This is not correct. You can only select an infusion once with the explicit exception of the Replicate Magic Item infusion (choosing a different magic item each time). For it to work the way you suggest you'd have to apply the Many-Handed Pouch infusion to multiple items, which goes against the rule that says that you can't.
As such, the 2-5 pouches represent the sum of a single infusion. Think of the actual Many-Handed Pouch infusion being the interdimensional space that the 2-5 pouches are connected to, thus a single item.
I can see the Many-Handed Pouch having a minimum of 2 pouched, but why a maximum of 5? Five is also the maximum number of infusions a player can have. So why is 5 the maximum number? I can see the argument that 2 pouches would be a single infusion, but more then 2 pouches would require additional infusions.
I think you are reading waytoo much into the coincidence of the number of pouches the Many-Handed Pouch Infusion can be bound to. The rules are rather clear:
You can only select an infusion once.
The only exception being the Replicate Magic Item infusion, choosing a different magic item each time.
You can only apply an infusion to one item.
Your interpretation would require the breaking of one or both of those rules. You'd either need to select the Many-Handed Pouch infusion 2 to 5 times to infuse it to 2 to 5 pouches or you would need to use the Many-Handed Pouch infusion to apply it to each pouch separately. Additionally, look at the wording on the Prerequisites and the Item for the Many-Handed Pouch.
Notice that they explicitly used the singular form of the word "Item" when describing the 2 - 5 pouches. That is because the pouches as a group represent one item. Think of it like a bag of M&Ms, granted there are multiple M&Ms within that bag, but the Bag of M&Ms is one item. This infusion is a set of pouches.
Additionally, your interpretation would make this infusion widely unusable.
I think your last point is the most important one. As a single infusion, this is mid-range(good, but doesn't really contribute to power level much). If it were to use up all your infusion slots, it becomes so terrible as to become unusable in any situation other than a specific mission such as a diamond heist.
Excited for Robo dog, bit annoyed that the stats of the Alchemical Homunculus dont increase with proficiency automatically like that beast master ranger does. Going to be annoying to keep track of the dogs stats.
Homunculus has Might of the Master as well:
Might of the Master. The following numbers increase by 1 when your proficiency bonus increases by 1: the homunculus’ skill bonuses and the bonuses to hit and damage of its Acidic Spittle.
Excited for Robo dog, bit annoyed that the stats of the Alchemical Homunculus dont increase with proficiency automatically like that beast master ranger does. Going to be annoying to keep track of the dogs stats.
Homunculus has Might of the Master as well:
Might of the Master. The following numbers increase by 1 when your proficiency bonus increases by 1: the homunculus’ skill bonuses and the bonuses to hit and damage of its Acidic Spittle.
Excited for Robo dog, bit annoyed that the stats of the Alchemical Homunculus dont increase with proficiency automatically like that beast master ranger does. Going to be annoying to keep track of the dogs stats.
Homunculus has Might of the Master as well:
Might of the Master. The following numbers increase by 1 when your proficiency bonus increases by 1: the homunculus’ skill bonuses and the bonuses to hit and damage of its Acidic Spittle.
Gotta flip the page over. 😋
Sorry, what page? I know they both have might of the master but it would be nice if that process was automatic in the creatures tab.
Excited for Robo dog, bit annoyed that the stats of the Alchemical Homunculus dont increase with proficiency automatically like that beast master ranger does. Going to be annoying to keep track of the dogs stats.
Homunculus has Might of the Master as well:
Might of the Master. The following numbers increase by 1 when your proficiency bonus increases by 1: the homunculus’ skill bonuses and the bonuses to hit and damage of its Acidic Spittle.
Gotta flip the page over. 😋
Sorry, what page? I know they both have might of the master but it would be nice if that process was automatic in the creatures tab.
Page 7 of the UA:A3 document, first column 3/4 way down in the homunculus stat block above Actions (Requires Your Bonus Action).
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Hjalmar Gunderson, Vuman Alchemist Plague Doctor in a HB Campaign, Post Netherese Invasion Cormyr (lvl20 retired) Godfrey, Autognome Butler in Ghosts of Saltmarsh into Spelljammer Grímr Skeggisson, Goliath Rune Knight in Rime of the Frostmaiden DM of two HB campaigns set in the same world.
if we multi class into an alternate caster class would right cantrip for the right job allow you to change the lets say warlocks cantrips as well?
Nope, unfortunately its states artificer spells only.
"Whenever you finish a short or long rest, you can replace one of the artificer cantrips you know with another cantrip from the artificer spell list." Page 6 of UA:A3.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Hjalmar Gunderson, Vuman Alchemist Plague Doctor in a HB Campaign, Post Netherese Invasion Cormyr (lvl20 retired) Godfrey, Autognome Butler in Ghosts of Saltmarsh into Spelljammer Grímr Skeggisson, Goliath Rune Knight in Rime of the Frostmaiden DM of two HB campaigns set in the same world.
I don’t view them as using spells, it’s a mechanical convenience only, which I have no problem with as a whole.
I do agree using the existing spell system does fall short in fully realising the Artificer fantasy however, namely in that you can’t exactly hand out spells for others to use, and they are very impermanent.
For the replicate magic item infusion, my DM has allowed me to freely change infusions around amongst the first tier list to help provide that greater flexibility I wanted. It takes an hour and the catch is the existing item is entirely destroyed in the process. I didn’t ask for this but he also increased my total known infusions (artificer level/2 rounded up).
This little nudge means at level 5 I have 1 ‘permanent’ infusion for myself and 1 to hand out, and a bag of flexible tricks, that mostly provide utility, provided I have an hour and the raw materials.
I do also agree that if they had a lesser but more general purpose crafting feature akin to the subclasses, this would make sense. However, frankly you need a DM to come to the table for crafting period, otherwise this amounts to a ribbon ability.
In the end I have no issue with the Artificer wielding magic. But to give them spellcasting abilities that even wizards (who have study the arcane arts practically their whole lives) don't have (Right Cantrip for the Job), is just wrong.
I could definitely see Wizards as too focused on the High level Magic, constantly striving for Wish, Instant Fortress or Element Bending World Shaping Spells and simply forgetting about Cantrips.
Even mechanically which Wizard cares about Cantrips by level 10? By level 10 a wizard has 15 spells before he has to rely on Cantrips and refreshes 5 levels worth of spell slots on a short rest. While a Artificer only has 7 with no short rest refresh, and on a delayed timeline given he is a half caster. It just makes sense lore wise for them to put more effort into mastering the lower levels ie Cantrips.
Not to mention tome locks are already greater masters of Cantrips than Wizards. So a flexible but restricted version of Right Cantrip for the Job absolutely makes sense even for a non Ebberon Artificer. Crafting many little tricks without being able to go all out Sunbeam and Chain Lightning on enemies.
In the end I have no issue with the Artificer wielding magic. But to give them spellcasting abilities that even wizards (who have study the arcane arts practically their whole lives) don't have (Right Cantrip for the Job), is just wrong.
I could definitely see Wizards as too focused on the High level Magic, constantly striving for Wish, Instant Fortress or Element Bending World Shaping Spells and simply forgetting about Cantrips.
Even mechanically which Wizard cares about Cantrips by level 10? By level 10 a wizard has 15 spells before he has to rely on Cantrips and refreshes 5 levels worth of spell slots on a short rest. While a Artificer only has 7 with no short rest refresh, and on a delayed timeline given he is a half caster. It just makes sense lore wise for them to put more effort into mastering the lower levels ie Cantrips.
Not to mention tome locks are already greater masters of Cantrips than Wizards. So a flexible but restricted version of Right Cantrip for the Job absolutely makes sense even for a non Ebberon Artificer. Crafting many little tricks without being able to go all out Sunbeam and Chain Lightning on enemies.
Yes, Wizards have access to high level spells and they are striving to advance their knowledge in the arcane arts and to rediscover long lost magic and spell or inventing new magic and spells. But when it comes to the simplest spells (i.e. cantrips), they have to carefully choose which cantrip will be the most useful to them, just like all the other caster classes that have access to cantrips.
If the powers that be at WotC D&D are giving Artificers the ability to switch out their cantrips (after a short or long rest), then they should require the Artificer to have an actual mechanical device that when they activate it, it simulates the effect of the spell. Not require them to use their Artisan's tools, thieves' tools or an infused item to cast the spell. Even for their 1st - 5th level spells. Also not forcing the player to have an imagination and describe how they cast cast Faerie Fire with their thieves' tools.
The human Artificer wants to cast the See Invisibility spell. So instead of actually casting the spell, they attach a device onto their goggles and focus it until it simulates the effects of the spell. Or they use the same device and adjust it until they can see in darkness, as the device simulates the effects of the Darkvision spell.
I do also agree that if they had a lesser but more general purpose crafting feature akin to the subclasses, this would make sense. However, frankly you need a DM to come to the table for crafting period, otherwise this amounts to a ribbon ability.
The DMG (pg. 129) gives a brief explanation on the time period needed to craft item depending on it's rarity level. XGtE (pg. 129) goes more indepth about crafting magic items.
In the end I have no issue with the Artificer wielding magic. But to give them spellcasting abilities that even wizards (who have study the arcane arts practically their whole lives) don't have (Right Cantrip for the Job), is just wrong.
I could definitely see Wizards as too focused on the High level Magic, constantly striving for Wish, Instant Fortress or Element Bending World Shaping Spells and simply forgetting about Cantrips.
Even mechanically which Wizard cares about Cantrips by level 10? By level 10 a wizard has 15 spells before he has to rely on Cantrips and refreshes 5 levels worth of spell slots on a short rest. While a Artificer only has 7 with no short rest refresh, and on a delayed timeline given he is a half caster. It just makes sense lore wise for them to put more effort into mastering the lower levels ie Cantrips.
Not to mention tome locks are already greater masters of Cantrips than Wizards. So a flexible but restricted version of Right Cantrip for the Job absolutely makes sense even for a non Ebberon Artificer. Crafting many little tricks without being able to go all out Sunbeam and Chain Lightning on enemies.
Yes, Wizards have access to high level spells and they are striving to advance their knowledge in the arcane arts and to rediscover long lost magic and spell or inventing new magic and spells. But when it comes to the simplest spells (i.e. cantrips), they have to carefully choose which cantrip will be the most useful to them, just like all the other caster classes that have access to cantrips.
If the powers that be at WotC D&D are giving Artificers the ability to switch out their cantrips (after a short or long rest), then they should require the Artificer to have an actual mechanical device that when they activate it, it simulates the effect of the spell. Not require them to use their Artisan's tools, thieves' tools or an infused item to cast the spell. Even for their 1st - 5th level spells. Also not forcing the player to have an imagination and describe how they cast cast Faerie Fire with their thieves' tools.
The human Artificer wants to cast the See Invisibility spell. So instead of actually casting the spell, they attach a device onto their goggles and focus it until it simulates the effects of the spell. Or they use the same device and adjust it until they can see in darkness, as the device simulates the effects of the Darkvision spell.
Well this sounds much more like we 100% agree, haha ^^ The fluff text was no where near enough when just saying Tools Required, while the intent was good the delivery was not nearly close enough. Out of interest would you also agree with "Spellcasting" if the text was change to something like the following, or any further suggestions / changes you would recommend?
I think what could work is a more dramatic approach to reflavoring spellcasting. Instead of spellcasting with Tools Required I suggest we go all out, replace Spellcasting with the following:
Spell Conduit
At 2nd level, you have learned how to anchor the weave to magic items. You can craft conduits out of weapons, armors or mundane looking items which then act as conduits to spell like abilities. These are drawn from other classes’ spell lists but are restricted to the below “Artificer Conduit List.” (renamed spell list)
You can craft up to Int Mod + half your Artificer level of these conduits and can double up on spells from the list if needed. Over the course of a Longrest you can rework up to Int Mod of these items to recreate different spells on the list. If disarmed of these Spell Conduit Items, you can recraft up to your Int Mod of these as improvised conduits over the period of a Long Rest or replaced at a town at a cost of 100g each.
These items can be used by any allied creature but only within 30ft of you, as the conduits draw from a power source connected to you, be that magical or technological in nature. This power source refreshes on long rest and increases with level as per the Conduit Slots table (renamed from Spell Slots table) and can be powered by other classes spell slots as detailed in the multiclassing optional rules.
When activated the items use a Spellcasting modifier defined of your Int Mod, but take the Spell’s required Action and act as if cast by the activating creature, using their concentration if required. The conduit item is not consumed in the process.
(I may be missing some things please look at the Intent instead of the RAW）
This would make thematic sense to those of you who prefer full crafting focus Artificer and maintain the lore of an Ebberon Artificer, and I think more cleanly does what they intended to do with Tools required. And yes I intend this still be paired with DMG/XGTE magic item crafting, but with this being the more active combat focused crafting giving a lot of extra options of what to do in combat.
On balance I see that this is a whole different ballpark, giving a crazy unique way of playing Artificer as every spell known becomes a spell stored item, but it maintains most of the limitations of Spellcasting, while interestingly giving Artificer a super strong and unique Utility party role. Turn your Barbarian’s Greataxe into a conduit for Arcane weapon, etc. I though don’t think it is that over powered because it doesn’t give that much numerical advantage just a lot of flexibility and theme driven mechanics.
The more I look at the Iron Defender's pet the more I want it to do more than just be a big bitey meat shield...
I wonder if it would be overpowered to add a bonus action/reaction to it (maybe at higher levels or even a subclass specific infusion) that allows it to turn into armor that gives you it's Health as Temp HP, its AC, and, if you are a small character, its medium size. So basically your character presses a button and the Iron Defender alters its form to clamp around you and become a sweet mech suit... is that too weird? It would stay in line with the subclasses "armor smith/battle artificer" vibe.
If it were a sub class specific infusion that would also pave the way for other infusions of the like.
We could give the Alchemist back a revised version of the Alchemist's Satchel that gives you access to Healing Draught, Smoke Sticks, Alchemist's Fire, Tanglefoot Bag, and Thunderstone (or something of the like) but you can only have 3 of these prepared per long rest or something.
The more I look at the Iron Defender's pet the more I want it to do more than just be a big bitey meat shield...
I wonder if it would be overpowered to add a bonus action/reaction to it (maybe at higher levels or even a subclass specific infusion) that allows it to turn into armor that gives you it's Health as Temp HP, its AC, and, if you are a small character, its medium size. So basically your character presses a button and the Iron Defender alters its form to clamp around you and become a sweet mech suit... is that too weird? It would stay in line with the subclasses "armor smith/battle artificer" vibe.
If it were a sub class specific infusion that would also pave the way for other infusions of the like.
We could give the Alchemist back a revised version of the Alchemist's Satchel that gives you access to Healing Draught, Smoke Sticks, Alchemist's Fire, Tanglefoot Bag, and Thunderstone (or something of the like) but you can only have 3 of these prepared per long rest or something.
I think that the bonus action buffs would tred too closely on the Artillerist's turrets abilities. That being said, keep on mind that as a Battle Smith you can create armor that your Iron Defender could wear, which can obviously magical. Additionally, something that may be overlooked is that unlike the Turrets, the Iron Defender is a creature, meaning a lot of spells (both good and bad) can target it (the Turrets are objects).
They have yet to actually add Repeating weapons, they've just added the Infusions so far. At least that I could find . . .
The new spells have been added to the Artificer class.
The three new infusions have been added.
Magical Items have been added for [Tooltip Not Found] as well as [Tooltip Not Found] and [Tooltip Not Found] - we've still got some work to do on the Repeating Shot weapons.
The more I look at the Iron Defender's pet the more I want it to do more than just be a big bitey meat shield...
I wonder if it would be overpowered to add a bonus action/reaction to it (maybe at higher levels or even a subclass specific infusion) that allows it to turn into armor that gives you it's Health as Temp HP, its AC, and, if you are a small character, its medium size. So basically your character presses a button and the Iron Defender alters its form to clamp around you and become a sweet mech suit... is that too weird? It would stay in line with the subclasses "armor smith/battle artificer" vibe.
If it were a sub class specific infusion that would also pave the way for other infusions of the like.
We could give the Alchemist back a revised version of the Alchemist's Satchel that gives you access to Healing Draught, Smoke Sticks, Alchemist's Fire, Tanglefoot Bag, and Thunderstone (or something of the like) but you can only have 3 of these prepared per long rest or something.
I think that the bonus action buffs would tred too closely on the Artillerist's turrets abilities. That being said, keep on mind that as a Battle Smith you can create armor that your Iron Defender could wear, which can obviously magical. Additionally, something that may be overlooked is that unlike the Turrets, the Iron Defender is a creature, meaning a lot of spells (both good and bad) can target it (the Turrets are objects).
I suppose I didn't think about it being a creature and thus barding could come into effect... honestly I've just been waiting for the ability for my Warforged Artificer to go full Transformers and merge with their mechanical Mastiff. Hopefully whatever DM I have will be kind and allow me to make some... modifications to my Iron Defender.
I stand by the Alchemist's Satchel though. Alchemists should have a more active "potion mixing" mechanic. And having Subclass specific infusions wouldn't be a terrible idea.
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I think your last point is the most important one. As a single infusion, this is mid-range(good, but doesn't really contribute to power level much). If it were to use up all your infusion slots, it becomes so terrible as to become unusable in any situation other than a specific mission such as a diamond heist.
Homunculus has Might of the Master as well:
Might of the Master. The following numbers increase by 1 when your proficiency bonus increases by 1: the homunculus’ skill bonuses and the bonuses to hit and damage of its Acidic Spittle.
Gotta flip the page over. 😋
Sorry, what page? I know they both have might of the master but it would be nice if that process was automatic in the creatures tab.
Page 7 of the UA:A3 document, first column 3/4 way down in the homunculus stat block above Actions (Requires Your Bonus Action).
Hjalmar Gunderson, Vuman Alchemist Plague Doctor in a HB Campaign, Post Netherese Invasion Cormyr (lvl20 retired)
Godfrey, Autognome Butler in Ghosts of Saltmarsh into Spelljammer
Grímr Skeggisson, Goliath Rune Knight in Rime of the Frostmaiden
DM of two HB campaigns set in the same world.
if we multi class into an alternate caster class would right cantrip for the right job allow you to change the lets say warlocks cantrips as well?
Nope, unfortunately its states artificer spells only.
"Whenever you finish a short or long rest, you can replace one of the artificer cantrips you know with another cantrip from the artificer spell list." Page 6 of UA:A3.
Hjalmar Gunderson, Vuman Alchemist Plague Doctor in a HB Campaign, Post Netherese Invasion Cormyr (lvl20 retired)
Godfrey, Autognome Butler in Ghosts of Saltmarsh into Spelljammer
Grímr Skeggisson, Goliath Rune Knight in Rime of the Frostmaiden
DM of two HB campaigns set in the same world.
I don’t view them as using spells, it’s a mechanical convenience only, which I have no problem with as a whole.
I do agree using the existing spell system does fall short in fully realising the Artificer fantasy however, namely in that you can’t exactly hand out spells for others to use, and they are very impermanent.
For the replicate magic item infusion, my DM has allowed me to freely change infusions around amongst the first tier list to help provide that greater flexibility I wanted. It takes an hour and the catch is the existing item is entirely destroyed in the process. I didn’t ask for this but he also increased my total known infusions (artificer level/2 rounded up).
This little nudge means at level 5 I have 1 ‘permanent’ infusion for myself and 1 to hand out, and a bag of flexible tricks, that mostly provide utility, provided I have an hour and the raw materials.
I do also agree that if they had a lesser but more general purpose crafting feature akin to the subclasses, this would make sense. However, frankly you need a DM to come to the table for crafting period, otherwise this amounts to a ribbon ability.
I could definitely see Wizards as too focused on the High level Magic, constantly striving for Wish, Instant Fortress or Element Bending World Shaping Spells and simply forgetting about Cantrips.
Even mechanically which Wizard cares about Cantrips by level 10? By level 10 a wizard has 15 spells before he has to rely on Cantrips and refreshes 5 levels worth of spell slots on a short rest. While a Artificer only has 7 with no short rest refresh, and on a delayed timeline given he is a half caster. It just makes sense lore wise for them to put more effort into mastering the lower levels ie Cantrips.
Not to mention tome locks are already greater masters of Cantrips than Wizards. So a flexible but restricted version of Right Cantrip for the Job absolutely makes sense even for a non Ebberon Artificer. Crafting many little tricks without being able to go all out Sunbeam and Chain Lightning on enemies.
Yes, Wizards have access to high level spells and they are striving to advance their knowledge in the arcane arts and to rediscover long lost magic and spell or inventing new magic and spells. But when it comes to the simplest spells (i.e. cantrips), they have to carefully choose which cantrip will be the most useful to them, just like all the other caster classes that have access to cantrips.
If the powers that be at WotC D&D are giving Artificers the ability to switch out their cantrips (after a short or long rest), then they should require the Artificer to have an actual mechanical device that when they activate it, it simulates the effect of the spell. Not require them to use their Artisan's tools, thieves' tools or an infused item to cast the spell. Even for their 1st - 5th level spells. Also not forcing the player to have an imagination and describe how they cast cast Faerie Fire with their thieves' tools.
The human Artificer wants to cast the See Invisibility spell. So instead of actually casting the spell, they attach a device onto their goggles and focus it until it simulates the effects of the spell. Or they use the same device and adjust it until they can see in darkness, as the device simulates the effects of the Darkvision spell.
The DMG (pg. 129) gives a brief explanation on the time period needed to craft item depending on it's rarity level. XGtE (pg. 129) goes more indepth about crafting magic items.
Well this sounds much more like we 100% agree, haha ^^ The fluff text was no where near enough when just saying Tools Required, while the intent was good the delivery was not nearly close enough. Out of interest would you also agree with "Spellcasting" if the text was change to something like the following, or any further suggestions / changes you would recommend?
I don't know if it has been discussed or not, but do we have any idea when the new subclasses will be added to D&D Beyond?
There's another thread about this, but the gist is that they're working on it and it'll be out soon.
They put out this update. Some things have been added, but they are still working on the sub-classes: https://twitter.com/DnDBeyond/status/1132011086176108544
The more I look at the Iron Defender's pet the more I want it to do more than just be a big bitey meat shield...
I wonder if it would be overpowered to add a bonus action/reaction to it (maybe at higher levels or even a subclass specific infusion) that allows it to turn into armor that gives you it's Health as Temp HP, its AC, and, if you are a small character, its medium size. So basically your character presses a button and the Iron Defender alters its form to clamp around you and become a sweet mech suit... is that too weird? It would stay in line with the subclasses "armor smith/battle artificer" vibe.
If it were a sub class specific infusion that would also pave the way for other infusions of the like.
We could give the Alchemist back a revised version of the Alchemist's Satchel that gives you access to Healing Draught, Smoke Sticks, Alchemist's Fire, Tanglefoot Bag, and Thunderstone (or something of the like) but you can only have 3 of these prepared per long rest or something.
They have yet to actually add Repeating weapons, they've just added the Infusions so far. At least that I could find . . .
Watch your back, conserve your ammo,
and NEVER cut a deal with a dragon!
I think that the bonus action buffs would tred too closely on the Artillerist's turrets abilities. That being said, keep on mind that as a Battle Smith you can create armor that your Iron Defender could wear, which can obviously magical. Additionally, something that may be overlooked is that unlike the Turrets, the Iron Defender is a creature, meaning a lot of spells (both good and bad) can target it (the Turrets are objects).
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D&D Beyond FoundersThe new spells have been added to the Artificer class.
The three new infusions have been added.
Magical Items have been added for [Tooltip Not Found] as well as [Tooltip Not Found] and [Tooltip Not Found] - we've still got some work to do on the Repeating Shot weapons.
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I suppose I didn't think about it being a creature and thus barding could come into effect... honestly I've just been waiting for the ability for my Warforged Artificer to go full Transformers and merge with their mechanical Mastiff. Hopefully whatever DM I have will be kind and allow me to make some... modifications to my Iron Defender.
I stand by the Alchemist's Satchel though. Alchemists should have a more active "potion mixing" mechanic. And having Subclass specific infusions wouldn't be a terrible idea.