I know Beyond didn't have the translated version of books because they didn't have the rights, but now Wizard owns Beyond AND they do the translations themselves. Why can't they just add the translated books or make it so you can switch languages?
I don't know if it's because it would be too much work or cost, but they could at least make it so you could switch languages in the character sheet (not spell/item description, just the interface).
I really hope that with the coming release of the new core rulebooks, they will add other languages to beyond, mainly because it's such a hussle to translate everything on the fly when playing.
Right now, the issue is staffing. They're doing a new edition (not in the sense of 4e, 5e etc, but in terms of how the system reacts, they have to have it work with two sets of rules, which is like a new edition for the site) as well as developing a new VTT and trickling out at least some new features to placate the customers. That is more than enough to keep them busy, since before the acquisition, DDB struggled to keep up even with just releases.
Translating is a lot of work. They did try Italian and it seems like it didn't do well enough to justify going beyond the PHB (although why they chose Italian I don't know - Spanish would have been a better option I'd have thought - and selling it rather than having it as an option like most sites I know probably kept numbers down), so it seems as though they might think it's a dead end anyway.
I really wouldn't expect anything until next year at the earliest, when 2024e is out on this front. Even then, I wouldn't necessarily expect it.
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I'm pretty sure that WotC has translated the books into at least one or two other languages since they used to have two sales offices in Latin America. That said, making the website fully multi-lingual takes a lot of work since that is not how the original designers built it from the beginning.
[REDACTED]
Notes: Please don't advocate for others to break the site rules and guidelines. thank you
I think this comes from Hasbro's operating philosophy, I am a Chinese player, as far as the feedback I have got, when the fifth edition of the dnd was first launched, our domestic translation enthusiasts contacted them and expressed their willingness to provide them with the Chinese language version of the dnd5 version of the book we have translated for free, but the other party refused and said that they have no plans to launch Chinese, it can be said that this is completely sales discrimination in their board decision, at this point, Hasbro and Warhammer 40000's gameworkshop are exactly the same kind of company。
Even if the basic transcriptions were done for free, formatting the book to the new characters and getting the production systems set up for them would still be a not inconsiderable expense on WotC's part, and not only would that not be something they would pursue unless they expected to turn a respectable profit from it, it would also not be something they would pursue if their analysis indicates that they could invest the same resources that project would take into a different project and see better returns. Obviously I'm not privy to what the actual decision-making process is, but this scenario is at least as likely as discrimination.
Even if the basic transcriptions were done for free, formatting the book to the new characters and getting the production systems set up for them would still be a not inconsiderable expense on WotC's part, and not only would that not be something they would pursue unless they expected to turn a respectable profit from it, it would also not be something they would pursue if their analysis indicates that they could invest the same resources that project would take into a different project and see better returns. Obviously I'm not privy to what the actual decision-making process is, but this scenario is at least as likely as discrimination.
Warehouse space to store printed books that have yet to be shipped is also extremely expensive, and then you would have to ship them, adding more costs. For digital products, you have to translate not only the content, but the tools as well to a certain degree, adding more cost, including digital storage costs. There is the fact Wizards does translate products to Chinese, which means they have a contract with a translation company - and that contract might prohibit them from working with others. Or, even if they could work with others, Wizards would still have to pay someone to double check the entire product line - they are not going to just trust some random company. Beyond that, there are rampant and systemic issues of intellectual property theft in China, which might give Wizards pause about working with any unknown company.
Then there are significant content issues. The Chinese government has bans on certain depictions (for example skeletons in art) - which is why Wizards uses different artwork for their Chinese localized Magic cards than their cards in other countries. There are also Chinese laws against artwork or stories acknowledging the existence of LGBT+ individuals - Wizards of the Coast responded by implementing a policy which said “We would rather have our products banned than submit to censorship of LGBT+ rights.”
There are so very legitimate many reasons why Wizards might not want to go down the route of publishing in other languages; discrimination is almost certainly not the culprit.
Then there are significant content issues. The Chinese government has bans on certain depictions (for example skeletons in art) - which is why Wizards uses different artwork for their Chinese localized Magic cards than their cards in other countries. There are also Chinese laws against artwork or stories acknowledging the existence of LGBT+ individuals - Wizards of the Coast responded by implementing a policy which said “We would rather have our products banned than submit to censorship of LGBT+ rights.”
There are so very legitimate many reasons why Wizards might not want to go down the route of publishing in other languages; discrimination is almost certainly not the culprit.
Totally this. Straight up disrcimination definitely is not it. China is a large market with four times our population. The potential to make a lot of money is huge.
However, it is difficult to enter the Chinese market for certain IPs. Political censorship is the main barrier. It is difficult to tell stories where our core values as a society diverge significantly from their political leadership's values. They cap the number of foreign films entering their market annually and severely restrict videogames and gaming consoles. Censorship range from editting/altering content to wholesale ban of entire IP series, websites, and platforms.
It is possible for D&D to enter the Chinese market, but it is probably best to start outside the country in Taiwan, Singapore, and Malaysia instead given the current geopolitical climate. Not a good idea to overinvest in a country where it is difficult back out, and whatever you sell in Taiwain, Singapore, and Malaysia can also trickle into China. I would also start with translating Basic Rules and SRD first; these two do not make any money directly, but I figure spending money on translating these two would be cheaper than running a traditional marketing campaign, and be more effective at grabbing market share because they are free.
But honestly, I would not even bother with a Chinese translation until we have done Spanish first. Mexico is literally across the border, and is also a lot closer in terms of cultural and political ties, and that also opens the gateway to the rest of Latin America.
...But honestly, I would not even bother with a Chinese translation until we have done Spanish first. Mexico is literally across the border, and is also a lot closer in terms of cultural and political ties, and that also opens the gateway to the rest of Latin America.
didn't they kick off the whole run-up to the 50th anniversary with a new japanese roll out of the game? so it's not impossible to cater to an asian market and graphic layout challenges that might present. i think the argument that preexisting contracts and a strong desire to retain quality (and creative) control is pretty good reason for why they haven't committed to china and many other areas yet.
as for southern north america, i know WOtC prints the books in spanish because i recently saw that they are canceling new portuguese translations going forward. something that didn't occur to me at the time was that just because the news blurb appears on DBB doesn't necessarily mean DBB tools are officially translated into spanish as well. if that's what you meant, then i agree it's a little surprising that the spanish language digital market hasn't yet been tapped.
The number of Spanish-speakers in USA are near 62'5 millions, more than the complete population of Spain (almost 48,6 millions).
Hasbro has got enough experience with the Chinese market with other type of products, the risks and the potential incomes. It is its choice and we should respect it because we don't know enough to give an opinion.
Japanese society and hobby culture in the free time is too different. Here WotC needs to find the right style. I am told Japanese roleplayers would rather fast creation of PCs for one-shot games, without campaigns. And they don't want to spend too many money to start. They are happy with their "Sword World" TTRPG.
...But honestly, I would not even bother with a Chinese translation until we have done Spanish first. Mexico is literally across the border, and is also a lot closer in terms of cultural and political ties, and that also opens the gateway to the rest of Latin America.
didn't they kick off the whole run-up to the 50th anniversary with a new japanese roll out of the game? so it's not impossible to cater to an asian market and graphic layout challenges that might present. i think the argument that preexisting contracts and a strong desire to retain quality (and creative) control is pretty good reason for why they haven't committed to china and many other areas yet.
as for southern north america, i know WOtC prints the books in spanish because i recently saw that they are canceling new portuguese translations going forward. something that didn't occur to me at the time was that just because the news blurb appears on DBB doesn't necessarily mean DBB tools are officially translated into spanish as well. if that's what you meant, then i agree it's a little surprising that the spanish language digital market hasn't yet been tapped.
Yeah, they worked on the Italian compendium for the PHB some years ago on Beyond, and then they stopped futher translation due to lack of sales. Not sure why they did not choose Spanish first with about half a billion speakers spanning most of the western hemisphere, compared to Italian which is primarily confined to one country in Europe. Now that Wizards has Beyond, even if Wizards has issues penetrating a foreign country's market with their physical books, they can still penetrate that market with digital books. And in markets where consumers have lower income, Beyond's piecemeal purchase options is great to make things more affordable.
It just feels so frustrating to see Hasbro leave money on the table and then whine about poor revenue. Like no shit if you are not leveraging all the tools you have. Beyond is not going to completely save Hasbro's revenue, but every bit helps. From what I see, they bought a golden goose for the golden eggs but is refusing to feed the goose properly. Maps and third party is nice and further development for them should continue, but not investing in multilanguage support at the same time just seems stupid. Like, there is so much synergy between third party support and multilanguage support, where Wizards can profit from third party publishers selling to a global audience, third party publishers domestic and foreign can access each other's markets and make more money too, and every GM and player around the world have even more options. And Maps is basically the final piece that makes Beyond the one-stop shop for all of D&D's digital experience, and making that available to the global audience would be huge. I know everything takes time, but this just feels too slow.
The number of Spanish-speakers in USA are near 62'5 millions, more than the complete population of Spain (almost 48,6 millions).
Hasbro has got enough experience with the Chinese market with other type of products, the risks and the potential incomes. It is its choice and we should respect it because we don't know enough to give an opinion.
Japanese society and hobby culture in the free time is too different. Here WotC needs to find the right style. I am told Japanese roleplayers would rather fast creation of PCs for one-shot games, without campaigns. And they don't want to spend too many money to start. They are happy with their "Sword World" TTRPG.
D&D is not like other products though. The hobby is already extremely niche here in the West, so cracking the Chinese market is going to be challenging even if geopolitics were set aside. And due to current geopolitical climate, I would avoid further investment into China in the mean time, but Wizards can still have D&D trickle into the market in a round about way through Singapore, Malaysia, and Taiwan first. And if these three markets are doing well, then go to China. Other than smaller market size, seems better to start in these countries with less geopolitical risk. Singapore and Malaysia have large numbers of English speakers that Wizards can tap first and increase D&D's brand awareness in the region. Once that picks up some steam, then Wizards can try to tap the Chinese speakers in South East Asia and test Taiwan out at the same time. If Taiwan does well too, then that paves the way into China.
There is no reason D&D cannot do well in Japan, and it seems like it is doing okay right now. It is in no way dominating the TTRPG industry there like here in America, but they seem to do well enough to warrant creating commercials there. D&D can be played for free with BR/SRD, and Beyond makes creating characters pretty quick, but obviously, no Japanese support. I just wish Wizards invest more into Beyond with more languages.
Regarding Spanish, I suppose the question is how many of those Spanish-speakers who fit the market segment of people who would play D&D don't also speak English. If they figure most of their target audience could get by with the English copies, that disincentivizes spending the resources to translate the book.
With respect to China, it could very well be that China itself places some sort of restrictions in the way making it impractical. With respect to Portugal, it is likely a combination of market size and how widespread English language knowledge is.
However, just because a language exists is not an argument that any given thing, particularly a luxury product, must be translated to that language. There are many specific dialects and lesser known languages in the world. There is not a lot of Bayrisch (Bavarian) language literature of any sort even here in Germany.
Regarding Spanish, I suppose the question is how many of those Spanish-speakers who fit the market segment of people who would play D&D don't also speak English. If they figure most of their target audience could get by with the English copies, that disincentivizes spending the resources to translate the book.
Italian has the same issue, there are just a lot fewer people to buy it in the first place (like 60million...compared to nearly half a billion). Even as an Italian speaker... it's left me scratching my head. I think even Italian speakers would have been benefited by them trying Spanish first - more likely to succeed and justify further translation. Right now, DDB is useless for Italian speakers unless they are already comfortable with English.
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It's frankly quite surprising that the core 3 books + Xanathar's never got a full translation into non-English language even these have been around over a decade. While we cannot assume the same degree of "market penetration" could be relied upon for the Spanish, Chinese, French, Russian, or other languages with large population centers, it also makes sense to diversify revenue streams by literally diversifyiing the languages that one publishes in. As for cultural barriers, I doubt that LGBT-related issues are as massive of a problem in Europe, French-speaking Canada, or South America as economics barriers are, especially when the core rules books make no mention of sexuality, gender issues whatsoever. Economic barriers being what might inhibit people from picking up the game - a lack of time and space to host games, or the money to keep up with multiple books if one is GMing. The 2008 financial crisis was a global phenomenon because of how inter-linked global capital has become. That had a pretty deleterious effect on lower middle class and working people in the markets most tightly integrated with the U.S. and European banking sectors. The Covid-pandemic has largely made the issue worse.
In theory, people with a computer can play D&D from anywhere via cloud-based table top simulators, but having the time and money to commit to a game with strangers who don't even speak your native language is a harder sell than playing that same game with people who do.
So I was able to order an all Spanish-language Monster Manual, the other day, which basically guarantees that the DMG and PHB have already been published in Spanish. I also just found a Spanish-language version of Tasha's Cauldron, so at least the primary and expanded important rule books have probably all seen publication in at least 1 non-English language.
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I know Beyond didn't have the translated version of books because they didn't have the rights, but now Wizard owns Beyond AND they do the translations themselves. Why can't they just add the translated books or make it so you can switch languages?
I don't know if it's because it would be too much work or cost, but they could at least make it so you could switch languages in the character sheet (not spell/item description, just the interface).
I really hope that with the coming release of the new core rulebooks, they will add other languages to beyond, mainly because it's such a hussle to translate everything on the fly when playing.
Right now, the issue is staffing. They're doing a new edition (not in the sense of 4e, 5e etc, but in terms of how the system reacts, they have to have it work with two sets of rules, which is like a new edition for the site) as well as developing a new VTT and trickling out at least some new features to placate the customers. That is more than enough to keep them busy, since before the acquisition, DDB struggled to keep up even with just releases.
Translating is a lot of work. They did try Italian and it seems like it didn't do well enough to justify going beyond the PHB (although why they chose Italian I don't know - Spanish would have been a better option I'd have thought - and selling it rather than having it as an option like most sites I know probably kept numbers down), so it seems as though they might think it's a dead end anyway.
I really wouldn't expect anything until next year at the earliest, when 2024e is out on this front. Even then, I wouldn't necessarily expect it.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
Great question.
I'm pretty sure that WotC has translated the books into at least one or two other languages since they used to have two sales offices in Latin America. That said, making the website fully multi-lingual takes a lot of work since that is not how the original designers built it from the beginning.
[REDACTED]
The SRD is released in several other languages than english. It's not the full books, but still very useful.
In july? Wizards of the Coast announced that they added French, Italian, German, and Spanish language releases of the 5.1 SRD via Creative Commons.
Evidently, this is the main feedback thread if you have particular requests about translating D&D Beyond:
https://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/d-d-beyond-general/d-d-beyond-feedback/47203-translating-d-d-beyond-feedback
我觉得这源自于孩之宝的运营理念，我是一名中国玩家，就我得到的信息反馈来说，在dnd五版刚刚推出时，我们国内的翻译爱好者曾经联系过他们，并且表示愿意免费为他们提供我们已经翻译完成的dnd5版书籍的中文语言版本，但是对方却拒绝了并且表示他们没有推出中文的计划，可以说这完全是他们董事会决策的销售歧视，这一点上，孩之宝和战锤40000的gameworkshop完全是同一类公司。
==============
I think this comes from Hasbro's operating philosophy, I am a Chinese player, as far as the feedback I have got, when the fifth edition of the dnd was first launched, our domestic translation enthusiasts contacted them and expressed their willingness to provide them with the Chinese language version of the dnd5 version of the book we have translated for free, but the other party refused and said that they have no plans to launch Chinese, it can be said that this is completely sales discrimination in their board decision, at this point, Hasbro and Warhammer 40000's gameworkshop are exactly the same kind of company。
Even if the basic transcriptions were done for free, formatting the book to the new characters and getting the production systems set up for them would still be a not inconsiderable expense on WotC's part, and not only would that not be something they would pursue unless they expected to turn a respectable profit from it, it would also not be something they would pursue if their analysis indicates that they could invest the same resources that project would take into a different project and see better returns. Obviously I'm not privy to what the actual decision-making process is, but this scenario is at least as likely as discrimination.
Warehouse space to store printed books that have yet to be shipped is also extremely expensive, and then you would have to ship them, adding more costs. For digital products, you have to translate not only the content, but the tools as well to a certain degree, adding more cost, including digital storage costs. There is the fact Wizards does translate products to Chinese, which means they have a contract with a translation company - and that contract might prohibit them from working with others. Or, even if they could work with others, Wizards would still have to pay someone to double check the entire product line - they are not going to just trust some random company. Beyond that, there are rampant and systemic issues of intellectual property theft in China, which might give Wizards pause about working with any unknown company.
Then there are significant content issues. The Chinese government has bans on certain depictions (for example skeletons in art) - which is why Wizards uses different artwork for their Chinese localized Magic cards than their cards in other countries. There are also Chinese laws against artwork or stories acknowledging the existence of LGBT+ individuals - Wizards of the Coast responded by implementing a policy which said “We would rather have our products banned than submit to censorship of LGBT+ rights.”
There are so very legitimate many reasons why Wizards might not want to go down the route of publishing in other languages; discrimination is almost certainly not the culprit.
Totally this. Straight up disrcimination definitely is not it. China is a large market with four times our population. The potential to make a lot of money is huge.
However, it is difficult to enter the Chinese market for certain IPs. Political censorship is the main barrier. It is difficult to tell stories where our core values as a society diverge significantly from their political leadership's values. They cap the number of foreign films entering their market annually and severely restrict videogames and gaming consoles. Censorship range from editting/altering content to wholesale ban of entire IP series, websites, and platforms.
It is possible for D&D to enter the Chinese market, but it is probably best to start outside the country in Taiwan, Singapore, and Malaysia instead given the current geopolitical climate. Not a good idea to overinvest in a country where it is difficult back out, and whatever you sell in Taiwain, Singapore, and Malaysia can also trickle into China. I would also start with translating Basic Rules and SRD first; these two do not make any money directly, but I figure spending money on translating these two would be cheaper than running a traditional marketing campaign, and be more effective at grabbing market share because they are free.
But honestly, I would not even bother with a Chinese translation until we have done Spanish first. Mexico is literally across the border, and is also a lot closer in terms of cultural and political ties, and that also opens the gateway to the rest of Latin America.
Check Licenses and Resync Entitlements: < https://www.dndbeyond.com/account/licenses >
Running the Game by Matt Colville; Introduction: < https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-YZvLUXcR8 >
D&D with High School Students by Bill Allen; Season 1 Episode 1: < https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52NJTUDokyk&t >
didn't they kick off the whole run-up to the 50th anniversary with a new japanese roll out of the game? so it's not impossible to cater to an asian market and graphic layout challenges that might present. i think the argument that preexisting contracts and a strong desire to retain quality (and creative) control is pretty good reason for why they haven't committed to china and many other areas yet.
as for southern north america, i know WOtC prints the books in spanish because i recently saw that they are canceling new portuguese translations going forward. something that didn't occur to me at the time was that just because the news blurb appears on DBB doesn't necessarily mean DBB tools are officially translated into spanish as well. if that's what you meant, then i agree it's a little surprising that the spanish language digital market hasn't yet been tapped.
unhappy at the way in which we lost individual purchases for one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters?
tell them you don't like features disappeared quietly in the night: provide feedback!
The number of Spanish-speakers in USA are near 62'5 millions, more than the complete population of Spain (almost 48,6 millions).
Hasbro has got enough experience with the Chinese market with other type of products, the risks and the potential incomes. It is its choice and we should respect it because we don't know enough to give an opinion.
Japanese society and hobby culture in the free time is too different. Here WotC needs to find the right style. I am told Japanese roleplayers would rather fast creation of PCs for one-shot games, without campaigns. And they don't want to spend too many money to start. They are happy with their "Sword World" TTRPG.
Yeah, they worked on the Italian compendium for the PHB some years ago on Beyond, and then they stopped futher translation due to lack of sales. Not sure why they did not choose Spanish first with about half a billion speakers spanning most of the western hemisphere, compared to Italian which is primarily confined to one country in Europe. Now that Wizards has Beyond, even if Wizards has issues penetrating a foreign country's market with their physical books, they can still penetrate that market with digital books. And in markets where consumers have lower income, Beyond's piecemeal purchase options is great to make things more affordable.
It just feels so frustrating to see Hasbro leave money on the table and then whine about poor revenue. Like no shit if you are not leveraging all the tools you have. Beyond is not going to completely save Hasbro's revenue, but every bit helps. From what I see, they bought a golden goose for the golden eggs but is refusing to feed the goose properly. Maps and third party is nice and further development for them should continue, but not investing in multilanguage support at the same time just seems stupid. Like, there is so much synergy between third party support and multilanguage support, where Wizards can profit from third party publishers selling to a global audience, third party publishers domestic and foreign can access each other's markets and make more money too, and every GM and player around the world have even more options. And Maps is basically the final piece that makes Beyond the one-stop shop for all of D&D's digital experience, and making that available to the global audience would be huge. I know everything takes time, but this just feels too slow.
D&D is not like other products though. The hobby is already extremely niche here in the West, so cracking the Chinese market is going to be challenging even if geopolitics were set aside. And due to current geopolitical climate, I would avoid further investment into China in the mean time, but Wizards can still have D&D trickle into the market in a round about way through Singapore, Malaysia, and Taiwan first. And if these three markets are doing well, then go to China. Other than smaller market size, seems better to start in these countries with less geopolitical risk. Singapore and Malaysia have large numbers of English speakers that Wizards can tap first and increase D&D's brand awareness in the region. Once that picks up some steam, then Wizards can try to tap the Chinese speakers in South East Asia and test Taiwan out at the same time. If Taiwan does well too, then that paves the way into China.
There is no reason D&D cannot do well in Japan, and it seems like it is doing okay right now. It is in no way dominating the TTRPG industry there like here in America, but they seem to do well enough to warrant creating commercials there. D&D can be played for free with BR/SRD, and Beyond makes creating characters pretty quick, but obviously, no Japanese support. I just wish Wizards invest more into Beyond with more languages.
Check Licenses and Resync Entitlements: < https://www.dndbeyond.com/account/licenses >
Running the Game by Matt Colville; Introduction: < https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-YZvLUXcR8 >
D&D with High School Students by Bill Allen; Season 1 Episode 1: < https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52NJTUDokyk&t >
Regarding Spanish, I suppose the question is how many of those Spanish-speakers who fit the market segment of people who would play D&D don't also speak English. If they figure most of their target audience could get by with the English copies, that disincentivizes spending the resources to translate the book.
With respect to China, it could very well be that China itself places some sort of restrictions in the way making it impractical. With respect to Portugal, it is likely a combination of market size and how widespread English language knowledge is.
However, just because a language exists is not an argument that any given thing, particularly a luxury product, must be translated to that language. There are many specific dialects and lesser known languages in the world. There is not a lot of Bayrisch (Bavarian) language literature of any sort even here in Germany.
Italian has the same issue, there are just a lot fewer people to buy it in the first place (like 60million...compared to nearly half a billion). Even as an Italian speaker... it's left me scratching my head. I think even Italian speakers would have been benefited by them trying Spanish first - more likely to succeed and justify further translation. Right now, DDB is useless for Italian speakers unless they are already comfortable with English.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
It's frankly quite surprising that the core 3 books + Xanathar's never got a full translation into non-English language even these have been around over a decade. While we cannot assume the same degree of "market penetration" could be relied upon for the Spanish, Chinese, French, Russian, or other languages with large population centers, it also makes sense to diversify revenue streams by literally diversifyiing the languages that one publishes in. As for cultural barriers, I doubt that LGBT-related issues are as massive of a problem in Europe, French-speaking Canada, or South America as economics barriers are, especially when the core rules books make no mention of sexuality, gender issues whatsoever. Economic barriers being what might inhibit people from picking up the game - a lack of time and space to host games, or the money to keep up with multiple books if one is GMing. The 2008 financial crisis was a global phenomenon because of how inter-linked global capital has become. That had a pretty deleterious effect on lower middle class and working people in the markets most tightly integrated with the U.S. and European banking sectors. The Covid-pandemic has largely made the issue worse.
In theory, people with a computer can play D&D from anywhere via cloud-based table top simulators, but having the time and money to commit to a game with strangers who don't even speak your native language is a harder sell than playing that same game with people who do.
So I was able to order an all Spanish-language Monster Manual, the other day, which basically guarantees that the DMG and PHB have already been published in Spanish. I also just found a Spanish-language version of Tasha's Cauldron, so at least the primary and expanded important rule books have probably all seen publication in at least 1 non-English language.