According to the latest PT, the monk will gain a new ability called self-restoration. This ability replaces the former class features Stillness of Mind, Purity of Body, and Timeless Body.
However, I don't believe this is the right decision. The three mentioned features create an immersive depiction of the monk class, and I think they should be kept. Also, an RPG includes beautiful and fitting language to describe things, effects, and situations. The terms used for these features add flavor to the monk as well. More importantly, I liked the idea of a monk being immune to poisons, unaffected by age, and not needing to eat and drink anymore. It fits the overall style of a monk and underlines his connection to his inherent energy (ki, etc.).
By contrast, the skill self-restoration eliminates (destroys) these class features and all their game-play and role-play advantages. It reminds me of a skill you would use in a video game, where you push a button, and your character quickly removes an adverse effect. This is not what I like to see in a table-top RPG.
I hope this skill will be looked at again and this change hopefully reverted or at least modified, which would entail bringing back the three class features in one form or another.
WotC is making changes to move monk away from cultural stereotypes (Ki is changed to Disciple Points etc). Certain language is being discarded or generalized so monk fits into various settings and not so focused on “this is how monks are in Forgotten Realms”
The change to end charmed or frightened had its action removed so it could end even when dominate (or other effect that took away your ability to control how you use your action). A good change in my opinion
Disease is going away so that part of Purity of Body isn’t needed and it looks like they are getting away from immunities for characters. But being able to end the poisoned condition is a good alternative
Age never really played any part in the game so you might as well just RP it. It’s mainly a ribbon feature.
Not every monk needs to be the shaolin king fu master or Dragonball Z/Anime Warrior and WotC is trying to get away from that narrow-ish theme. Fighters give players so much versatility in concept where monks, especially the 2014 version, seems more narrow in what you can do creatively. I mean they right out tell you you probably trained at a monastery. And that’s fine if that’s what you want. But wouldn’t it be much better if the language and features didn’t curtail a players creativity? Now don’t get me wrong. I’m all for “flavor is free” and you can design your monk concept from backroom brawler/street thug to ninja to whatever.
I wasn't talking about "cultural stereotypes," but mentioned three specific situations. For example, I don't have a problem with them using the word "discipline" now instead of "ki." But the basic idea of an empowering and invigorating energy, no matter how you want to call it, is and should still be there.
As I pointed out, I don't particularly appreciate how they "discarded" certain phrases and abandoned verbal descriptions that fit a monk. Monks can still fit any "setting" if they maintain what a monk usually embodies, like a still and focused mind, bodily control, inherent energy, etc.
The removal of the action to end charmed or frightened was indeed a good change. I agree with it, and it should be kept.
I am not happy that diseases are going "away" or at least becoming negligible. D&D should offer rules and examples about regularly implementing diseases in a game. That would force players to do something about it, either through magic or potions/medicine, etc. This would increase the value and appreciation of the monk's immunity to diseases.
Of course, being able to end poisoned is good, but it would even be better if the monk maintained his complete immunity to poison from the get-go (starting at a specific later level).
Age can and should play a role in a game, especially if it is ongoing for long. They should at least offer some rules on how to apply aging in long campaigns.
Again, I never mentioned "Kung-Fu masters" or "Dragonball warriors." My point was to give the monk (like any class) a unique identity, and I complained about them removing three features that I believe express the monk's style in good ways.
I apologize if I misunderstood what you were getting at.
You still have that inherent invigorating energy in Discipline Points.
I believe they said that disease has been covered by the poisoned condition, I could be wrong. But it never was much of a thing in 5E anyway, in my experience.
And I think even when not called outright in the focused mind/body/energy the features still lean into that. Being able to just shrug off charmed or frightened effects can still be part of that focused mind or RP’d as sheer force of will or whatever a player wants (reminds me of the line of dialogue in Predator “I ain’t got time to bleed”) Or falling distances without dying or taking much, if any, damage. Or having proficiency in all saves. Again that combination of mind/body/energy if you choose to play it that way, but you don’t feel like you have to because the language tells you that’s how it is.
I get what you are saying and I agree about identity, but still some of the mind/body/energy language can have that Eastern Asian movie tropes they seem to be getting away from
Edit: Look at the opening text for the monk in UA8 (for some reason I can’t copy from the pdf, no “copy” option pops up 😡) but it does talk about stuff like this internal energy etc.
I agree with the OP that I liked the names "Stillness of Mind" and "Purity of Body" better, I'd like to at least see those names come back; they're not tied to any kind of cultural stereotype (unlike Ki, or Kensai or such), or maybe "Purity of Mind and Body" since it's really a single feature now, because it's just a nice evocative name. People always talk about flavour being free, and while that's true to some extent, it's still nice to have things to inspire how you see a feature, as the more generic everything gets the more mechanically minded the game becomes, which is already a problem in 5e IMO.
In terms of the mechanics I'm generally happy with the feature; Stillness of Mind was a feature that in RAW was potentially unusable most of the time you needed it, now it should at least definitely work as it was likely intended to. I'd have been fine with just advantage on the saves, as I can't help but feel like there's some exploit or weird issue just waiting to be found, but that's hopefully just me being paranoid. Extending it to the poisoned makes sense and avoids needing a second feature, and too much immunity to poison just eliminates some of the challenges you can throw at a party.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
As someone has stated, the WotC thinks it's doing good by claiming the Monk is a stereotype and taking steps to change it. In effect they are creating a fix for a problem that never existed. The only time this would have applied was when TSR created the "Oriental Adventures" supplemental book.
Pretty sad really because most people chose Monk because they watched some movie or animation involving Martial Arts. If they really wanted to address some non-existent stereotype they could have simply renamed the Monk to Mystic, which is was TSR did in the final revision of the Basic Rules in the Rules Cyclopedia.
Hello,
According to the latest PT, the monk will gain a new ability called self-restoration. This ability replaces the former class features Stillness of Mind, Purity of Body, and Timeless Body.
However, I don't believe this is the right decision. The three mentioned features create an immersive depiction of the monk class, and I think they should be kept. Also, an RPG includes beautiful and fitting language to describe things, effects, and situations. The terms used for these features add flavor to the monk as well. More importantly, I liked the idea of a monk being immune to poisons, unaffected by age, and not needing to eat and drink anymore. It fits the overall style of a monk and underlines his connection to his inherent energy (ki, etc.).
By contrast, the skill self-restoration eliminates (destroys) these class features and all their game-play and role-play advantages. It reminds me of a skill you would use in a video game, where you push a button, and your character quickly removes an adverse effect. This is not what I like to see in a table-top RPG.
I hope this skill will be looked at again and this change hopefully reverted or at least modified, which would entail bringing back the three class features in one form or another.
Thanks
A few things.
WotC is making changes to move monk away from cultural stereotypes (Ki is changed to Disciple Points etc). Certain language is being discarded or generalized so monk fits into various settings and not so focused on “this is how monks are in Forgotten Realms”
The change to end charmed or frightened had its action removed so it could end even when dominate (or other effect that took away your ability to control how you use your action). A good change in my opinion
Disease is going away so that part of Purity of Body isn’t needed and it looks like they are getting away from immunities for characters. But being able to end the poisoned condition is a good alternative
Age never really played any part in the game so you might as well just RP it. It’s mainly a ribbon feature.
Not every monk needs to be the shaolin king fu master or Dragonball Z/Anime Warrior and WotC is trying to get away from that narrow-ish theme. Fighters give players so much versatility in concept where monks, especially the 2014 version, seems more narrow in what you can do creatively. I mean they right out tell you you probably trained at a monastery. And that’s fine if that’s what you want. But wouldn’t it be much better if the language and features didn’t curtail a players creativity? Now don’t get me wrong. I’m all for “flavor is free” and you can design your monk concept from backroom brawler/street thug to ninja to whatever.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
I wasn't talking about "cultural stereotypes," but mentioned three specific situations. For example, I don't have a problem with them using the word "discipline" now instead of "ki." But the basic idea of an empowering and invigorating energy, no matter how you want to call it, is and should still be there.
As I pointed out, I don't particularly appreciate how they "discarded" certain phrases and abandoned verbal descriptions that fit a monk. Monks can still fit any "setting" if they maintain what a monk usually embodies, like a still and focused mind, bodily control, inherent energy, etc.
The removal of the action to end charmed or frightened was indeed a good change. I agree with it, and it should be kept.
I am not happy that diseases are going "away" or at least becoming negligible. D&D should offer rules and examples about regularly implementing diseases in a game. That would force players to do something about it, either through magic or potions/medicine, etc. This would increase the value and appreciation of the monk's immunity to diseases.
Of course, being able to end poisoned is good, but it would even be better if the monk maintained his complete immunity to poison from the get-go (starting at a specific later level).
Age can and should play a role in a game, especially if it is ongoing for long. They should at least offer some rules on how to apply aging in long campaigns.
Again, I never mentioned "Kung-Fu masters" or "Dragonball warriors." My point was to give the monk (like any class) a unique identity, and I complained about them removing three features that I believe express the monk's style in good ways.
I apologize if I misunderstood what you were getting at.
You still have that inherent invigorating energy in Discipline Points.
I believe they said that disease has been covered by the poisoned condition, I could be wrong. But it never was much of a thing in 5E anyway, in my experience.
And I think even when not called outright in the focused mind/body/energy the features still lean into that. Being able to just shrug off charmed or frightened effects can still be part of that focused mind or RP’d as sheer force of will or whatever a player wants (reminds me of the line of dialogue in Predator “I ain’t got time to bleed”) Or falling distances without dying or taking much, if any, damage. Or having proficiency in all saves. Again that combination of mind/body/energy if you choose to play it that way, but you don’t feel like you have to because the language tells you that’s how it is.
I get what you are saying and I agree about identity, but still some of the mind/body/energy language can have that Eastern Asian movie tropes they seem to be getting away from
Edit: Look at the opening text for the monk in UA8 (for some reason I can’t copy from the pdf, no “copy” option pops up 😡) but it does talk about stuff like this internal energy etc.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
I agree with the OP that I liked the names "Stillness of Mind" and "Purity of Body" better, I'd like to at least see those names come back; they're not tied to any kind of cultural stereotype (unlike Ki, or Kensai or such), or maybe "Purity of Mind and Body" since it's really a single feature now, because it's just a nice evocative name. People always talk about flavour being free, and while that's true to some extent, it's still nice to have things to inspire how you see a feature, as the more generic everything gets the more mechanically minded the game becomes, which is already a problem in 5e IMO.
In terms of the mechanics I'm generally happy with the feature; Stillness of Mind was a feature that in RAW was potentially unusable most of the time you needed it, now it should at least definitely work as it was likely intended to. I'd have been fine with just advantage on the saves, as I can't help but feel like there's some exploit or weird issue just waiting to be found, but that's hopefully just me being paranoid. Extending it to the poisoned makes sense and avoids needing a second feature, and too much immunity to poison just eliminates some of the challenges you can throw at a party.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
Don’t get me wrong. I didn’t have a problem with some of the names. I was just trying to convey the direction WotC seems to be going.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
As someone has stated, the WotC thinks it's doing good by claiming the Monk is a stereotype and taking steps to change it. In effect they are creating a fix for a problem that never existed. The only time this would have applied was when TSR created the "Oriental Adventures" supplemental book.
Pretty sad really because most people chose Monk because they watched some movie or animation involving Martial Arts. If they really wanted to address some non-existent stereotype they could have simply renamed the Monk to Mystic, which is was TSR did in the final revision of the Basic Rules in the Rules Cyclopedia.