very satisfied, although I agree with Poggledop that the resistances could have been moved earlier.
Personally, I like that part of the alchemist that has some randomness when waking up (None of it is harmful, nor is it secret until the end so that you can't distribute it according to what happens, so at most they are wasted if you have bad luck.), but I really appreciate that an option helps you get what you need most at the moment according to what you planned to do that day.
I don't know if "Tool Proficiency", apart from what is offered, should also add proficiency in Medicine (Arcane in gunner and an extra tool in the other two.) which is somewhat related to the direction of the subclass.
I would prefer that at level 9 those elixirs are improved as a group advances to your experiments, instead of a tasteless and generic improvement, yes, now that improvement is greater but it is not what we need, perhaps something like the following (It was done lightly but it gives an idea.):
1----> Healing: The drinker regains a number of Hit Points equal to 2dX plus your Intelligence modifier. ----> The drinker regains a number of Hit Points equal to 4dX plus your Intelligence modifier.
2----> Swiftness: The alls drinker’s Speeds increases by 10 feet for 1 hour. ----> The alls drinker’s Speeds increases by 10 feet for 8 hours.
3----> Resilience: The drinker gains a +1 bonus to AC for 10 minutes. ----> The drinker gains a +2 bonus to AC for 10 minutes.
4----> Boldness: The drinker can roll 1d4 and add the number rolled to every attack roll and saving throw they make for the next minute. ----> The drinker add +4 to every attack roll and saving throw they make for the next minute.
5----> Flight: The drinker gains a Fly Speed of 20 feet for 10 minutes. ----> The drinker gains a Fly Speed of 20 feet for 1 hour.
6----> You determine the elixir’s effect by choosing one of the other rows in this table. ---->You can choose the effects of two of the other options on this table, they must be different. (Only available when rolling the dice.)
I suppose they could excuse themselves with the lack of spells that cause necrotic damage by justifying themselves with one provided by the species, feats or items. But even so, that would be an excuse; the alchemist at least needs one spell that causes necrotic damage, and if it is only one, preferably one of a higher level than what they could get from species or feats.
With Chemical Mastery, I am very satisfied, although I agree with Poggledop that the resistances could have been moved earlier.
I dig it but what if the increase was just the proficiency bonus to make it simple? So 2d# + Int Mod + Prof Mod? That may still be washed out and I still like the idea of just giving people Spells to use from my spell list.
You get X amount of experimentelle Pointe each day where X Equals your proficiency. Then you can spend either 1 point to make a random potion , 2 points to make a specific potion or 3 points for an improved specific potion (eg potion with one chosen effect and one random)
You get X amount of experimentelle Pointe each day where X Equals your proficiency. Then you can spend either 1 point to make a random potion , 2 points to make a specific potion or 3 points for an improved specific potion (eg potion with one chosen effect and one random)
Best idea yet. It mechanically represents working harder on something while keeping some of the chaotic 'I just used what I had and slapped this together.' vibe.
Would you be happy if Wizards and Clerics had to roll to see what their spells were going to be every morning, or if the Martials had to roll daily to see what their weapon masteries are? The randomness would be tolerable if this was supposed to be a ribbon, but this is the Alchemist's Signature class feature. Having to roll every day to see if your basic powers work is not an okay setup.
I might feel differently if there were some genuinely exciting options on the table.
Would you be happy if Wizards and Clerics had to roll to see what their spells were going to be every morning, or if the Martials had to roll daily to see what their weapon masteries are? The randomness would be tolerable if this was supposed to be a ribbon, but this is the Alchemist's Signature class feature. Having to roll every day to see if your basic powers work is not an okay setup.
I might feel differently if there were some genuinely exciting options on the table.
Would you be happy if Wizards and Clerics had to roll to see what their spells were going to be every morning, or if the Martials had to roll daily to see what their weapon masteries are? The randomness would be tolerable if this was supposed to be a ribbon, but this is the Alchemist's Signature class feature. Having to roll every day to see if your basic powers work is not an okay setup.
I might feel differently if there were some genuinely exciting options on the table.
Your comparison is completely wrong and inconsistent, you are comparing a SUB-class with classes, that is completely absurd (Since it does not harm you in what you obtained as an ARTIFICER, there is no way to accept comparing them as you mentioned.). If it is equal you should compare them with other SUB-classes, and in that line there are examples of SUB-classes with a certain randomness, and unlike the sorcerer there are NO potentially harmful options.
I love that the ALCHEMIST has the randomness of the UA elixirs, which is more predictable than the original version due to the 6th option, but not how it continues, improving at level 9, all options equally, without leaving a feeling of how experimental it is and a certain advance of this due to the experience gained thanks to doing it every day by not leaving an improvement more in line with certain options.
Barbarian Path of the Wild Heart having to roll randomly to see which animal totem feature they get when they rage. Wanted Bear? Ooh, sorry. You rolled Eagle.
Cleric subclasses, all. Want to use your Channel Divinity subclass feature? Flip a coin. Oops. Looks like you have to use it to Turn Undead this time. Sorry.
Druid subclasses, all. Wildshape for subclass feature? Nope. Roll randomly, and you MIGHT get it. OR... you might have to change into a squirrel. Sorry... that's just what the dice picked for you.
Fighter, Battle Master. Roll randomly to see which maneuver you get to use. Fighter Psi Warrior: roll randomly to determine which of your psi powers you get to use. Eldritch Knight: roll randomly to see which spells you get to prepare.
Monk subclasses, all. Roll each turn to see how you'll be spending your Focus Points.
Rogue, Arcane Trickster: roll to see which spells you prepare. SoulKnife: roll to see how you'll get to use your Psionic Energy Dice.
Sorcerer, Draconic. Roll to see which color dragon you'll get. Sorcerer, Wild Magic: Huh. Well. Finally, a subclass that SHOULD have random rolls. But Wild Sorcerers have a much improved, very good list of random things that could happen. And people play them FOR the randomness. It's right in the name.
Maybe there are more examples of how to make other Sub Class features bad by taking away agency from the player. I don't know. But the point is: I don't want to play a subclass that takes away my agency, my choice. To me, that feels like a totally different game. Do you run? Fight? Talk? Go left? Right? Just roll the dice and do what they say? Nah. No thanks. I'd like to play a game where I get to decide what my character does. The dice in this game are supposed to determine success or failure.
If you are able to select the potion than it only makes sense to have 2 options. The only potions anyone would make at the start of the day are the pseudo bless and the healing potion. All the rest aren't as impactful even though they are all still universally good except the flight potion. Ask yourself if you do roll is there any roll that you are actually unhappy to see? If not then it shouldn't matter if it is random because it is giving you something good regardless unlike all of the examples you were trying to give which seem to suggest you don't know what action you are taking before you roll. These potions are a bonus action, not a full action and you can even give them to other people. What you do and when you do it is not random at all. Do you complain when the DM didn't let you pick out the loot that you got from the monster? The magic items and potions you get from monsters aren't set and yet people have no problem adapting their daily resources to what they get there I don't see why anyone should have a problem adopting this one. The artificer still gets to choose their magic items they will have and the spells they prepare. Getting 2 potions as well as the number 6 option also means the odds of getting your number 1 preferred potion each day is also pretty high. And of course 1 first level slot can get you any of them that you want and each of them is well worth a first level slot.
It still feels like a bad subclass which is awful because it is my favorite class thematically and I developed my favorite character of all time as an alchemist.
Experimental Elixir not only got nerfed, but it is still mostly unusable. The Transformation elixir was the best option available on the table and now that is gone. The ability to choose what you make in the place of that is just okay. If the elixirs leveled up with the alchemist, then it would be better because +1 AC drops off before it is even useful but raising that to a +5 AC at level 10 or something would be.
The rest of the subclass is okay. Not great not terrible. Getting a level 6 spell at level 15 is okay but I would consider it the best capstone feature either.
Any other suggestions?
EDIT: Leaving the above for reference, but updating my idea for how to handle Experimental Elixirs.
Experimental Elixir
Whenever you finish a long rest, while holding Alchemist Supplies, you can use that tool to magically produce two elixirs. These elixirs are spells you know distilled into potions. The elixir appears in a vial, and the vial vanishes when the elixir is drunk or poured out. If any elixir remains when you finish a Long Rest, the elixir and its vial vanish.
Drinking an Elixir. As an Action, a creature can drink the elixir or administer it to another creature within 5 feet of itself.
Throwing an Elixir. As an Action, a creature can throw the potion at another creature as a ranged touch attack administering the effects upon a successful hit.
Creating Additional Elixirs. As a Magic action while holding Alchemist’s Supplies, you can expend one spell slot to create another elixir. When you do so, you choose its effect from the Experimental Elixir table rather than rolling. When you reach certain Artificer levels, you can make an additional elixir at the end of each Long Rest: a total of three at level 5, four at level 9, and 5 at level 15.
"Life is Cast by Random Dice"
Burn my candle twice.
I have done my life justice
Against random dice.
+5 AC at level 10? For the whole party? That sounds excessive. +1 AC doesn't drop off. Ever. This isn't 3rd edition, we have bounded accuracy in 5th edition.
I think the only change that is needed is the flight potion. 10 feet is just too slow. I think 30 feet for 1 minute would be better. I think even 20 feet for 10 minutes would feel a lot less bad. But personally all the other potions just seem generically good. The healing one may be the one that scales the worst but a bonus action to use keeps all of them relevant.
I was attempting to build out an Alchemist, because I'm currently playing one in a campaign that will be updating to the 2024 rules. I found out something interesting.
So in the YouTube video, Jeremy Crawford makes a point to explain that they dropped out the Blight spell for Alchemists and added in Vitriolic Sphere. Now here's where things break down a little.
The Level 5 Alchemical Savant ability still lists a bonus to casting a spell that restores hit points or deals Acid, Fire, Necrotic, or Poison damage. Blight was the only spell Alchemists had that could deal Necrotic damage. I looked over the entire Artificer spell list, and all the potential magic item Plans that an Artificer could make, and nowhere can I find anything that deals Necrotic damage. So either 1) they just copy/pasted that ability without actually reviewing it, or 2) it has that in the list for the very specific purpose of multi-classing. I'm inclined to believe the former.
Spell empowered weapon and armor gives access to any first level spell at level 6 and any 3rd level spell and lower at level 14 for artificers.
So, I've had a few ideas on how to improve this subclass. The UA is better than the original Tasha's, to be sure. And so, i suppose it fulfills the design team's stated goal of bringing the Artificer more in line power-wise (aka a "glow-up") with the other 2024 classes. However, this UA fails to confront the obviously bad design decision to make the main subclass feature RANDOM. Nobody really likes it. Many people like the IDEA of the Alchemist, but dislike- or are disappointed by- the mechanics of it.
EXPERIMENTAL ELIXIR should let the player CHOOSE which elixirs they make. The rest of the feature only needs a few minor changes. The number of elixirs and how they increase is good. The effects are good, except for Flight. Make it 30 feet for 1 minute. 10 feet is just... meh. Otherwise, I'd recommend that the 6th option be changed to something else useful. Maybe 10 minutes Darkvision, or the original Alter Self, or something. Expending a spell slot to create more elixirs is fine. And you'd still get to choose.
ALCHEMICAL SAVANT. This is fine. However, I'd recommend they make it explicit that this bonus stacks with any other. For example: Cure Wounds and Healing Word, which both qualify for this feature, already add your spellcasting modifier to their healing totals. It should be made clear that this adds your modifier a second time.
RESTORATIVE REAGENTS should be renamed something like "Improved Elixirs." Temporary HP is cheap in 2024- so many spells & class features now dish them out. And, since they do not stack, any feature that gives Temp HP is less valuable than it otherwise could be. So, instead, this feature should be improving your elixirs in a way other than temp hp. I could see this going one of 2 ways. First, the level 3 options could be improved upon to scale better into higher tiers of play. 4d8 healing. 20 foot movement bonus. +2 AC. 1d6 bonus to attacks & Saves. 1 hour of flight (or double the flight speed), and 1 hour darkvision (if we assume my earlier proposed idea). OR...(and this would be my preference) expand the list of possible elixirs. Invisibility for 10 minutes. Enlarge/Reduce for 1 minute. Choose a damage type to resist for 10 minutes. Haste for 1 minute. Blur for 1 minute. Disguise self for 1 hr. Another idea would be to add debuffs into the mix of options, and they could be thrown at enemies. This would bring in things like Blindness, a Web or Entangle effect, a Slow, a Stun, etc. These options could vary from the original spells in duration or area of effect to bring them in line, power-wise, since they wouldn't have concentration. I think this would make the Alchemist feel very unique.
CHEMICAL MASTERY is actually decent. I think that the Acid/Poison resistance should come online much earlier, like at level 5. But the added damage and the Tasha's Cauldron spell are both good features. I'd Luke the damage boost to match the damage type used, rather than be force damage, so it'd be more on theme. But it's not a big deal.
If they proposed some ideas like the ones I've proposed- or if they at least tried something else- I'd be more excited. But, from the look of it, they are going to keep the subclass' basic design and just boost it a little. And that's really too bad. They proved that they can really improve things with the Monk.
Agree on the elixirs. It makes no sense this is random. I could live with 1 being chosen the rest random, but the Alchemist needs some control.
And Agree on the Flight, 30' would be great, I could live with 15-20' , 10 is just pointless.
+5 AC at level 10 for a party is waaay too high. Not sure you realize how good a +5 AC bump is... especially stacking on their current AC.
I've got a character with just a +1 Shield. The shield is a 3 AC bump for my character (wasn't using a shield before), going from 16 to 19. My character rarely gets hit as is. So Lets say my character is in a party with a level 10 alchemist. Your idea for this would mean my AC would be TWENTY FOUR (24) with that. That is way too high for basically an up all the time bonus.
I tend to disagree with the choosing of the elixir that are made for free each day pretty heavily. In the early levels you are going to see healing potions made a lot and past level 5 the only potions that are going to be made are the ones that add to attack and saving throw and any other potions will only be made when the situation calls for them with a first level slot. This is significantly less fun as a feature. In addition, with the way it is and getting to choose on a 6 and rolling 2 dice to pick the odds of a player getting at least 1 potion that would have been their choice is around 50% because you get that potion if you roll that potion or a 6 so 1/3 on 2 different dice making the chance around 50% that at least 1 elixir will be the one you would have chosen anyway.
Maybe +1 per tier would be better, or +1 per 6 levels (or fraction thereof). Something that still scales, but not so quickly as to become a problem for the DM.
Yeah, I realized that, but I also have a better idea for the experimental elixir feature.
I agree it should be at least 30ft.
I loved everything in here, but I think I may have a better idea for Experimental Elixir.
See above, I beefed it with that but maybe I have a better solution?
TL;DR - My proposal below would be to allow the Alchemist to make spells they can give to other members of the party instead of a random table.
Experimental Elixir
Whenever you finish a long rest, while holding Alchemist Supplies, you can use that tool to magically produce two elixirs. These elixirs are spells you know distilled into potions. The elixir appears in a vial, and the vial vanishes when the elixir is drunk or poured out. If any elixir remains when you finish a Long Rest, the elixir and its vial vanish.
Drinking an Elixir. As an Action, a creature can drink the elixir or administer it to another creature within 5 feet of itself.
Throwing an Elixir. As an Action, a creature can throw the potion at another creature as a ranged touch attack administering the effects upon a successful hit. (For attack or Debuff spells.)
Creating Additional Elixirs. As a Magic action while holding Alchemist’s Supplies, you can expend one spell slot to create another elixir. When you do so, you choose its effect from the Experimental Elixir table rather than rolling. When you reach certain Artificer levels, you can make an additional elixir at the end of each Long Rest: a total of three at level 5, four at level 9, and 5 at level 15.
"Life is Cast by Random Dice"
Burn my candle twice.
I have done my life justice
Against random dice.
Personally, I like that part of the alchemist that has some randomness when waking up (None of it is harmful, nor is it secret until the end so that you can't distribute it according to what happens, so at most they are wasted if you have bad luck.), but I really appreciate that an option helps you get what you need most at the moment according to what you planned to do that day.
I don't know if "Tool Proficiency", apart from what is offered, should also add proficiency in Medicine (Arcane in gunner and an extra tool in the other two.) which is somewhat related to the direction of the subclass.
I would prefer that at level 9 those elixirs are improved as a group advances to your experiments, instead of a tasteless and generic improvement, yes, now that improvement is greater but it is not what we need, perhaps something like the following (It was done lightly but it gives an idea.):
I suppose they could excuse themselves with the lack of spells that cause necrotic damage by justifying themselves with one provided by the species, feats or items. But even so, that would be an excuse; the alchemist at least needs one spell that causes necrotic damage, and if it is only one, preferably one of a higher level than what they could get from species or feats.
With Chemical Mastery, I am very satisfied, although I agree with Poggledop that the resistances could have been moved earlier.
I dig it but what if the increase was just the proficiency bonus to make it simple? So 2d# + Int Mod + Prof Mod? That may still be washed out and I still like the idea of just giving people Spells to use from my spell list.
"Life is Cast by Random Dice"
Burn my candle twice.
I have done my life justice
Against random dice.
Alchemist:
You get X amount of experimentelle Pointe each day where X Equals your proficiency. Then you can spend either 1 point to make a random potion , 2 points to make a specific potion or 3 points for an improved specific potion (eg potion with one chosen effect and one random)
Attack: [roll]3d20dl2+6[/roll] Damage: [roll](if([roll:-1:critical], =0, 1d8, 2{1d8}.expand()))+4[/roll] Sneakattack: [roll](if([roll:-2:critical], =0, 2d6, 2{2d6}.expand()))[/roll]Best idea yet. It mechanically represents working harder on something while keeping some of the chaotic 'I just used what I had and slapped this together.' vibe.
"Life is Cast by Random Dice"
Burn my candle twice.
I have done my life justice
Against random dice.
Would you be happy if Wizards and Clerics had to roll to see what their spells were going to be every morning, or if the Martials had to roll daily to see what their weapon masteries are? The randomness would be tolerable if this was supposed to be a ribbon, but this is the Alchemist's Signature class feature. Having to roll every day to see if your basic powers work is not an okay setup.
I might feel differently if there were some genuinely exciting options on the table.
I love you for putting it so clearly. Yes!!!!!
"Life is Cast by Random Dice"
Burn my candle twice.
I have done my life justice
Against random dice.
Your comparison is completely wrong and inconsistent, you are comparing a SUB-class with classes, that is completely absurd (Since it does not harm you in what you obtained as an ARTIFICER, there is no way to accept comparing them as you mentioned.). If it is equal you should compare them with other SUB-classes, and in that line there are examples of SUB-classes with a certain randomness, and unlike the sorcerer there are NO potentially harmful options.
I love that the ALCHEMIST has the randomness of the UA elixirs, which is more predictable than the original version due to the 6th option, but not how it continues, improving at level 9, all options equally, without leaving a feeling of how experimental it is and a certain advance of this due to the experience gained thanks to doing it every day by not leaving an improvement more in line with certain options.
Barbarian Path of the Wild Heart having to roll randomly to see which animal totem feature they get when they rage. Wanted Bear? Ooh, sorry. You rolled Eagle.
Cleric subclasses, all. Want to use your Channel Divinity subclass feature? Flip a coin. Oops. Looks like you have to use it to Turn Undead this time. Sorry.
Druid subclasses, all. Wildshape for subclass feature? Nope. Roll randomly, and you MIGHT get it. OR... you might have to change into a squirrel. Sorry... that's just what the dice picked for you.
Fighter, Battle Master. Roll randomly to see which maneuver you get to use. Fighter Psi Warrior: roll randomly to determine which of your psi powers you get to use. Eldritch Knight: roll randomly to see which spells you get to prepare.
Monk subclasses, all. Roll each turn to see how you'll be spending your Focus Points.
Rogue, Arcane Trickster: roll to see which spells you prepare. SoulKnife: roll to see how you'll get to use your Psionic Energy Dice.
Sorcerer, Draconic. Roll to see which color dragon you'll get. Sorcerer, Wild Magic: Huh. Well. Finally, a subclass that SHOULD have random rolls. But Wild Sorcerers have a much improved, very good list of random things that could happen. And people play them FOR the randomness. It's right in the name.
Maybe there are more examples of how to make other Sub Class features bad by taking away agency from the player. I don't know. But the point is: I don't want to play a subclass that takes away my agency, my choice. To me, that feels like a totally different game. Do you run? Fight? Talk? Go left? Right? Just roll the dice and do what they say? Nah. No thanks. I'd like to play a game where I get to decide what my character does. The dice in this game are supposed to determine success or failure.
If you are able to select the potion than it only makes sense to have 2 options. The only potions anyone would make at the start of the day are the pseudo bless and the healing potion. All the rest aren't as impactful even though they are all still universally good except the flight potion. Ask yourself if you do roll is there any roll that you are actually unhappy to see? If not then it shouldn't matter if it is random because it is giving you something good regardless unlike all of the examples you were trying to give which seem to suggest you don't know what action you are taking before you roll. These potions are a bonus action, not a full action and you can even give them to other people. What you do and when you do it is not random at all. Do you complain when the DM didn't let you pick out the loot that you got from the monster? The magic items and potions you get from monsters aren't set and yet people have no problem adapting their daily resources to what they get there I don't see why anyone should have a problem adopting this one. The artificer still gets to choose their magic items they will have and the spells they prepare. Getting 2 potions as well as the number 6 option also means the odds of getting your number 1 preferred potion each day is also pretty high. And of course 1 first level slot can get you any of them that you want and each of them is well worth a first level slot.