I was wondering if a rogue (I'm not playing one and this is purely theoretical) taking 2 levels in barbarian is a smart idea. They'd get rage, and reckless (which gives them advantage and triggers sneak attack). Then, the rogue could stray away from the party and hide so that they get advantage on their attack roll without worrying about not getting sneak attack. A level 18 rogue would still get a maximized sneak attack and if they're an assassin (subclass) possibly double their sneak attack damage if they surprise they're enemy. So is the guranteed sneak attack from reckless worth it, or is better to just stay as a rogue for the whole campaign and limit your flexibility and how much you hide to stay within five feet of your allies and get sneak attack? What do you guys think?
Edit: Excuse me, I made a mistake. I thought you can use reckless to get advantage on ranged attacks, and hide so your enemies wouldn't see & attack you and exploit their advantage due to reckless. Did not realize reckless only applied to melee attacks, my bad guys, sorry about that, I'll read more carefully next time.
You'd have to focus on Strength, since RA and the damage bonus from Rage only work for strength-based attacks. You could still use sneak attacks, but you'd need to use a finesse weapon with Strength to get both(A rapier's best, but it's still only 1d8). And if you want to go Barbarian/Rogue, three levels for a subclass is probably worth it.
Rogue-Barbarian is not overpowered. Strength and Dex do not min-max well. Sneak attack is so common, getting it is no that hard to do, and the problem with advantage is it goes away when you add Disadvantage. A lot of Rogue subclasses can help out with that all by themselves - look at swashbuckler's third level ability.
I was wondering if a rogue (I'm not playing one and this is purely theoretical) taking 2 levels in barbarian is a smart idea. They'd get rage, and reckless (which gives them advantage and triggers sneak attack). Then, the rogue could stray away from the party and hide so that they get advantage on their attack roll without worrying about not getting sneak attack.
That doesn't make any sense. The whole point of using Reckless Attack to make your sneak attacks is that you don't need to hide anymore.
A level 18 rogue would still get a maximized sneak attack and if they're an assassin (subclass) possibly double their sneak attack damage if they surprise they're enemy.
Assassins are a bad Rogue subclass and this doesn't fix them. Assassins are only good when you stop at 3-4 levels and mix them with (sub)classes that are actually good at initiative and making multiple attacks while the going is good.
So is the guranteed sneak attack from reckless worth it, or is better to just stay as a rogue for the whole campaign and limit your flexibility and how much you hide to stay within five feet of your allies and get sneak attack? What do you guys think?
I think unless a Rogue is an Arcane Trickster or a Swashbuckler they have no business whatsoever trying to Sneak Attack in melee.
I was wondering if a rogue (I'm not playing one and this is purely theoretical) taking 2 levels in barbarian is a smart idea. They'd get rage, and reckless (which gives them advantage and triggers sneak attack). Then, the rogue could stray away from the party and hide so that they get advantage on their attack roll without worrying about not getting sneak attack.
That doesn't make any sense. The whole point of using Reckless Attack to make your sneak attacks is that you don't need to hide anymore.
A level 18 rogue would still get a maximized sneak attack and if they're an assassin (subclass) possibly double their sneak attack damage if they surprise they're enemy.
Assassins are a bad Rogue subclass and this doesn't fix them. Assassins are only good when you stop at 3-4 levels and mix them with (sub)classes that are actually good at initiative and making multiple attacks while the going is good.
So is the guranteed sneak attack from reckless worth it, or is better to just stay as a rogue for the whole campaign and limit your flexibility and how much you hide to stay within five feet of your allies and get sneak attack? What do you guys think?
I think unless a Rogue is an Arcane Trickster or a Swashbuckler they have no business whatsoever trying to Sneak Attack in melee.
Scouts as well, as are any rogue who Dual-Wields or uses Booming Blade. Melee rogues are just as good as ranged rogues, but they have a different use-case. Fortunately, rogues are flexible, and can switch to whatever is most useful at the moment without losing too much power.
Rather than comment on your build, I have a proposal for a somewhat similar option. Hear me out please: I’m currently playing an ancestors barbarian 5/swashbuckler rogue 4. It’s a great build that my GM prolly thinks is OP lol.
It’s a little counterintuitive though, because I never use RA. I’m focused on dex, with strength as my dump stat in fact. The way it works is I rage, move to a lonesome target so I get SA due to the swashbuckler levels, hit them to proc Ancestral Protectors and then move away so my victim has to decide whether to chase me, possibly wasting an attack, make a ranged attack instead—often a less than ideal option—or attack someone else with disadvantage. Rinse and repeat while the group’s primary target is focus-fired down.
High dex and unarmoured defense with con as my second highest stat make me hard to hit. If I do get hit, I have the DR from raging and more HP than your average rogue due to the levels of d12 hit dice and high con. My damage is admittedly low compared to the sharpshooting ranger and the smiting paladin but I’m a great off tank who keeps groups of baddies from getting to the ranger and casters, or ganging up on the pally. Uncanny dodge next level will make me even more resilient. I’m considering one more level of barbarian to get Spirit Shield to help protect party members but rogue has a lot of goodies on the horizon and it competes with uncanny dodge as a reaction. I’ll see how it goes; it will be some time before level 11.
At any rate, if you can wrap your head around utterly forgoing a class feature, I highly recommend this build. It’s tons of fun.
Rather than comment on your build, I have a proposal for a somewhat similar option. Hear me out please: I’m currently playing an ancestors barbarian 5/swashbuckler rogue 4. It’s a great build that my GM prolly thinks is OP lol.
It’s a little counterintuitive though, because I never use RA. I’m focused on dex, with strength as my dump stat in fact. The way it works is I rage, move to a lonesome target so I get SA due to the swashbuckler levels, hit them to proc Ancestral Protectors and then move away so my victim has to decide whether to chase me, possibly wasting an attack, make a ranged attack instead—often a less than ideal option—or attack someone else with disadvantage. Rinse and repeat while the group’s primary target is focus-fired down.
High dex and unarmoured defense with con as my second highest stat make me hard to hit. If I do get hit, I have the DR from raging and more HP than your average rogue due to the levels of d12 hit dice and high con. My damage is admittedly low compared to the sharpshooting ranger and the smiting paladin but I’m a great off tank who keeps groups of baddies from getting to the ranger and casters, or ganging up on the pally. Uncanny dodge next level will make me even more resilient. I’m considering one more level of barbarian to get Spirit Shield to help protect party members but rogue has a lot of goodies on the horizon and it competes with uncanny dodge as a reaction. I’ll see how it goes; it will be some time before level 11.
At any rate, if you can wrap your head around utterly forgoing a class feature, I highly recommend this build. It’s tons of fun.
Does this dump stat give you the minimum of 13 needed to be a barb?
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I was wondering if a rogue (I'm not playing one and this is purely theoretical) taking 2 levels in barbarian is a smart idea. They'd get rage, and reckless (which gives them advantage and triggers sneak attack). Then, the rogue could stray away from the party and hide so that they get advantage on their attack roll without worrying about not getting sneak attack. A level 18 rogue would still get a maximized sneak attack and if they're an assassin (subclass) possibly double their sneak attack damage if they surprise they're enemy. So is the guranteed sneak attack from reckless worth it, or is better to just stay as a rogue for the whole campaign and limit your flexibility and how much you hide to stay within five feet of your allies and get sneak attack? What do you guys think?
Edit: Excuse me, I made a mistake. I thought you can use reckless to get advantage on ranged attacks, and hide so your enemies wouldn't see & attack you and exploit their advantage due to reckless. Did not realize reckless only applied to melee attacks, my bad guys, sorry about that, I'll read more carefully next time.
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HERE.You'd have to focus on Strength, since RA and the damage bonus from Rage only work for strength-based attacks. You could still use sneak attacks, but you'd need to use a finesse weapon with Strength to get both(A rapier's best, but it's still only 1d8). And if you want to go Barbarian/Rogue, three levels for a subclass is probably worth it.
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Rogue-Barbarian is not overpowered. Strength and Dex do not min-max well. Sneak attack is so common, getting it is no that hard to do, and the problem with advantage is it goes away when you add Disadvantage. A lot of Rogue subclasses can help out with that all by themselves - look at swashbuckler's third level ability.
Honestly, getting sneak attack on every attack is kind of necessary for rogues to even keep up with other classes.
That doesn't make any sense. The whole point of using Reckless Attack to make your sneak attacks is that you don't need to hide anymore.
Assassins are a bad Rogue subclass and this doesn't fix them. Assassins are only good when you stop at 3-4 levels and mix them with (sub)classes that are actually good at initiative and making multiple attacks while the going is good.
I think unless a Rogue is an Arcane Trickster or a Swashbuckler they have no business whatsoever trying to Sneak Attack in melee.
Scouts as well, as are any rogue who Dual-Wields or uses Booming Blade. Melee rogues are just as good as ranged rogues, but they have a different use-case. Fortunately, rogues are flexible, and can switch to whatever is most useful at the moment without losing too much power.
Rather than comment on your build, I have a proposal for a somewhat similar option. Hear me out please: I’m currently playing an ancestors barbarian 5/swashbuckler rogue 4. It’s a great build that my GM prolly thinks is OP lol.
It’s a little counterintuitive though, because I never use RA. I’m focused on dex, with strength as my dump stat in fact. The way it works is I rage, move to a lonesome target so I get SA due to the swashbuckler levels, hit them to proc Ancestral Protectors and then move away so my victim has to decide whether to chase me, possibly wasting an attack, make a ranged attack instead—often a less than ideal option—or attack someone else with disadvantage. Rinse and repeat while the group’s primary target is focus-fired down.
High dex and unarmoured defense with con as my second highest stat make me hard to hit. If I do get hit, I have the DR from raging and more HP than your average rogue due to the levels of d12 hit dice and high con. My damage is admittedly low compared to the sharpshooting ranger and the smiting paladin but I’m a great off tank who keeps groups of baddies from getting to the ranger and casters, or ganging up on the pally. Uncanny dodge next level will make me even more resilient. I’m considering one more level of barbarian to get Spirit Shield to help protect party members but rogue has a lot of goodies on the horizon and it competes with uncanny dodge as a reaction. I’ll see how it goes; it will be some time before level 11.
At any rate, if you can wrap your head around utterly forgoing a class feature, I highly recommend this build. It’s tons of fun.
Does this dump stat give you the minimum of 13 needed to be a barb?