Hey guys, I have a chance to be able to rework my current fighter in my current capmaign, and I'm kinda stuck on what to do. So far, my character is a lvl 8 Battle master, with a Great weapon focus (Feat, fighting style and a +1 greatsword) But, unfortunately, he just cannot take a hit. I have been playing this guy through white plume mountain and it seems every major fight My gatorman gets knocked out or dead (like legit dead, with only a mystic keeping him in the game on 2 occasions). I'm sure it has something to do with really crappy rolled HP, but as I said before I have a chance to somewhat fix this.
The caveat is, I cannot change classes or starting stats, but I can change maneuvers and probably a feat when I get the chance to. I have an idea on what to do, but I would like to try and bounce some ideas off the internet before I do.
Maneuvers: Disarming attack (barely used), Trip Attack (Most used), Feint attack (3rd most used). Riposte (I always get hit anyways so rarely used), Precision attack (2nd most used) Feat: Great weapon mastery (This is something I regret the most. On paper It is an awesome attack, especially with precision and feint attack, but even then I am currently getting only a +3 to hit when using this, and my dice rolls are usually crap. I built my character to really use this, with feint attack, prone capabilities and precision, but even then I rarely hit, and rarely use the extra bonus attack it gives.)
now, as this was the 2nd character I built, I messed up on the stat increases quite a bit, as well as which maneuvers I took. As I said above I barely use disarming attack and riposte and the great weapon feat, so I'm probably going to switch them out. I am enjoying the great weapons themselves though, so that's fine. I am mainly stuck getting knocked out of the fights and constantly needing to be rescued, and that's what i'm trying to fix... I plan on changing out disarming strike and riposte for parry and commander's strike, giving my team some extra support.
I have 3 plans for my character, but all of them will involve making strength 20 the first chance I get:
1st: either get the stat increases for lvl 8 instead of a feat, or taking a different feat, changing minimal things and continuing on or multiclassing
2nd: take heavy armor master for an extra stat increase, change some things around to get 20 Strength, and have a small -3 reduction to damage. I will probably get plate mail later so I have a better AC, but I doubt it would really help as everything we fight is pretty high hitting
3rd: take the toughness feat at lvl 4, get more health as I level, get strength from 16 to 20 and possibly multiclass into barbarian. This is the nuclear option, as I'm changing a few things about armor class and all but making my chain mail unwanted, but ultimately would give me more resistance to damage.
Any thoughts or critiques would be welcome, and feel free to vote in the poll!
If you really cannot land a hit on an enemy with Great Weapon attack when they are prone, or under the effect of another players spell effects then I would just swap feat for Heavy Armor Master, don't even need to get Plate mail yet, but it was something you should be aiming for eventually. Honestly surprised you do not have at least a mundane plate armor (even with the cost) granted when it is only one more AC over your magical armor it is not a large upgrade for the cost.
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"Where words fail, swords prevail. Where blood is spilled, my cup is filled" -Cartaphilus
"I have found the answer to the meaning of life. You ask me what the answer is? You already know what the answer to life is. You fear it more than the strike of a viper, the ravages of disease, the ire of a lover. The answer is always death. But death is a gentle mistress with a sweet embrace, and you owe her a debt of restitution. Life is not a gift, it is a loan."
Yeah a lot of people don't realize how significant a flat -5 penalty to attack rolls is with the Great Weapon Mastery feat's "Power Attack" (I'm never going to not call it that, thanks a lot 3.5E) option. Even the Barbarian's Reckless Attack (giving himself advantage for free) often just isn't enough to overcome the penalty.
I've found that the Devotion Paladin's Sacred Weapon feature to give a +CHA bonus to attack rolls in addition to a status or ally spellcaster's disabling spell for advantage (*especially* paralysis; no it doesn't double the +10 to damage, but it guarantees the extra bonus action attack, since any hit is an automatic critical hit) is about the only way to make the GWM feat work reliably. Otherwise, sure it's fun when it works but man it really sucks to waste a turn swinging into nothing but air.
Anywho, yeah to be perfectly honest I'd most likely swap out GWM for something you're going to enjoy using more....
As a first note, I typically caution people against the Heavy Armor Master feat; sure it comes with a +1 to Strength, which is nice, but the -3 to damage from incoming nonmagical physical attacks is... quite limited in its usefulness. Especially considering your party's current level, I can't really imagine that there are a whole lot of beasties you're probably fighting that don't have some kind of magical attack that circumvents that protection.
For survivability, I'd recommend the following: 1. Ditch the greatsword, ask if you can change it to a +1 longsword instead, and equip yourself with a shield; a +2 to AC is a massive jump with 5E's bounded accuracy system, and if you swap out the Great Weapon Fighting fighting style for Defensive for the additional +1, you'll be sitting real pretty with your 20 AC. 2. Lucky feat: getting to subtract a d4 from an enemy's attack roll can often be all you need, especially if you also do the above and get your 20 AC 3. Magic Initiate feat: cantrips are... well, who cares; they may be interesting to get to use the Lightning Lure/Green Flame Blade or Booming Blade, but the real zinger here is that you get to have Shield once per day. If there's that one big baddie bearing down on you with a big desperate attack roll and you're down in hit points and you have the chance to add +5 to your AC in your back pocket, wouldn't that be nice? 4. Mobile feat: sometimes, getting to run away (the better part of valor!), and doing it faster than any non-monk can, really is the best option 5. If you don't want to go full-on sword-and-shield, consider the Dual Wielder feat; you can still take the Defensive fighting style for the +1 to AC, and you get +1 from the feat, and you can use that bonus action attack if you're not already using a bonus action for something round-after-round. Sure, without the Two-Weapon Fighting style it's only an extra d8 of damage (if you're dual-wielding longswords), but that still ain't nothing. Plus, you could always take 2 levels in Ranger later for the 2W fighting style and a couple castings of Cure Wounds for yourself
So, thinking about your option of taking levels in Barbarian, which typically I dissuade people from, I'm tempted to ask what the composition of the rest of your party is...? Fighters in 5E aren't designed to be the lone guy in front; if the rest of your party are archers and low-hp spellcasters and you're the meat shield *er-hem* sole valued melee combat traveling companion, then going for a MC into the vaunted realms of Barbarianism might not be the worst way to go. Barbs are, without question, the absolute best things in 5E at being the lone guy on the front lines. I've seen it; I've pulled my hair out as a DM over the 7th level Bear Totem Barb who laughs in my face at literally everything I throw at him. They're practically un-GD-killable. Just sayin'.
So, I think the long and short of it is that you're going to need to seriously re-think how much you like that greatsword over being sword-and-board with the Defensive fighting style, or start poking at your other party members to help back you up, or *something*.
And for God's sake, don't take the Toughness feat. Are 16 extra hit points really going to keep you up in these fights? I can't help but doubt it. Going into levels of Barb for the resistance will take you so much farther it's not even funny. Unless your DM is dead-set against you multiclassing for some reason, there's no reason to take this feat over even just one level of Barb for effectively more health. I guess the question is... what kind of damage is it that's dropping you? Because if it's not physical damage, just know going into it that only by taking 3 levels of Barb will you really overcome the issue.
Welp, hope that somewhere in that big wall-o'-text there was something helpful.
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"I saw her first. Go find your own genetic time-capsule or, so help me, I'll cut you."
Yeah a lot of people don't realize how significant a flat -5 penalty to attack rolls is with the Great Weapon Mastery feat's "Power Attack" (I'm never going to not call it that, thanks a lot 3.5E) option. Even the Barbarian's Reckless Attack (giving himself advantage for free) often just isn't enough to overcome the penalty.
This entire thing was helpful, so thank you for the right up! As of right now I have no clue how much my DM will allow me to change, but I'm honestly just hoping for stat increases to be able to change along with maneuvers. I don't think I would be able to change fighting style, but there is really nothing stopping me from just picking up a shield when I need to, and I can just make one when I want to.
It's mostly physical damage that knocks my poor gator boy down, as everything I get close up to seems to hit like a truck (Then again that may just be white plume mountain). Our party composition features a frenzy barbarian, a poorly optimized eldrich knight, an immortal mystic, a battlemaster / ranger archer and an eldrich blasting warlock/sorcerer. So there is three fighters, but currently only 2 (myself and the barb) seem to be ready for close combat, and even then I can barely take a hit as described above.
The toughness thing is helpful though, and I have not even considered the lucky feat. I think I may pick that one up just to troll around, maybe save the GWM feat for later. the other stuff is worth looking at too, and I will consider it,and for now I think I will consider whether to multi-class or not, since there are at least 2 in the party that already did so.
So there are some tactics you can use also. Having Riposte means that you can potentially avoid attacks and still get a swing on response and be more survivable.
Move into melee range and dodge. Stretch that initial survival by making them miss more. Rely on your allies to burn down enemies and your one riposte to keep em honest. But that isn't really all that fun necessarily. Once the numbers are whittled down, go on offensive. Using that dodge tactic and some of the advice on upping your AC will help if you are getting ganged up on. Going in and whaling away will get you mashed sometimes. If you screw up, using action surge to get a dodge may not be a bad idea.
Also there is no shame in letting the barbarian attract the attacks and attention and then move up in support. Work together to take out the most dangerous enemy.
Lastly, it could be the tactics your GM is using and any change just won't be that effective. Maybe a controversial response, but you don't have a crappy AC or hit points and shouldn't be the only one dropping like this. You should be able to hold your own one to one even with a foe a few levels higher. It could be that your GM is trying to compensate for how tough a bear barbarian is and you are getting caught in the meat grinder.
Wow long time without posting here but school does that to people I guess
turns out dm didn't allow me to change feats, so I have been using GWM a lot smarter. I don't eat up my bonus action until the final attack in case I get a crit or a kill, so I have that extra attack in my back pocket in case it does happen, so I'm actually remembering to use it. The -5/+10dmg thing is not something I'm going to hit often but I now have a +2 maul and I'm remembering to save it for the easy to hit things or if I have advantage, so It's going a lot smoother if I do follow that idea rather than trying every round. (hitting a flying carpet for example, or a water elemental)
I also changed my maneuvers around a bit, as I described. I cannot say how much my squishy gator has been saved by parry, but so far he turned a hit of 13dmg down to 4 points of damage, so it's been really beneficial in terms of short term survival. Still got precision strike for my rouge GWM swings, and still have trip attack for the set up (I managed to trip a spherical boulder!) as well as feint attack, so I have accuracy. I finally picked up commander's strike for my allies in case I can't reach someone, so now it's all well rounded in terms of combat.
I think next level I'm going to go for a barbarian dip, as that resistance will make me last longer, and extra damage is always nice. So yea, not much gleaned from this thread but the ideas are solid so far for more characters!
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Hey guys, I have a chance to be able to rework my current fighter in my current capmaign, and I'm kinda stuck on what to do. So far, my character is a lvl 8 Battle master, with a Great weapon focus (Feat, fighting style and a +1 greatsword) But, unfortunately, he just cannot take a hit. I have been playing this guy through white plume mountain and it seems every major fight My gatorman gets knocked out or dead (like legit dead, with only a mystic keeping him in the game on 2 occasions). I'm sure it has something to do with really crappy rolled HP, but as I said before I have a chance to somewhat fix this.
The caveat is, I cannot change classes or starting stats, but I can change maneuvers and probably a feat when I get the chance to. I have an idea on what to do, but I would like to try and bounce some ideas off the internet before I do.
His stats: Race: Lizardfolk HP: 71 AC: 17
Strength: 18 ( 16 rolled, +1 lvl 4 stat increase, +1 lvl 6 stat increase)
Dex: 13
Constitution: 18 ( 14 rolled, +2 Race, +1 lvl 4 stat increase, +1 lvl 6 stat increase)
intelligence: 10
Wisdom: 13 (12 rolled, +1 race)
Charisma: 6
relevant Gear: +1 chainmail, +1 greatsword
Maneuvers: Disarming attack (barely used), Trip Attack (Most used), Feint attack (3rd most used). Riposte (I always get hit anyways so rarely used), Precision attack (2nd most used)
Feat: Great weapon mastery (This is something I regret the most. On paper It is an awesome attack, especially with precision and feint attack, but even then I am currently getting only a +3 to hit when using this, and my dice rolls are usually crap. I built my character to really use this, with feint attack, prone capabilities and precision, but even then I rarely hit, and rarely use the extra bonus attack it gives.)
now, as this was the 2nd character I built, I messed up on the stat increases quite a bit, as well as which maneuvers I took. As I said above I barely use disarming attack and riposte and the great weapon feat, so I'm probably going to switch them out. I am enjoying the great weapons themselves though, so that's fine. I am mainly stuck getting knocked out of the fights and constantly needing to be rescued, and that's what i'm trying to fix... I plan on changing out disarming strike and riposte for parry and commander's strike, giving my team some extra support.
I have 3 plans for my character, but all of them will involve making strength 20 the first chance I get:
1st: either get the stat increases for lvl 8 instead of a feat, or taking a different feat, changing minimal things and continuing on or multiclassing
2nd: take heavy armor master for an extra stat increase, change some things around to get 20 Strength, and have a small -3 reduction to damage. I will probably get plate mail later so I have a better AC, but I doubt it would really help as everything we fight is pretty high hitting
3rd: take the toughness feat at lvl 4, get more health as I level, get strength from 16 to 20 and possibly multiclass into barbarian. This is the nuclear option, as I'm changing a few things about armor class and all but making my chain mail unwanted, but ultimately would give me more resistance to damage.
Any thoughts or critiques would be welcome, and feel free to vote in the poll!
If allowed, I'd swap the GW feat for Heavy Armor Master definitely and take Defense fighting style.
Your other tweaks sound reasonable, I'd stick with Fighter and not multiclass. Your HPs aren't great for that level but they are decent.
Perpetually annoyed that Eldritch Knights can't use Eldritch Blast, Eldritch Smite, and Eldritch Sight.
If you really cannot land a hit on an enemy with Great Weapon attack when they are prone, or under the effect of another players spell effects then I would just swap feat for Heavy Armor Master, don't even need to get Plate mail yet, but it was something you should be aiming for eventually. Honestly surprised you do not have at least a mundane plate armor (even with the cost) granted when it is only one more AC over your magical armor it is not a large upgrade for the cost.
"Where words fail, swords prevail. Where blood is spilled, my cup is filled" -Cartaphilus
"I have found the answer to the meaning of life. You ask me what the answer is? You already know what the answer to life is. You fear it more than the strike of a viper, the ravages of disease, the ire of a lover. The answer is always death. But death is a gentle mistress with a sweet embrace, and you owe her a debt of restitution. Life is not a gift, it is a loan."
Yeah a lot of people don't realize how significant a flat -5 penalty to attack rolls is with the Great Weapon Mastery feat's "Power Attack" (I'm never going to not call it that, thanks a lot 3.5E) option. Even the Barbarian's Reckless Attack (giving himself advantage for free) often just isn't enough to overcome the penalty.
I've found that the Devotion Paladin's Sacred Weapon feature to give a +CHA bonus to attack rolls in addition to a status or ally spellcaster's disabling spell for advantage (*especially* paralysis; no it doesn't double the +10 to damage, but it guarantees the extra bonus action attack, since any hit is an automatic critical hit) is about the only way to make the GWM feat work reliably. Otherwise, sure it's fun when it works but man it really sucks to waste a turn swinging into nothing but air.
Anywho, yeah to be perfectly honest I'd most likely swap out GWM for something you're going to enjoy using more....
As a first note, I typically caution people against the Heavy Armor Master feat; sure it comes with a +1 to Strength, which is nice, but the -3 to damage from incoming nonmagical physical attacks is... quite limited in its usefulness. Especially considering your party's current level, I can't really imagine that there are a whole lot of beasties you're probably fighting that don't have some kind of magical attack that circumvents that protection.
For survivability, I'd recommend the following:
1. Ditch the greatsword, ask if you can change it to a +1 longsword instead, and equip yourself with a shield; a +2 to AC is a massive jump with 5E's bounded accuracy system, and if you swap out the Great Weapon Fighting fighting style for Defensive for the additional +1, you'll be sitting real pretty with your 20 AC.
2. Lucky feat: getting to subtract a d4 from an enemy's attack roll can often be all you need, especially if you also do the above and get your 20 AC
3. Magic Initiate feat: cantrips are... well, who cares; they may be interesting to get to use the Lightning Lure/Green Flame Blade or Booming Blade, but the real zinger here is that you get to have Shield once per day. If there's that one big baddie bearing down on you with a big desperate attack roll and you're down in hit points and you have the chance to add +5 to your AC in your back pocket, wouldn't that be nice?
4. Mobile feat: sometimes, getting to run away (the better part of valor!), and doing it faster than any non-monk can, really is the best option
5. If you don't want to go full-on sword-and-shield, consider the Dual Wielder feat; you can still take the Defensive fighting style for the +1 to AC, and you get +1 from the feat, and you can use that bonus action attack if you're not already using a bonus action for something round-after-round. Sure, without the Two-Weapon Fighting style it's only an extra d8 of damage (if you're dual-wielding longswords), but that still ain't nothing. Plus, you could always take 2 levels in Ranger later for the 2W fighting style and a couple castings of Cure Wounds for yourself
So, thinking about your option of taking levels in Barbarian, which typically I dissuade people from, I'm tempted to ask what the composition of the rest of your party is...? Fighters in 5E aren't designed to be the lone guy in front; if the rest of your party are archers and low-hp spellcasters and you're the meat shield *er-hem* sole valued melee combat traveling companion, then going for a MC into the vaunted realms of Barbarianism might not be the worst way to go. Barbs are, without question, the absolute best things in 5E at being the lone guy on the front lines. I've seen it; I've pulled my hair out as a DM over the 7th level Bear Totem Barb who laughs in my face at literally everything I throw at him. They're practically un-GD-killable. Just sayin'.
So, I think the long and short of it is that you're going to need to seriously re-think how much you like that greatsword over being sword-and-board with the Defensive fighting style, or start poking at your other party members to help back you up, or *something*.
And for God's sake, don't take the Toughness feat. Are 16 extra hit points really going to keep you up in these fights? I can't help but doubt it. Going into levels of Barb for the resistance will take you so much farther it's not even funny. Unless your DM is dead-set against you multiclassing for some reason, there's no reason to take this feat over even just one level of Barb for effectively more health. I guess the question is... what kind of damage is it that's dropping you? Because if it's not physical damage, just know going into it that only by taking 3 levels of Barb will you really overcome the issue.
Welp, hope that somewhere in that big wall-o'-text there was something helpful.
"I saw her first. Go find your own genetic time-capsule or, so help me, I'll cut you."
So there are some tactics you can use also. Having Riposte means that you can potentially avoid attacks and still get a swing on response and be more survivable.
Move into melee range and dodge. Stretch that initial survival by making them miss more. Rely on your allies to burn down enemies and your one riposte to keep em honest. But that isn't really all that fun necessarily. Once the numbers are whittled down, go on offensive. Using that dodge tactic and some of the advice on upping your AC will help if you are getting ganged up on. Going in and whaling away will get you mashed sometimes. If you screw up, using action surge to get a dodge may not be a bad idea.
Also there is no shame in letting the barbarian attract the attacks and attention and then move up in support. Work together to take out the most dangerous enemy.
Lastly, it could be the tactics your GM is using and any change just won't be that effective. Maybe a controversial response, but you don't have a crappy AC or hit points and shouldn't be the only one dropping like this. You should be able to hold your own one to one even with a foe a few levels higher. It could be that your GM is trying to compensate for how tough a bear barbarian is and you are getting caught in the meat grinder.
Option 2 for sure
Wow long time without posting here but school does that to people I guess
turns out dm didn't allow me to change feats, so I have been using GWM a lot smarter. I don't eat up my bonus action until the final attack in case I get a crit or a kill, so I have that extra attack in my back pocket in case it does happen, so I'm actually remembering to use it. The -5/+10dmg thing is not something I'm going to hit often but I now have a +2 maul and I'm remembering to save it for the easy to hit things or if I have advantage, so It's going a lot smoother if I do follow that idea rather than trying every round. (hitting a flying carpet for example, or a water elemental)
I also changed my maneuvers around a bit, as I described. I cannot say how much my squishy gator has been saved by parry, but so far he turned a hit of 13dmg down to 4 points of damage, so it's been really beneficial in terms of short term survival. Still got precision strike for my rouge GWM swings, and still have trip attack for the set up (I managed to trip a spherical boulder!) as well as feint attack, so I have accuracy. I finally picked up commander's strike for my allies in case I can't reach someone, so now it's all well rounded in terms of combat.
I think next level I'm going to go for a barbarian dip, as that resistance will make me last longer, and extra damage is always nice. So yea, not much gleaned from this thread but the ideas are solid so far for more characters!